Less done than you’d think. (Unless your answer is limited to your own family. Then you might ge done.)
Again you are misascribing motives. I’ve always believed indoor dining and church was higher risk. What I said was: there’s an inequity in that we are forcing some people and not others to take risk, there are trade offs which you fail to calculate the cost of (while forcing others to provide the things needed to keep you safe and sound), and people should be allowed to assess those cost themselves. My point on the study was the limited point that risks increased WITH or without masks the longer you are indoors. I’ve been saying forever people were neglecting the time factor. And I believe that explains the difference between your theoretical 40% and why masks in the real world haven’t worked to contain the outbreak. Extrapolating from there the best use of masks would have been to protect against short term exposure (like in grocery stores or doctor waiting rooms) but we didn’t say that because it would have brought down the airline industry, caused problems in prisons, and freaked out the essential workers. Instead we told them garbage like masks are better than vaccines
Ps. It’s also why outdoor mask mandates should never have been put in place, were ridiculous and only served to make a portion of the population hostile to them. Better a more limited use and treating people like grownups by being honest about what they can and can’t do.
The only thing that matters is the percentage of 55+ that got the shot which will be higher in both red and blue state. The death rate will be on the floor. Time to move on...cases are meaningless
Vax rates for 70+ are topping out at around 80%.
Assuming arguendo those figures are true what does that do to the ifr and how does it compare to a bad flu season? The goal is not zero deaths. It’s never going to be zero deaths. And for the vaccinated that made the choice they are more likely to be killed in the car drive on the way to indoor dining than from catching covid and dying of covid. At a certain point the rest of us can’t sit around waiting if the old who refuse vaccination chose to behave that way. It’s never going to be zero.
40% would not be expected to contain the outbreak.
It doesn’t change ifr for any age group. Total ifr drifts down a little because average age drifts down when a higher percentage of older people get vaccinated.
No, "it" is not done, even if I am. I will still be wearing a mask where required and avoiding those places that require one when possible.
Kids getting forced vaccinated too.
Why fight it? How many times do we need to go back through history and see that forcing people to do something "for their own good" is a slippery slope and the resulting power structure that is created to enforce it is very often worse than the problem it attempted to solve. Vaccine passports? Aren't the vaccines still listed as an emergency use authorization? We aren't even forcing the military to take the vaccine. The argument about doing it for the common good is quickly fading away as all those who desire vaccines able to get them. The risk to those that are vaccinated is less than that in a car trip (see below). It's time to let individual choice reign - well, by the end of May, anyway when it is obvious everyone who wants a vaccine can get one. We need to quit dividing ourselves based on irrational fear.
| Good morning. Why do so many vaccinated people remain irrationally fearful? Listen to the professor’s story. |
| A fable for our times |
| Guido Calabresi, a federal judge and Yale law professor, invented a little fable that he has been telling law students for more than three decades. |
| He tells the students to imagine a god coming forth to offer society a wondrous invention that would improve everyday life in almost every way. It would allow people to spend more time with friends and family, see new places and do jobs they otherwise could not do. But it would also come with a high cost. In exchange for bestowing this invention on society, the god would choose 1,000 young men and women and strike them dead. |
| Calabresi then asks: Would you take the deal? Almost invariably, the students say no. The professor then delivers the fable’s lesson: “What’s the difference between this and the automobile?” |
| In truth, automobiles kill many more than 1,000 young Americans each year; the total U.S. death toll hovers at about 40,000 annually. We accept this toll, almost unthinkingly, because vehicle crashes have always been part of our lives. We can’t fathom a world without them. |
| It’s a classic example of human irrationality about risk. We often underestimate large, chronic dangers, like car crashes or chemical pollution, and fixate on tiny but salient risks, like plane crashes or shark attacks. |
| One way for a risk to become salient is for it to be new. That’s a core idea behind Calabresi’s fable. He asks students to consider whether they would accept the cost of vehicle travel if it did not already exist. That they say no underscores the very different ways we treat new risks and enduring ones. |
| I have been thinking about the fable recently because of Covid-19. Covid certainly presents a salient risk: It’s a global pandemic that has upended daily life for more than a year. It has changed how we live, where we work, even what we wear on our faces. Covid feels ubiquitous. |
| Fortunately, it is also curable. The vaccines have nearly eliminated death, hospitalization and other serious Covid illness among people who have received shots. The vaccines have also radically reduced the chances that people contract even a mild version of Covid or can pass it on to others. |
| ‘Psychologically hard’ |
| To take just one example, major media outlets trumpeted new government data last week showing that 5,800 fully vaccinated Americans had contracted Covid. That may sound like a big number, but it indicates that a vaccinated person’s chances of getting Covid are about one in 11,000. The chances of a getting a version any worse than a common cold are even more remote. |
| But they are not zero. And they will not be zero anytime in the foreseeable future. Victory over Covid will not involve its elimination. Victory will instead mean turning it into the sort of danger that plane crashes or shark attacks present — too small to be worth reordering our lives. |
| That is what the vaccines do. If you’re vaccinated, Covid presents a minuscule risk to you, and you present a minuscule Covid risk to anyone else. A car trip is a bigger threat, to you and others. About 100 Americans are likely to die in car crashes today. The new federal data suggests that either zero or one vaccinated person will die today from Covid. |
| It’s true that experts believe vaccinated people should still sometimes wear a mask, partly because it’s a modest inconvenience that further reduces a tiny risk — and mostly because it contributes to a culture of mask wearing. It is the decent thing to do when most people still aren’t vaccinated. If you’re vaccinated, a mask is more of a symbol of solidarity than anything else. |
| Coming to grips with the comforting realities of post-vaccination life is going to take some time for most of us. It’s only natural that so many vaccinated people continue to harbor irrational fears. Yet slowly recognizing that irrationality will be a vital part of overcoming Covid. |
| “We’re not going to get to a place of zero risk,” Jennifer Nuzzo, a Johns Hopkins epidemiologist, told me during a virtual Times event last week. “I don’t think that’s the right metric for feeling like things are normal.” |
| After Nuzzo made that point, Dr. Ashish Jha of Brown University told us about his own struggle to return to normal. He has been fully vaccinated for almost two months, he said, and only recently decided to meet a vaccinated friend for a drink, unmasked. “It was hard — psychologically hard — for me,” Jha said. |
| “There are going to be some challenges to re-acclimating and re-entering,” he added. “But we’ve got to do it.” |
| And how did it feel in the end, I asked, to get together with his friend? |
| “It was awesome,” Jha said. |
See kickings post above
You're supposed to actually have some numbers behind it, not just wave your hands and say it's less than car accidents.
dailyvoice.com
That one slipped right by me. I completely misread your wording and thought you said “unvaccinated”.
When everyone has had the opportunity to be vaccinated, it is the right question.
It’s beginning to look like everyone who wants it will get the chance by the end of next week. It means 1 month and some change
