Vaccine

dad4 said:
Why talk Utah? Six months ago, you wanted to talk about Florida, Texas, and California
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I also would point out you thought you had a gotcha moment...ie masks saves the day...but go silent on Utah as just one example. They are not doing anything close to what CA or SF is doing and yet have had a substantially better outcome.

Based on the masked advocates preaching, they (Utah) should be in a far worse place now. And yet they are not.

Read the detailed article @Grace T. and others posted regarding the actual studies on masks. I notice even @dad4 didn't have much to say on it because it is hard to refute.

And yet people keep "believing".
 
dad4 said:
Are you saying Vegas is requiring jabs?

Or that you think the Raiders will lose their minds and return to Oaktown?
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Clark county Nevada (Vegas) has been requiring masks as of this month. They just announced an exception for large venue events if fully vaccinated and/or negative tests are required by the venue.
 
Desert Hound said:
Actually I am still happy to. All 3 states have about the same outcome...despite one (CA) closing schools, biz etc.

The stats on that haven't changed. CA's measures didn't make a difference.

Tx, FL, CA all have deaths per million less than the average in the US. You wouldn't know that just watching the news.

And in a month from now their stats will still be about the same.

The problem with delta is that cases don't really matter much. Cases are largely detached from deaths.
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I would recommend checking out the data on covid.cdc.gov. I made the attached graphs from their data, showing the reported new deaths attributed to covid per 100k over time (since start of covid death reporting). Right now, Utah is looking roughly similar to the overall US numbers. CA numbers are better than the national average. Note it is a log scale. They also have a page where one can dig into hospitalizations by age and jurisdiction if you want to dig into the recent increases in pediatric (and other age group) hospitalizations.
 

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Desert Hound said:
I also would point out you thought you had a gotcha moment...ie masks saves the day...but go silent on Utah as just one example. They are not doing anything close to what CA or SF is doing and yet have had a substantially better outcome.

Based on the masked advocates preaching, they (Utah) should be in a far worse place now. And yet they are not.

Read the detailed article @Grace T. and others posted regarding the actual studies on masks. I notice even @dad4 didn't have much to say on it because it is hard to refute.

And yet people keep "believing".
Click to expand...

Just curious, if one is to believe masks are so useless, then why do medical personnel wear them? Why bother with the extra cost and hassle? Is it just so that if the king George character from Hamilton is your surgeon that he won't spit in your incisions?
 
Roadrunner said:
I would recommend checking out the data on covid.cdc.gov. I made the attached graphs from their data, showing the reported new deaths attributed to covid per 100k over time (since start of covid death reporting). Right now, Utah is looking roughly similar to the overall US numbers. CA numbers are better than the national average. Note it is a log scale. They also have a page where one can dig into hospitalizations by age and jurisdiction if you want to dig into the recent increases in pediatric (and other age group) hospitalizations.
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If we are now in a pandemic of the ‘unvaccinated’…can we admit that obesity drives the death rate of Covid, second only to age?

Maybe there is a more simple correlation between those states populations/death rates relative to age and obesity within the population.
 
Roadrunner said:
Just curious, if one is to believe masks are so useless, then why do medical personnel wear them? Why bother with the extra cost and hassle? Is it just so that if the king George character from Hamilton is your surgeon that he won't spit in your incisions?
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For surgical masks it’s absolutely correct…to prevent bacterial infections in wounds. The practice of masking arose when bacterial infections were a large concern and is just part of standard practice. It’s also the reason for the gloves. If you’ll recall a few years back there was even that concern in hospitals you can catch drug resistant infections. These are also single use btw and never reused

otherwise, for highly infections diseases, they wear n95s. Those n95s are measured, fit tested and single use.

neither of these are the multiple use handmade cloth masks which go in the washing machine where their holes are made even bigger when washed. And the standard for these was flu which is transmitted in droplets not aerosolized and not as heavy particle wise as the delta

You wanna put n95s on 5 year olds let’s talk about the pros and cons. Otherwise you are doing security theater.
 
Grace T. said:
For surgical masks it’s absolutely correct…to prevent bacterial infections in wounds. The practice of masking arose when bacterial infections were a large concern and is just part of standard practice. It’s also the reason for the gloves. If you’ll recall a few years back there was even that concern in hospitals you can catch drug resistant infections. These are also single use btw and never reused

otherwise, for highly infections diseases, they wear n95s. Those n95s are measured, fit tested and single use.

neither of these are the multiple use handmade cloth masks which go in the washing machine where their holes are made even bigger when washed. And the standard for these was flu which is transmitted in droplets not aerosolized and not as heavy particle wise as the delta

You wanna put n95s on 5 year olds let’s talk about the pros and cons. Otherwise you are doing security theater.
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What is the transmission vehicle for delta? How does it vary from the same for other covid variants?
 
N00B said:
If we are now in a pandemic of the ‘unvaccinated’…can we admit that obesity drives the death rate of Covid, second only to age?

Maybe there is a more simple correlation between those states populations/death rates relative to age and obesity within the population.
Click to expand...

Obesity, age, diabetes. - yes, all among things known to increase personal risk for surviving/ recovering from covid. I'm sure access to medical care is also up there as a factor too. It wouldn't be at all surprising for covid death rates to be higher in areas where people cannot get adequate medical assistance.

The antibody drug treatment still works against delta, but I do not know how widely available it is. Where medical personnel are overwhelmed, however, they probably aren't going to be treating many patients with it because I understand it is a time intensive procedure to administer. Prevention is the best cure.
 
Roadrunner said:
Obesity, age, diabetes. - yes, all among things known to increase personal risk for surviving/ recovering from covid. I'm sure access to medical care is also up there as a factor too. It wouldn't be at all surprising for covid death rates to be higher in areas where people cannot get adequate medical assistance.

The antibody drug treatment still works against delta, but I do not know how widely available it is. Where medical personnel are overwhelmed, however, they probably aren't going to be treating many patients with it because I understand it is a time intensive procedure to administer. Prevention is the best cure.
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Obesity is a huge healthy concerns for kids & adults and will kill you. Don't think for a minute it's because someone like me is the problem. No, the problem is the weight and the lack of discipline to eat right. So many kids sit around plying video games and eating horrible poison. Throw mask on them is not helping either. I'm glad were all talking about the elephant in the room. I tried to warn my pals and everyone here to get healthy, that was 18 months ago. My wife has a nephew who is not doing good weight wise. Super prideful too and argues how he is right about the Rona and the shots. It's so hard to listen to his BS. He's at least 125 pounds over weight.

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Roadrunner said:
Just curious, if one is to believe masks are so useless, then why do medical personnel wear them? Why bother with the extra cost and hassle? Is it just so that if the king George character from Hamilton is your surgeon that he won't spit in your incisions?
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I was going to respond, but @Grace T. got there first.
 
N00B said:
If we are now in a pandemic of the ‘unvaccinated’…can we admit that obesity drives the death rate of Covid, second only to age?

Maybe there is a more simple correlation between those states populations/death rates relative to age and obesity within the population.
Click to expand...

The CDC covid site has a page with data that gets to your point as well, looking at preexisting conditions in populations at county level.
 
Grace T. said:
For surgical masks it’s absolutely correct…to prevent bacterial infections in wounds. The practice of masking arose when bacterial infections were a large concern and is just part of standard practice. It’s also the reason for the gloves. If you’ll recall a few years back there was even that concern in hospitals you can catch drug resistant infections. These are also single use btw and never reused

otherwise, for highly infections diseases, they wear n95s. Those n95s are measured, fit tested and single use.

neither of these are the multiple use handmade cloth masks which go in the washing machine where their holes are made even bigger when washed. And the standard for these was flu which is transmitted in droplets not aerosolized and not as heavy particle wise as the delta

You wanna put n95s on 5 year olds let’s talk about the pros and cons. Otherwise you are doing security theater.
Click to expand...

Actually Grace, there's data on masks that supports their ability to reduce transmission of viruses too. It's definitely more complicated, as many on this forum have discussed. (And yes, I have put a n95 respirator on an 8 year old, and expected them to wear it for the duration of a long day of travel through crowded airports in areas with high delta transmission.)

I like the discussion in the review I'm attaching here, and not just their section on masks vs no masks. Things are not just black and white, there's lots of gray and complexities.
 

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Roadrunner said:
Actually Grace, there's data on masks that supports their ability to reduce transmission of viruses too. It's definitely more complicated, as many on this forum have discussed. (And yes, I have put a n95 respirator on an 8 year old, and expected them to wear it for the duration of a long day of travel through crowded airports in areas with high delta transmission.)

I like the discussion in the review I'm attaching here, and not just their section on masks vs no masks. Things are not just black and white, there's lots of gray and complexities.
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Grace doesn't care about data. She is just trying to rationalize a prepared political position.
 
Roadrunner said:
Actually Grace, there's data on masks that supports their ability to reduce transmission of viruses too. It's definitely more complicated, as many on this forum have discussed. (And yes, I have put a n95 respirator on an 8 year old, and expected them to wear it for the duration of a long day of travel through crowded airports in areas with high delta transmission.)

I like the discussion in the review I'm attaching here, and not just their section on masks vs no masks. Things are not just black and white, there's lots of gray and complexities.
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I wonder if funding and pressure from Gov agencies do the same thing? Trick question.

www.upi.com

Survey: 1 in 5 medical researchers reports pressure from funders to change study results - UPI.com

Nearly one in five public health researchers feels pressured by study funders to delay reporting or change findings, a survey published Wednesday by PLOS One found.
www.upi.com www.upi.com
 
Roadrunner said:
Actually Grace, there's data on masks that supports their ability to reduce transmission of viruses too. It's definitely more complicated, as many on this forum have discussed. (And yes, I have put a n95 respirator on an 8 year old, and expected them to wear it for the duration of a long day of travel through crowded airports in areas with high delta transmission.)

I like the discussion in the review I'm attaching here, and not just their section on masks vs no masks. Things are not just black and white, there's lots of gray and complexities.
Click to expand...
Hahaha! What a troll. This post reeks of EOTL spawn. So, RR, where does your child play soccer? You just got on here August 4th, right? And you are everywhere. That's quite a start for a newbie. I remember the parent of a trans child finding our conversation in depths of "Off Topic 2" to speak of the trials of their child. The sad thing is, these are perfectly worthy conversations to have but your Jason Blair approach is pathetic.
 
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