Vaccine

Kicker4Life said:
Honest question, what does my vaccination status have to do with your health?
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I can’t use an ICU bed to recover from surgery if you are using it to treat your covid.

With just two people, not a big deal. I schedule my surgery and use another bed. Problem solved.

With 330 million people, it is a big deal. 100 million vaccine refusers can completely clog regional health care systems. When that happens, I can’t schedule my surgery, and my health is impacted.
 
dad4 said:
I can’t use an ICU bed to recover from surgery if you are using it to treat your covid.

With just two people, not a big deal. I schedule my surgery and use another bed. Problem solved.

With 330 million people, it is a big deal. 100 million vaccine refusers can completely clog regional health care systems. When that happens, I can’t schedule my surgery, and my health is impacted.
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A bit of a stretch, especially when hospitals have specifics “wards” set up for Covid ICU’s.

Of your 100 million “vaccine registers” how many have had C19? How many of those who aren’t vax’d but can confirm having had C19 are ending up in ICU’s?
 
Pandemic Preparedness: The Need for a Public Health
– Not a Law Enforcement/National Security – Approach

Conflating Public Health with National Security and Law Enforcement

Rather than focusing on well-established measures for protecting the lives and health of Americans, policymakers have recently embraced an approach that views public health policy through the prism of national security and law enforcement. This model assumes that we must “trade liberty for security.” As a result, instead of helping individuals and communities through education and provision of health care, today’s pandemic prevention focuses on taking aggressive, coercive actions against those who are sick. People, rather than the disease, become the enemy.
 
Kicker4Life said:
A bit of a stretch, especially when hospitals have specifics “wards” set up for Covid ICU’s.

Of your 100 million “vaccine registers” how many have had C19? How many of those who aren’t vax’d but can confirm having had C19 are ending up in ICU’s?
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Hospitals created those covid wards by taking resources away from other departments.

Covid patients didn't create a 50% increase in available nursing staff. They just created an increase in demand. The supply came by reallocating the people who are already trained.

When hospital administrators talk about delays in elective surgeries, do you think they are just making shit up?
 
dad4 said:
I can’t use an ICU bed to recover from surgery if you are using it to treat your covid.

With just two people, not a big deal. I schedule my surgery and use another bed. Problem solved.

With 330 million people, it is a big deal. 100 million vaccine refusers can completely clog regional health care systems. When that happens, I can’t schedule my surgery, and my health is impacted.
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Welcome to the party Alice. Aren't you a bit late?
 
dad4 said:
Hospitals created those covid wards by taking resources away from other departments.

Covid patients didn't create a 50% increase in available nursing staff. They just created an increase in demand. The supply came by reallocating the people who are already trained.

When hospital administrators talk about delays in elective surgeries, do you think they are just making shit up?
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The only people making shit up is you case hyping cowards.
 
dad4 said:
Most hospitals are happy to explain that 90-100 percent of their covid ICU patients are not vaccinated. The doctors are tired of it, too.

If you look at the ICU stats, it’s pretty clear that the crush of unvaccinated covid patients is creating health care shortages for other patients.

You can deny it, but that doesn‘t make it any less true.
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I suppose it is more PC than to point out most ICU patients also fall into one or more of these categories 1) obese 2) unhealthy eating habits. 3) insufficient exercise 4) drink too much alcohol or have drug dependency 5) practice risky sexual behavior. Sure, COVID is something new, but shouldn't we be pointing out all "controllable" causes of hospitalization if we are attempting to eliminate hospital bed shortages? Maybe we should produce and tweet statistics for all the obese people at the hospital and let them know their lifestyles aren't supported by science - many, many years of science - and they are taking hospital beds from others. In order for obese people to work, let's enforce a low-calorie, vegetarian diet (CDC approved, of course) until they reach a level where they are not obese. They can check in every 6 months to see if they need a "booster" diet to stay within range. I bet that would bring down hospital bed demand.
 
dad4 said:
Hospitals created those covid wards by taking resources away from other departments.

Covid patients didn't create a 50% increase in available nursing staff. They just created an increase in demand. The supply came by reallocating the people who are already trained.

When hospital administrators talk about delays in elective surgeries, do you think they are just making shit up?
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So your not going to even acknowledge my question, just ignore and double down.
 
Desert Hound said:
I note you conveniently ignore the points.

1) We do not know if there are any long terms issues with the vaccines. This statement is 100% correct. We started vaxxing people less than a year ago.
2) The next point was if we do not know long term affects of the vaccines, maybe we should not rush to mandate them. That is an entirely rational point
3) The other point made was that some people are in a high risk group. They should get vaxxed because of their risk factors. That is an entirely rational point.

Those are the 3 main points the person was talking about.

Which ones do you find offensive? Anti vax? Or anti science? And why?
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(1) Yes, we know with a high degree of certainty that there aren't long term issues. Vaccines have been rigorously vetted and one study after the next verifies it if you care to look. They have concluded they are safe except in incredibly rare and almost always mild circumstances that do not even remotely outweigh the risks, just like every other vaccine. And now that vaccines are FDA approved, 166 health systems have already reached the same conclusion and are mandating them, including such sharlatans as the Mayo Clinic, Duke Health, UPenn, USC Keck, UCLA, U Kentucky, UNC, U Alabama, U Chicago, U Louisville, U Maryland, U Utah, U Washington, and Yale, plus healthcare giants like Trinity, Sutter and Kaiser. And also crazy that children's hospitals of CO, CT and TX, plus numerous other local children's hospitals in Omaha, Philadelphia, Cincinnati, Dayton, Fresno, and St. Jude's have deemed vaccines sufficiently safe and important enough to protect even the little kiddies whom you claim are impervious to Covid-19 and cannot transmit it to others. Weren't you the one saying we should listen to those on the front line? On the other hand, you believe an anonymous fake post presumably from a conspiracy theory website relying on Dr. Horse Paste.

(2) This is irrational. The government is not making you get vaccinated. A few state governments are requiring that certain of their employees and some healthcare providers get vaccinated, but that's it and you aren't one of them. And since when did an American "patriot" and "lover of freedom" like yourself start trying to dictate decisions that businesses can make about their employees? If you don't want to get vaccinated, go work somewhere that doesn't require a vaccination. Why can't an employer exercise their freedom to kick your butt out of their business for being dangerous and expensive to their staff? Why shouldn't an employer be able to decide they don't want to pay increased healthcare and workers' compensation costs and restructure their operations to accommodate a handful of idiots? I'd think you of all people would support a company's right to cut unnecessary costs. Businesses don't need more information to know how much idiot anti-vaxxers are costing them in increased healthcare and workers' comp costs, in protective equipment and other precautions that would otherwise be unnecessary, in missed work time and other increased costs. In healthcare contexts especially, they know how much idiot anti-vaxxers have clogged up their ERs and ICUs and are killing patients who need medical care for legitimate reasons, and not because they're dumbfuck anti-vaxxers. What businesses don't know, however, is which of their dumbfuck anti-vaxxer employees are "high risk" and will end up costing them a fortune, so they may as well just get rid of them all. Even better if it's a public employer, since it saves us taxpayer dollars, right? Plus, anti-vaxxers are troublemakers and generally shitty employees anyway, so good riddance. Right crush?

(3) Not exactly. Many people in high risk groups cannot get vaccinated. Many people are in high risk groups and don't know it. Some people in good health will still die of Covid. Many people will suffer or die because our healthcare system is clogged with dumbfuck anti-vaxxers.

How on earth do you claim to be on the side of science when you're posting an apparently fake anonymous fake manifesto by a fake doctor that relies on horse paste as a better solution to Covid than vaccines, especially when 166 health care systems and virtually every single expert in the field say you're full of shit?

I answered your questions. So who is the mystery doctor/author/war veteran/graduate of a big 10 school/former resident of a prestigious place/horse paste advocate? Who is this guy who says the CDC, the Mayo Clinic, Yale and 164 other healthcare systems are wrong?
 
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