Vaccine

Multi Sport said:
My oldest is fully vaccinated as is his wife. They now both have covid. My daughter in law is finally recovering after a week of being bed ridden, my son is dealing with a persistent cough and sore throat. Oh..and they both had Covid back in 2019. Daughter in law is reacting the same as she did in 19' while my son is reacting much better.
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Both tested and confirmed both now and in 19? If not lots of people have been falling ill with flu, rsv, adenoviruses and other corona (my bestie was confirmed a week ago with another Rona virus)

But in any case, the data out of Israel seems to indicate that while the vaccine is effective in preventing hospitalization and death, it may be as low as 40% effective in preventing illness. If so we are nearing the point where the authorities will have to admit the vaccine had failed at least as sold (that it would end this thing). Two possible futures: this ends with govts declaring the unvaccinated a public menace and once eu approval removed dragging them (including y’all’s kids) kicking and screaming into vaccination, or we just accept we’re all going to get it and move on.
 
Grace T. said:
Both tested and confirmed both now and in 19? If not lots of people have been falling ill with flu, rsv, adenoviruses and other corona (my bestie was confirmed a week ago with another Rona virus)

But in any case, the data out of Israel seems to indicate that while the vaccine is effective in preventing hospitalization and death, it may be as low as 40% effective in preventing illness. If so we are nearing the point where the authorities will have to admit the vaccine had failed at least as sold (that it would end this thing). Two possible futures: this ends with govts declaring the unvaccinated a public menace and once eu approval removed dragging them (including y’all’s kids) kicking and screaming into vaccination, or we just accept we’re all going to get it and move on.
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Then we consider the whole story.....

"Israel is averaging about 120 weekly hospital admissions, which is down from a peak of nearly 2,000 in January. So while cases are less than one-tenth of what they were then, hospitalizations are about one-sixteenth. And admissions to the intensive care unit are about one-twentieth, according to data collected by the University of Oxford. "

"All told, Israeli government data show the Pfizer vaccine is indeed significantly less effective at preventing coronavirus cases of the delta variant (64 percent) than it was for previous variants (95 percent). It’s also significantly less effective at preventing symptomatic cases (64 percent vs. 97 percent). But it performs much more similarly when it comes to preventing serious cases and hospitalization (93 percent vs. 97.5 percent). "

Wouldn't it be great if news outlets put forth all of the information instead of just the information that fits either their narrative or gets them ratings?!
 
Multi Sport said:
At what point will a country just stop the all vaxs?

www.forbes.com

Australia Restricts AstraZeneca Covid Shot To Over 60s Over Blood Clot Risks, Joining Italy, Greece And Others

The availability of other vaccines and Australia’s low case rate changed the cost-benefit calculation for those taking the vaccine, officials said.
www.forbes.com www.forbes.com
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"Dr. Karen L. Furie, chair of the Department of Neurology at Brown’s Warren Alpert Medical School, served as lead author of the report, which synthesized existing data from more than 81 million patients and found that risk of developing CVST blood clots is eight to 10 times higher following a COVID-19 infection as compared to the risk associated with receipt of a COVID-19 vaccine. "
www.brown.edu

Rare blood clots more likely after COVID-19 infection than from vaccine, report finds

An analysis led by Brown University neurologist Dr. Karen L. Furie in partnership with the American Heart Association/American Stroke Association, put the post-vaccine risk of CVST in perspective.
www.brown.edu www.brown.edu
 
Keepermom2 said:
Then we consider the whole story.....

"Israel is averaging about 120 weekly hospital admissions, which is down from a peak of nearly 2,000 in January. So while cases are less than one-tenth of what they were then, hospitalizations are about one-sixteenth. And admissions to the intensive care unit are about one-twentieth, according to data collected by the University of Oxford. "

"All told, Israeli government data show the Pfizer vaccine is indeed significantly less effective at preventing coronavirus cases of the delta variant (64 percent) than it was for previous variants (95 percent). It’s also significantly less effective at preventing symptomatic cases (64 percent vs. 97 percent). But it performs much more similarly when it comes to preventing serious cases and hospitalization (93 percent vs. 97.5 percent). "

Wouldn't it be great if news outlets put forth all of the information instead of just the information that fits either their narrative or gets them ratings?!
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Yes but this forces us to make a choice…the wishful thinking that it’s pretty much behind us as of July 4 is over. Cases numbers are going to rise, as are hospitalizations since anyone admitted with covid for another reason such as giving birth will be counted as hospitalized since such individuals must be monitored but deaths are on the floor. On the one hand, we can shut schools and resume lockdowns but then what’s the end game…the thing is going to keep mutating and people are going to get it…are we prepared to rob kids of multiple years of their short childhoods and continue these disruptions for several years. On the other hand we resume life as normal knowing deaths esp among the unvaccinated will be comparable to a bad flu season. And a spectrum of in between.

The other thing is even with these breakthrough cases the unvaccinated are being painted as a threat to the vaccinated even though the virus would continue to circulate based on the Israeli numbers even with 100% vaccination not to mention the rest of the world won’t be vaccinated until 2023. When eu approval is removed and the vaccine gets full approval, this gets really nasty.
 
Grace T. said:
Yes but this forces us to make a choice…the wishful thinking that it’s pretty much behind us as of July 4 is over. Cases numbers are going to rise, as are hospitalizations since anyone admitted with covid for another reason such as giving birth will be counted as hospitalized since such individuals must be monitored but deaths are on the floor. On the one hand, we can shut schools and resume lockdowns but then what’s the end game…the thing is going to keep mutating and people are going to get it…are we prepared to rob kids of multiple years of their short childhoods and continue these disruptions for several years. On the other hand we resume life as normal knowing deaths esp among the unvaccinated will be comparable to a bad flu season. And a spectrum of in between.

The other thing is even with these breakthrough cases the unvaccinated are being painted as a threat to the vaccinated even though the virus would continue to circulate based on the Israeli numbers even with 100% vaccination not to mention the rest of the world won’t be vaccinated until 2023. When eu approval is removed and the vaccine gets full approval, this gets really nasty.
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Shut schools? Who (other than Grace) is talking about shutting schools this fall? That's not even on the table.

The smart move is just to follow Macron and require vaccinations for any high risk places. There is no need to cater to gullible people who think vaccinations make people magnetic. (I just touched a steel table. No reaction. You're safe.)
 
dad4 said:
Shut schools? Who (other than Grace) is talking about shutting schools this fall? That's not even on the table.

The smart move is just to follow Macron and require vaccinations for any high risk places. There is no need to cater to gullible people who think vaccinations make people magnetic. (I just touched a steel table. No reaction. You're safe.)
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That’s funny. “Open schools” was in your parade of horribles in the other thread.
 
Fact

Vaxed people:
Can still get Covid
Can still spread Covid
Can still die from Covid
Can potentially die from Vaccine

Unvaxed people:
Can still get Covid
Can still spread Covid
Can still die from Covid
Cannot die from Vaccine
 
Grace T. said:
That’s funny. “Open schools” was in your parade of horribles in the other thread.
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I just was asking who, other than you, is suggesting zoom classrooms for this fall.

Not me. (Though there ought to be far more HVAC upgrade projects on campus right about now.). Is there anyone? Or can we just call it “Grace’s personal straw man”?
 
dad4 said:
I just was asking who, other than you, is suggesting zoom classrooms for this fall.

Not me. (Though there ought to be far more HVAC upgrade projects on campus right about now.). Is there anyone? Or can we just call it “Grace’s personal straw man”?
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YOU had it in your parade of horribles.
 
Grace T. said:
I quote you “ now if you want to open schools, burn your masks, and ban vaccine…”.
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Yes. I am opposed to the combination of open schools and weakening interventions.

Where does it say I think we should close schools? I am saying that, in order to offset the effect of opening schools, we need to do more with masks, vaccinations, and moving outside.

Sorry it doesn’t fit your narrative.
 
dad4 said:
Yes. I am opposed to the combination of open schools and weakening interventions.

Where does it say I think we should close schools? I am saying that, in order to offset the effect of opening schools, we need to do more with masks, vaccinations, and moving outside.

Sorry it doesn’t fit your narrative.
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so essentially holding schools hostage to all the other stuff you want done, otherwise we close the schools. Nice. Glad you don't have any political power....whether its Macron's passports or this position re schools you always rush to an authoritarian position.
 
Grace T. said:
so essentially holding schools hostage to all the other stuff you want done, otherwise we close the schools. Nice. Glad you don't have any political power....whether its Macron's passports or this position re schools you always rush to an authoritarian position.
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Schools hostage? Of course not. Adults made this mess. Let adults step up to solve it.

Just have high risk businesses require vaccine cards. No card? No indoor table.

Your restaurant insists on operating in a manner which spreads disease? No public health license for you.

Macron's on the right track. Require vaccines for high transmission activities, and stop catering to the tin foil hat crowd.
 
dad4 said:
Schools hostage? Of course not. Adults made this mess. Let adults step up to solve it.

Just have high risk businesses require vaccine cards. No card? No indoor table.

Your restaurant insists on operating in a manner which spreads disease? No public health license for you.

Macron's on the right track. Require vaccines for high transmission activities, and stop catering to the tin foil hat crowd.
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How are you going to verify they have taken the vaccine? A card? Seems pretty easy to fake. As soon as the rule comes down there will instantly be over 70% vaccinated.. according to the cards.
 
tjinaz said:
How are you going to verify they have taken the vaccine? A card? Seems pretty easy to fake.
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Yes, I admit, some people are going to be assholes no matter how bad the situation. Consider Daniel Buckley, who disguised himself as a woman in order to get priority for a seat on one of the Titanic's lifeboats.
 
dad4 said:
Schools hostage? Of course not. Adults made this mess. Let adults step up to solve it.

Just have high risk businesses require vaccine cards. No card? No indoor table.

Your restaurant insists on operating in a manner which spreads disease? No public health license for you.

Macron's on the right track. Require vaccines for high transmission activities, and stop catering to the tin foil hat crowd.
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No Macron is not on the right track.

The right track is not to demand papers to live your life and go to a restaurant, movie theater, baseball game, etc.

Funny how no matter what some people want more and more restrictions on life.

We are seeing in the west with high vax rates that cases are not coinciding with deaths. So lets stop trying to put in rules pretending that showing papers is going to make a difference relating to cases.

Just say no.
 
Desert Hound said:
No Macron is not on the right track.

The right track is not to demand papers to live your life and go to a restaurant, movie theater, baseball game, etc.

Funny how no matter what some people want more and more restrictions on life.

We are seeing in the west with high vax rates that cases are not coinciding with deaths. So lets stop trying to put in rules pretending that showing papers is going to make a difference relating to cases.

Just say no.
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Another vote from the undertaker lobby?
 
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