New ECNL Clubs

[Carlsbad10]

[QUOTE="What will be interesting to see is how former ECNL clubs respond. If it happened as I understand it I would not be surprised to see DPL clubs do everything in their power to make ECNL irrelevant.[/QUOTE]

Are you suggesting Duggan's DPL league will be the demise of ECNL?

 

[MyDaughtersAKeeper]

Are you suggesting Duggan's DPL league will be the demise of ECNL?

If Surf doesn’t get ECNL back I would expect them to do everything they can to develop DPL into a competive alternative. With or without MD.

 

[With Pace]

But without Baker, Blues other ECNL teams are not strong enough to win a championship, this year or next. So, to answer your question, yes, at Blues the ECNL is the second team, excluding Bakers two teams (U19 and U18/19 Composite)

Blues is trying to win another ecnl championship this year with the Baker olders or with the 06 team (which is good enough to potentially win it) in order to keep both again next year. If they keep both, the plan is for the 2006 team to go DA next year. However, Baker will have a very strong 07 ECNL team next year and will try to win an ecnl national championship with that team. Seems like they will likely fail to win an ECNL national championship at some point, and then the question is will they choose DA or ECNL.

 

[Dabizness]

Blues is trying to win another ecnl championship this year with the Baker olders or with the 06 team (which is good enough to potentially win it) in order to keep both again next year. If they keep both, the plan is for the 2006 team to go DA next year. However, Baker will have a very strong 07 ECNL team next year and will try to win an ecnl national championship with that team. Seems like they will likely fail to win an ECNL national championship at some point, and then the question is will they choose DA or ECNL.

Soooo...

As long as Blues can win at least one ECNL Championship per year, they can remain in ECNL, have their cake and eat it too? If you win, you automatically get to stay in? Then it would seem to me to win the U13 (since those girls aren’T in the DA yet) or U14 is best case to win a championship before they move those girls onto top teams and over to the DA? Then move second teams into ECNL? I suspect them to put all their eggs and recruit heavy U11 and U12 to keep winning the ECNL at the younger Division...no?

How can Surf get back into ECNL while they have their top teams in DA? it seems their only choice is to promote DPL “as best option outside of DA in SoCal” and try to lure all other clubs into playing in the DPL and spending countless weekends driving to Norco? All top teams at U13 are in DPL, then at U14 clubs (Legends, Surf, LA GALAXY, etc.) send second teams. So how can second teams compete with first teams in the ECNL? Legitimate question.

THe real question is...is the ECNL willing to give in, and cede ALL of SoCal to the DA? SoCal is a powerful Region in the soccer world. There is plenty of top talent to go around. Enough to field two top flights, one in the DA and one in the ECNL. The question is...has the balance of top talent shifted to the DA, making ECNL irrelevant in SoCal?

ECNL has 2-4 really good clubs/ teams at the top of most divisions. But from Division to Division U13-U18 the bottom 5 clubs could be juggled, or better yet added to, or replaced to make the SW REGION even at 12 clubs/teams...with 6 solid clubs that can send multiple teams to play for championships year and year out. Will the ECNL kick some clubs out and seek to find a balance of talent in LA and SD COUNTIES? OC is well represented!

Does the ECNL need to adjust strategy and find balance in the clubs they admit from SW Region? If they lose a strong presence in the region, there is no way they can be
Considered on par with DA....true/false?

 

[With Pace]

Soooo...

As long as Blues can win at least one ECNL Championship per year, they can remain in ECNL, have their cake and eat it too? If you win, you automatically get to stay in? Then it would seem to me to win the U13 (since those girls aren’T in the DA yet) or U14 is best case to win a championship before they move those girls onto top teams and over to the DA? Then move second teams into ECNL? I suspect them to put all their eggs and recruit heavy U11 and U12 to keep winning the ECNL at the younger Division...no?

How can Surf get back into ECNL while they have their top teams in DA? it seems their only choice is to promote DPL “as best option outside of DA in SoCal” and try to lure all other clubs into playing in the DPL and spending countless weekends driving to Norco? All top teams at U13 are in DPL, then at U14 clubs (Legends, Surf, LA GALAXY, etc.) send second teams. So how can second teams compete with first teams in the ECNL? Legitimate question.

THe real question is...is the ECNL willing to give in, and cede ALL of SoCal to the DA? SoCal is a powerful Region in the soccer world. There is plenty of top talent to go around. Enough to field two top flights, one in the DA and one in the ECNL. The question is...has the balance of top talent shifted to the DA, making ECNL irrelevant in SoCal?

ECNL has 2-4 really good clubs/ teams at the top of most divisions. But from Division to Division U13-U18 the bottom 5 clubs could be juggled, or better yet added to, or replaced to make the SW REGION even at 12 clubs/teams...with 6 solid clubs that can send multiple teams to play for championships year and year out. Will the ECNL kick some clubs out and seek to find a balance of talent in LA and SD COUNTIES? OC is well represented!

Does the ECNL need to adjust strategy and find balance in the clubs they admit from SW Region? If they lose a strong presence in the region, there is no way they can be
Considered on par with DA....true/false?

At U13 girls, the best competition overall in SoCal is dpl, but the u13 blues and slammers teams in ecnl are among the top 5 teams in SoCal. The u14 blues team is not very strong and clearly the b team for the club. I’ve been told that Baker plans to keep that 07 team in ecnl as they get older instead of moving them to da. If so (and assuming the blues are actually able to keep both da and ecnl), it will be interesting to see if he can recruit and keep a strong group of girls together in ecnl when da appears to have taken over in SoCal as the top league.

 

[LASTMAN14]

Blues is trying to win another ecnl championship this year with the Baker olders or with the 06 team (which is good enough to potentially win it) in order to keep both again next year. If they keep both, the plan is for the 2006 team to go DA next year. However, Baker will have a very strong 07 ECNL team next year and will try to win an ecnl national championship with that team. Seems like they will likely fail to win an ECNL national championship at some point, and then the question is will they choose DA or

Unless US Soccer asks them to commit.

 

[Dabizness]

Unless US Soccer asks them to commit.

Exactly!

It seems the whole selection and decision making process around who is in and who is out of the DA is political. Is US SOCCER now in the business of politics, pandering, and the lucrative business of youth soccer in America? Is the selection criteria clear and published, process transparent?

Read below...US SOCCER mission statement...

Someone previously in this thread, I believe stated that the ECNL clubs themselves vote clubs in, can they vote to kick teams out? Politics? Market economics?

Where is the focus on player development? The reason why with each passing year the US women’s team continues to lose ground to world in the women’s game is due directly to the LACK of development of US game and players. Read the attached mission statement. Ask why is US soccer in the business of youth soccer league governance? Pandering to club through political maneuvers to get into the DA.

I have no faith in the US SOCCER DA, ECNL , or any other youth soccer organization to get this fixed for players or for the National team.

US Soccer mission statement...”player development “...joke!

 

[LASTMAN14]

Exactly!

It seems the whole selection and decision making process around who is in and who is out of the DA is political. Is US SOCCER now in the business of politics, pandering, and the lucrative business of youth soccer in America? Is the selection criteria clear and published, process transparent?

Read below...US SOCCER mission statement...

Someone previously in this thread, I believe stated that the ECNL clubs themselves vote clubs in, can they vote to kick teams out? Politics? Market economics?

Where is the focus on player development? The reason why with each passing year the US women’s team continues to lose ground to world in the women’s game is due directly to the LACK of development of US game and players. Read the attached mission statement. Ask why is US soccer in the business of youth soccer league governance? Pandering to club through political maneuvers to get into the DA.

I have no faith in the US SOCCER DA, ECNL , or any other youth soccer organization to get this fixed for players or for the National team.

US Soccer mission statement...”player development “...joke!

It’s not any difference what ECNL is doing. ECNL just has a competitor.

 

[Dabizness]

It’s not any difference what ECNL is doing. ECNL just has a competitor.

Should US Soccer be in the business of youth soccer...in the “disguise” of “DEVELOPMENT “ ...as in Development Academy? Is the question.

But you are right, ECNL now has a competitor... and I would argue...the DA is beating them at their own game. I don’t think the ECNL has a good strategy for the SW REGION...specifically SoCal! The ECNL would be better served by employing a responsive strategy to the DA and provide a better service TO PLAYERS/parents that are focused on getting better, growing in the game, learning, and preparing for college and being a student athlete in college.

It is no secret that the DA is designed to provide a pathway to the National team. That is the express purpose, the DA by their own admission is not the pathway to college. So then why is their system and structure designed to support college recruiting?

If the ECNL was designed and intended to be a pathway to college, then why haven’t they responded to a “competitor” that has eaten into 75 or more of its club and base?

At some point, I don’t think that it is possible to make sense of this!!! All I can think is that our national teams continue to struggle (in the wmnt continue to lose ground to other nations pushing forward)... and ask why? Then I look at it from where I sit...as a parent of youth player...faced with this gigantic clusterfuck... and can’t explain it, but can’t point to it and say...that’s why!!!

Done and done...
Thanks for those who share knowledge, experiences, wisdom.

 

[LASTMAN14]

Should US Soccer be in the business of youth soccer...in the “disguise” of “DEVELOPMENT “ ...as in Development Academy? Is the question.

But you are right, ECNL now has a competitor... and I would argue...the DA is beating them at their own game. I don’t think the ECNL has a good strategy for the SW REGION...specifically SoCal! The ECNL would be better served by employing a responsive strategy to the DA and provide a better service TO PLAYERS/parents that are focused on getting better, growing in the game, learning, and preparing for college and being a student athlete in college.

It is no secret that the DA is designed to provide a pathway to the National team. That is the express purpose, the DA by their own admission is not the pathway to college. So then why is their system and structure designed to support college recruiting?

If the ECNL was designed and intended to be a pathway to college, then why haven’t they responded to a “competitor” that has eaten into 75 or more of its club and base?

At some point, I don’t think that it is possible to make sense of this!!! All I can think is that our national teams continue to struggle (in the wmnt continue to lose ground to other nations pushing forward)... and ask why? Then I look at it from where I sit...as a parent of youth player...faced with this gigantic clusterfuck... and can’t explain it, but can’t point to it and say...that’s why!!!

Done and done...
Thanks for those who share knowledge, experiences, wisdom.

There are many questions that need to be answered. And some can only come with time. DA may be like FACEBOOK when it was in its earliest days. They didn’t know what it would become. However, it is a new and emerging avenue to college soccer.

 

[Soccer43]

the one aspect that seems to be missed in this discussion is that not all DA clubs are equal and not all ECNL clubs are equal. There are some that are better than others in each category so if you played the top DA teams against the top ECNL teams they would likely be evenly matched. DA is not a good fit for all top elite players so those players will not be in the DA. The college coaches know this and will continue to be able to find the best players no matter where they are and the coach and club that you are with and their connections and reputations are what matter the most for college recruitment. At the end of the day it is mostly a money grab with the parent's ponying up the cash and the coaches and clubs having a pay day while they promise opportunities and "development" whether it is DA or ECNL.

 

[LadiesMan217]

Exactly!

It seems the whole selection and decision making process around who is in and who is out of the DA is political. Is US SOCCER now in the business of politics, pandering, and the lucrative business of youth soccer in America? Is the selection criteria clear and published, process transparent?

Read below...US SOCCER mission statement...

Someone previously in this thread, I believe stated that the ECNL clubs themselves vote clubs in, can they vote to kick teams out? Politics? Market economics?

Where is the focus on player development? The reason why with each passing year the US women’s team continues to lose ground to world in the women’s game is due directly to the LACK of development of US game and players. Read the attached mission statement. Ask why is US soccer in the business of youth soccer league governance? Pandering to club through political maneuvers to get into the DA.

I have no faith in the US SOCCER DA, ECNL , or any other youth soccer organization to get this fixed for players or for the National team.

US Soccer mission statement...”player development “...joke!

HAHA you are a confused soul but now worries most people are. Can you expand on why you say DA club selection is political? I know ECNL was prior to DA. Of all the years my kids have played soccer the first time we actually saw league coaching standards and development agenda was DA. I do not think it is a joke - what DA club does your DD play for where you are experiencing less development?

 

[LadiesMan217]

the one aspect that seems to be missed in this discussion is that not all DA clubs are equal and not all ECNL clubs are equal. There are some that are better than others in each category so if you played the top DA teams against the top ECNL teams they would likely be evenly matched. DA is not a good fit for all top elite players so those players will not be in the DA. The college coaches know this and will continue to be able to find the best players no matter where they are and the coach and club that you are with and their connections and reputations are what matter the most for college recruitment. At the end of the day it is mostly a money grab with the parent's ponying up the cash and the coaches and clubs having a pay day while they promise opportunities and "development" whether it is DA or ECNL.

What is a top club? My kid has played for 2 of the clubs in SoCal that are always 1st or 2nd in standings and I can tell you they are crap at development - as well as many of the others at the top as she trained with others for multiple weeks in search of soccer development. Good at attracting better athletic players with some soccer skills.

 

[Soccer43]

I didn't say "top clubs" , I said top "teams". As everyone knows, within each club there are varying levels of teams and different coaches. Some are better than others. I don't think the DA is necessarily any better at contributing to development of players than ECNL or other leagues. IMHO it has more to do with the individual coach's skills and knowledge. Was not impressed with the coaching standards and mandated training protocol of the DA. It was a good start but also saw it becoming a scripted process that did not respond to the players individual needs many times and did not always take advantage of the coach's own abilities. I saw one coach in particular who was an incredible coach and trainer prior to DA and since this coach has lost some valuable qualities during involvement with the DA.

 

[Dabizness]

the one aspect that seems to be missed in this discussion is that not all DA clubs are equal and not all ECNL clubs are equal. There are some that are better than others in each category so if you played the top DA teams against the top ECNL teams they would likely be evenly matched. DA is not a good fit for all top elite players so those players will not be in the DA. The college coaches know this and will continue to be able to find the best players no matter where they are and the coach and club that you are with and their connections and reputations are what matter the most for college recruitment. At the end of the day it is mostly a money grab with the parent's ponying up the cash and the coaches and clubs having a pay day while they promise opportunities and "development" whether it is DA or ECNL.

Good stuff!

I agree about the top and bottom of both leagues. That is why I initially brought up the question of “balance”. In terms of quality and level of play but also geographic balance as well. Often times whether you are seeking DA or ECNL... due to geographic or coach/club quality PLAYERS HAVE LITTLE TO NO CHOICE!

 

[LadiesMan217]

I didn't say "top clubs" , I said top "teams". As everyone knows, within each club there are varying levels of teams and different coaches. Some are better than others. I don't think the DA is necessarily any better at contributing to development of players than ECNL or other leagues. IMHO it has more to do with the individual coach's skills and knowledge. Was not impressed with the coaching standards and mandated training protocol of the DA. It was a good start but also saw it becoming a scripted process that did not respond to the players individual needs many times and did not always take advantage of the coach's own abilities. I saw one coach in particular who was an incredible coach and trainer prior to DA and since this coach has lost some valuable qualities during involvement with the DA.

I was actually impressed that there are standards and protocol. The coach is not applying what DA provided if it is not helping individual needs - it is all about 1% improvement increments for individuals. I guess a coach could apply it throughout the whole practice at a global level. There are definitely good coaches that do not have the credentials to coach DA next year; but, it is better to have some standards in general.

 

[Dabizness]

Lol

What is a top club? My kid has played for 2 of the clubs in SoCal that are always 1st or 2nd in standings and I can tell you they are crap at development - as well as many of the others at the top as she trained with others for multiple weeks in search of soccer development. Good at attracting better athletic players with some soccer skills.

...

Awesome post...love it! That says it All!!!!! Agreed 100%!

 

[LASTMAN14]

I was actually impressed that there are standards and protocol. The coach is not applying what DA provided if it is not helping individual needs - it is all about 1% improvement increments for individuals. I guess a coach could apply it throughout the whole practice at a global level. There are definitely good coaches that do not have the credentials to coach DA next year; but, it is better to have some standards in general.

Agree that is an established difference. I was told by a club official years before GDA was announced that one of the differences would be the standards put in place for all clubs.

 

[Dos Equis]

But you are right, ECNL now has a competitor... and I would argue...the DA is beating them at their own game. I don’t think the ECNL has a good strategy for the SW REGION...specifically SoCal! The ECNL would be better served by employing a responsive strategy to the DA and provide a better service TO PLAYERS/parents that are focused on getting better, growing in the game, learning, and preparing for college and being a student athlete in college.

If the ECNL was designed and intended to be a pathway to college, then why haven’t they responded to a “competitor” that has eaten into 75 or more of its club and base?

 

[Dos Equis]

I would be interested in what you suggest a revised strategy and response should be. ECNL has chosen new clubs in LA, San Diego and Arizona to replace some of those lost. They could expand more, but need to balance out the quality issue with the geographic constaints.

As for college path, any coach I have ever talked to says unequivocally the 5 ECNL annual showcases (if Nationals are included) are the best run college showcase events by far (better than DA, Surf, Silver Lakes).

ECNL cannot "beat" the DA as long as US Soccer is in the conflicted role of both running a league and selecting the players that make the national team pools. The best ECNL can do is provide a first-class alternative. So what more should they do to improve or differentiate the product they are offering?

This is relevant to the thread as it is about new ECNL clubs. Who do they add to improve the league in the SW conference?

 

[Dabizness]

This is a great post from another thread....read it all...the point is appropriate here...regarding ECNL and DA politics and league competition.

With due respect (and I really mean that, I'm not trying to be rude), you're missing the point. Firstly, you say there's "no point in allowing DA players to play". Of course there is; representing your region, playing with unfamiliar players, playing MORE soccer not less. These are all huge "points" to play.

Secondly, you've bought everything US Soccer is selling by believing the scouts there are going "to pick who they want to play for the US team". US Soccer already knows who the very few unicorns are that have national team potential at the young age groups. Everybody else who will play for the national team will get there the regular way -- by being a D1 standout. GDA ID Camps are no different to ODP or ECNL all star teams - it's just recognition that you're doing well not a sign you're the next Mia Hamm.GDA is primarily an alternative route to college not a true national team selection pool. If it were a actual tool for national team selection there'd only be two GDA teams in CA (one north and one south) and the kids would truly be the cream of the crop. Instead it's a power and cash grab by the federation. I'm not knocking them for this, as all other organizations are similarly motivated.

My 06 DD plays at a DA club for the pre-DA team but my eyes are wide open. She wants to play D1 and GDA or ECNL is the best way to get there and from there the very slim chance of making the national team is an exciting one. But I sure as heck am not writing checks right now thinking it'll put her on the USWNT radar, and I hope nobody else is.