More potential NCAA changes

[Soccerfan2]

Do you know how well you have to score on SAT? 1300+, 1400+?

The Ivy coaches have a formula. They can have a few students a year at different GPA+SAT levels. The lower end is around 3.5 GPA and 1200 SAT. It’s the combination that matters, so the higher the GPA, the lower the SAT score can be and visa versa. They will do a pre check of GPA and PSAT during the first recruiting conversation and they will tell you explicitly what you need. They don’t bother advancing the conversation if you’re not already in the ballpark. As the previous poster said, they will also require a demanding course load all the way through senior year.

 

[Mosafie]

The downside with soccer is some Pay to Play clubs discourage kids from playing other sports. Or completely ban them ( MLS next). I have seen multiple elite soccer players go to college as recruits in other sports because it was simply easier than soccer for them.

R

This is correct but having just had discussions recently with 3 Ivy League coaches during recruitment…SAT and ACT scores matter (SAT requirement is likely coming back and you have to score well), you must continue to take a rigorous course load (not just easy A classes), keep grades 4.0+ through senior year, you commit to the admissions process (not commit to playing) because things can change if you don’t keep your grades stellar, and the top Ivies won’t even let you publicly announce your commitment until well into senior year. This is why a few still publicly state they have zero 2025 recruits. Also, there are no athletic scholarships so money is need based.

So essentially, you only go to an Ivy IF you are cool with the uncertainty of admissions, you have the money to pay for it or qualify for financial aid, and you are fine giving up all other scholarship offers in hopes admissions works out Senior year. It’s a huge decision, comes with risk and definitely isn’t as easy or glamorous as it sounds. PLUS the top soccer Ivies are extremely strong soccer programs with top players. You don’t just get an offer if you play soccer and have good grades. Some of the schools are on par with the top Power 4.

FYI many Ivys accept AP exam scores in place of SAT scores. They feel the AP tests better gauge the performance of students in subjects they have studies.

 

[Carlsbad7]

Oregon Asks Court to Reject Title IX Suit’s NIL ‘Theory’

UO beach volleyball players and club rowers are suing the school for sex discrimination. A settlement conference is set for next week.

www.sportico.com

Looks like the NIL Title 9 workaround is being challenged in court.

FYI for those that don't know colleges are giving money to male players via NIL. Female players are saying wait a minute. You can't just pay male players via NIL and not pay female players an equal amout of NIL funding per Title 9.

Interesting that Oregon is against equal NIL for male and female players.

 

[Zeke]

Oregon Asks Court to Reject Title IX Suit’s NIL ‘Theory’

UO beach volleyball players and club rowers are suing the school for sex discrimination. A settlement conference is set for next week.

www.sportico.com

Looks like the NIL Title 9 workaround is being challenged in court.

FYI for those that don't know colleges are giving money to male players via NIL. Female players are saying wait a minute. You can't just pay male players via NIL and not pay female players an equal amout of NIL funding per Title 9.

Interesting that Oregon is against equal NIL for male and female players.

If the athletes are employees, the schools will rethink sports funding before they do dollar for dollar equal pay. Athletic departments can't afford to pay a women's forward 1M per year just because that's what the men's QB makes. Even Rodman doesn't make that.

How they do that within Title IX is a different question.

 

[Carlsbad7]

If the athletes are employees, the schools will rethink sports funding before they do dollar for dollar equal pay. Athletic departments can't afford to pay a women's forward 1M per year just because that's what the men's QB makes. Even Rodman doesn't make that.

How they do that within Title IX is a different question.

That's the issue with the current NCAA settlement. They wanted to sanction NIL collectives. Basically NCAA wants to control who and how players get paid via NIL. BTW this is the section that was rejected by the judge last week.

If NCAA is able to control how players get paid via NIL. The question is are they also responsible for adhering to Title 9 and making the same amount of $$$ available to female players.

This sounds like a silly situation but not allowing NIL collectives because of Title 9 compleley opens up college sports.

 

[RandomSoccerFan]

FYI many Ivys accept AP exam scores in place of SAT scores. They feel the AP tests better gauge the performance of students in subjects they have studies.

This is in the process of changing back. Several are now already requiring SAT (or ACT) scores again, and all signs look like it will continue to grow.

 

[Zeke]

That's the issue with the current NCAA settlement. They wanted to sanction NIL collectives. Basically NCAA wants to control who and how players get paid via NIL. BTW this is the section that was rejected by the judge last week.

If NCAA is able to control how players get paid via NIL. The question is are they also responsible for adhering to Title 9 and making the same amount of $$$ available to female players.

This sounds like a silly situation but not allowing NIL collectives because of Title 9 compleley opens up college sports.

I wonder if courts will uphold equal pay the same way they upheld equal scholarships.

It was easy while the schools could pretend the players are all merely students, and the games were a recreational activity for those students.
Under that view, the girls deserve just as much recreation as the boys.

But, when it is a job with a salary, it all looks different.

 

[Carlsbad7]

I wonder if courts will uphold equal pay the same way they upheld equal scholarships.

It was easy while the schools could pretend the players are all merely students, and the games were a recreational activity for those students.
Under that view, the girls deserve just as much recreation as the boys.

But, when it is a job with a salary, it all looks different.

By next spring most of the big hurdles will be addressed. I don't see how NCAA is going to find a way out of all this that preserves the concept of "amateurism" as it exists today. The only thing I can see colleges maintaining is 4-5 years of eligibility.

 

[WatchthemPlay]

This is in the process of changing back. Several are now already requiring SAT (or ACT) scores again, and all signs look like it will continue to grow.

Correct and they are asking about scores, even the schools that don’t yet require them yet. They went away with COVID and are coming back as a requirement. And yes you need to have multiple AP classes to show rigor. The required scores maybe aren’t as high as a non-soccer kid but they require very competitive scores not far out of the range of the average for regular admissions. For a player who is being recruited by multiple schools, it just feels uncertain to put your eggs all in the Ivy bucket and say no to other full ride offers. Bummer that is the situation, but it is. A lot of stress to put on a kid.

 

[Mosafie]

College football players now make more money than Pro MLS players.

Oregon spend over $23 million last year building their football team. That's more than the LA Galaxy total salary.

The settlement with the NCAA which the schools agreed to says 22% of their revenue will be shared with athletes. All athletes are placed in a pool and paid equally. This will become an issue for low revenue schools trying to compete with big ones in Football. The only way they can pay football players more is to cut other sports and many will do that. Football is the only sport that matters.

NIL is completely different issue and is still demand based. NIL money may be passed through universities but the companies paying them contract directly with players. No NCAA or court is going to tell Nike how much they can pay each athlete at Oregon for their NIL.

Caleb Williams was the highest paid NIL athlete and got zero money directly from USC.

Within the next 10 years the 3 or 4 big conference will ditch the NCAA. Go private a single giant league. Make and police their own rules.

 

[Yak]

The settlement with the NCAA which the schools agreed to says 22% of their revenue will be shared with athletes. All athletes are placed in a pool and paid equally.

To be clear, all athletes playing a particular sport are paid equally. Revenue is not shared equally among all atheletes at the school. At least per the draft settlement

 

[Carlsbad7]

College football players now make more money than Pro MLS players.

Oregon spend over $23 million last year building their football team. That's more than the LA Galaxy total salary.

The settlement with the NCAA which the schools agreed to says 22% of their revenue will be shared with athletes. All athletes are placed in a pool and paid equally. This will become an issue for low revenue schools trying to compete with big ones in Football. The only way they can pay football players more is to cut other sports and many will do that. Football is the only sport that matters.

NIL is completely different issue and is still demand based. NIL money may be passed through universities but the companies paying them contract directly with players. No NCAA or court is going to tell Nike how much they can pay each athlete at Oregon for their NIL.

Caleb Williams was the highest paid NIL athlete and got zero money directly from USC.

Within the next 10 years the 3 or 4 big conference will ditch the NCAA. Go private a single giant league. Make and police their own rules.

Reguarding NIL what you're describing is what the Oregon case I provided a link to is about. NCAA is trying to control NIL by forcing payments to go through collectives which NCAA can define rules for. Also yes colleges are giving NIL $$$ to players through the collectives.

The Oregon lawsuit is saying hold on a minute, colleges are giving $$$ to male football players via NIL through collectives. Because the $$$ is coming from schools it's subject to Title 9 and and equivalent amount of $$$ should go to female players.

Nike can still give NIL money directly to players but colleges can't use NIL as a way to funnel money into male players + not pay an equivalent amount to female players because of Title 9.

 

[Carlsbad7]

WHL player commits to ASU, challenging NCAA

Braxton Whitehead of the WHL's Regina Pats has received a verbal commitment from Arizona State's Division I program despite NCAA eligibility rules that prevent any player who has appeared in a major junior hockey game from playing college hockey.

www.espn.com

Players that have played and been paid for playing "Pro" hockey are now committing to D1 schools.

This is a direct challenge to NCAAs "amateurism" concept. Schools see that NCAA can't enforce amature status or they'll get put in court. In the end the only thing NCAA will be able to enforce is the number of years of college eligibility.

For soccer what this means is MLS players or any professional league players are eligible for playing in college.

This will have deep ramifications for all kinds of different sports. Recruiters will be able to recruit pro players that want to go back to school. So now HS recruits are competing against 21+ year old full time professional players for roster spots.

 

[crush]

This will have deep ramifications for all kinds of different sports. Recruiters will be able to recruit pro players that want to go back to school. So now HS recruits are competing against 21+ year old full time professional players for roster spots.

100%. This is great. Go Pro at 16 then come back for a degree at 20, play 4 years of top college soccer and then go live life. Or, play pro 8 years, travel the world for free, make some moneyand then come back to school at 24, ball and then become a coach or teacher at 28.

 

[Carlsbad7]

100%. This is great. Go Pro at 16 then come back for a degree at 20, play 4 years of top college soccer and then go live life. Or, play pro 8 years, travel the world for free, make some moneyand then come back to school at 24, ball and then become a coach or teacher at 28.

I don't know if the changes will be good or bad for young people. It does seem like college sports will end up just like pro sports but with the added benefit of scholorships and a college degree.

What's to stop a big name pro from playing on a college team the way Premier League players play in MLS when they get old? Once you stop being effective in a pro league just play in college and make $$$ off your name via NIL beating up on former HS players.

 

[watfly]

WHL player commits to ASU, challenging NCAA

Braxton Whitehead of the WHL's Regina Pats has received a verbal commitment from Arizona State's Division I program despite NCAA eligibility rules that prevent any player who has appeared in a major junior hockey game from playing college hockey.

www.espn.com

Players that have played and been paid for playing "Pro" hockey are now committing to D1 schools.

This is a direct challenge to NCAAs "amateurism" concept. Schools see that NCAA can't enforce amature status or they'll get put in court. In the end the only thing NCAA will be able to enforce is the number of years of college eligibility.

For soccer what this means is MLS players or any professional league players are eligible for playing in college.

This will have deep ramifications for all kinds of different sports. Recruiters will be able to recruit pro players that want to go back to school. So now HS recruits are competing against 21+ year old full time professional players for roster spots.

Fairly common for hockey players to play a year of two of professional Junior Hockey before going to college.

What I'm saying is that colleges have been making so much money off students + donations + federal funding + etc that they've been able to save up soo much money that the (tax free) interest alone could fund the entire school.

That's the bigger picture. Many universities are sitting on multi-billion dollar endowments and still charge exorbitant amounts for tuition. I say they should be ineligible for federal funding (and/or taxed) unless they put some of the money back into lowering tuition. Research students in many cases bring more money into the school than a soccer player. Where's their NIL money.

Crazy that this all started with Ed O'Bannon suing the NCAA for using his likeness on a video game. I feel like its one thing to use someone's likeness for a "side gig" and not compensate the player, and a whole other thing when a college receives ticket revenue and tv money and players expect to share in that income when the college creates the platform for that to occur (while the player receives a free education). I'm conflicted and just feel like we've jumped the shark when it comes to compensation and unionization of college athletes.

 

[Carlsbad7]

Fairly common for hockey players to play a year of two of professional Junior Hockey before going to college.

That's the bigger picture. Many universities are sitting on multi-billion dollar endowments and still charge exorbitant amounts for tuition. I say they should be ineligible for federal funding (and/or taxed) unless they put some of the money back into lowering tuition. Research students in many cases bring more money into the school than a soccer player. Where's their NIL money.

Crazy that this all started with Ed O'Bannon suing the NCAA for using his likeness on a video game. I feel like its one thing to use someone's likeness for a "side gig" and not compensate the player, and a whole other thing when a college receives ticket revenue and tv money and players expect to share in that income when the college creates the platform for that to occur (while the player receives a free education). I'm conflicted and just feel like we've jumped the shark when it comes to compensation and unionization of college athletes.

Everyone's got their own opinion on the topic. I'd like to point out that if colleges paid players as employees everything would work out. The issue with NCAA is they're going to go down kicking and screaming for their "right" to exploit players.

 

[watfly]

Everyone's got their own opinion on the topic. I'd like to point out that if colleges paid players as employees everything would work out. The issue with NCAA is they're going to go down kicking and screaming for their "right" to exploit players.

Yes, the NCAA is corrupt and greedy. I'm not convinced that paying players as employees is the solution, but I don't have any better suggestion. I'll admit that this is an issue I can't really get my mind around.

 

[Code]

Best thing that could happen is college sports goes away, and colleges focus on education and research. The althetes can continue to play in free-market sports leagues for compensation, or in local leagues for the love of playing the game.

 

[crush]

Best thing that could happen is college sports goes away, and colleges focus on education and research. The althetes can continue to play in free-market sports leagues for compensation, or in local leagues for the love of playing the game.

I have a very good friend whose daughter is studying biology in England and then plays on the soccer team for fun and competition. The schools in England are more specific, like a biology only Big U. Gov pays a little, Parents pay a little, she works part time to pay a little and she gets a little help for being on the club soccer team for the school. Soccer is very popular in England. I think we need to blow up this sports system and just focus on your specific trade.