Simisoccerfan
PREMIER
ROI worked for us and then some.
D1 college soccer under threat
- Thread starter jpeter
- Start date
ROI worked for us and then some.
MacDre
PREMIER
You haven’t watched the documentary.
Insurance company paid millions for their defense; defendants paid nothing.
Good. Glad it worked out well, and I do. ot want to take anything away from your kid’s accomplishment.
However, I’d still advise families of younger kids to put money in the college fund before paying the club fees. For the vast, vast majority of families, club soccer is an entertainment expense.
vegasguy
GOLD
What do you find dull about college soccer.. you also said it should be eliminated as a college sport and played only as a club sport. That is such bs.
Did you see Virginia play this year? Did you watch the college cup? Why does a player from the east bay make the game better and more entertaining? And what is your proof that you so covet. You have a bias and do not admit it.
You can not force players to play if they would rather play football or basketball. Is it not on Moms and Dads to bring them to a sport. AAU is not cheap.. Football is going the club route with 7v7 and that will not be inexpensive.
Simisoccerfan
PREMIER
Agree. I had the college funded for all 3 of my kids.
MacDre
PREMIER
I find the lack of skill in college soccer dull. MAP says only 4 or 5 college teams plays good soccer. I also prefer football rules of the game. I think college soccer is unnecessarily dangerous.
What’s wrong with club sports for a person that does not want to go pro and school is their priority? Why do you feel college sports are better than club sports for a kid that doesn’t want to turn pro? Wouldn’t club sports allow a kid more time to focus on their studies while playing the game they love-isn’t excelling academically the priority for this group?
I did not see Virginia play or most of the college cup-what exactly was it that you liked about those games? In football, basketball, and international soccer/football the vast majority of the “stars” come from lower socioeconomic levels. Currently, soccer in the USA lacks participation of people from lower socioeconomic levels and lacks the entertainment factor that the Brazilians and Argentinians bring to European football. I guess you can also include the entertainment factor that Latino’s like Vela bring to MLS. Watch Fuerte Apache the Carlos Tevez story on Netflix for a clear example of what I’m talking about.
Many kids in my community haven’t been exposed to soccer. Many in my community don’t have parents that can support them in their athletic pursuits. AAU & 7v7 are FREE for folks from my hood-may even get under the table money, house, car etc. Soccer ain’t even in the hood homie!
The college game is terrible. It barely resembles soccer as played in the rest of the world. It's sheer speed and physicality. Such a shame that the ncaa plays football and basketball so well, but can't play soccer.
I have to say I was shocked to see how physical and intense the college games I've watched with my own eyes have been. My dd played for _________________ for two years and their TC was physical and prepped you for the college game. Injury after injuries, one physical game after another. I used to not like that at all because my little dd was the smallest. However, _______________________________________________________________________always told me to go watch a D1 game. So I did, with my goat and we both saw how hard and intense it is and it's 100% not for the weak at heart. One girl tore something and left the game. Cal State Fullerton had someone get hurt too and they played very very hard. Like a chip on their shoulders and actually beat SC. I loved the fans I saw at SC ((need better fields)) and the passion with all the students. It was fun and my dd would have a blast in a game like that. Its just not what I thought it would be. Call me naive if you want. When I watched Stanford play NC this year, I saw some cool soccer on both sides. Two completely different styles but very fun to watch for me.
vegasguy
GOLD
Please do not talk down to me like I do not know soccer. I know it is your style of trying to make yourself look like the smartest man in the room but it isn't necessary.
Playing a varsity sport for your school is completely different than club.
Emotionally for the players but you would say that is on them. Watch the College Cup or The Blue/Green Game and watch the fans, watch the players and see the emotion they bring to the game. You won't know the power of Daryl Dike because you choose not to watch. You need to depend on MAP's opinion of 4 or 5 teams are good and the rest stink because you do not watch. You miss Zak Stefen dominating games from the box, Tryston Blackmon being quietly the best player on the field,Julie Johnson Ertz killing at Santa Clara, and Rose LaVelle changing games at Wisconsin because you don't like it.
I agree it isn't a beautiful style and it is different but the passion does not change. What is the difference between how how a team from the second division in Brazil celebrate as opposed to Tufts Men winning the championship. The answer is their is not a difference. Trust me Tufts athletes are students first as are Stanford Men and Women. The pride does not change.
It is something you do not get from a college club sport with a volunteer coach, having to pay for your own travel and no backing from your school. I have personally felt the difference between college varsity and a college club sport albeit a long time ago.
You also do not get the Blue / Green game when those two universities play each other at the club level. I have seen it. Those kids play with pride and passion but the feel is different. The experience is different for the players
kickingandscreaming
PREMIER
I'd say college soccer is a direct reflection of US club soccer and, in general, soccer in the US. While access to club soccer can be improved, the reason you enjoy watching the "stars" you mention isn't due to their club soccer access. It is due to the soccer culture. They played all the time, in their neighborhood streets, playgrounds and parks with no coaches near them. Even in the US, if a youngster is "star" level and plays in public at all, a club coach will find her and she won't have to worry about club tuition.
I am also more entertained by skill than physical play and I would like to see the game called more closely to facilitate a game where skill has the opportunity to overcome physical play. Hockey (non-fighting) skill and entertainment has improved immensely from my youth as has basketball from the days of the Bad Boys in Detroit. However, that is just part of the equation. This hit home for me a few years ago when watching a U14 game among two top level clubs at an ECNL showcase. The team that started the game with the kick off immediately lofted the ball deep to the opponents defensive corner. As long as top teams can thrive with this as a viable strategy, soccer skill entertainment value will be limited. I like to see teams and players that prefer the ball at their feet instead of at their opponents' feet. Part of getting to this point is "better" training, but the few hours a week of club training isn't enough without a significant does of "soccer culture" outside the club confines.
You'd enjoy watching Catarina Macario.
vegasguy
GOLD
To continue, AAU and 7v7 is not free for everyone in the neighborhood in your area. It is free for those only deemed good enough to be on that team so that team can show how good a team from that area can be. Little Johnny, who is a little slower, little shorter and can not hit a 3 is not getting any car or any free money under the table. The "hood" seems who is left behind. Also it is the Neighborhood that deems what sports are worth for their neighborhood. Is little Suzy going to get money under the table because she is a phenom on the soccer field? Bet? Soccer is accessible, their are less expensive leagues. Why not start an AYSO or NYS league in your neighborhood. How many parents in Richmond are going to put their kid in that league. It is where most kids start.
Also, do not act like every basketball player is great and has flair or style because they are poor and from the "hood". That is not reality anymore. It is still there but not the full truth today. Just like it is not the full truth in baseball, football or soccer. There are great success stories but there are great success stories in middle class too. Kobe.. Stef.. SI did an article a few years ago stating that the majority of football players drafted where from middle or lower middle class families.
I watched the Tevez presser when he left Red Devils to Citizen Blue. Funny you did not mention players like Drogba, Boateng or Dempsey. Great players from lower income worlds.
vegasguy
GOLD
It is ok to play the game that reflects your countries personality. Brazilian greats play with flair and dancelike.. like Carnival.. Argentinians play with a like more couple glasses of wine dancing in the town square to samba feel. Germans can be very structured, strong engineered feel, Spain is more like a bullfight flair beautiful and dangerous, Italy has more of a Sunday feel to their game dinner with our family style arguing with each other constantly but they love and have each others back, Netherlands defined, technical, artistic.. Ivory Coast, fast hunter like.. lionlinke... America.. we grind it out work hard not the best but driven for success even when people want to hold us back. Our best successes did not come from the prettiest games. We are strong, fast and direct.. defend when our backs are against the wall. I am good with it and I am good not winning the World Cup but I want us too.
The point is there are so many styles and it is great. It makes the game wonderful. When you try to force it to be something it is not you may not qualify for the World Cup and that is worse than not winning it.
Here's my issue if you have a goat at 7-9 years old in the hood or not. I lived__________________________________________________________________________________ and we had I think 7 soccer clubs and only two were home grown, plus local AYSO. The other 5 were affiliates from bigger clubs looking to take market share from the mom & pop clubs like the Hawks. One girl lived far, far away between Temecula and Indio. She was fast as hell and just so happened to be black too. Anyway, dad had two jobs and mom had one. Little girl was playing AYSO and all the parents got pissed off because she was twice as fast as the other girls and scored and scored some more. They told her to go play club. She comes to play club and she's the fastest, but not twice as fast. These parents make dumb comments like, "no skills, just fast." How about teach the fast ones to have more skill? Dam if you do and dam if you don;t. People told me to stop complaining that my baby girl was blocked from the GDA because of HS and they told me to go play local DPL or SCDSL. We took a guest game in and she scored at will and those parents got all mad and said things like, "I can;t believe a player like her would come down to our level and score on us like. What a show off" You really can;t win with some you.
MacDre
PREMIER
I apologize If I have offended you. You are actually one of my favorite coaches on this board. I can feel that your care about the game and kids greatly. I can feel your passion and your power to reach kids because you’ve touched me by your comments. I am who I am because of dudes like you. I also was not trying to be condescending, I was trying to show deference out of respect. I’m not an expert at soccer, I was recently exposed to the game by my daughter. I’m here trying to learn the game. I promise, I’m not hiding the ball.
Last summer, I took my kid to Lyon for the semi-finals and finals of the women’s world cup. My kid and I were impressed with Rose Lavelle and Kady Diani of France. I thought Leke Martens and Tobin Heath were overrated; my kid remembers Heath as the player that over dribbled and missed 2 wide open shots on 2 separate occasions. So what’s so great about Tobin Heath? I’m sincerely trying to understand the game and assess where my kid falls.
The reason that I don’t watch college soccer and the NWSL is because I suspect that most of it is bad soccer and I don’t want my kid to be influenced by it. Similar to how I don’t want my kid exposed to the negativity I was exposed to as a kid-a bad environment is a bad environment. I love the passion of our kids. However, I think our kids suffer from extreme low expectations. For me, it’s not okay to say “our kids suck at soccer, but they sure are passionate.”
I understand I am fortunate for my child’s soccer experience and I would like your kid to have the same experience; why does this offend you?
I don’t want to minimize opportunities for amateur sports. I’m being passive aggressive with a certain group on this board (which includes myself)-they know who they are. I’m calling on them to do the right thing. If I wanted to destroy college sports I’d do it-I wouldn’t be on a forum debating the merits.
MacDre
PREMIER
MacDre
PREMIER
I agree. However, in America I don’t think we have a style and suffer from low expectations. I don’t consider kick ball a style. All countries have passionate athletes; that’s not an excuse for an extreme lack of skill
MacDre
PREMIER
Simisoccerfan
PREMIER
The goal of a soccer game is to outscore the opponent. It’s not a dance off or a style contest. Instead it’s like a giant interactive puzzle where you try and try again until one team figures it out. There is no one style that is the right style. Certainly spectators can prefer a style. But whatever style that allows you to win on a given day is the right style.
jpeter
PREMIER
My son and I have attended over a 100 college games over the years and he's trained with a few of them, knows several coaches.
Mens college soccer has some great players and universities do a good job in helping students athletes prepare for professions outside the sport.
With the short season and general style of play in the past they have done a rather poor job of preparing athletes for higher levels of play behind college. Very few even make to the MLS, out of those even fewer stick around most linger on the second team or USL. Besides Jordan Morris most would be hard pressed to name college soccer players who have made it professionaly.
Apparently the proposed split season for men is not going to happen in the foreseeable future now
www.socceramerica.com
For the serious soccer athletes playing 3 months doesn't get it done for what should be some prime development years.
My son's first soccer mentor was a college star who's had a nice long, and lucrative career in the MX league since. He remembers all the things he used to have to run around to do in the off-season including playing as a amateur on a semi-pro team and was hoping there would be a better way when he gets to that point.
He's always had a hard time seeing the return on investment from a pure soccer standpoint in the college mens game. So much so he didn't even want to consider college soccer until he was a HS sophomore when one of the schools advocating the split season told him things where going to be different by the time he would be a college freshman. Now with that out of the picture he had a video conference on Friday about that and the scholarship pool money that's now is up in the air. He is now reassessing his options and verbal commitment.
Mens college soccer has some great players and universities do a good job in helping students athletes prepare for professions outside the sport.
With the short season and general style of play in the past they have done a rather poor job of preparing athletes for higher levels of play behind college. Very few even make to the MLS, out of those even fewer stick around most linger on the second team or USL. Besides Jordan Morris most would be hard pressed to name college soccer players who have made it professionaly.
Apparently the proposed split season for men is not going to happen in the foreseeable future now
NCAA hits pause button on men's college soccer's quest for split-season @21stCMSoccer
Thanks to an effort spearheaded by University of Maryland coach Sasho Cirovski, the NCAA seemed on the brink of approving major reform for men’s college soccer with a Division ICouncil vote in late April. But a decision on the proposal to switch to a fall-spring split season has been put on hold...
www.socceramerica.com
For the serious soccer athletes playing 3 months doesn't get it done for what should be some prime development years.
My son's first soccer mentor was a college star who's had a nice long, and lucrative career in the MX league since. He remembers all the things he used to have to run around to do in the off-season including playing as a amateur on a semi-pro team and was hoping there would be a better way when he gets to that point.
He's always had a hard time seeing the return on investment from a pure soccer standpoint in the college mens game. So much so he didn't even want to consider college soccer until he was a HS sophomore when one of the schools advocating the split season told him things where going to be different by the time he would be a college freshman. Now with that out of the picture he had a video conference on Friday about that and the scholarship pool money that's now is up in the air. He is now reassessing his options and verbal commitment.
MacDre
PREMIER
The USMNT can’t even qualify for the World Cup; so we’re not winning enough. Low expectations and a ethnocentric mentality will not get us to the World Cup.
kickingandscreaming
PREMIER
I'd argue soccer that in the US our style reflects our skill level more than our personality. For US born and raised "play with flair", I give you Oscar Robertson, Pistol Pete Maravich, Julius Erving, Magic Johnson, Larry Bird, Michael Jordan ... you get the idea. I'd also argue that the Brazilian's don't play with flair just because that is their culture, they play with flair because they can.