Trans eligibility rules for girls sports.

SurFutbol said:
I already answered your question about whether biological males have a physiological advantage over biological females, but I will point out the exact post as soon as you admit that biological girls virtually always have their substantial advantages over trans girls, including: (1) emotional advantages; (2) purposes for engaging in sustained levels of development and commitment that do not exist for trans girls, such as the potential for a scholarship or admission to a college using their athletic ability that would otherwise be out of reach; (3) supportive parents who are also willing to make the sustained commitment to support their child in a sport in which it is incredibly expensive and time consuming just to keep up ability-wise.
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OMFG….there is not a world we live in where a Biological Female has a Physiological advantage over a Biological Male in sports…well…except for the Biological Females ability to be a Birth Person…‍♂️ Maybe we should put that in the Olympics and see how many Biological Males Qualify…
 
Woobie06 said:
OMFG….there is not a world we live in where a Biological Female has a Physiological advantage over a Biological Male in sports…well…except for the Biological Females ability to be a Birth Person…‍♂ Maybe we should put that in the Olympics and see how many Biological Males Qualify…
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Again, I already answered your question, and it is once again clear that you continue to refuse to acknowledge that cis girls also have their own advantages. Again, you only want to talk about the one factor you like and pretend that the ones that don't do not exist - because acknowledging the ones you don't forces you to admit that you deem a trophy in U14 soccer to be more important than the abuse that trans girls must suffer if they were forced to play with boys.

Well, too bad so sad. Again, CIF, ECNL, the NCAA, the USWNT, SCOTUS, a significant number of the most important female athletes in history (Billie Jean King, Megan Rapinoe, and Candace Parker Join Nearly 200 Athletes Supporting Trans Youth Participation in Sports - Women's Sports Foundation (womenssportsfoundation.org), plus the bronze medalist (at least) in the infamous Lia Thomas race, all agree with me. The mere fact that you can't acknowledge that any of them have a single legitimate reason to justify their position, no matter how many times or how exhaustively they have done so, is pretty nuts.
 
Woobie06 said:
Haha…FFS…The “situation” infringed on others rights. I sincerely apologize if I have not been super clear. My apologies to you. I should go back and put “Controversy” after her name if you go back and look, which I did in one of the first posts anyway. Jesus Christ…get back in the Subaru, go to hot yoga and have a boba or chi tea. I bet you are just insufferable AF IRL. Anyway….

The problem in all these conversations seems to be that people on the extreme ends get uber emotional when talking about these things, and are intolerant. People who are more centrist seem to want to discuss, not call names, and don’t gaslight…like….YOUR a TRANSPHOBE!!! I’m not innocent with my Subaru, Sticker, and insufferable comments, but I can only take so much…it’s my mea culpa…
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You were quite clear that you were pinning this on Ms. Thomas. I have been quite clear why your comments are transphobic. FFS, you can't even admit that a single legitimate reason supports a trans girl playing soccer with other girls. Instead, you must go down the rabbit hole of claiming that CIF, ECNL, the USWNT, the NCAA, SCOTUS and Ms. Thomas' own competitor are crazy. Well, the truth is they are rational and your refusal to accept that makes you transphobic.
 
Are any of you transphobes out there willing to admit that a single legitimate reason supports letting a trans girl play in ECNL? I'm not asking you whether they outweigh your "men are men and women are women" argument. Are any of you willing to admit that the likely repercussions of not letting a trans girl participate - such as the likely abuse if forced to play with boys and the likely negative emotional effects of not being able to be around people with whom she associates and would be more comfortable - even constitute legitimate factors to consider in the discussion?
 
SurFutbol said:
It's interesting that you don't understand that stupid jokes like this relating to appropriate gender or pronoun are transphobic.
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Hypocrite and Gaslight much…Jesus. It’s very clear that if people do not believe what you believe, your ideology, narrative etc., that others are Phobic, Racist, Intolerant, etc. Look in the mirror…I just don’t agree with you. I have a perspective and because you disagree I am all these things. It’s pretty weird.
 
A month ago I thought mtf athletes in rec would work. The assumption was that people would be reasonable if there was a problem.

The more EOTL posts, the more I realize that just isn't true. 99% of people might be reasonable. But the rest are like EOTL. If you ask their 6'4" trans girl to join a coed or boys leagues, they'll threaten boycotts and lawsuits until you let their safety hazard go break someone's arm.
 
dad4 said:
Why expect a huge shift to the m/f balance?

The trans population is small. If the court recognizes trans as "none of the above", you go from 50/50 to 49/49/2. It's a giant change for the '2', but not a big deal for anyone else.

It may not end up there,but it would be as good compromise.
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Because the legal rationale for the balance was men and women were equal and entitled to equal shares. If one is for everyone (men women non-binary mtf ftm genetically different) and one is a special lesser protected category for women, you just knocked out the stool on which that equality rests. There’s nothing that says it must be proportional then.
 
Grace T. said:
Because the legal rationale for the balance was men and women were equal and entitled to equal shares. If one is for everyone (men women non-binary mtf ftm genetically different) and one is a special lesser protected category for women, you just knocked out the stool on which that equality rests. There’s nothing that says it must be proportional then.
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Don't they already use proportionality?

You seem to be arguing in favor of a conflict which has already been resolved. We know how to apply Title IX to a school with a 70/30 gender split. Figuring out how to extend that to handle a three way split isn't particularly difficult.
 
dad4 said:
Don't they already use proportionality?

You seem to be arguing in favor of a conflict which has already been resolved. We know how to apply Title IX to a school with a 70/30 gender split. Figuring out how to extend that to handle a three way split isn't particularly difficult.
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The proportionality is based on a starting point that if you have a 50/50 gender split at a school then 50% goes to the men and 50% go to the women. The assumption is they are equivalent. But if you have an open division it doesn’t have to be proportional. Why? Well for starters it’s open so inclusive of women who want to play in the men’s division. Open means it’s for everyone while the closed women’s division is only for women who elect to be protected. The same rational btw applies to why there isn’t proportionality for the disabled categories (they aren’t considered equivalent). It’s no longer about men and women being equal. There’s everyone else and there’s the sealed restricted women’s category. You might assign them proportionally. You could argue that’s how they should be treated. But legally the original rational is gone because it rests on the assumption notwithstanding at that time that men’s sports was more popular and there were more male athletes, that they should be treated equivalently.
 
dad4 said:
A month ago I thought mtf athletes in rec would work. The assumption was that people would be reasonable if there was a problem.

The more EOTL posts, the more I realize that just isn't true. 99% of people might be reasonable. But the rest are like EOTL. If you ask their 6'4" trans girl to join a coed or boys leagues, they'll threaten boycotts and lawsuits until you let their safety hazard go break someone's arm.
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meh my sons at the time 4 10 friend was safety hazzarded by a 6 fter. My then 80 pound niece was once plowed down by a 120 mountain of goalkeeper on a 1v1 the gk slid through her (everyone called for a foul but the dumb dumb parents didn’t understand it was a fair tackle). Crushes little girl squeeked when she was shoulder checked by a girl twice her size that tried to play the player instead of the ball.

I agree there’s a safety concern in soccer caused by kids of unusual size. Until we start signaling out all the safety hazards, cry me a river.
 
Grace T. said:
Doubtful even with a conservative court...at least not without unintended consequences that spill all over the place (such as a serious gutting of Title IX's male/female balance). If you have an "open" division it directly undermines the proposition that female sports have to be treated equally....they are no longer equal...they are a subcategory akin to a disabled category of the larger "open" division". Unintended consequences. If you don't, then you are on the same footing as disabilities: if you extend accommodations for disabilities, it's hard to see how you don't for the trans, even if it's just under a proposition of separate but equal. Hard to predict, but in the US, barring the acceptance of some sort of rational compromise, or the Rs taking both houses of Congress overcoming the fillibuster and getting the Presidency, I think it comes down to a blue state/red state split. Long term, I think Europe leads the way and where they come out on things.

In any case, Title IX and women's athletics may be about to be turned on their head in the event women's football catches on in the next 3-5 years. If it does (I'm not convinced it will but I saw a demonstration in Sherman Oaks Park a few months and the players really seemed into it), soccer and volleyball in particularly are going to be greatly impacted. If I had a DD that was 5 or 6 right now and looking to direct her to a sport, I'd be looking at this carefully to see how it develops because if it takes off (a big if) it's going to turn everything over on its head.
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Can't say I agree 100% with your lawyer work there, Lou.

Title IX does not mandate a balance of results, it just bans discrimination "on the basis of sex". You can look it up..

Fargo (1996) - Officer Lou's Police Work Scene (8/12) | Movieclips - YouTube
 
espola said:
Can't say I agree 100% with your lawyer work there, Lou.

Title IX does not mandate a balance of results, it just bans discrimination "on the basis of sex". You can look it up..

Fargo (1996) - Officer Lou's Police Work Scene (8/12) | Movieclips - YouTube
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I actually agree, but that’s not how the admin state has chosen to interpret it, as dad4 correctly points out. Further eotl has correctly pointed out scotus already ruled on the point with respect to title vii so would be trickle to distinguish title ix.
 
Grace T. said:
I actually agree, but that’s not how the admin state has chosen to interpret it, as dad4 correctly points out. Further eotl has correctly pointed out scotus already ruled on the point with respect to title vii so would be trickle to distinguish title ix.
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When all the schools that award 50 or 80 scholarships to football players also award 50 to 80 scholarships to women's flag football players, then we can talk about "balance".
 
Grace T. said:
All respiratory viruses.
plus the teachers found they don’t like schlepping the kids on buses on the weekend but rather stay home and judged the competitions from bed.
Schools don’t have to travel kids for regionals
they still have live ones but they are fewer and further between

choir is the same but band competitions (which are generally outside) are live
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Yeah, that's what we need in society - less face-to-face interaction under the guise of health concerns. By far the biggest health concern now is mental health and yet we facilitate hypochondriacs and promote isolation.
 
SurFutbol said:
Why do you think an elite girl can't compete in a soccer game against a trans girl? Is it because you're misogynistic?
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oh man, you do hate women. Just wondering how this scenario plays out in your head. when you say elite are you referring to an elite ulittle girl playing against ulittle boys? Or you are saying elite woman playing in college or professionally against men? Spare me the "it doesn't happen enough to really freak out over it" bs.

By the way, what does misogyny mean to you? Mansplain for me so I can at least understand your view of the word.
 
Woobie06 said:
Hypocrite and Gaslight much…Jesus. It’s very clear that if people do not believe what you believe, your ideology, narrative etc., that others are Phobic, Racist, Intolerant, etc. Look in the mirror…I just don’t agree with you. I have a perspective and because you disagree I am all these things. It’s pretty weird.
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Uh, you are transphobic because you do not have perspective. You are unwilling to consider the legitimate interests of trans children at all. Again, it's one thing to weigh those interests against what you call "a perspective", but you can't recognize the humanity of trans children. That makes you transphobic, pure and simple.

Carry on trying to make yourself feel better about your transphobia and intolerance by accusing those who support equality and fairness of being intolerant.
 
Happened again said:
oh man, you do hate women. Just wondering how this scenario plays out in your head. when you say elite are you referring to an elite ulittle girl playing against ulittle boys? Or you are saying elite woman playing in college or professionally against men? Spare me the "it doesn't happen enough to really freak out over it" bs.

By the way, what does misogyny mean to you? Mansplain for me so I can at least understand your view of the word.
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In reality, it has never happened that a trans girl has dominated an elite girls soccer game. Spare me this nonsense about how it allegedly happens sometimes. Also spare me this nonsense about how making sure your little princess wins a trophy is more important than the interests of trans children.
 
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