Trans eligibility rules for girls sports.

[MARsSPEED]

IKR. Trans people and their enablers like me are just so powerful. You are such a victim.

I was waiting for someone to mention this poll. Presumably, even someone as dumb as you can figure out why it doesn't support what you claim. Of course, most people are going to say they oppose trans participation in sports when they aren't given any options about differences between kiddie, collegiate and professional sports. Of course a majority of Americans oppose what happened with Lia Thomas. Of course a majority of Americans oppose trans women from participating in NCAA or professional sports without testosterone suppression. A generic poll like this is no more appropriate than one that asks people whether they are pro- or anti-abortion without giving them the opportunity to address rape or incest.

Regardless, you seem to mistake what a poll says for what is right. A majority of Americans also hated gay people as recently as 2012, with very similar percentages of evil republicans leading the hate, as is the case in your poll. And before a majority of Americans hated gay people, they hated black people.

So please tell me more about this Jesus fella. I understand that his resurrection means it is no longer mandatory to stone gay and trans people to death anymore, but does it also mean that it's suddenly ok to be gay or trans and that his daddy was wrong initially when he wrote the parts of the bible that you want to pretend don't exist? Or does Jesus teach you that being gay and trans is still wrong, and it's therefore ok to deprive them of civil rights even if it's no longer mandatory to stone them to death? Does your buddy Jesus draw the (chalk) line in his direction to support for the downtrodden if it means they might deprive your little princess of a trophy? Honestly, I missed that part of the Bible that says ECNL can't have empathy towards trans children and must therefore be denied their free market right to decide who may and may not participate. Seriously, can you show me that part of the Bible that says we must ban trans kids? Are you saying that the bible was wrong when it says "Similarly, if anyone competes as an athlete, he does not receive the victor's crown unless he competes according to the rules"? Doesn't this mean you need to STFU and just accept your kiddie losing a trophy because ECNL rules allowed trans participation? It seems to me that all of your Karen-y whining is very anti-bible because you don't want to compete according to the rules.

You are such trash. Just like your media. You take things out of context and completely turn them around. Then you start making up the thoughts and opinions of those that oppose your feelings. Absolutely delusional. Being gay has no affect on competitive sports except maybe a few homophobics. Being trans and MTF has A DIRECT AFFECT on girls/womens sports. Example? FTM athletes can't make male teams so you will never hear an outcry. Like ever. I don't know why you are too stupid to understand the difference between the two and nor can I understand why you keep using bigotry as an argument. I'll never support it and it is sad that such a small group of progressives can push these kind of agendas.

I'd stay and debate but as always, I realize you are a 100% waste of time and its not worth the effort. Then I make the unfortunate error in checking into this thread, rinse and repeat.

BTW, in just a short time, we are now the laughing stock of morality World Wide. You thought Biden was the savior and now things are only worse. Even Europe is now on a different page about the Trans Community yet alone the rest of the world. Closest to Nuclear War since the Cuba Missile Crisis (which BTW Putin just suspended the START treaty so that may happen again), spending BILLIONS on Ukraine but not our own citizens, much of the World now questioning the CoVid narrative AND the vaccine but no worries, H5N1 looks like it might make everyone show what a real illness looks like (how Ironic the timing...), oh and we have the most expensive groceries due to inflation rates that dated back to 80s. I won't bother on reminding you about how things looked pre-covid because I know you are brain washed.

 

[SurFutbol]

Nice try turkey neck. Your gaslighting skills are as dogshit as your dinner table conversations. Maybe once those nuts clear your throat you'll have a usable pair.

You just love the homophobic insults, don't you? Just a suggestion, but you really should be paying more attention to what your daughter is doing with other people's nuts. As previously stated, a lot of you transphobes have some pretty terrible soccer player daughters. Given your behavior, I fear both of you are having a hard time accepting that. It is not uncommon for girls who are going through self-esteem issues to compensate through sex, and presumably you don't want her getting preggers in HS.

So just to be clear….

1. You really don’t think the Trans Young Lady has a physiological advantage over her Biological Female competitors, is that correct?
2. Or, If you do think there is an advantage, you don’t think it matters because the teams are non-competitive in the grand scheme of high school basketball in that state, is that correct?

So who decides when the competitiveness of the event matters enough? Only D1 HS???

If you have ever heard the sayings “if you give someone an inch, they will take a yard, or death by a million cuts”…when you crack the door it sometimes gets blown wide open.

This is where the discussion gets challenging, you think people like me who have a different perspective are blaming the trans girl. I don’t blame her, I’m positive she and her family are dealing with a lot. I’m sure she just wants to play. I blame the Woke Politicians, School Districts, States, Governing Bodies, etc. for allowing the participation in competitive sports where an individual(s) has a distinct physiological advantage. Allowing Biological Males to participate in Biological Female sports takes opportunities away from Biological Females. Allowing it because of the way somebody feels, identifies, due to Dysphoria, etc., etc., does not change the fact that the Trans Girl is a Biological Male who has physiological advantages. Biological Females should not have opportunities taken away because somebody is more comfortable or feels better playing and being with opposite sex.

We talked about Coed Sports, I worked at an indoor soccer facility as a Teenager, ran the scoreboard…we had Coed Adult Leagues…Men had to play 2 touch on shooting plays, could only score from behind a line, and then only from a pass from a women, and had to have 3 women on the field at all times, why do you think rules like this were in place? To ensure Biological Males did not dominate the game, and to create a fair playing field. How do you create fair and equitable in Team Sports with Biological Males and Females competing on the same team without changing the rules of the game. You can’t. It is forcing Biological Females to just deal with it, live with it, and just accept it. Just does not seem right for them to give up opportunities. Individual sports are different and think that can be solved…team sports are different animals. This whole issue is very unique to the mtf vs ftm.

To answer your questions:

1. She has a likely physiological advantage over the person she would have been if she had been born a female, and that is it. The fact that she plays for the #5 seed in what is probably the lowest, worst division of HS basketball in the entire United States, and got destroyed in their second round game, is pretty definitive proof that she does not have a physiological advantage over other girls. She would clearly be a terrible girls' player in any legitimate HS league. But why is it that you keep ignoring the emotional and other disadvantages that counterbalance alleged physiological advantage? Why on earth do you keep pretending that they don't exist? Why is it that you keep trying to delegitimize all of the disadvantages that trans children face in sport?

2. No, it doesn't matter at that age and level. There are very important reasons to support inclusivity that are far more important than whether one of the worst, most transphobic girls' basketball teams in the entire United States loses to a team with a trans player or loses instead to one that doesn't have one. In fact, the Karen team's abysmal behavior and grandstanding shows how critically important it is to allow trans participation given how many shitbag little transphobic Karens still exist. That team would have lost no matter who they played, meaning the trans player would have had no impact to them whatsoever. And why is it that you ignore the benefit that all of the players on the trans team have received as a result of having the privilege to play with a trans player who could help them and their families overcome inaccurate stereotypes?

Yes, I have heard the saying “if you give someone an inch, they will take a yard, or death by a million cuts”. These are lame tropes and excuses to support irrational fears of things that will never happen. Trans participation in sports has been around for decades and proven that all these fake concerns about how trans participation in youth sports will ruin girls sports are completely unfounded. But also keep in mind that your tropes go both ways. If we give transphobic shitbags an inch, they will obviously take a mile. That is exactly what is happening here. All of you lost your minds that one trans woman won an NCAA swim meet, so now you want to deprive a 12 year old girl of playing soccer with those with whom she identifies. I there were ever an example to support your cliche, that is it.

Your fake sympathy is pathetic. You are literally claiming that trans children need to know their place (meaning the place you want them to be) and that those who are actually taking steps to overcome transphobic hate and educate their members are the bad guys here. Although you claim that they are taking away opportunities from cis kids, that is a really myopic and transphobic perspective. The reality is they are providing massive opportunities to kids. They are providing their teammates and opponents who don't forfeit like faux christian hate mongers that there is nothing to fear in life from trans people. They aren't going to make anyone "go trans". They aren't going to rape anyone in the bathroom, they aren't going to cause kiddie sports to get out of balance, and they are going to help teach them that kiddie sports is not very important compared to things that are, like treating others with dignity and respect.

In the end, you will find that most girls who play ECNL don't feel how you do about trans participation. There will always be awful people like that Kareny VT religious cult team that use trans children as an excuse for losing a game they would have lost against anyone, but f**k those cheaters who refuse to play by the rules.

 

[Chelsea dad g09]

You just love the homophobic insults, don't you? Just a suggestion, but you really should be paying more attention to what your daughter is doing with other people's nuts. As previously stated, a lot of you transphobes have some pretty terrible soccer player daughters. Given your behavior, I fear both of you are having a hard time accepting that. It is not uncommon for girls who are going through self-esteem issues to compensate through sex, and presumably you don't want her getting preggers in HS.


To answer your questions:

1. She has a likely physiological advantage over the person she would have been if she had been born a female, and that is it. The fact that she plays for the #5 seed in what is probably the lowest, worst division of HS basketball in the entire United States, and got destroyed in their second round game, is pretty definitive proof that she does not have a physiological advantage over other girls. She would clearly be a terrible girls' player in any legitimate HS league. But why is it that you keep ignoring the emotional and other disadvantages that counterbalance alleged physiological advantage? Why on earth do you keep pretending that they don't exist? Why is it that you keep trying to delegitimize all of the disadvantages that trans children face in sport?

2. No, it doesn't matter at that age and level. There are very important reasons to support inclusivity that are far more important than whether one of the worst, most transphobic girls' basketball teams in the entire United States loses to a team with a trans player or loses instead to one that doesn't have one. In fact, the Karen team's abysmal behavior and grandstanding shows how critically important it is to allow trans participation given how many shitbag little transphobic Karens still exist. That team would have lost no matter who they played, meaning the trans player would have had no impact to them whatsoever. And why is it that you ignore the benefit that all of the players on the trans team have received as a result of having the privilege to play with a trans player who could help them and their families overcome inaccurate stereotypes?

Yes, I have heard the saying “if you give someone an inch, they will take a yard, or death by a million cuts”. These are lame tropes and excuses to support irrational fears of things that will never happen. Trans participation in sports has been around for decades and proven that all these fake concerns about how trans participation in youth sports will ruin girls sports are completely unfounded. But also keep in mind that your tropes go both ways. If we give transphobic shitbags an inch, they will obviously take a mile. That is exactly what is happening here. All of you lost your minds that one trans woman won an NCAA swim meet, so now you want to deprive a 12 year old girl of playing soccer with those with whom she identifies. I there were ever an example to support your cliche, that is it.

Your fake sympathy is pathetic. You are literally claiming that trans children need to know their place (meaning the place you want them to be) and that those who are actually taking steps to overcome transphobic hate and educate their members are the bad guys here. Although you claim that they are taking away opportunities from cis kids, that is a really myopic and transphobic perspective. The reality is they are providing massive opportunities to kids. They are providing their teammates and opponents who don't forfeit like faux christian hate mongers that there is nothing to fear in life from trans people. They aren't going to make anyone "go trans". They aren't going to rape anyone in the bathroom, they aren't going to cause kiddie sports to get out of balance, and they are going to help teach them that kiddie sports is not very important compared to things that are, like treating others with dignity and respect.

In the end, you will find that most girls who play ECNL don't feel how you do about trans participation. There will always be awful people like that Kareny VT religious cult team that use trans children as an excuse for losing a game they would have lost against anyone, but f**k those cheaters who refuse to play by the rules.

Uh oh everyone watch out, someones getting upset. Is this why your wife left?

 

[SurFutbol]

putting Jesus aside for now...are you talking pre or post pubescence? Can't quite figure you out though..now attacking "little Karens"??Mansplaining again or just a genera hater of XX chromosomers? I was hoping you could come out from underneath the blanket of ideology but you can't...

It's like you are in constant rinse and repeat. I've been checking in lately hoping to take in your recommendations for gender affirming care All I've gotten though is bot like sentences, steeped in barristerness and a constant stream of XX and religion hate speech. Was wondering if I could get your take on covid care and the heroic advocacy work you've likely done.

You call it rinse and repeat, but that is only because the reasons that support trans participation in kiddie sports doesn't really change. The same can be said about you clowns who repeatedly litter this place with homophobic and transphobic comments, and have nothing to support your position besides "men are men and women or women".

I also love Christians, just like they love the LGBTQ community. In all seriousness, though, if someone can find the bible passage that explains why ECNL and CIF should not allow trans children to participate, by all means send it. The reality is that too many of you use Christianity hate others and use your purported christianity as a shield to hopefully avoid having to face repercussions because, you know, god says it's ok. But the reality is you can't point to any sound religious basis to ban trans children from kiddie sports. You can only find a religious basis to proclaim they are wrong and bad people, in order to rationalize why you have no empathy for them. And when that is your starting point, I have no respect for you no matter how much you say your abysmal beliefs are off limits because you interpret your bible to rationalize hatred.

I take no position on gender affirming care. If it ever becomes something that impacts my life, I am sure my position will be far more nuanced than your bs neanderthal position on trans participation in sports.

 

[SurFutbol]

You are such trash. Just like your media. You take things out of context and completely turn them around. Then you start making up the thoughts and opinions of those that oppose your feelings. Absolutely delusional. Being gay has no affect on competitive sports except maybe a few homophobics. Being trans and MTF has A DIRECT AFFECT on girls/womens sports. Example? FTM athletes can't make male teams so you will never hear an outcry. Like ever. I don't know why you are too stupid to understand the difference between the two and nor can I understand why you keep using bigotry as an argument. I'll never support it and it is sad that such a small group of progressives can push these kind of agendas.

I'd stay and debate but as always, I realize you are a 100% waste of time and its not worth the effort. Then I make the unfortunate error in checking into this thread, rinse and repeat.

BTW, in just a short time, we are now the laughing stock of morality World Wide. You thought Biden was the savior and now things are only worse. Even Europe is now on a different page about the Trans Community yet alone the rest of the world. Closest to Nuclear War since the Cuba Missile Crisis (which BTW Putin just suspended the START treaty so that may happen again), spending BILLIONS on Ukraine but not our own citizens, much of the World now questioning the CoVid narrative AND the vaccine but no worries, H5N1 looks like it might make everyone show what a real illness looks like (how Ironic the timing...), oh and we have the most expensive groceries due to inflation rates that dated back to 80s. I won't bother on reminding you about how things looked pre-covid because I know you are brain washed.

Yes, I am conspiring with Biden and the media now, in addition to CIF, ECNL, the NCAA, the USWNT, SCOTUS and many others. It is only a matter of time until we are able to leverage our pro trans agenda to cause a nuclear war against Russia and vaccinate everyone into zombies. I think maybe you should take one conspiracy at a time.

I am not surprised, though, that you would gladly sacrifice the lives of hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians if it means saving a dollar a gallon on milk. I mean, although the US has spent trillions of dollars on military equipment for the express purpose of killing Russians, and we now have the opportunity to put it to use without even having to risk our own soldiers, I can certainly see how we should just do nothing while Russians murder hundreds of thousands of people. Letting as many Ukrainians die as it takes to keep the cost of Cheerios under $5 a box is the Christian thing to do, right?

 

[Happened again]

You call it rinse and repeat, but that is only because the reasons that support trans participation in kiddie sports doesn't really change. The same can be said about you clowns who repeatedly litter this place with homophobic and transphobic comments, and have nothing to support your position besides "men are men and women or women".

I also love Christians, just like they love the LGBTQ community. In all seriousness, though, if someone can find the bible passage that explains why ECNL and CIF should not allow trans children to participate, by all means send it. The reality is that too many of you use Christianity hate others and use your purported christianity as a shield to hopefully avoid having to face repercussions because, you know, god says it's ok. But the reality is you can't point to any sound religious basis to ban trans children from kiddie sports. You can only find a religious basis to proclaim they are wrong and bad people, in order to rationalize why you have no empathy for them. And when that is your starting point, I have no respect for you no matter how much you say your abysmal beliefs are off limits because you interpret your bible to rationalize hatred.

I take no position on gender affirming care. If it ever becomes something that impacts my life, I am sure my position will be far more nuanced than your bs neanderthal position on trans participation in sports.

oh sweetie, we are in fact feeding the beast. You make absolutely no sense in your frothiness. The circle is strong with you. lash out at women and christianity...and you think you are offending me by calling me a neanderthal woman. Hilarious.

Science and biology seemingly escapes you.

 

[Chelsea dad g09]

oh sweetie, we are in fact feeding the beast. You make absolutely no sense in your frothiness. The circle is strong with you. lash out at women and christianity...and you think you are offending me by calling me a neanderthal woman. Hilarious.

Science and biology seemingly escapes you.

You forgot body shaming young women.

 

[SurFutbol]

oh sweetie, we are in fact feeding the beast. You make absolutely no sense in your frothiness. The circle is strong with you. lash out at women and christianity...and you think you are offending me by calling me a neanderthal woman. Hilarious.

Science and biology seemingly escapes you.

Again, the laws of the game are not contained in a biology or science textbook. That said, I also understand science and biology perfectly well. I understand, for example, that your genes are likely to be directly responsible for any athletic limitations that prevent your daughter from being able to effectively compete in ECNL against a team with a trans girl. I also understand that the bible is about as anti-science as it gets.

 

[Woobie06]

You just love the homophobic insults, don't you? Just a suggestion, but you really should be paying more attention to what your daughter is doing with other people's nuts. As previously stated, a lot of you transphobes have some pretty terrible soccer player daughters. Given your behavior, I fear both of you are having a hard time accepting that. It is not uncommon for girls who are going through self-esteem issues to compensate through sex, and presumably you don't want her getting preggers in HS.


To answer your questions:

1. She has a likely physiological advantage over the person she would have been if she had been born a female, and that is it. The fact that she plays for the #5 seed in what is probably the lowest, worst division of HS basketball in the entire United States, and got destroyed in their second round game, is pretty definitive proof that she does not have a physiological advantage over other girls. She would clearly be a terrible girls' player in any legitimate HS league. But why is it that you keep ignoring the emotional and other disadvantages that counterbalance alleged physiological advantage? Why on earth do you keep pretending that they don't exist? Why is it that you keep trying to delegitimize all of the disadvantages that trans children face in sport?

2. No, it doesn't matter at that age and level. There are very important reasons to support inclusivity that are far more important than whether one of the worst, most transphobic girls' basketball teams in the entire United States loses to a team with a trans player or loses instead to one that doesn't have one. In fact, the Karen team's abysmal behavior and grandstanding shows how critically important it is to allow trans participation given how many shitbag little transphobic Karens still exist. That team would have lost no matter who they played, meaning the trans player would have had no impact to them whatsoever. And why is it that you ignore the benefit that all of the players on the trans team have received as a result of having the privilege to play with a trans player who could help them and their families overcome inaccurate stereotypes?

Yes, I have heard the saying “if you give someone an inch, they will take a yard, or death by a million cuts”. These are lame tropes and excuses to support irrational fears of things that will never happen. Trans participation in sports has been around for decades and proven that all these fake concerns about how trans participation in youth sports will ruin girls sports are completely unfounded. But also keep in mind that your tropes go both ways. If we give transphobic shitbags an inch, they will obviously take a mile. That is exactly what is happening here. All of you lost your minds that one trans woman won an NCAA swim meet, so now you want to deprive a 12 year old girl of playing soccer with those with whom she identifies. I there were ever an example to support your cliche, that is it.

Your fake sympathy is pathetic. You are literally claiming that trans children need to know their place (meaning the place you want them to be) and that those who are actually taking steps to overcome transphobic hate and educate their members are the bad guys here. Although you claim that they are taking away opportunities from cis kids, that is a really myopic and transphobic perspective. The reality is they are providing massive opportunities to kids. They are providing their teammates and opponents who don't forfeit like faux christian hate mongers that there is nothing to fear in life from trans people. They aren't going to make anyone "go trans". They aren't going to rape anyone in the bathroom, they aren't going to cause kiddie sports to get out of balance, and they are going to help teach them that kiddie sports is not very important compared to things that are, like treating others with dignity and respect.

In the end, you will find that most girls who play ECNL don't feel how you do about trans participation. There will always be awful people like that Kareny VT religious cult team that use trans children as an excuse for losing a game they would have lost against anyone, but f**k those cheaters who refuse to play by the rules.

Interesting Read has some interesting solutions regarding competition and the concerns people have.

A Fair And Inclusive Solution For Transgender Women In Sports

The fact that trans girls and women were born with biologically male bodies means that even after taking hormones or undergoing surgery or both, they don’t fit neatly into female or male categories, biologically speaking.

www.forbes.com

I’m not afraid of Trans Kids or Trans Adults…what is there to be afraid of? It not about trans kids knowing their place, that is just stupid.

Let’s follow along…Trans Girls are not Biological Girls, and Trans Boys are not Biological Boys. Biological Boys are not Biological Girls. There are differences…and if men/women and boys/girls were equal physiologically and athletically, why do we even have men’s and women’s sports and not just sports? Why are we even having the Women’s World Cup this year…

Serious Question…are there Trans Animals? Does any other species present Trans other than Human Beings? Are there trans dogs, cats? I don’t know, never heard of it, is it because it is not naturally occurring, and is here because we made it/created it? Is it because there may be psychological, mental situations, Dysphoria, etc. that are the underlying cause? Did we create Trans to be the Diagnosis for these psychological challenges people are facing with their identities? Is it nature or nurture? Is it that the Biology is not wrong, nature did it’s thing and a XX or XY was born. And if that was the diagnosis, did we create Hormone Therapy Protocols and Cosmetic Surgeries to support the Diagnosis…and in turn that is the “trying” to turn yourself into something you are not through Chemicals and Surgeries. These changes are not natural occurring, we are creating this.

Yes, people did lose their minds on the NCAA Swimming Controversy because it was absolutely ludicrous how it played out and what the “Adults” let transpire. How the NCAA, Penn, and the Media pushed a narrative. You talk about the emotions of Trans Girls, what about those of Biological Girls? Again, these Young Biological Women are forced to just take and accept it. What Penn did to threaten team members (threaten graduation, continuation at school, etc.), was horrible, forcing girls to share locker rooms they were uncomfortable with, only so these organizations could Virtue Signal for Trans Rights. That is not ok. YOU may not think it is a big deal. Many others do, and the pushback to all of this is why many people don’t want to see it happen again or to younger girls. There is not a good model for Trans Women in Biological Women’s Team Sports at this time. Saying just play, is not the answer. Allowing Trans Girls/Women to participate in Biological Women’s sports is done at the expense of Biological Women/Girls. Saying young biological women don’t care, based on what data?

As far as my faux concern or care for kids…believe what you want it does not matter to me.

Trans Women are not Biological Women. Trans Women can’t have babies. Trans Women are Physiologically different. These are undeniable facts. Can Trans Woman give birth, do they have milk ducts to nurse? Because you want something to be the same, create emoji’s, believe it to be the same, act like it is the same, have surgeries to make it look the same, does not make it the same. You can’t wish something into being.

 

[Happened again]

Again, the laws of the game are not contained in a biology or science textbook. That said, I also understand science and biology perfectly well. I understand, for example, that your genes are likely to be directly responsible for any athletic limitations that prevent your daughter from being able to effectively compete in ECNL against a team with a trans girl. I also understand that the bible is about as anti-science as it gets.

Really, not even a teeny, tiny, wittle but of science and biology???Again, the laws of the game are not contained in a biology or science textbook.

As for the rest of your silliness...oooooo, what a burn. I do love how you get your rocks off by shaming XX humans. But continue to do your dance sweet little barrister. Your zigs and zags are quite cute and your heroism is charming.

 

[Grace T.]

Interesting Read has some interesting solutions regarding competition and the concerns people have.

A Fair And Inclusive Solution For Transgender Women In Sports

The fact that trans girls and women were born with biologically male bodies means that even after taking hormones or undergoing surgery or both, they don’t fit neatly into female or male categories, biologically speaking.

www.forbes.com

I’m not afraid of Trans Kids or Trans Adults…what is there to be afraid of? It not about trans kids knowing their place, that is just stupid.

Let’s follow along…Trans Girls are not Biological Girls, and Trans Boys are not Biological Boys. Biological Boys are not Biological Girls. There are differences…and if men/women and boys/girls were equal physiologically and athletically, why do we even have men’s and women’s sports and not just sports? Why are we even having the Women’s World Cup this year…

Serious Question…are there Trans Animals? Does any other species present Trans other than Human Beings? Are there trans dogs, cats? I don’t know, never heard of it, is it because it is not naturally occurring, and is here because we made it/created it? Is it because there may be psychological, mental situations, Dysphoria, etc. that are the underlying cause? Did we create Trans to be the Diagnosis for these psychological challenges people are facing with their identities? Is it nature or nurture? Is it that the Biology is not wrong, nature did it’s thing and a XX or XY was born. And if that was the diagnosis, did we create Hormone Therapy Protocols and Cosmetic Surgeries to support the Diagnosis…and in turn that is the “trying” to turn yourself into something you are not through Chemicals and Surgeries. These changes are not natural occurring, we are creating this.

Yes, people did lose their minds on the NCAA Swimming Controversy because it was absolutely ludicrous how it played out and what the “Adults” let transpire. How the NCAA, Penn, and the Media pushed a narrative. You talk about the emotions of Trans Girls, what about those of Biological Girls? Again, these Young Biological Women are forced to just take and accept it. What Penn did to threaten team members (threaten graduation, continuation at school, etc.), was horrible, forcing girls to share locker rooms they were uncomfortable with, only so these organizations could Virtue Signal for Trans Rights. That is not ok. YOU may not think it is a big deal. Many others do, and the pushback to all of this is why many people don’t want to see it happen again or to younger girls. There is not a good model for Trans Women in Biological Women’s Team Sports at this time. Saying just play, is not the answer. Allowing Trans Girls/Women to participate in Biological Women’s sports is done at the expense of Biological Women/Girls. Saying young biological women don’t care, based on what data?

As far as my faux concern or care for kids…believe what you want it does not matter to me.

Trans Women are not Biological Women. Trans Women can’t have babies. Trans Women are Physiologically different. These are undeniable facts. Can Trans Woman give birth, do they have milk ducts to nurse? Because you want something to be the same, create emoji’s, believe it to be the same, act like it is the same, have surgeries to make it look the same, does not make it the same. You can’t wish something into being.

I keep wanting out but they keep pulling me back in:

-Yes there are "trans" animals (there are also gay animals). The most common example is in bird species...the most typical example of those are beta male who keep the plumage and appearance and behavior of a female in order to avoid being attacked by males. You see it in some antlered mammals too such as moose and deer. You even do see it in dogs and horses (particularly if they have been neutered). In nature, MTF is overwhelmingly more common than FTM but both are nevertheless rare, appearing most often in birds, and interestingly enough, the great apes.
-Why is it more common in some species than others? It's very simple: there's a greater tendency to appear when there is a species divides itself into masculine and feminine characteristics. The greater the differentiation, the more likely it is to appear, hence humans. Humans have built whole jobs, familial roles, religion, and hierarchies based on gender.
-yes, a biological man can nurse. That's a silly point. Lactation is triggered by a the lactation hormone. You can artificially produce the result by injecting a man with the lactation hormone.
-we are getting pretty close to the ability of a biological man being able to carry a child. I was reading something in some science journo about they were attempting a uterus implant. Why you would do this I have no idea. The man would have to be an organ rejection medication, we don't know what that organ rejection medication would do to the fetus, and the fetus would be in high danger in the event of organ rejection. Why, when surrogacy is available, someone would insist on having to carry their child, is absolutely beyond me. But scientists be crazy and they unleashed COVID and nuclear bombs on us so there's that.
-Trans individuals have been documented in history back to ancient Egypt, Greece and Rome. It's not a recent phenom. They seem to have developed independently of each other as well, regardless of influences from other cultures (e.g. it's not just a western thing). Further to my conversation with sockma, the Polynesians are interesting in that they developed a third gender of biological males expressing as females (the "sexy boys" we were talking about). That doesn't appear in other cultures as far as I know.
-What's different in the last 50 years or so is the arrogance of our scientists, who think that they can play god. They convinced themselves they could in fact change a man into a woman, however imperfectly. That's not surprising considering they thought they could control COVID and face planted on that one. The moon landings really did a number on science. The entire "we choose to go to the moon and do these things". It gave them all a god complex. BUT, the technology is getting better and what they know (through trial and error) is getting better and eventually.....
-It's pretty clear that trans, like being gay, is a biological condition. As I posted previously, it's already settled science that the brains of most transgendered individuals appear to have many characteristics of the desired expressed gender. It is literally like having the brain of a woman trapped in a man's body (or vice versa). Can you imagine how nutso that would make you? So you have two choices: treat the brain or treat the body. Given our treatment of the brain is still the stone age (again, see prior discussion regarding ADHD), that doesn't give you very many good options.
-The prevailing theory, based on the 2020 study I posted, is that shortly before birth women have a burst of estrogen, the female sex hormone. There's something wrong in the MTF female hormone receptors that they imperfectly block this. As a result, the genetic flaw blocks the male brain from undergoing the masculinization process. They aren't sure about FTM but they suggest it may be an issue with the mother having an imperfect burst of the estrogen needed to feminize the brain.

 

[Grace T.]

I keep wanting out but they keep pulling me back in:

-Yes there are "trans" animals (there are also gay animals). The most common example is in bird species...the most typical example of those are beta male who keep the plumage and appearance and behavior of a female in order to avoid being attacked by males. You see it in some antlered mammals too such as moose and deer. You even do see it in dogs and horses (particularly if they have been neutered). In nature, MTF is overwhelmingly more common than FTM but both are nevertheless rare, appearing most often in birds, and interestingly enough, the great apes.
-Why is it more common in some species than others? It's very simple: there's a greater tendency to appear when there is a species divides itself into masculine and feminine characteristics. The greater the differentiation, the more likely it is to appear, hence humans. Humans have built whole jobs, familial roles, religion, and hierarchies based on gender.
-yes, a biological man can nurse. That's a silly point. Lactation is triggered by a the lactation hormone. You can artificially produce the result by injecting a man with the lactation hormone.
-we are getting pretty close to the ability of a biological man being able to carry a child. I was reading something in some science journo about they were attempting a uterus implant. Why you would do this I have no idea. The man would have to be an organ rejection medication, we don't know what that organ rejection medication would do to the fetus, and the fetus would be in high danger in the event of organ rejection. Why, when surrogacy is available, someone would insist on having to carry their child, is absolutely beyond me. But scientists be crazy and they unleashed COVID and nuclear bombs on us so there's that.
-Trans individuals have been documented in history back to ancient Egypt, Greece and Rome. It's not a recent phenom. They seem to have developed independently of each other as well, regardless of influences from other cultures (e.g. it's not just a western thing). Further to my conversation with sockma, the Polynesians are interesting in that they developed a third gender of biological males expressing as females (the "sexy boys" we were talking about). That doesn't appear in other cultures as far as I know.
-What's different in the last 50 years or so is the arrogance of our scientists, who think that they can play god. They convinced themselves they could in fact change a man into a woman, however imperfectly. That's not surprising considering they thought they could control COVID and face planted on that one. The moon landings really did a number on science. The entire "we choose to go to the moon and do these things". It gave them all a god complex. BUT, the technology is getting better and what they know (through trial and error) is getting better and eventually.....
-It's pretty clear that trans, like being gay, is a biological condition. As I posted previously, it's already settled science that the brains of most transgendered individuals appear to have many characteristics of the desired expressed gender. It is literally like having the brain of a woman trapped in a man's body (or vice versa). Can you imagine how nutso that would make you? So you have two choices: treat the brain or treat the body. Given our treatment of the brain is still the stone age (again, see prior discussion regarding ADHD), that doesn't give you very many good options.
-The prevailing theory, based on the 2020 study I posted, is that shortly before birth women have a burst of estrogen, the female sex hormone. There's something wrong in the MTF female hormone receptors that they imperfectly block this. As a result, the genetic flaw blocks the male brain from undergoing the masculinization process. They aren't sure about FTM but they suggest it may be an issue with the mother having an imperfect burst of the estrogen needed to feminize the brain.

p.s. I just thought about it (a little "eureka" moment) but that would also explain a lot why there are girls that try and express as "nonbinary" (there are far more girls expressing "nonbinary" if the UC school survey is to be believed than there are men expressing MTF). Part of it may be social acculturation and the fact it's the in thing for progressives to do, and other conditions such as depression or eating disorders. BUT, if it is the result of the mother having an imperfect estrogen burst, it would seem to be that the degree of femininity might be correlated to the robustness of the mother's burst, whereas in the case of a MTF it's that the brain can't adequately protect itself from the onslaught of the mother's hormones. Fascinating....

 

[Woobie06]

p.s. I just thought about it (a little "eureka" moment) but that would also explain a lot why there are girls that try and express as "nonbinary" (there are far more girls expressing "nonbinary" if the UC school survey is to be believed than there are men expressing MTF). Part of it may be social acculturation and the fact it's the in thing for progressives to do, and other conditions such as depression or eating disorders. BUT, if it is the result of the mother having an imperfect estrogen burst, it would seem to be that the degree of femininity might be correlated to the robustness of the mother's burst, whereas in the case of a MTF it's that the brain can't adequately protect itself from the onslaught of the mother's hormones. Fascinating....

Thanks for the reply. It is fascinating, It’s a lot of info, my point is we are engineering these changes, implanting uterus’, surgeries for nursing, my point is all of this is not naturally occurring. It is being created. “Getting close for a Male to have a baby”…we are experimenting on people. I agree about the god complex of Dr.’s, the Surgeries, the subscriptions or prescriptions depending on what you think.

If people want/need to change their bodies, surgeries, hormone therapy’s, implanted organs, etc.,.more power to them. Please pursue any means you need to feel happy, whole, and at peace with yourself. People need to find their happy. More power to them. I have no horse in the here are also a lot of people who have regret after all these changes to their bodies that can’t be undone.

In Ancient Rome, Egypt, Greece, were they Trans or were they Gay? I agree 100% with you that you don’t choose being Gay. I also agree it would be horrible to feel trapped in another’s body.

It’s a very tricky prospect when we start trying to manage, control, out-think or out-maneuver nature; genetically engineer plants, crops, animals, meat, people…

A lot of the hierarchy’s you mentioned have a lot to do with Biology, evolution, sex, hunter/gatherers, when your physiology, ability to child beat, and strength dictated your role.

There is a lot to it…and we are no closer to having a level playing field in sports when trying to mix Biological Women/Girls Sports with Trans Women/Girl Athletes.

There was actually a GK at UC-Santa Cruz a few years ago who is Transgender. She played JUCO for two years and the played and started quite a bit at UC-Santa Cruz. Coach, AD, and I think a Compliance Officer were the only ones aware and worked with the NCAA on it. She did not disclose to her teammates until after she was done playing her Senior year. It’s all a very interesting story.

 

[dad4]

Interesting Read has some interesting solutions regarding competition and the concerns people have.

A Fair And Inclusive Solution For Transgender Women In Sports

The fact that trans girls and women were born with biologically male bodies means that even after taking hormones or undergoing surgery or both, they don’t fit neatly into female or male categories, biologically speaking.

www.forbes.com

I’m not afraid of Trans Kids or Trans Adults…what is there to be afraid of? It not about trans kids knowing their place, that is just stupid.

Let’s follow along…Trans Girls are not Biological Girls, and Trans Boys are not Biological Boys. Biological Boys are not Biological Girls. There are differences…and if men/women and boys/girls were equal physiologically and athletically, why do we even have men’s and women’s sports and not just sports? Why are we even having the Women’s World Cup this year…

Serious Question…are there Trans Animals? Does any other species present Trans other than Human Beings? Are there trans dogs, cats? I don’t know, never heard of it, is it because it is not naturally occurring, and is here because we made it/created it? Is it because there may be psychological, mental situations, Dysphoria, etc. that are the underlying cause? Did we create Trans to be the Diagnosis for these psychological challenges people are facing with their identities? Is it nature or nurture? Is it that the Biology is not wrong, nature did it’s thing and a XX or XY was born. And if that was the diagnosis, did we create Hormone Therapy Protocols and Cosmetic Surgeries to support the Diagnosis…and in turn that is the “trying” to turn yourself into something you are not through Chemicals and Surgeries. These changes are not natural occurring, we are creating this.

Yes, people did lose their minds on the NCAA Swimming Controversy because it was absolutely ludicrous how it played out and what the “Adults” let transpire. How the NCAA, Penn, and the Media pushed a narrative. You talk about the emotions of Trans Girls, what about those of Biological Girls? Again, these Young Biological Women are forced to just take and accept it. What Penn did to threaten team members (threaten graduation, continuation at school, etc.), was horrible, forcing girls to share locker rooms they were uncomfortable with, only so these organizations could Virtue Signal for Trans Rights. That is not ok. YOU may not think it is a big deal. Many others do, and the pushback to all of this is why many people don’t want to see it happen again or to younger girls. There is not a good model for Trans Women in Biological Women’s Team Sports at this time. Saying just play, is not the answer. Allowing Trans Girls/Women to participate in Biological Women’s sports is done at the expense of Biological Women/Girls. Saying young biological women don’t care, based on what data?

As far as my faux concern or care for kids…believe what you want it does not matter to me.

Trans Women are not Biological Women. Trans Women can’t have babies. Trans Women are Physiologically different. These are undeniable facts. Can Trans Woman give birth, do they have milk ducts to nurse? Because you want something to be the same, create emoji’s, believe it to be the same, act like it is the same, have surgeries to make it look the same, does not make it the same. You can’t wish something into being.

It's a good article, and a reasonable suggestion.

Regional teams for trans athletes in team sports makes sense.

 

[Grace T.]

p.s. I just thought about it (a little "eureka" moment) but that would also explain a lot why there are girls that try and express as "nonbinary" (there are far more girls expressing "nonbinary" if the UC school survey is to be believed than there are men expressing MTF). Part of it may be social acculturation and the fact it's the in thing for progressives to do, and other conditions such as depression or eating disorders. BUT, if it is the result of the mother having an imperfect estrogen burst, it would seem to be that the degree of femininity might be correlated to the robustness of the mother's burst, whereas in the case of a MTF it's that the brain can't adequately protect itself from the onslaught of the mother's hormones. Fascinating....

p.p.s. the entire "ask a biologist" thing is the most stupid thing ever. The reason why is because there's a fierce division among biologists now over how to classify things. The primatologist Phil Kloer for example has pointed out it's impossible for biologists to ever firmly determine if an animal is trans because other than some of cetaceans, they are incapable of complex speech (dogs being limited to maybe a hundred words, apes to several hundred). Kloer points out a lot of the hysteria is that because in many human languages we use the word "sex" to mean a variety of things including the act, the biological gender, the genetic composition and the gender expression. BUT, it is clear that there are apes going around assuming gender roles that are different than which they were born, and in both directions. For example, he writes about one ape that insisted on using the female bathroom, hung out with the female nursery, failed to associate with the other boys or engage in typical chimp challenge behavior. Does it consider itself female? We don't know, but it certainly acts like one. The answer to the question therefore turns on whether you believe masculinity and femininity is a social construct or something innate to biology.

Thanks for the reply. It is fascinating, It’s a lot of info, my point is we are engineering these changes, implanting uterus’, surgeries for nursing, my point is all of this is not naturally occurring. It is being created. “Getting close for a Male to have a baby”…we are experimenting on people. I agree about the god complex of Dr.’s, the Surgeries, the subscriptions or prescriptions depending on what you think.

If people want/need to change their bodies, surgeries, hormone therapy’s, implanted organs, etc.,.more power to them. Please pursue any means you need to feel happy, whole, and at peace with yourself. People need to find their happy. More power to them. I have no horse in the here are also a lot of people who have regret after all these changes to their bodies that can’t be undone.

In Ancient Rome, Egypt, Greece, were they Trans or were they Gay? I agree 100% with you that you don’t choose being Gay. I also agree it would be horrible to feel trapped in another’s body.

It’s a very tricky prospect when we start trying to manage, control, out-think or out-maneuver nature; genetically engineer plants, crops, animals, meat, people…

A lot of the hierarchy’s you mentioned have a lot to do with Biology, evolution, sex, hunter/gatherers, when your physiology, ability to child beat, and strength dictated your role.

There is a lot to it…and we are no closer to having a level playing field in sports when trying to mix Biological Women/Girls Sports with Trans Women/Girl Athletes.

There was actually a GK at UC-Santa Cruz a few years ago who is Transgender. She played JUCO for two years and the played and started quite a bit at UC-Santa Cruz. Coach, AD, and I think a Compliance Officer were the only ones aware and worked with the NCAA on it. She did not disclose to her teammates until after she was done playing her Senior year. It’s all a very interesting story.

cool story. Belies the “they are all obvious” remark dad 4

as for the we’re they gay or were they trans issue Roman culture is illustrative. It was perfectly respectable for a boy to have a sexual encounter with more powerful alpha men for position and advancement. Indeed Augustus was rumored to have had such a relationship with Caesar which is why it was rumored Caesar left him as his heir. But it was not respectable for a man or boy to don a woman’s garment in such an affair and someone doing that would find themselves ejected from polite equestrian society. The ancients overall were generally more tolerant of both and western culture doesn’t begin to shun either until: a) the judeo influences since the ancient Israelites were generally odd ducks out in ancient society both with monotheism and their sexual mores, and b) the empire and the morality laws of emperors like Augustus and Claudius (Caligula being both famously a male and female god, and both bi and a trans flirt)

the division is harder to measure in the great apes where among chimps it appears with up to 9% of them. I read de waals “differences” over the pandemic and it is hard to draw the line since they can’t express what they identify as verbally. But the measure they generally use is do they adopt masculine or feminine roles or are they just males interested in other males. Even under the more conservative estimates trans mtf run higher in the great apes and monkeys than humans

Ps the article in interesting. I don’t think regional teams works though. Too much insistence of playing for your school. Other than basketball though team sports shouldn’t make a difference.

 

[crush]

March is the month we celebrate women from all over the world and all the great accomplishments they have done over the centuries. It wasn't too long that women were not allowed to be actress's in plays. The men dressed up and played the role of the women because it was illegal for any woman to be in the plays. Now their back at it. The men are stealing and cheating biological women opportunities to work, play sports and just be a female because they hate the female and want them out of the game of life. Hershey kisses the female goodbye (Her She Y) is all in for the man. So sad. They should just change the name to, Himhey (Him He Y) Crazy times were all living in. BTW, my profile buddy (Ph.D. Phycological Profiler) is doing a human experience on this thread. Espola and Surf Futbol are coming to light with my Dr friend and oh boy, his findings on both of these avatars are very interesting. I will report back his final findings. It's a trip and Doc is so smart and can read folks real well. TGIFF and always remember God loves you all.

 

[crush]

It's never too late to become a woman. Tiffany is the new winner of all the records.

Transgender Athlete Wins (too bad for the slow women) Four Consecutive Races, Smashes Records

A 50 year-old Canadian transgender woman is racking up racing victories like nobody’s business, according to reports.

Tiffany Newell, a 50 year-old transgender woman, first started their transition in 2017. In 2020, Newell claimed to meet the requirements set by the World Athletics guidelines to allow transgender competitors.

On Jan. 8, 2023, Newell won the women’s 3000 meter event at the Winter Mini Meet for the 45-49 year-old cohort. In the days following, Newell would then go onto win the women’s 5000 meter event for the same age cohort.

Newell followed up these achievements Feb. 5 by winning first place in the 1500 meter event for women aged 45-49.

Following a birthday, Newell competed in a competition that ran from Feb. 23 through 26. and repeated the accomplishment, winning the 1,500 meter race for the 50-54 women age group.

 

[whatithink]

In Ancient Rome, Egypt, Greece, were they Trans or were they Gay?

While I realize this thread goes off on weird tangents, it's a bit random to suddenly ask how people were labelled 2,000, 3000 or 4,000 years ago as if that were somehow relevant!

 

[crush]

While I realize this thread goes off on weird tangents, it's a bit random to suddenly ask how people were labelled 2,000, 3000 or 4,000 years ago as if that were somehow relevant!

You can say that again. Welcome back by the way. I'm still waiting for tenacious and husker to come and chat it up. Sodom and Gomora is very interesting story from thousands of years ago. Not sure if it's a true story or just more lies about history. According to legend, the men back then were horny for the other men and did whatever they wanted to the men of that town. Forget rape, you were subjects and did whatever the men in power wanted. Then Paul wrote some stuff to the church in Rome 2000 years ago. I am for freedom of choice but this is not freedom anymore today. The men are stealing and cheating women out of life's opportunities. That's what i think and let's all be happy that today is THGIFF!

 

[Grace T.]

While I realize this thread goes off on weird tangents, it's a bit random to suddenly ask how people were labelled 2,000, 3000 or 4,000 years ago as if that were somehow relevant!

The issue implied was that this is somehow new and doesn’t even appear in nature. That’s incorrect. It isn’t new and does appear in nature. The only thing that is really new is our ability to do anything about it. It’s the same with adhd. Has always existed. The only thing that’s new id the ability to do anything about it (and demands of modern society). Treatments for both are still not quite Stone Age but definitely Bronze Age.

the other thing that is fairly new is the labeling, at least in the west. There wasn’t so much a bi gay trans distinction. Yes there were people that fit into each description, and yes Roman society for example was much more forgiving of bi than trans and even expected men to engage in experimentation. You see the labeling come in with the Judaic influences in the west. They were the odd ducks of the ancient world with their one god and their various social rules. The early Christiana took on many of those rules, pushed along by the second factor which was the sense of some patricians that the empire was in moral decline and that sought to distinguish themselves from the excesses of a Caligula or Nero. Christianity and Roman Puritanism hit at the same time in imperial Rome to create the moral standards that lived on until the 20th century and its high point of progressivism and prohibition.