Why do kids switch clubs

[crush]

Lou's son has been pigeon-holed for three years. Lots of parents also pigeon-hole kids with potential new team with the, "my child is a 10 or no thanks" approach. Parents looking to join another family but will only come if little Susie or Charlie are guaranteed the 10 spot is just as bad as a coach forcing a kid to play defense on same team when child is 7-10 years old is not good.

Charlie: Coach, can I play some offense

Coach: Sorry Charlie, no!

Three years later, Charlie and dad ask coach about 11 x 11 and where Charlie fits in coaches plans

Coach: CB

This is not good.

 

[sigmabody]

Yes. Most of the roster spots at most of the top teams are all but done before the large group tryouts.

Offers or rejections I guess. But even rejections would be nice then cause you can focus on other teams/clubs.

This is true for my son's smaller club as well. Early invites went out already, and most of the existing players received them, with the requirement to accept or reject by end of January (ish). I don't think they sent out any early rejections, but I know some of the weaker players did not get invites to register early, and were instead asked to attend the tryouts (which are next week).

Based on what the club did last year, I'd guess that most (if not all) of those players would still get invites to play with the club next year also, unless they get a large influx of better players or something (and perhaps even if they do). My impression is that the club was more trying to just "lock in" the stronger players early, before they had a chance to look around (in essence, forcing them to commit before the tryout period was open in order to guarantee a spot on the team, or risk getting dropped during try outs). The generous reading is that they are doing early team capacity planning for coaching decisions; the pragmatic view is that they are applying pressure on parents of kids who might have other/better options elsewhere, before they are allowed to explore them.

I know at least a couple kids who received early invites who are not accepting them, because they want to explore other options after the tryout window opens, even though they will probably still try to stay with the club. Others are taking the offers to not risk getting dropped later. But I estimate that at least 50% of the team slots will be filled by tryouts, if not more.

 

[crush]

This is true for my son's smaller club as well. Early invites went out already, and most of the existing players received them, with the requirement to accept or reject by end of January (ish). I don't think they sent out any early rejections, but I know some of the weaker players did not get invites to register early, and were instead asked to attend the tryouts (which are next week).

Based on what the club did last year, I'd guess that most (if not all) of those players would still get invites to play with the club next year also, unless they get a large influx of better players or something (and perhaps even if they do). My impression is that the club was more trying to just "lock in" the stronger players early, before they had a chance to look around (in essence, forcing them to commit before the tryout period was open in order to guarantee a spot on the team, or risk

My dd was on the best team and this coach was one of OC's best coaches. He started ODP and was the first ever U15 YNT coach. No one was allowed to guest play for our team or come to our practices. Coach did put on Sunday scrimmages to recruit other top players plus he and his side kick would show up a game early to look for next year's haul. Kids change and you always have to look for the best if you want to be the best. Poor guy took a bad rap for over recruiting and stealing other players from other clubs. He told all the parents before the season that after the season, he would hold tryouts. Basically, if he cut you, you could miss on the early offers to switch over. Retaliation also comes into play if parents, team manager (team spy in some cases) and or coach find out your looking at other clubs. I strongly believe in the one year commitment on both sides. Some coaches would bring ringers in and take play time away from the paying customer, the parent. Kid is pissed because no play time. We need some rules.

 

[Socal-Soccer-Dad]

This is true for my son's smaller club as well. Early invites went out already, and most of the existing players received them, with the requirement to accept or reject by end of January (ish). I don't think they sent out any early rejections, but I know some of the weaker players did not get invites to register early, and were instead asked to attend the tryouts (which are next week).

Based on what the club did last year, I'd guess that most (if not all) of those players would still get invites to play with the club next year also, unless they get a large influx of better players or something (and perhaps even if they do). My impression is that the club was more trying to just "lock in" the stronger players early, before they had a chance to look around (in essence, forcing them to commit before the tryout period was open in order to guarantee a spot on the team, or risk getting dropped during try outs). The generous reading is that they are doing early team capacity planning for coaching decisions; the pragmatic view is that they are applying pressure on parents of kids who might have other/better options elsewhere, before they are allowed to explore them.

I know at least a couple kids who received early invites who are not accepting them, because they want to explore other options after the tryout window opens, even though they will probably still try to stay with the club. Others are taking the offers to not risk getting dropped later. But I estimate that at least 50% of the team slots will be filled by tryouts, if not more.

Yea I think it's a fairly common practice.

I will say though that if you're honest about your kid, you know where you stand in "risk of getting dropped during tryouts".
Generally if they're being offered positions early on... they're usually not in risk of getting dropped... Always an exception... and I've seen kids who's scored most of the goals and played most of the games leading up to tryout being dropped... but I think that's super rare

If you're one of the better players, I think you don't have to sign early and keep your options open and explore... Lot of kids I know don't pay that deposit until like May... there's a risk for sure... but I think it's a minimal one...

 

[CaliR1]

I honestly do not know if my kid is good or not...his U-10 club played very well in the fall but largely cause a new super player joined the time (who could leave at any time cause all the teams knows about him). My son is not the best athletically or technically but plays hard, smart, and has lots of fun. Coaches are pretty good and do not push too hard but is enigmatic about who they think are "good" versus who they think are just okay/bad. He is playing the position that he likes so I think that's a win.

The club is not one of the big boys but that means I do not pay nearly as much for him to play. Pretty happy about that. I probably will stick with this club for a couple more years and see whether he gets better or wants to play higher.

 

[Grace T.]

Always an exception... and I've seen kids who's scored most of the goals and played most of the games leading up to tryout being dropped... but I think that's super rare

Introductory scholarship offer which expired when other solid players joined the squad? Problematic and/or demanding parent? Behavioral/discipline case during practices?

 

[Jamisfoes]

Introductory scholarship offer which expired when other solid players joined the squad? Problematic and/or demanding parent? Behavioral/discipline case during practices?

By the way, any idea on what questions to ask when evaluating a new team to join? Assuming you have already received an offer.

 

[RandomSoccerFan]

Wow, I really damaged the tranny in you, didn't I? Sorry... no man in a dress is walking in the girls bathroom with my daughter. Get over it. Clearly my political beliefs don't align with yours, but you're the one acting like a dumped girlfriend. Grow the fuck up.

You continue to miss the point. It is only the most egregious example where you post something inflammatory on this board, say that you didn't post it, and then play dumb when someone quotes your own words back to you.

You can consistently believe and post anything you want - and anyone can agree or ignore. Hoping people don't remember what you post from one page to the next is not particularly savvy.

 

[RandomSoccerFan]

The coach’s perspective? What perspective can he possibly add and why does it matter? My kid hates playing defense. What does his coach’s perspective have to do with that?

He plays my son in defense 95% of the time for three years. My son asked him SEVERAL times himself can I please play somewhere else. Even during scrimmages that did not count. Or when they are up 5-0 etc. he never got the chance except maybe 5% of the time. If that. Honestly thinking back 5% is even high. It was much much less.

Because with the situation laid out as written - someone's clearly either missing the point, mistaking reality, or is a terrible coach. It's either the parent, the coach, or both. You've clarified that it's now less than 5% - and it sure sounds like the kid isn't happy. Would the coach agree that the kid has been given little to no opportunity to learn other positions, or would they instead think that they are doing everything they can to rotate kids throughout, given whatever other parameters they are dealing with.

If the kid's not happy - find someplace where he can be. Whether playing time, position, or any other reason - all of them may be valid reasons to consider leaving. It's just that in many situations, it turns out that what they thought was the issue - wasn't - especially if it follows them.

 

[sigmabody]

By the way, any idea on what questions to ask when evaluating a new team to join? Assuming you have already received an offer.

This is a really good question, and I don't think there's an objective or clear-cut answer to it. That said, I tend to ask the most questions (of the parents on our team), and I can tell you what I am trying to discern, broadly:
- What is the coaching style going to be?
- What is the coach looking for most in kids of that age? What will he/she emphasize in terms of training?
- Will there be opportunities to have exposure to playing with higher level players (if your child isn't already at the highest level in the club)?
- What are the practice facilities and times likely to be like?
- What is the expected tournament schedule, and what are the expected costs for such?
- What is the stance on other external sports activities (if that's material for your child)?
- Does the club have video for games/scrimmages which is available for parents?
- What's the club's play philosophy, if it's not per-coach? If it is per coach, what is it for the coach?
- What is the pathway for advancement (if you think it might be material for your child)? Will you get regular evaluations from the coaches?

Those are the highlights. For my son's club, about 50% of those were covered going into the decision process (info online or provided in the general talk from the DOC); about 50% were questions I asked explicitly during the parent meeting.

 

[CaliR1]

I dont have the experience that most of you have on here but I have heard a lot of complaints about coaches who care about winning more than player development or whether the players are enjoying the sport because their financial compensation depends on it. Not to mention, a team that "wins" is more likely to attract more players and potential recruits. Some parents/students want this, others do not.

Also...I assume that every club has their own views on how to best play the game...we tried out with several clubs before settling on the one he is on now and some teams are very pro offense, some are very pro passing, and others are defense oriented.

I know that my kid is the opposite in that he likes playing defense a lot more than offense so he would be miserable if you stuck him at striker 95% of the time.

 

[Slobodan]

You continue to miss the point. It is only the most egregious example where you post something inflammatory on this board, say that you didn't post it, and then play dumb when someone quotes your own words back to you.

You can consistently believe and post anything you want - and anyone can agree or ignore. Hoping people don't remember what you post from one page to the next is not particularly savvy.

I've never denied posting anything. Why would I? It's all here in black and white. You've lied before, claiming I posted something I didn't, so if your whiny little ass has a problem with something I posted, too fucking bad. Post my quote. Or try, like you did last time, and get put in your place again.

Being a little whiny bitch appears to be your forte. Get over it or ignore me if my posts bother you. Your endless fucking drivel on this thread bothers me and you don't see me crying, do you?

 

[RandomSoccerFan]

I've never denied posting anything.

It's pretty simple Slobi. Every time you choose to address me directly, I'll remind you and everyone following along that you're not worth talking to - as you'll likely first say something moronic, and soon after you'll deny posting it - even when your own quotes are shown to you. See above.

And then I'll point out why whatever you're spewing now is likely just as useless. Though the second part may be superfluous at times - as most see it for themselves already anyway.

 

[Jamisfoes]

I've seen kids become disgruntled with an existing team and, in essence, leave that team with a month or 2 left in the season. They start ringing the DOC at said "desired" club and, in my experience, the bigger clubs won't let that player attend their practice in season. It's tough because most of us know there really isn't an offseason. So your window of opportunity to practice before upcoming tryouts is hard. If your existing club doesn't release you and your player card because they know you want to leave, they don't have to and I've seen that, too. And if I'm being honest, I'm not super excited to see my kid's team bring in an outside player with a month left in the season. There's a good chance that kid is going to take minutes away from some kids that were grinding it out all year.

Nevermind that clubs deliberately schedule tryouts at the same time so it's nearly impossible to attend more than one.

I’m pretty sure you are wrong. By November, if you are on a payment plan, you should have completed the entire year of payment. If you have paid up for the year, they CANNOT NOT release you. Your new DOC will call your old DOC and chit chat a little annd it’s done. They are all buddies. No one wants to piss off another. They understand players come and go.

You won’t be added to the new team’s playoff/ state cup roster because the deadline likely had passed.

 

[Slobodan]

I’m pretty sure you are wrong. By November, if you are on a payment plan, you should have completed the entire year of payment. If you have paid up for the year, they CANNOT NOT release you. Your new DOC will call your old DOC and chit chat a little annd it’s done. They are all buddies. No one wants to piss off another. They understand players come and go.

You won’t be added to the new team’s playoff/ state cup roster because the deadline likely had passed.

I'm pretty sure my real life experiences aren't wrong and they aren't all buddies.

Not every family and club experience is the same.

 

[Slobodan]

It's pretty simple Slobi. Every time you choose to address me directly, I'll remind you and everyone following along that you're not worth talking to - as you'll likely first say something moronic, and soon after you'll deny posting it - even when your own quotes are shown to you. See above.

And then I'll point out why whatever you're spewing now is likely just as useless. Though the second part may be superfluous at times - as most see it for themselves already anyway.

It is simple... which is especially good for you. I realize you're butthurt. That's your problem and not anybody else's.

Let me repeat for you, little lady: There's nothing to deny posting. I don't delete my posts. It's all here in black and white so nothing can be "denied". You're just a dipshit that doesn't like my take on men in dresses using the women's bathroom. There's nothing inflammatory about that. Again, YOUR problem. And I only address you directly because you cry like a bitch when I post.

You have my permission to perseverate over my take on anything. Just understand you're the only one whining about it. An army of one.

 

[crush]

It is simple... which is especially good for you. I realize you're butthurt. That's your problem and not anybody else's.

Let me repeat for you, 'tard: There's nothing to deny posting. I don't delete my posts. It's all here in black and white so nothing can be "denied". You're just a dipshit that doesn't like my take on men in dresses using the women's bathroom. There's nothing inflammatory about that. Again, YOUR problem. And I only address you directly because you cry like a bitch when I post.

You have my permission to perseverate over my take on anything. Just understand you're the only one whining about it. An army of one.

Random Soccer Fan (RSF) is a snitch and a little crybaby. RSF thinks a man can be a woman with big balls, . Let that sink in to your brain today. TGIFF, roof, roof!!!

 

[Jamisfoes]

This is a really good question, and I don't think there's an objective or clear-cut answer to it. That said, I tend to ask the most questions (of the parents on our team), and I can tell you what I am trying to discern, broadly:
- What is the coaching style going to be?
- What is the coach looking for most in kids of that age? What will he/she emphasize in terms of training?
- Will there be opportunities to have exposure to playing with higher level players (if your child isn't already at the highest level in the club)?
- What are the practice facilities and times likely to be like?
- What is the expected tournament schedule, and what are the expected costs for such?
- What is the stance on other external sports activities (if that's material for your child)?
- Does the club have video for games/scrimmages which is available for parents?
- What's the club's play philosophy, if it's not per-coach? If it is per coach, what is it for the coach?
- What is the pathway for advancement (if you think it might be material for your child)? Will you get regular evaluations from the coaches?

Those are the highlights. For my son's club, about 50% of those were covered going into the decision process (info online or provided in the general talk from the DOC); about 50% were questions I asked explicitly during the parent meeting.

Is asking for playing time at a position you like a big consideration when accepting an offer? Is it safe to assume that if one is offered a spot on a top tier team, the coach wants you in the starting lineup… at least initially until you fail to deliver?

 

[sigmabody]

Is asking for playing time at a position you like a big consideration when accepting an offer? Is it safe to assume that if one is offered a spot on a top tier team, the coach wants you in the starting lineup… at least initially until you fail to deliver?

I think this is probably dependent on the club and coach.

Speaking only for my son's club and coach, they make no guarantees for play time at a specific position, but the coach will work with the players to try to get them play time at the position they want. However, in some cases that might mean on a lower tier team. I know one player, for example, who I understand (second hand) was invited to continue on the team in his main position, or continue with the club in the position he wanted to move to, but on the lower tier team in the second case (as he was not as skilled/valuable at that position). He ended up staying and playing at his initial/primary position on the higher tier team, and now splits time between both, as he is developing.

Re starting lineup, this varies a bit from game to game, and depends on other factors somewhat (eg: attendance at training, performance in the last week, injuries, etc.). I wouldn't assume an offer to join a team/club comes with an expectation of being in the starting lineup; that's generally something you would earn on an ongoing basis. For example, my son has started most games for his team, but there have been a few where he started on the bench, even as a "starter" level player for the team.

 

[crush]

I think this is probably dependent on the club and coach.

Speaking only for my son's club and coach, they make no guarantees for play time at a specific position, but the coach will work with the players to try to get them play time at the position they want. However, in some cases that might mean on a lower tier team. I know one player, for example, who I understand (second hand) was invited to continue on the team in his main position, or continue with the club in the position he wanted to move to, but on the lower tier team in the second case (as he was not as skilled/valuable at that position). He ended up staying and playing at his initial/primary position on the higher tier team, and now splits time between both, as he is developing.

Re starting lineup, this varies a bit from game to game, and depends on other factors somewhat (eg: attendance at training, performance in the last week, injuries, etc.). I wouldn't assume an offer to join a team/club comes with an expectation of being in the starting lineup; that's generally something you would earn on an ongoing basis. For example, my son has started most games for his team, but there have been a few where he started on the bench, even as a "starter" level player for the team.

The best coach my kid played for had the same philosophy as my father-in-law when he coached club in the 80s and my coaching philosophy which is the following:

1) I keep my word, and I coach to win games, not win parents over to my side
2) I play who I want, where I want and when I want. If you want guaranteed play time, go to AYSO
3) I make no promise of who starts and who sits. Your kid earns play time from playing great, showing up to practice and not parent paying me for guarantee play time and access to my network. That is not real sports and its why youth sports can suck, especially soccer.
4) This is a one-year commitment from coach, player and parent
5) I will make cuts at the end of the year and recruit new players to better my team the next season
6) No guest players allowed and no guest playing with other teams.
7) No privates. Nope, no extra privates with coach crush. I would want my players to enjoy their free time and go to the beach and hang out with their peers outside of soccer, soccer, soccer and more soccer 12 months out of the year and basically just play and be all consumed with soccer and more soccer. Its way too much, moo!

P.S. A good coach will let player know where he sees him/her on his squad and it's ok to ask coach, "what position do you see my little one playing for you?" A good coach where say, "anywhere, where I see him/her helping our team win."