Say bye-bye-bye to Girls and Boys DA

oh canada said:
The problem with pro/rel model in youth amateur sports...

1) Quality of play will suffer - in the quest to win as many games as possible, there would be a lot more kickball and less possession, less creativity, less risk-taking, more coaches yelling at the kids what to do.

2) Individual player development will suffer - due to #1 and the type of player that does better at kickball, guess what type of players will get most/all of the playing time? Also, rosters of 18-20 may only play the same 11-13 kids. So much for the late bloomers.

3) Feeds the problem of Super Teams - most players will flock to the best teams who have the deepest bench with the least chance of being relegated. Didn't we recently read about professional soccer players discussing that one of the most important things for them was how they had to sometimes carry their team or consistently be the one who put the team on his/her back to win a game because they were NOT on a SuperTeam? That builds and teaches grit etc. in the youth game, when they need to learn it.

4) Don't forget who is the league's customer - ECNL's customers are the clubs, not the parents, not the players. Who do they want to keep happy? Their customers. This isn't professional soccer. A new ECNL club can't go out and buy players to join their cause and make for better TV ratings like an Aston Villa, Wigan or Leeds. If doing it the right way, they need time/years to bear fruit of their coaching, development, team cohesion, etc. -- these are 13-17yr old kids, not adults. Clubs want stability. And gosh, after all this upheaval, don't we as families want some stability too? We should want to encourage clubs to develop players over time, not hang out in parking lots and recruit gullible parents. If a top player wants to stay on a mediocre team because his/her friends from school are on that team and because he/she is carrying the load and improving as discussed in #3, the league should encourage that. Not penalize by forcing the kid to go play on SuperTeam and become a cookie-cutter player who plays half as much and develops 50% less.

It's ok to have some incentives and rewards for winning more games -- Cups, better showcase placement, etc. -- but too often we want our kids' athletic experiences to be like what we see on TV--The pros...how they train, how they play, how they're coached (and how many of the coaches see themselves), how they're dressed on the field, how they travel, what they do off the field. But guess what, they're not pros, not adults, and treating them as such will actually hurt them in the long run--burnout, injury, desire, etc.

Pro/rel is a great thing in professional soccer - and I think it should definitely be a part of MLS. But making it a part of a youth league, where the PRIMARY purpose should still be to develop our players as much as possible, would be completely contrary to that goal. If you want to add a couple of clubs each year to your league--ECNL or MLS/hybrid or ABCD--fine, no problem. That, you can do like the pro leagues do--geographically where does it fill a void, which clubs have shown stability and a mission that is consistent with the league, which clubs will add value, etc. Just don't do it at the expense of eliminating other existing customer clubs. Otherwise, you repeat the frustration and disruption that the USSF has currently created and continue the cycle for even more families and players.

Beautiful day out there--find some time to horseplay with your kids today in the street if you haven't already.
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Except that some of the top SoCal ECNL teams emphasize recruiting over development and do not emphasize possession soccer.
 
outside! said:
It will not be "the best players", it will be "the best players whose parent's can afford it". Soccer in the US basically ignores millions of players from low income families (which are approximately half of the population depending on region). How many possible great players are never given a chance? In the short term, ECNL and the club soccer structure have created positive results for those with the means to participate, but in the long term closing the door on so many players will slow the growth of the sport in this country, which will hurt ability for MLS and NWSL to become financially viable. If you want proof, look at the rosters of the top D1 women's teams in the country. While they are amazing athletes and players, they are not the best of the best. Since soccer has a limited number of scholarships, they are the best of the players whose families can afford to send them there with a few token less affluent players thrown in if they are really amazing players.

The old system of local leagues/National Cup/National League/National Championship is a more inclusive model and if US Soccer was run by individuals with foresight, they would figure out a way to make that work. Supposed "Elite" clubs will not always have the best coaches and players (and since they offer coaches an immense amount of power over players, increase the potential for abuse to be tolerated). At this point our only hope is that the players that go through this meat grinder of a system think of something better for their children.
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A lot of people forget that the top D1 schools and even top and D3 want the best academic players they can get. Some of the D1 schools will recruit a top player with a lower GPA and test scores hoping to pull in other players who are top academic students to raise their APR. Maybe some of these talented players need to put in more work academically. If they have great grades and are great soccer players, schools will pick them up regardless of their parents income.
 
Kicker4Life said:
Another way which parallels what you are saying is to grown ECRL and make the whole system a Promotion/Relegation system. Top 2 ECRL get promoted, bottom 2 ECNL get relegated.

Have National Showcases and Regional Showcases.
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There is absolutely no need for National Showcases, maybe one regional showcase per year. Waste of parents money and just another way for league to make money.
 
Emma said:
This is the chance to bring things back to a local level and develop players without excessive travel. This is the chance to do what we've all been hoping for: improve the quality in local leagues and give our players more time to play and develop, not travel (for practice or games).

Forget ECNL or DPL and just go back to our local leagues : SCDSL, CSL, SDDA, and Presidio.


Keep things simple.
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I don't have any kids in ECNL/DA so this is a neutral comment. Personally, I do feel bad for parents that had so much invested in DA programs. Better yet, kids that had their dreams to make it at the Pro level or play in college.

However, look on the bright side of this....
1. There's ECNL and if your kid is that good, you will not have a problem getting into a team.
2. Flight 1 is going to be really good now that the top talent will take ECNL and the reserves will move down to Flight 1.
3. Your child can play high school soccer. You may think it sucks, but now it's going to be much better. I actually think that college scouts will be checking out high school regional playoff games now. They will look for that star ECNL player and can scout non ECNL players as well.

4. ECNL doesn't guarantee scholarships moving forward. Again, ECNL doesn't guarantee it anymore. WHy?
- Too many colleges will begin to drop soccer and other sports. We are entering a new era of college and it's not going to benefit soccer.

5. We live in a new world. Next year tournaments will get cancelled again so get ready for some rocky times in 2021/2022
6. Professional Soccer players don't make much in this country. Have your kids focus on careers that actually pay more than $50k a year.
 
Messi>CR7 said:
I don't disagree with what you said, but different arguments can easily be made to justify the decision. Borrowing @sdb's map from earlier and ignore the club names for now. Which SoCal area is more under-represented?

If the decision is between the #2 DA club in an area that already has options, vs the #4 DA club in an under-represented area, what's the best long-term choice? (I'm not suggesting this is how the decision was made)

View attachment 6845
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The areas that seem particularly underserved by ECNL are South Bay/Long Beach/Seal Beach/Los Al and Pasadena/SGV area. If you're talking about dilution, the cluster of teams around Irvine/OCGP seems most diluted. Based on the PPG tables that have been posted here, LAG seems as deserving of a slot as any.
 
Kicker4Life said:
Always possible for those that can make the hour to hour + commute.
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How many Beach players actually live in Long Beach??? Probably just a handful. Some may already live on the Westside so it’ll be an easier commute for them. If little Suzy wants to play for an ECNL team, mom and dad will make it happen. I did it a couple of times with my kids. Most of my dd’s team moved from SoCal Academy/LA Surf to Breakers with most of us; including myself; living in the SGV. My son played for Legends DA last season with practice in Chino and home games at UC Riverside. It was tough but we did it. Hard choices will have to be made by families, just how bad do they want it...
 
outside! said:
It will not be "the best players", it will be "the best players whose parent's can afford it". Soccer in the US basically ignores millions of players from low income families (which are approximately half of the population depending on region). How many possible great players are never given a chance? In the short term, ECNL and the club soccer structure have created positive results for those with the means to participate, but in the long term closing the door on so many players will slow the growth of the sport in this country, which will hurt ability for MLS and NWSL to become financially viable. If you want proof, look at the rosters of the top D1 women's teams in the country. While they are amazing athletes and players, they are not the best of the best. Since soccer has a limited number of scholarships, they are the best of the players whose families can afford to send them there with a few token less affluent players thrown in if they are really amazing players.

The old system of local leagues/National Cup/National League/National Championship is a more inclusive model and if US Soccer was run by individuals with foresight, they would figure out a way to make that work. Supposed "Elite" clubs will not always have the best coaches and players (and since they offer coaches an immense amount of power over players, increase the potential for abuse to be tolerated). At this point our only hope is that the players that go through this meat grinder of a system think of something better for their children.
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I have to disagree. Being a good athlete does not mean that you are a good soccer player, football player, basketball player etc. The best schools find the best soccer players and if a player is good enough they will make it work. Are you telling me that there are players somewhere who played soccer growing up who are elite level and who want to play in college that can't find a team that will give them a scholarship plus grants that allow them to afford college? If so I call BS.
 
dad4 said:
Sort of.

It isn't Darwinism. I can't call it survival of the fittest as long as Legends is out. ( Not my club, but I'd like my daughter to play against them. )

It feels like ECNL wants to pick the winners now that USSF is out.
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They aren't picking winners. They are inviting in clubs that have already won. Prior to ECNL starting and becoming a closed league how many national championships did Legends win? Once the ECNL teams were out of the way then Legends could actually win something but prior to that they were second tier.
 
RedCard said:
How many Beach players actually live in Long Beach??? Probably just a handful. Some may already live on the Westside so it’ll be an easier commute for them. If little Suzy wants to play for an ECNL team, mom and dad will make it happen. I did it a couple of times with my kids. Most of my dd’s team moved from SoCal Academy/LA Surf to Breakers with most of us; including myself; living in the SGV. My son played for Legends DA last season with practice in Chino and home games at UC Riverside. It was tough but we did it. Hard choices will have to be made by families, just how bad do they want it...
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More than you think, but your point rings true as does mine. We can both be right.
 
MakeAPlay said:
I have to disagree. Being a good athlete does not mean that you are a good soccer player, football player, basketball player etc. The best schools find the best soccer players and if a player is good enough they will make it work. Are you telling me that there are players somewhere who played soccer growing up who are elite level and who want to play in college that can't find a team that will give them a scholarship plus grants that allow them to afford college? If so I call BS.
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No I am saying there are kids out there that could become elite players but will never get the chance to be in an environment where that will happen. That is what happens when 1/2 the population cannot afford to participate. For that matter, there are also probably great coaches out there that will never move up the ladder because they have the wrong accent.
 
MacDre said:
I see you have never had the privilege to indulge in the fabulous outdoor organic products of Humbolt county.
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Obviously has no clue. My buddy smokes this stuff today because of major back surgery he had years ago. This guy never smoked weed either until last year. 55 years old and was hooked on Morphine and Vicodin, Satan's little pills before the weed. Now off the poison and doing better. Anyway, I go over to his house and tells me he's got this premium "Cherry Pie." I grab it and I kid you not this stuff breaks up in my hands like dead man's bones. I said, "this is premium?" I then tell him about true skunk, Thai Stick, hash from the "brotherhood of eternal love" movement in laguna canyon that had much better quality products back in the 70s and 80s. I researched why the weed feels old and I'm told the boys have to freeze the dope now so it doesn;t go to mold.
 
SoccerFan4Life said:
6. Professional Soccer players don't make much in this country. Have your kids focus on careers that actually pay more than $50k a year.
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I've never understood the parents that are so motivated to make their kid into a professional soccer player. It's really the worst career choice, especially in this country, unless your kid really is a prodigy of sorts. I would be more willing to encourage my kid to try to make it in Hollywood as an actor than I would a professional soccer player. Small chance of making it, injury can ruin career and terrible salary potential.
 
foreveryoung said:
I've never understood the parents that are so motivated to make their kid into a professional soccer player. It's really the worst career choice, especially in this country, unless your kid really is a prodigy of sorts. I would be more willing to encourage my kid to try to make it in Hollywood as an actor than I would a professional soccer player. Small chance of making it, injury can ruin career and terrible salary potential.
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What makes you think it's the parents? I asked my dd what she wanted to do at 11 and she said wanted to be on the national team and be pro soccer player. So what, I wanted to be a MLB player and also play for the Lakers when I was 11. I did not go to my dd and say, "heya, you want to go pro like OM?" No, they came to some of us. I checked it out and saw no money. I even came on here and it's 100% no money. So I told my goat no pro $$ unless your the best and she's not. Go pro and work part time job, no thanks!!
 
Ellejustus said:
What makes you think it's the parents? I asked my dd what she wanted to do at 11 and she said wanted to be on the national team and be pro soccer player. So what, I wanted to be a MLB player and also play for the Lakers when I was 11. I did not go to my dd and say, "heya, you want to go pro like OM?" No, they came to some of us. I checked it out and saw no money. I even came on here and it's 100% no money. So I told my goat no pro $$ unless your the best and she's not. Go pro and work part time job, no thanks!!
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Personal experience. In my experience it's clear the parents are driving the situation. Obviously that might not always be the case but I was referring to my experience.
 
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