Time to Play

dad4 said:
Yeah, I had hoped that the opening in GA was going to work out so we could copy it.

I don’t know if GA is growing because the plan was bad, or the plan was good except for the protests.

I really wish we could all wear masks and limit contacts. Compared to everything else, wearing a mask and having my bridge night online is not a big deal.
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Fair question.....based on the timeline, I would say the protests opened the flood gates.
 
dad4 said:
Yeah, I had hoped that the opening in GA was going to work out so we could copy it.

I don’t know if GA is growing because the plan was bad, or the plan was good except for the protests.

I really wish we could all wear masks and limit contacts. Compared to everything else, wearing a mask and having my bridge night online is not a big deal.
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Well, it takes 2-3 weeks to have an impact on cases so what happened 2-3 weeks ago? The protests. And it wasn't just the spread from the protests but the protests also caused people to think the emergency was over and to also engage in whataboutism: well, if they can do it what about funerals, what about Trump rallies, what about my business, what about my kid's birthday party, what about youth sports? If the authorities don't treat things as emergencies it's not unfair for people to assume the emergency is over.

Add to that the pathetic mask handling of our leadership. Fauci admitted he lied about the mask thing early on, so like the boy who cried wolf the public is skeptical. The WHO lied and continues to lie. Trump won't wear one. Don't know if you saw the fiasco (both in behavior and mask usage, by both Nadler and the Republicans) at the House committee hearing yesterday. And I had to deal with 2 cops yesterday and both of them showed up without masks and didn't put them on until they were shamed by a neighbor and her baby.

There's also the possibility that the wave curves are rigid. For states which didn't have outbreaks like the northeast, the only thing the lockdowns did was push the outbreaks back in time. We see that not only in the south but also in the Eastern Europe and even in Eastern Germany. The most persuasive point on this is the difference between NorCal and SoCal which locked down around the same time and have similar rules and mask requirements. Like a brush fire, unless you smother it right at the inception, it may be it has to burn through a certain amount of brush before it can be controlled. The other underwritten thing is that if you've seen what's going on in Mexico, people are fleeing due to the poor medical treatment there...some of the hospital spike in the southern area is being driven by people coming north, though the percentage is unclear and it could be a small effect or a large one.

The initial idea was that we were going to flatten the curve and give ICUs time to prepare. We did that. We don't at this point really have any choice but to move forward with life because the protests broke the possibility of having any limiting principle on gatherings, and we are heading into a huge trainwreck with the 4th of July where many informal celebrations will also be protected by the first amendment. Hopefully people will wear masks when sensible, but at this point the kids may as well play because if movie theatres are open, there's no reason for limiting the kids.
 
Grace T. said:
Well, it takes 2-3 weeks to have an impact on cases so what happened 2-3 weeks ago? The protests. And it wasn't just the spread from the protests but the protests also caused people to think the emergency was over and to also engage in whataboutism: well, if they can do it what about funerals, what about Trump rallies, what about my business, what about my kid's birthday party, what about youth sports? If the authorities don't treat things as emergencies it's not unfair for people to assume the emergency is over.

Add to that the pathetic mask handling of our leadership. Fauci admitted he lied about the mask thing early on, so like the boy who cried wolf the public is skeptical. The WHO lied and continues to lie. Trump won't wear one. Don't know if you saw the fiasco (both in behavior and mask usage, by both Nadler and the Republicans) at the House committee hearing yesterday. And I had to deal with 2 cops yesterday and both of them showed up without masks and didn't put them on until they were shamed by a neighbor and her baby.

There's also the possibility that the wave curves are rigid. For states which didn't have outbreaks like the northeast, the only thing the lockdowns did was push the outbreaks back in time. We see that not only in the south but also in the Eastern Europe and even in Eastern Germany. The most persuasive point on this is the difference between NorCal and SoCal which locked down around the same time and have similar rules and mask requirements. Like a brush fire, unless you smother it right at the inception, it may be it has to burn through a certain amount of brush before it can be controlled. The other underwritten thing is that if you've seen what's going on in Mexico, people are fleeing due to the poor medical treatment there...some of the hospital spike in the southern area is being driven by people coming north, though the percentage is unclear and it could be a small effect or a large one.

The initial idea was that we were going to flatten the curve and give ICUs time to prepare. We did that. We don't at this point really have any choice but to move forward with life because the protests broke the possibility of having any limiting principle on gatherings, and we are heading into a huge trainwreck with the 4th of July where many informal celebrations will also be protected by the first amendment. Hopefully people will wear masks when sensible, but at this point the kids may as well play because if movie theatres are open, there's no reason for limiting the kids.
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San Diego is not allowed to have bbq with friends and neighbors. What will SD peeps do for the 4th of July? Can you go to beach and do bbq there?
 
watfly said:
I have to believe that the vast majority of people have been exposed to Covid on some level or another, maybe not direct contact, but odds are you've touched something or been in the same space as a Covid positive person.

Ultimately in regards to resuming youth sports, the difference in opinions is based on someone's individual perception of risk (aka fear) and the level of risk they're willing to accept. Based on the comments here, it appears that those who are most fearful, are basing their fear on what could happen, whereas those who are less fearful are basing it on what has actually happened. When I've posted good, or positive information, I can't tell you how many posters have basically said "oh just wait, its going to get worse" like were going to run out of icu beds, doctors are going to have to make life or death decisions on who to treat etc. The common justification was "lag time". I heard that every time when I mentioned how well Georgia was doing with their reopening, "oh no you have wait a month" a month passes with the number of deaths plummeting, "oh no, you have to wait a few more months, be patient". Two months later and Covid deaths in Georgia continue to plummet. It's incredible how many people use the "lag time" argument to just kick the can of Covid fears down the road. News flash, Covid isn't going away, but its basically only dangerous to a minority of people with very identifiable characteristics.

At the end of the day, I'm not going to convince those that disagree with me. Which is the beauty of choice, just don't project your fears on my behavior or others and take my choice away. While I wear a mask in public out of respect for others, there is simple solution if you run into someone that isn't, move 6 feet away. No harm, no foul.
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Copa9 said:
Tell her, model for her, be an example, IT IS NOT FOREVER! Give her options, be positive about what she can do. Of course it is not the same. It is also not the same as sheltering in place. We will get back to normal. Children reflect what the parents say and do. Guess what? Negative parents beget negative kids. Sit down with her and talk to her about what she is really missing, validate what she says then discuss options and what path we are on to get back to normal. We are developing better therapeutics, we will eventually get a vaccine.
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Tell me Dr, what is worse? Cmon

www.cbsnews.com

Coronavirus pandemic may lead to 75,000 "deaths of despair" from suicide, drug and alcohol abuse, study says

Job loss, isolation and anxiety could lead to more deaths from suicide and substance abuse over the next 10 years, researchers say.
www.cbsnews.com www.cbsnews.com
 
chiefs said:
Tell me Dr, what is worse? Cmon

www.cbsnews.com

Coronavirus pandemic may lead to 75,000 "deaths of despair" from suicide, drug and alcohol abuse, study says

Job loss, isolation and anxiety could lead to more deaths from suicide and substance abuse over the next 10 years, researchers say.
www.cbsnews.com www.cbsnews.com
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Copa must be home with kids during these tough times. Most parents have to work two jobs to make ends meet. So when both parents are not home for little 14 year old Sally, she's home all alone. There lies the problem Copa. What is little Sally or little Jonny going to do? Grandma, whose still alive, is in the risk category and can;t watch the grand kids. Copa, what should one do with this situation?
 
Keepermom2 said:
Fair point but educated and intelligent isn't what I was going for since M decided to attack with idiotic comments.
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Ah, I see...cite idiotic comments to justify idiotic comments... Brilliant!

You're obviously way too educated and intelligent for this venue... it's beneath you.
 
MicPaPa said:
Ah, I see...cite idiotic comments to justify idiotic comments... Brilliant!

You're obviously way too educated and intelligent for this venue... it's beneath you.
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Yeah impulse move and reactionary. Worst comment ever made on here. I usually keep my emotions in check. Why are you trying to insite a further argument?
 
I'm starting to see a pattern. Rich folks who have so much money in the bank can sit at home and have zero financial fear. #1 reason spouses fight is over $$$$. If you don;t have any, more fights probably is what some data shows. They have a huge back yard too or can hop the fence for play time with the other rich neighbor friends kids and so exercise is all good and easy for their kids. Plus parents are so rich they can watch their kiddos for free and then come on here and spank us all for being so stupid and that we would want to cause death to others or something like that. The truth is, most kids teenagers are being left alone and getting into much trouble. Of course, it;s all the negative parents fault who still have to work their essential jobs at grocery stores. I've never seen such a double standard ever in my life on this planet. The good news is we get to see behind the mask of whats really going on.
 
Ellejustus said:
OK Mavs, you say so. I say this. In two weeks, the politicians will dictate what happens, not the virus. Were always behind the data because we won;t know the facts until after the facts. For example, OC had to add 26 deaths to the death count. Headline News is what grabs everyone's attention. OC Register does this all the time. Look at this mornings headline. You have to read the article to find the truth:

Coronavirus: 26 new deaths, 354 new cases in Orange County as of June 24


Update: Orange County health officials said Wednesday afternoon that “there is a delay in identification and confirmation of deaths and this group of deaths reported today are the result of a concentrated effort to reconcile death certificates with reported cases.” They said the 26 deaths were not all from the previous day, but would even reach back to recent weeks.

The Orange County Health Care Agency reported on Wednesday, June 24, another 26 deaths raising the total in the county since the start of tracking the coronavirus to 299.

Of those who have died, 152 were residents of skilled nursing facilities, up from 138 in Tuesday’s daily report.

More than half of those who died were in a nursing home. I already told many of you their is bonus money for "Corona Death." So again, your 78 and cursing around healthy in life and then bam, stroke attack and now brain dead because no oxygen to the brain. Rushed to hospital and they do what they can but you pass away really but do a breathing tube to see if brain wakes up. I had to do this a twice with dear friends who had strokes. Is there any brain activity? Stroke victim gets Corona at the hospital and is considered a corona death in the numbers. Triple bonus pay plus scare the crap out of everyone. It's what I call a Twofer.
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Orange County health numbers are always messed up. The State site has more accurate numbers because the hospitals appear to be more accountable to the State rather than the county. OC numbers are usually at least 10% less than the State and they have 7 less hospitals reporting to them.
 
Ellejustus said:
I'm starting to see a pattern. Rich folks who have so much money in the bank can sit at home and have zero financial fear. #1 reason spouses fight is over $$$$. If you don;t have any, more fights probably is what some data shows. They have a huge back yard too or can hop the fence for play time with the other rich neighbor friends kids and so exercise is all good and easy for their kids. Plus parents are so rich they can watch their kiddos for free and then come on here and spank us all for being so stupid and that we would want to cause death to others or something like that. The truth is, most kids teenagers are being left alone and getting into much trouble. Of course, it;s all the negative parents fault who still have to work their essential jobs at grocery stores. I've never seen such a double standard ever in my life on this planet. The good news is we get to see behind the mask of whats really going on.
Click to expand...
It's safe to say every one of these folks subjugating to government officials and so-called "experts" while dictating my rights draws a steady income...prove me wrong.
 
Kicker4Life said:
Fair question.....based on the timeline, I would say the protests opened the flood gates.
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Only because people chose to react that way. People want to rationalize, because it lets them do what they want.

If you rationalize, you can host a 30 person dance party in your house and still feel good about yourself because at least you aren’t looting Target. It’s still just as bad an idea as it was in April. But now we have a convincing story for when we want to lie to ourselves.

EJ has a point about there being nothing for kids to do. It’s a lot easier for single income families and those with desk jobs who can telecommute. If you have a stay at home parent, you can play a board game or kick a ball with your kid whenever you need. Lots of families don’t have that.

There isn’t much reason for the youth restrictions, especially for those under 10 or 12. But there is way to get rid of them as long we spend our risk budget on dining out, movies, and going mask-free.
 
dad4 said:
Only because people chose to react that way. People want to rationalize, because it lets them do what they want.

If you rationalize, you can host a 30 person dance party in your house and still feel good about yourself because at least you aren’t looting Target. It’s still just as bad an idea as it was in April. But now we have a convincing story for when we want to lie to ourselves.

EJ has a point about there being nothing for kids to do. It’s a lot easier for single income families and those with desk jobs who can telecommute. If you have a stay at home parent, you can play a board game or kick a ball with your kid whenever you need. Lots of families don’t have that.

There isn’t much reason for the youth restrictions, especially for those under 10 or 12. But there is way to get rid of them as long we spend our risk budget on dining out, movies, and going mask-free.
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U5-U17. I do see your climbing up a little. Kids need a purpose to live folks. Duh!!!
 
Grace T. said:
Well, it takes 2-3 weeks to have an impact on cases so what happened 2-3 weeks ago? The protests. And it wasn't just the spread from the protests but the protests also caused people to think the emergency was over and to also engage in whataboutism: well, if they can do it what about funerals, what about Trump rallies, what about my business, what about my kid's birthday party, what about youth sports? If the authorities don't treat things as emergencies it's not unfair for people to assume the emergency is over.

Add to that the pathetic mask handling of our leadership. Fauci admitted he lied about the mask thing early on, so like the boy who cried wolf the public is skeptical. The WHO lied and continues to lie. Trump won't wear one. Don't know if you saw the fiasco (both in behavior and mask usage, by both Nadler and the Republicans) at the House committee hearing yesterday. And I had to deal with 2 cops yesterday and both of them showed up without masks and didn't put them on until they were shamed by a neighbor and her baby.

There's also the possibility that the wave curves are rigid. For states which didn't have outbreaks like the northeast, the only thing the lockdowns did was push the outbreaks back in time. We see that not only in the south but also in the Eastern Europe and even in Eastern Germany. The most persuasive point on this is the difference between NorCal and SoCal which locked down around the same time and have similar rules and mask requirements. Like a brush fire, unless you smother it right at the inception, it may be it has to burn through a certain amount of brush before it can be controlled. The other underwritten thing is that if you've seen what's going on in Mexico, people are fleeing due to the poor medical treatment there...some of the hospital spike in the southern area is being driven by people coming north, though the percentage is unclear and it could be a small effect or a large one.

The initial idea was that we were going to flatten the curve and give ICUs time to prepare. We did that. We don't at this point really have any choice but to move forward with life because the protests broke the possibility of having any limiting principle on gatherings, and we are heading into a huge trainwreck with the 4th of July where many informal celebrations will also be protected by the first amendment. Hopefully people will wear masks when sensible, but at this point the kids may as well play because if movie theatres are open, there's no reason for limiting the kids.
Click to expand...
To restate what we already know, the PUBLIC protests from the right wing groups, open carry militias and anti-maskers, Michigan, Huntington Beach, etc., and the actions of Trump to undermine and make political the pandemic response, immediately preceded the George Floyd protests. Let’s not forget the idiots like the ones out there on PCH at Main Beach breached the damn first. Not to excuse the blm protests, but when half the country started to disregard the idea behind shutdown, inevitably the virus would come back strong. That’s why cases and deaths are growing in states that don’t necessarily correlate to the blm protests, and are more about denial of the whole endeavor and a wish to return to “normal.”
 
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