Bad News Thread

dad4 said:
It is fair to exclude stock space and office space, just as you should exclude the office and utility space in the church. For Costco, this changes very little. The vast majority of their space is in the main shopping area.

But you don’t exclude inventory space in the main room. That volume is still part of the main airflow, and that volume still helps the aerosols disperse. Similarly, you should not exclude the pulpit or the chancel in the sanctuary. It’s part of the airflow in the main room.

Measured by people per square foot or cubic foot in the main room, Costco is far less dense than almost any church. Any church with 150 square feet per parishioner is probably very close to closing. (that would be a living room worth of space around every couple attending church. Eerily quiet.)

Main point is that fire occupancy is the wrong way to think of airborne disease risk. Cubic feet per person or square feet per person make more sense. The court’s standard is a-scientific nonsense.
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Mainline churches were constructed with large crowds in mind. You are very clearly not aware of the decline they’ve gone through. Ours has a huge sanctuary built in 3 levels + choir loft + the Dias. There’s no taxes on the place and it’s all paid for with repair costs the biggest expense. On Easter Sunday and Christmas, the sanctuary first floor, with no open spaces between families, would be 1/2 occupied

this is not true of course for Mormon or evangelical churches but it’s their call whether the ministers want to offer multiple services. It is true of many Catholic Churches using sanctuaries built before 1960 when the churches began to go into decline.

the point is the standard whether church or store is required to be neutral. Either way my own church by fire code or cubic feet per person, knowing 1/2 the congregation (most over 50) would not show up, would easily pass muster. And yes services in the sanctuary on a holiday weekend would be eerily quiet as they would in many mainline churches. It’s why we normally worship in the chapel which is usually crowded and would not pass muster under this test
 
There’s an anti Pfizer whisper campaign afoot in Europe. It’s based on the claims that the mRNA vaccines cause myocarditis. Some are blaming the Russian government which is trying to push its Sputnik vaccines. Others say it’s az which had a study leaked showing incidents of deaths (not necessarily correlated) were greater with the Pfizer vaccine than with the az vaccine.
 
Grace T. said:
As kicker points out not everywhere in the Costco is being used for shopping. What’s more is there is a prolonged concentration of people next to each other at bottle necks such as the check out (10-15 minutes on a Saturday afternoon). So I’m breathing in the air not just of 25 families but 200 that have been concentrated in that area for the last hour. Plus I might be standing right next to someone for 15 minutes who is actively ill. Again it’s all nice in theory but the real world simply doesn’t work that way. And as usual I point out it’s why businesses do not put the theoreticians in charge of making the final call because you all get lost in the math.

The concentration of people and the amount of time spent in a Costco on a Saturday afternoon is excess of the truncated service of 25 families spread out in a large sanctuary. You even started out by conceding that in your post up above but changed your mind when the result didn’t line up with your thinking, as always.

But in any case, to circle around, a standard that emphasizes neutral standards of time and concentration of people would likely survive scrutiny from the courts. Standards that declare churches non essential or single out churches from other establishments would not. You can argue whether that’s wise or should be the case but that is the way the ruling breaks down.
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If we agree that a people per square foot standard survives, then we can stop with the “all restrictions are illegal” line of reasoning.

At most, we can say that Newsom wrote his restrictions the wrong way. He should have just said 5 people per 1000 square feet, plus 6 feet distance and a minimum air cycling standard.
 
Good vs Evil: The Two Doors of Life​

Door #1 is Jesus Christ The Winner. Freedom, forgiveness, mercy, grace, love, joy, peace & happiness, no more disease, no more fear, no more hate and just a fun guy to be around.

Door #2 is Lucifer The Loser. Slave, hate, division, murder, abortion, harvest baby parts, torture baby and then drink blood from Pineal Gland and eat that too for the ultimate high on earth. Have the world and everything the world brings: Sex, drugs and rock and roll. Cheating and more cheating so one can look good all the time, abuse kids in foster care, steal kids for human trafficking, drink more blood to get high, sell soul, rape, lie and more lies. Live a life of a Big Lie. Lie and more lie and just die. That is not a good life and brings heart ache to one's soul.

I hear it's going to get really scary soon. It's going to get dark. Lean on Him and He will take good care of you. Love you all, regardless of what door you choose. I know someone who is atheist and he just told me that he believes in UFOs now. I told him those are Angels bro and he got all mad at me. I love my pal :)
 
dad4 said:
If we agree that a people per square foot standard survives, then we can stop with the “all restrictions are illegal” line of reasoning.

At most, we can say that Newsom wrote his restrictions the wrong way. He should have just said 5 people per 1000 square feet, plus 6 feet distance and a minimum air cycling standard.
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That would have survived if he applied it equally across all establishments and not singled out churches. But schools would still be shut, no?
 
Grace T. said:
That would have survived if he applied it equally across all establishments and not singled out churches. But schools would still be shut, no?
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The other thing which might have survived at the time and could have peeled off some cons is very narrowly defining essential as necessary for survival. But that would have meant schools must close, dentists limited to emergency care, no weed or alcohol shops open, no takeout....only grocery fire police medical and pharmacies and the blm stuff would have complicated things
 
dad4 said:
At most, we can say that Newsom wrote his restrictions the wrong way.
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...or that it didn’t matter how the restrictions were written because by the time they were challenged though the court system the surge or peak would have passed.
 
N00B said:
...or that it didn’t matter how the restrictions were written because by the time they were challenged though the court system the surge or peak would have passed.
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A. But the precedent has now been set of it needs to be used again and
B. It most definitely impacted the way newsom was able to manage the winter surge and it also forced him into settlements with religious schools in some areas keeping them open.
 
Grace T. said:
A. But the precedent has now been set of it needs to be used again and
B. It most definitely impacted the way newsom was able to manage the winter surge and it also forced him into settlements with religious schools in some areas keeping them open.
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If there is a pandemic in the future, there will be a much quicker rush to the courts than what happened this time, because of the beating the restrictions took in the court.
 
Are we seriously arguing about the volume of air in Costcos and churches? Whatever standard of occupancy is set is speculative at best and largely irrelevant. It seems we're completely missing the bigger picture. The virus doesn't give a shit about micromanagement. Staying 6 feet away from non-household members is probably the best we can do.

For the next pandemic are we going to get epidemiologist decoder rings, so we know which ones to believe vs. the ones to ignore?
 
watfly said:
Are we seriously arguing about the volume of air in Costcos and churches? Whatever standard of occupancy is set is speculative at best and largely irrelevant. It seems we're completely missing the bigger picture. The virus doesn't give a shit about micromanagement. Staying 6 feet away from non-household members is probably the best we can do.

For the next pandemic are we going to get epidemiologist decoder rings, so we know which ones to believe vs. the ones to ignore?
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The virus was going to spread no matter what. The reality is people had to go to the store, get gas, etc. A significant amount of people had to work, etc. When you look at that, the virus was going to spread.

At best maybe people learn to stay home when they don't feel well.
 
dad4 said:
I think you’re having trouble thinking in terms of people per square foot.

Imagine what your church would look like if, after you all sit down, you bring in a large shopping cart for each person. Then bring in a bunch of shelving to hold all the boxes. That’s what Costco would look lime if it were actually as crowded as a church or a theater.

Costco feels crowded only because there is no room for the shelves and the shopping carts. The next time you are at a grocery store, take a guess at how many people are within a 20 meter radius. Then do the same for your church or theater. There is no comparison. The seated venue is far more crowded.
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Always good for a laugh.
 
C+C+P+Dr. F+Abortion+HC+Vax+Vax Booster x pie+Billy Boy x Tommy Boy= WMD+Evil= Satan or some like to call Lucifer!!! He's captured folks. Think about that for a moment. My sources and rumor mill is backing me up 100%. Clean up time has been going on. Arrest too so sit back and watch with your eyes. God really does love us all. Jesus came to save, not judge you. He knows way more then Santa and the NSA combined. He knows motive as well. Bad people can become good, trust me. Bad people WHO become evil is not good. Look, if you got caught with kick back and hand in cookie jar, stop doing that and be good from now on. It's a choice :) If you get confronted and you know you cheated, stop cheating and say sorry. Dont get all defensive and act like you did nothing wrong.
 
Grace T. said:
roh roh.....

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1398252182609154056
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Yep.

And over the past couple of months his story on the lab in China has changed. Last year he was telling us this was a naturally occurring virus. The press happily went along and was not curious as to the origin of the virus be it natural or man made.

Now that it doesn't matter any more, suddenly it isn't some conspiracy story any more. Hell the Wash Post just the other day basically said their reporting early on was partisan. Since Trump said it may have came from a lab, the Post and others took the other position.

We would be far better off if people realized that the press is highly partisan in this country. Most support one party. Most in their reporting help to create divisions in this country that would normally not be there.
 
Desert Hound said:
Yep.

And over the past couple of months his story on the lab in China has changed. Last year he was telling us this was a naturally occurring virus. The press happily went along and was not curious as to the origin of the virus be it natural or man made.

Now that it doesn't matter any more, suddenly it isn't some conspiracy story any more. Hell the Wash Post just the other day basically said their reporting early on was partisan. Since Trump said it may have came from a lab, the Post and others took the other position.

We would be far better off if people realized that the press is highly partisan in this country. Most support one party. Most in their reporting help to create divisions in this country that would normally not be there.
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Hey Hound, we've all been lied too. Natural virus my ass bro. This is game on!!!
 
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