Vaccine

Dr. Fraud wants to make things very simple for everyone. If you got the jabs, you need to get the booster after 6 months of the 2nd jab. He thinks booster for a while and is not sure when normal will be back. Simple is simple. He said nothing about the religious folks and Native Americans who strongly hold to ancient believe that nothing impure can enter one's blood and no one can do experiment on another human without authorization and consent by the one being experimented on. Two way agreement has to enforced.
 
You did miss the point.

VT has the highest cases they ever have had since the beginning of this.

The point is the vaxx is not stopping the spread of the virus. If it did, in a state with the highest vax rate, they would not or should not be experiencing their highest spike in cases.
“the highest case rate they have ever had.“. That is a meaningless phrase. It sounds like it makes a point, but it doesn’t.

My 3 year old nephew is the tallest he has ever been. That doesn’t make him tall.
 
I’d certainly prefer we all choose a 95% vax rate, upgraded ventilation, and cloth masks for flu season. A lot fewer deaths that way.

But that’s not the path we picked. We chose a 60% vax rate, existing ventilation, and no masks. So we will get annual case and death spikes every winter, whatever is needed to create enough natural immunity to balance things out.
Doesn't your preferred scenario depend on the assumption that the flu wouldn't mutate to be more highly infectious - as COVID has? By wearing masks all the time, don't we create an environment that promotes the growth of highly aerosolized viruses? By reducing the number of illnesses each year, don't we also put ourselves in a position where our natural immunity is lower as a population and more susceptible to a catastrophically large outbreak when a virus finds a way? I just wonder how much of this we can actually control - beyond the moment. It reminds me a little of the Trolley dilemma @Grace T. brought up earlier. My current thoughts are that I am now a bigger proponent of antivirals and not as big a proponent of vaccines as I was at the beginning of the pandemic. I am not anti-Vax - at least by my definition of anti-Vax - but my position has definitely moved.
 
“the highest case rate they have ever had.“. That is a meaningless phrase. It sounds like it makes a point, but it doesn’t.

My 3 year old nephew is the tallest he has ever been. That doesn’t make him tall.

The parents who track each milestone on the wall, not to mention probably most proud 3 years olds, would disagree the new milestone is meaningless.
 
Doesn't your preferred scenario depend on the assumption that the flu wouldn't mutate to be more highly infectious - as COVID has? By wearing masks all the time, don't we create an environment that promotes the growth of highly aerosolized viruses? By reducing the number of illnesses each year, don't we also put ourselves in a position where our natural immunity is lower as a population and more susceptible to a catastrophically large outbreak when a virus finds a way? I just wonder how much of this we can actually control - beyond the moment. It reminds me a little of the Trolley dilemma @Grace T. brought up earlier. My current thoughts are that I am now a bigger proponent of antivirals and not as big a proponent of vaccines as I was at the beginning of the pandemic. I am not anti-Vax - at least by my definition of anti-Vax - but my position has definitely moved.

mine too. I was a few months ago open to the idea of adult state and local mandates (opposed to kids and federal). I don't really see the point now.
 
”Can we acheive herd immunity with a 60% vax rate and 2019 behavior patterns” is a perfectly reasonable question.

It is just a different question from “can we achieve herd immunity”.

You claim to be asking the second, then insist on pivoting to the first.
That herd is at about 8 billion today. Please continue.
 
Well, I get my Covid booster tomorrow and flu shot on Saturday. For some strange reason, it took over 15 minutes to set up the appointments last week. They allow getting both at the same time if you can find a spot that does both and has openings. It didn't help that CA hasn't approved mixing vaccines yet so I had to get a Pfizer booster. I was actually hoping to get a Moderna booster so @watfly couldn't keep holding it over my head that his vaccine is better than mine. Not really but it would have been sooner and at the same time if they would have allowed me to take Moderna.
Ok, so I am not getting my COVID booster today. I got an email stating it had been 6 months and boosters were available. Evidently, further down the page, there is a list that identifies those "eligible". I didn't fall into any of the categories. I found this out when they called and asked, "Why are you getting a COVID booster?" So, I'll get my flu shot. Maybe I'll ask for some horse paste to go - just in case.
 
Doesn't your preferred scenario depend on the assumption that the flu wouldn't mutate to be more highly infectious - as COVID has? By wearing masks all the time, don't we create an environment that promotes the growth of highly aerosolized viruses? By reducing the number of illnesses each year, don't we also put ourselves in a position where our natural immunity is lower as a population and more susceptible to a catastrophically large outbreak when a virus finds a way? I just wonder how much of this we can actually control - beyond the moment. It reminds me a little of the Trolley dilemma @Grace T. brought up earlier. My current thoughts are that I am now a bigger proponent of antivirals and not as big a proponent of vaccines as I was at the beginning of the pandemic. I am not anti-Vax - at least by my definition of anti-Vax - but my position has definitely moved.
My Buddy Steve got the JJ jab in May 2021 and COVID last month: They treated him with the following:


Covid drugs & other



  1. Solu-medrol injection and
Rocephin 2, 1 Graham injections. 1 time.

  1. Ivermectin tablets 10/Daily. 7 days
  2. Monoclonal injection 1 time
  3. NAC 1/daily. 14 days
  4. Hydroxychloroquine 2/daily. 7 day.
  5. Prednisone 2/daily. 7 days.
  6. Azithromycin 1/daily. 7 days
  7. Bayer aspirin 1/Daily 10 days (not prescription)
  8. Zinc. 1/daily 10 days (not prescription)
  9. Vitamin C (not prescription)
  10. Vitamin D3 (not prescription)
  11. Nebulizer, Ipratropium Bromide & Albuterol Sulfate 3-4/daily 7 days.
  12. Oxygen tank for whenever I want.


Quite the arsenal post-vax.
 
Ok, so I am not getting my COVID booster today. I got an email stating it had been 6 months and boosters were available. Evidently, further down the page, there is a list that identifies those "eligible". I didn't fall into any of the categories. I found this out when they called and asked, "Why are you getting a COVID booster?" So, I'll get my flu shot. Maybe I'll ask for some horse paste to go - just in case.
See list above
 
Doesn't your preferred scenario depend on the assumption that the flu wouldn't mutate to be more highly infectious - as COVID has? By wearing masks all the time, don't we create an environment that promotes the growth of highly aerosolized viruses? By reducing the number of illnesses each year, don't we also put ourselves in a position where our natural immunity is lower as a population and more susceptible to a catastrophically large outbreak when a virus finds a way? I just wonder how much of this we can actually control - beyond the moment. It reminds me a little of the Trolley dilemma @Grace T. brought up earlier. My current thoughts are that I am now a bigger proponent of antivirals and not as big a proponent of vaccines as I was at the beginning of the pandemic. I am not anti-Vax - at least by my definition of anti-Vax - but my position has definitely moved.
I think it’s the reverse. A higher transmissibility variant (flu or covid) will always have a competitive advantage. The question is how often that happens.

Mutation rates depend on the amount of virus in circulation. Choosing the low vax path means we are choosing to have more virus in circulation, and this a higher mutation rate.
 
I think it’s the reverse. A higher transmissibility variant (flu or covid) will always have a competitive advantage. The question is how often that happens.

Mutation rates depend on the amount of virus in circulation. Choosing the low vax path means we are choosing to have more virus in circulation, and this a higher mutation rate.
You always overlook the world on this. Only a little more than 50% of the world has gotten a single jab. Of those, some of the vaccines are problematic even before declining immunity. Some nations (including some from where the USA and Poland are currently having immigration issues) have very low rates and some in Africa don't even approach 1%. Some, like in Russia with their own decent Sputnik vaccine, unless the government suddenly decides to crack down, are going to have high rates of refusal. Unless you have some global solution that addresses China, Russia, India and Africa, you are always going to have a lot of room for mutations, at least for another year and a half or so, and that's before we even get to boosters.
 
I think it’s the reverse. A higher transmissibility variant (flu or covid) will always have a competitive advantage. The question is how often that happens.

Mutation rates depend on the amount of virus in circulation. Choosing the low vax path means we are choosing to have more virus in circulation, and this a higher mutation rate.
I'm glad I got the viral update that evolved with the virus unlike the MRNa shots. The COVID anti bodies are still on patrol according to my last blood test. A good diet and exercise has always been a plus. Nobody is choosing a low vax path. The tyrannical and socialist mandates that you approve of are unconstitutional. They take away our right to due process and our rights to freedom from cruel and unusual punishment.
 
I think it’s the reverse. A higher transmissibility variant (flu or covid) will always have a competitive advantage. The question is how often that happens.

Mutation rates depend on the amount of virus in circulation. Choosing the low vax path means we are choosing to have more virus in circulation, and this a higher mutation rate.
Doesn’t the amount of virus in circulation also depend on the current level of natural immunity as well as immunity due to vaccines? Vaccines will always be “behind” a mutating virus. I can see vaccines not only flattening the curve but also lengthening it. As the curve lengthens, immunity from vaccines wanes. Are we confident the area under the curve is less for the lengthened curve? I don’t believe the answer is straightforward in a mutating virus.
 
Mutation rates depend on the amount of virus in circulation. Choosing the low vax path means we are choosing to have more virus in circulation, and this a higher mutation rate.
Billions of people will never get vaxxed. Poor and corrupt countries pretty much guarantee this happening.

There will always be a vast pool of people where the virus can do its thing so to speak.
 
Doesn’t the amount of virus in circulation also depend on the current level of natural immunity as well as immunity due to vaccines? Vaccines will always be “behind” a mutating virus. I can see vaccines not only flattening the curve but also lengthening it. As the curve lengthens, immunity from vaccines wanes. Are we confident the area under the curve is less for the lengthened curve? I don’t believe the answer is straightforward in a mutating virus.
The area under the case curve decreases if you have a vaccine.

Normally, you keep getting new cases until your recovered population equals the herd immunity threshold.

For this, people who are effectively protected by the vaccine count towards your recovered population.

So, if you need 250 million recovered patients, and 150 million are immune by vaccine, then only 100 million end up getting sick.

Area under the curve fell from 250 to 100.

Harder to explain when you toss in new variants, partially effective natural immunity, and partially effective vaccines, but the core idea is the same. The number of infections is reduced by (number of vaccinated people) x (vaccine efficacy).
 
Ok, so I am not getting my COVID booster today. I got an email stating it had been 6 months and boosters were available. Evidently, further down the page, there is a list that identifies those "eligible". I didn't fall into any of the categories. I found this out when they called and asked, "Why are you getting a COVID booster?" So, I'll get my flu shot. Maybe I'll ask for some horse paste to go - just in case.
Good move bro
 
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