So what would your suggestion be for these people?
Should society continue to get vaccinated, mask up and socially distance in order to protect this segment of the population?
Bad News Thread
- Thread starter kickingandscreaming
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Should society continue to get vaccinated, mask up and socially distance in order to protect this segment of the population?
When you heard that "Masks are better than vaccines", who did you hear it from and what did you take it to mean?
Vax, mask, and distance? Yes. Close schools and businesses? No.
The difficult part is very high risk events/businesses. Square dance conventions, boomer rock concerts, cruise lines and so on.
Those may not be able to open safely without some kind of proof of vaccination. The liability costs would kill you.
kickingandscreaming
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Xi Jinping approves.
Insurance companies and their lawyers will not hold back going after someone who ignores mask or vaccination requirements and can be shown to have been the source of another person's illness. At some point not getting vaccinated is like deciding you have the right to run red lights or drive on the left side of the road because --
FREEDUMB!
Same person you heard it from, the CDC director, I took it as stated, but I took it as nonsense. When leadership continued to wear masks after they were vaccinated it also sent the message that masks are better than vaccines. Neither was honest, or helpful. We needed honesty, not theater. I hope others thought of it as nonsense, as well, however, if you said that you were labeled "Team Virus", or possibly grandma killer.
Like it or not, office places were some of the earliest known superspreader sites. The HVAC systems can be locked down pretty tight, so there is not much fresh air.
So, Frances is putting her coworkers at risk. You can deny it, or deal with it.
That's why we need Tort reform.
I see those Fellowes HEPA room air purifiers advertised on TV all the time now. I wonder how effective those really are? While I'm a little skeptical, the evidence on the HEPA filters seems pretty good.
1. Employers are the most likely target (which is why all the delay in opening up the offices). Not much of a deep pocket in suing an individual if there's no insurance coverage and there's no insurance coverage for COVID.
2. At this point, there's a legit argument that if somebody gets sick due to failure to provide a vaccine they've assumed the risk.
3. Infection cases are notoriously hard to prove, even in the HIV context. Unless it's deliberate, causation is really really really tough.
kickingandscreaming
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This is pretty funny considering how little information we can get on how people have contracted COVID and the number of asymptomatic / mildly symptomatic cases there are that *might* have been the source. However, we have a lot of lawyers so I won't be surprised if this is attempted.
This is pretty funny, because it's ridiculous. While I was happy to get the vaccine, if I had a young child, I would seriously consider not having them take the vaccine as the risk to them due to COVID is well-known and extremely low. The vaccine is not without risk and it is likely very low also, but for children, is the unknown and likely low risk for the vaccine better than the known and extremely low risk of COVID?
Yeah, it's hard to make out the case for the vaccine because the EU label is still on it....after that's removed it becomes easier to mandate it and say if you infect someone you are liable, particularly if you are violating a mask ordinance. But proof is really really hard, there's the argument the person who got sick assumed the risk if they aren't vaccinated, and lawyers like to go after deep pockets. It's more of a problem for employers than individuals.
I read the whole context, and it obviously wasn't nonsense at the time it was stated.
An example of a legitimate tort is not why we need tort reform.
HEPA filters located in a room are in the same category as vaccine-reinforced antibodies in your bloodstream. They can only work on the virus that is already present there. If someone comes into your cubicle at work and breathes his infection in your direction, the HEPA filter in the corner won't do you any good.
A HEPA filter installed on the room's ventilation input might make more sense, but that still relies on people not bypassing it by walking the infection in through the door.
If you spit in my soup or lick my hamburger when you're Covid positive then I don't have a problem with a lawsuit. Otherwise were talking about an airborne virus and you have to assume the risk of catching it, particularly if you don't get vaccinated. Life is full of risks, deal with it.
Maybe my crystal ball was just working better than yours at the time.
If you don’t want ridiculous lawsuits over covid, then don’t recommend a covid policy of “hold people responsible for their actions.”
In this country, the way we hold people responsible for their actions is through the courts. So, when you say “hold each person individually responsible”, you are asking to turn public health over to the tort lawyers.