Bad News Thread

Yep my brother in law died alone in hospice. They didn't allow his immediate family any visits at all. Finally when he was within an hour of so of death they "allowed" his kids and wife to visit. He by that time was so far gone he didn't know anyone was even there.
That's criminal...makes my stomach turn and pisses me off. Can't imagine how the family felt. My condolences to you and his family. That's just so wrong.
 
Yep my brother in law died alone in hospice. They didn't allow his immediate family any visits at all. Finally when he was within an hour of so of death they "allowed" his kids and wife to visit. He by that time was so far gone he didn't know anyone was even there.
That's what Dad4 advocates.
 
Just got some sad news. My favorite breakfast dinner (not one of those chain restaurants...a mom and pop) is closing its doors after 65 years. Prepandemic it was always full and the wait on Sundays was at least a 1/2 hour. We'd always go after church or after dropping off the car across the street for service. Kids grew up there....love the omelettes. VC, unlike LA, only briefly closed outdoor dining when forced by the state. But most people don't go out and get once weekly takeout from the dinner, so right at the finish line, they had to close up....they just got too far on their bills. Our favorite sushi place has the same issue (people don't get sushi for takeout). A blow to the main blvd too which has lost quite a few businesses during the pandemic. I have pictures of the kids growing up there....sad.

It has been years since I had sushi that was not takeout, or not available for takeout in boxes like this --

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The response back at this point should be "I'm fully vaccinated thanks. I believe in science."
Your science is a bit off.

Unless vaccines completely eliminate transmission, then you still have some benefit from masks.

Part of that benefit is keeping the social norm of masks. We still have over 40% of people unvaccinated. The vaccine holdouts are not going to mask up if the rest of us go bare faced.

And, if the unvaccinated 40% skip masks, it will take that much longer for cases and deaths to drop.
 
Your science is a bit off.

Unless vaccines completely eliminate transmission, then you still have some benefit from masks.

Part of that benefit is keeping the social norm of masks. We still have over 40% of people unvaccinated. The vaccine holdouts are not going to mask up if the rest of us go bare faced.

And, if the unvaccinated 40% skip masks, it will take that much longer for cases and deaths to drop.
The mask less unvaccinated in about 3 weeks time will have assumed the risk.
 
The mask less unvaccinated in about 3 weeks time will have assumed the risk.
Like it or not, even vaccinated people have a good reason to want covid cases lower.

I know “vaccinated = zero risk” is a convenient approximation. It’s close to true. But, as you would say, that’s micro. It really only explains the short to medium term effect on individuals.

On a macro, population wide scale, it’s different. Having 60% vaccinated while 40% keep the virus alive is just a recipe for creating vaccine resistant variants. Eventually, we have to get our act together and vaccinate the remainder of adults.
 
It's been a month since that packed Texas Rangers game.

Dr. Fauci didn't like that game one bit:
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I wonder if anyone is going to ask him why his latest prediction of doom about people living normally was as wrong as usual:

z-BHkAESXFU7iHwKAqvwqhpKxOvY4mqxPzDfNEAOjMcInaGu4mHwle5tqOOUi0-xEalGWzizxuHPLD6BZtJkkFWiUgS4vMUXmtL8FzUClY-oD3u_WCS8LPpfvPXtbxt4UlcpfZ_GXXKVEJd_gBYN3lj-0HnY-Q=s0-d-e1-ft
And finally, courtesy of Eric @IAmTheActualET on Twitter, here are the 25 most stringent lockdown states graphed against the 25 least stringent; there must be a radical different between the two groups, right?
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Shouldn't those hospitalization numbers be wildly different? And yet you can't even tell them apart.

How does this not end the debate right there? (This is a rhetorical question.)
 
Like it or not, even vaccinated people have a good reason to want covid cases lower.

I know “vaccinated = zero risk” is a convenient approximation. It’s close to true. But, as you would say, that’s micro. It really only explains the short to medium term effect on individuals.

On a macro, population wide scale, it’s different. Having 60% vaccinated while 40% keep the virus alive is just a recipe for creating vaccine resistant variants. Eventually, we have to get our act together and vaccinate the remainder of adults.
Wrong again
 
Like it or not, even vaccinated people have a good reason to want covid cases lower.

I know “vaccinated = zero risk” is a convenient approximation. It’s close to true. But, as you would say, that’s micro. It really only explains the short to medium term effect on individuals.

On a macro, population wide scale, it’s different. Having 60% vaccinated while 40% keep the virus alive is just a recipe for creating vaccine resistant variants. Eventually, we have to get our act together and vaccinate the remainder of adults.
again as we’ve discussed if the variant risk is what you are worried about: a. That’s really an argument for forcing the remaining 40%...to get there though you’d have to remove the eu label first and I rather use soft incentives first and b. Worlds not finished until 2023 so unless you are going to finish trumps wall, shut the borders even to American citizens and ground the planes, you are worried about the horses after they’ve fled the barn.

but then you are a preacher so you worry about these silly little things rather than the big things because that’s what’s important to you.
 
Tuckers nonsensical rant notwithstanding there have been a few reports of GB syndrome with the mRNA vaccines (from the news reports at least as many as the blood clots from the j&j vaccine in the us). But GB happens with quite a few vaccines and the incidence is really low and can also happen with natural infections. The media isn’t reporting and Twitter is soft censoring for fear of setting off a panic for something which shouldn’t.

there’s also been a rash of heart attacks but since we are vaccinating so many people and there are bound to be coincidences which otherwise would have happened, tuckers rant notwithstanding, it’s hard to distinguish that from the noise.

still the handling of the j&j shot and their unwillingness to look at this doesn’t exactly raise confidence when it comes to vaccinating the kids
 
Tuckers nonsensical rant notwithstanding there have been a few reports of GB syndrome with the mRNA vaccines (from the news reports at least as many as the blood clots from the j&j vaccine in the us). But GB happens with quite a few vaccines and the incidence is really low and can also happen with natural infections. The media isn’t reporting and Twitter is soft censoring for fear of setting off a panic for something which shouldn’t.

there’s also been a rash of heart attacks but since we are vaccinating so many people and there are bound to be coincidences which otherwise would have happened, tuckers rant notwithstanding, it’s hard to distinguish that from the noise.

still the handling of the j&j shot and their unwillingness to look at this doesn’t exactly raise confidence when it comes to vaccinating the kids
But SAR's enters the body through ears, nose and mouth. Vaccines Uber direct to the blood stream. Comparing transmission of the actual virus and a shot that is not the virus makes little sense. Natural infections are natural. Virus's are and always will be a part of the evolutionary process. We are bathed in virus's daily. Our innate and adaptive immune systems contain the intel to fight off virtually all virus's. Billions are without vaccines. A world population of 7.7 billion doesn't happen without a robust and evolving immune system.
 
But SAR's enters the body through ears, nose and mouth. Vaccines Uber direct to the blood stream. Comparing transmission of the actual virus and a shot that is not the virus makes little sense. Natural infections are natural. Virus's are and always will be a part of the evolutionary process. We are bathed in virus's daily. Our innate and adaptive immune systems contain the intel to fight off virtually all virus's. Billions are without vaccines. A world population of 7.7 billion doesn't happen without a robust and evolving immune system.

Yeah, but like everything it's not free. It comes at the cost which is mostly born by the old people but also every once in a while it also strikes down someone younger in their 50s 40s and even 30s. It's a da kine thing.

Small pox was also natural and we had dealt with it as far back as the Roman Empire. Struck down millions over recorded history. I doubt anyone mourns the disappearance of small pox.

Natural infection is about on par with the first vaccine dose, at least so they think. The protocol they are studying in the UK is if you've had it, you may only need the 1 shot, but they aren't sure yet.
 
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