Vaccine

dad4 said:
You skipped the role of deliberate disinformation.
Click to expand...
That's what our brains are for. I don't want the government deciphering the information for me. We live in a country that allows people to make bad decisions and then suffer the repercussions. Unfortunately that can result in collateral damage. Its an imperfect system. I get that you don't trust other people to make the right decisions, but that's how our country works. With freedom comes risks you assume as a citizen that you can't control. Your points aren't necessarily unreasonable on their face its just not "how things work" aka not reality. It seems your issue is more with how our country works than with any disinformation or anti-vaxxers.

We're all a product of our situation. You are dependent on the government for your livelihood, while I'm dependent on the freedoms of capitalism for mine. That tremendously shades our opinions. Selfishness is just a matter of perspective based upon what side of the fence you're standing.

This is going to be a wildly unpopular opinion, but misinformation for the most part is protected free speech. Its a slippery slope when we let a government, organization or communication platform determine what is misinformation or not. See Wuhan Lab Leak for example. Misinformation is most often in the eyes of the beholder.
 
watfly said:
That's what our brains are for. I don't want the government deciphering the information for me. We live in a country that allows people to make bad decisions and then suffer the repercussions. Unfortunately that can result in collateral damage. Its an imperfect system. I get that you don't trust other people to make the right decisions, but that's how our country works. With freedom comes risks you assume as a citizen that you can't control. Your points aren't necessarily unreasonable on their face its just not "how things work" aka not reality. It seems your issue is more with how our country works than with any disinformation or anti-vaxxers.

We're all a product of our situation. You are dependent on the government for your livelihood, while I'm dependent on the freedoms of capitalism for mine. That tremendously shades our opinions. Selfishness is just a matter of perspective based upon what side of the fence you're standing.

This is going to be a wildly unpopular opinion, but misinformation for the most part is protected free speech. Its a slippery slope when we let a government, organization or communication platform determine what is misinformation or not. See Wuhan Lab Leak for example. Misinformation is most often in the eyes of the beholder.
Click to expand...
Without the government you would be whittling wood.
 
dad4 said:
Even that was too much for CDC, so they are recommending women choose Moderna or Pfizer.
Click to expand...
It isn't fear mongering if the CDC says they recommend women choose another vaccine. Right? They appear concerned enough to recommend this group of people take a different drug.

And that is why they do long term studies before bringing drugs to the market. And it is precisely because of that unknown that makes it irresponsible to mandate someone to take a vaccine.
 
Hüsker Dü said:
Misinformation and bold face lies can persuade many in the middle. That’s how trump got elected, that’s why people don’t trust one flank of the media because the other flank told them not to, that they were the sole purveyors of the truth (silly ain’t it?), it’s called propaganda at least it use to be called that, now it’s just how we are being ‘informed’ in many cases . . . but hey, we bite, they feed.
Click to expand...

Your flank does not care about MisInformation, that is for sure
 
Desert Hound said:
It isn't fear mongering if the CDC says they recommend women choose another vaccine. Right? They appear concerned enough to recommend this group of people take a different drug.

And that is why they do long term studies before bringing drugs to the market. And it is precisely because of that unknown that makes it irresponsible to mandate someone to take a vaccine.
Click to expand...

Well, it's really worse than that since it looks like they are going at a minimum "prioritize" the other vaccines. Either they've allowed a dangerous drug to be out on the market for 12 months (in which case those people who said long term analysis was needed were right), or they are for various reasons trying to push people into not making a choice and only taking the mRNA vaccines (which BTW has been a key objection against people reluctant to jab their kids). They don't even realize what they are doing but it's becoming a S show of epic proportions as they torch the last of their credibility. When this is all over, there will be a portion of society that will want to tear the FDA and CDC to the ground and start from scratch.
 
Hüsker Dü said:
Misinformation and bold face lies can persuade many in the middle. That’s how trump got elected, that’s why people don’t trust one flank of the media because the other flank told them not to, that they were the sole purveyors of the truth (silly ain’t it?), it’s called propaganda at least it use to be called that, now it’s just how we are being ‘informed’ in many cases . . . but hey, we bite, they feed.
Click to expand...
Hüsker Dü said:
So for you it must be 100% full proof or you ain’t buying? Check, got it.
Click to expand...
Hüsker Dü said:
Why ask me? If it helps I’m in. I wear a helmet when I ride as well, always have.
Click to expand...
Hüsker Dü said:
Agree with most of that, but yes evolution is inevitable.
Click to expand...


The sicknesses/blisters you get from slinging the Democrats filthy water
must be atrocious.
 
watfly said:
I'd like to think I would be a hunter-gatherer and fishing for my next meal.
Click to expand...
I would be just find and dandy. I already have a cave I know of that you can only get to during really low tide. It's idea for this situation. I have wetsuit and spear and that's all one needs to catch fish. I guess we know what Husler and Dad and GG are afraid of. They need government so bad their willing to steal for it and lie through their teeth to keep government as their Papi.
 
Fentanyl overdoses become No. 1 cause of death among US adults, ages 18-45: 'A national emergency'
More adults between 18 and 45 died of fentanyl overdoses in 2020 than COVID-19, motor vehicle accidents, cancer and suicide
 
Get a grip, folks. 9 deaths out of over 17 million patients.

CDC is doing their job, which is to try to reduce that 9 down to zero.

But taking the J&J vaccine is roughly as deadly as driving 50 miles. Both are about a one in 2 million risk.
 
Grace T. said:
Well, it's really worse than that since it looks like they are going at a minimum "prioritize" the other vaccines. Either they've allowed a dangerous drug to be out on the market for 12 months (in which case those people who said long term analysis was needed were right), or they are for various reasons trying to push people into not making a choice and only taking the mRNA vaccines (which BTW has been a key objection against people reluctant to jab their kids). They don't even realize what they are doing but it's becoming a S show of epic proportions as they torch the last of their credibility. When this is all over, there will be a portion of society that will want to tear the FDA and CDC to the ground and start from scratch.
Click to expand...

500 people die per year due to reactions to penicillin, yet here we have the unemployed former equestrian claiming that a drug that has killed 2% of that number is a "dangerous drug".

Only an idiot of the unemployed former equestrian's proportions would believe that an entity "loses credibility" because it recommends one medication as a safer alternative than another. She's probably just bitter that the CDC recommended J&J over injecting bleach into your lungs, blowing sunshine up your ass, and eating horse paste.
 
I found Dads Dr.....

CNN guest advises people to wear masks at Christmas whether 'vaccinated or not'
Dr. William Schaffer also suggested everyone get tested the morning of family gatherings.

"Should we be getting together with our vaccinated loved ones or do you not recommend it?" Camerota asked.

"I would recommend that we hang our stockings with care. I think we have to be careful. If we’re all going to get together, we should all be vaccinated and preferentially boosted. We should wear our masks if we’re uncertain," Dr. Schaffer said.

"I would recommend that we hang our stockings with care. I think we have to be careful. If we’re all going to get together, we should all be vaccinated and preferentially boosted. We should wear our masks if we’re uncertain," Dr. Schaffer said.

And I would certainly say if you’re going to any group event indoors whether you’re vaccinated or not, please wear your mask. And yes, I join the chorus of everyone saying vaccination vaccination vaccination. If you had your first dose, bring those children in age 5 and older. And if you hadn’t gotten your booster and you’re eligible, run, do not walk, and get vaccinated," Schaffer said.
 
dad4 said:
Get a grip, folks. 9 deaths out of over 17 million patients.

CDC is doing their job, which is to try to reduce that 9 down to zero.

But taking the J&J vaccine is roughly as deadly as driving 50 miles. Both are about a one in 2 million risk.
Click to expand...

How many have had myocarditis or other cardiovascular events from an mRNA vaccine? Why isn't it the CDCs job then to reduce that risk down to zero, particularly in the other 30 male crowd for which this is a risk? Why then did the CDC allow the shot be out there for almost a year when it's been known for a long time now that there is this risk? If the answer is the "science evolved", can you blame people for being skeptical of rushing out to vaxx people who are not particularly at risk, worried the "science" might evolve further?

Sorry man....there's no real way to defend this from a public relations point of view....
 
crush said:
I found Dads Dr.....

CNN guest advises people to wear masks at Christmas whether 'vaccinated or not'
Dr. William Schaffer also suggested everyone get tested the morning of family gatherings.

"Should we be getting together with our vaccinated loved ones or do you not recommend it?" Camerota asked.

"I would recommend that we hang our stockings with care. I think we have to be careful. If we’re all going to get together, we should all be vaccinated and preferentially boosted. We should wear our masks if we’re uncertain," Dr. Schaffer said.

"I would recommend that we hang our stockings with care. I think we have to be careful. If we’re all going to get together, we should all be vaccinated and preferentially boosted. We should wear our masks if we’re uncertain," Dr. Schaffer said.

And I would certainly say if you’re going to any group event indoors whether you’re vaccinated or not, please wear your mask. And yes, I join the chorus of everyone saying vaccination vaccination vaccination. If you had your first dose, bring those children in age 5 and older. And if you hadn’t gotten your booster and you’re eligible, run, do not walk, and get vaccinated," Schaffer said.
Click to expand...

Public health "experts" in the UK have blown way past masks and there's already a substantial amount calling for the UK to institute lockdowns to avoid a Christmas wave of infection.
 
Grace T. said:
How many have had myocarditis or other cardiovascular events from an mRNA vaccine? Why isn't it the CDCs job then to reduce that risk down to zero, particularly in the other 30 male crowd for which this is a risk? Why then did the CDC allow the shot be out there for almost a year when it's been known for a long time now that there is this risk? If the answer is the "science evolved", can you blame people for being skeptical of rushing out to vaxx people who are not particularly at risk, worried the "science" might evolve further?

Sorry man....there's no real way to defend this from a public relations point of view....
Click to expand...

Maybe they did a cost/benefit analysis.
 
Grace T. said:
How many have had myocarditis or other cardiovascular events from an mRNA vaccine? Why isn't it the CDCs job then to reduce that risk down to zero, particularly in the other 30 male crowd for which this is a risk? Why then did the CDC allow the shot be out there for almost a year when it's been known for a long time now that there is this risk? If the answer is the "science evolved", can you blame people for being skeptical of rushing out to vaxx people who are not particularly at risk, worried the "science" might evolve further?

Sorry man....there's no real way to defend this from a public relations point of view....
Click to expand...

The CDC should immediately take penicillin off the market because 500 people died last year. It is ridiculous that the CDC does not reduce that risk to zero. Those who are skeptical whether the benefits of penicillin outweigh the risks are so smart.
 
Grace T. said:
How many have had myocarditis or other cardiovascular events from an mRNA vaccine? Why isn't it the CDCs job then to reduce that risk down to zero, particularly in the other 30 male crowd for which this is a risk? Why then did the CDC allow the shot be out there for almost a year when it's been known for a long time now that there is this risk? If the answer is the "science evolved", can you blame people for being skeptical of rushing out to vaxx people who are not particularly at risk, worried the "science" might evolve further?

Sorry man....there's no real way to defend this from a public relations point of view....
Click to expand...
I notice that you don't use any numbers in your argument.

See previous note about people who make things sound risky by talking about the harm but never once mentioning the probability.
 
dad4 said:
What makes you think that people know their risk in advance?

If you ask people, not many will say “I am 50 pounds overweight and I will die 15 years early as a result”. You are more likely to hear “I played lots of sports back when I was younger, but I have a couple extra pounds because my knees just won’t let run like I used to.“
Click to expand...

That's an interesting and fair question. My experience has been that people who receive routine healthcare and have a relationship with their provider through routine wellness interaction have a pretty good undertanding of where they stand. Plenty of nuance in healthcare. People know when they are not healthy. There has been enough info and emphasis over the last 20 months or so that specifally calls out risks to those people presenting with obesity issues (which is a lot of Americans).
 
GoldenGate said:
500 people die per year due to reactions to penicillin, yet here we have the unemployed former equestrian claiming that a drug that has killed 2% of that number is a "dangerous drug".

Only an idiot of the unemployed former equestrian's proportions would believe that an entity "loses credibility" because it recommends one medication as a safer alternative than another. She's probably just bitter that the CDC recommended J&J over injecting bleach into your lungs, blowing sunshine up your ass, and eating horse paste.
Click to expand...
You are just as dumb as trump. I don't think he mentioned lung injection but you get the drift. Sodium hypochlorite has undergone clinical trials. It's used in dental offices every day. Other preoperative rinses are also undergoing clinical trials. Will they work? who knows. Safety profile is great, as is povidone iodine , hydrogen peroxide , and others.

Amazing the info you get from friends who work in other fields. Who knew that teeth pullers may hold the key to covid-19 prophylaxis.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top