Cal Berkeley Coach (women) abusive

[Giesbock]

Ag

Always amazed by the amount of dads who apply their own brief and unspectacular athletic careers often times not even in soccer to girls and women’s club and collegiate soccer. When you are a student athlete you are just that. You are not a pro. There is no similarity between pro and college athlete. None. Furthermore this behavior in a pro setting wound to happen period! Your agent, manager, private coach, shoe dealer rep, national team coach etc would not have it, end of story. These women coming forward are not weak, or soft. They are tough strong women who Neil recruited to be in his program. This is not one person not liking running extra. This is multiple women over several years with legitimate issues of misconduct that no one should have to deal with in any form much less at a school like Cal. I said it before and I will say it again. Every player in your program is of equal value. They all mater.

I agree with all that.

Professional in my use is not Pro. ie. Paid to play.

A person can be a professional scholar, artist, fashionista, surfer, soldier, etc when they put their chosen craft before everything else. An amateur is swayed by what their friends are doing, the weather, bad mood, etc.

 

[crush]

Ag

I agree with all that.

Professional in my use is not Pro. ie. Paid to play.

A person can be a professional scholar, artist, fashionista, surfer, soldier, etc when they put their chosen craft before everything else. An amateur is swayed by what their friends are doing, the weather, bad mood, etc.

Yes, I heard what "pro" means for the girls ((goodie little two shoe)) from many dear friends who speak truth to me about the mental health of some girl soccer players over the years. 8 out of 10 not finishing is horrible. Let's start with the basics. Female soccer player at 14 better be doing the following the next four years or else. 4.4 GPA, AP baby to start plus 1400+ on SAT by Jr year and be the best soccer playa too. Dont get into trouble, no boy friends, train 5 or 6 days a week 11 months out of the year. Be perfect little Susie soccer player. No chance to fail. Boys? Be a stud, have girls, party, keep low profile, get 2.5 and stay out of trouble, if possible.

 

[dad4]

Yes, I heard what "pro" means for the girls ((goodie little two shoe)) from many dear friends who speak truth to me about the mental health of some girl soccer players over the years. 8 out of 10 not finishing is horrible. Let's start with the basics. Female soccer player at 14 better be doing the following the next four years or else. 4.4 GPA, AP baby to start plus 1400+ on SAT by Jr year and be the best soccer playa too. Dont get into trouble, no boy friends, train 5 or 6 days a week 11 months out of the year. Be perfect little Susie soccer player. No chance to fail. Boys? Be a stud, have girls, party, keep low profile, get 2.5 and stay out of trouble, if possible.

If you have 4.4, 1400, and APs, why do you think you need soccer for college?

 

[MacDre]

Always amazed by the amount of dads who apply their own brief and unspectacular athletic careers often times not even in soccer to girls and women’s club and collegiate soccer. When you are a student athlete you are just that. You are not a pro. There is no similarity between pro and college athlete. None. Furthermore this behavior in a pro setting wound to happen period! Your agent, manager, private coach, shoe dealer rep, national team coach etc would not have it, end of story. These women coming forward are not weak, or soft. They are tough strong women who Neil recruited to be in his program. This is not one person not liking running extra. This is multiple women over several years with legitimate issues of misconduct that no one should have to deal with in any form much less at a school like Cal. I said it before and I will say it again. Every player in your program is of equal value. They all mater.

What behavior? What misconduct? Telling a player they are not fit? Encouraging them to quit and focus on something that they are actually good at?

I also don’t think these women are weak or soft. I do think it is very possible however that these ladies aren’t good enough to distinguish themselves from others at the highest levels of the game. I also think that there are several athletes in every sport that have to face the reality that they ain’t good enough every year at Cal so I don’t think those statements over several years are dispositive on the issue.

I agree that all players matter and are of equal value; I just don’t understand why you think this has anything to do with playing time or being welcome on a team. If you can’t contribute and you don’t fit in...kick rocks!

 

[oh canada]

No way he survives this -- not with #metoo and other movements. Not at Berkeley. Not saying he should or shouldn't, just that he won't.

 

[eastbaysoccer]

I am not sure how I feel about it. Full disclosure, I like Neil and I’d like to think that there’s a high probability that my kid will play for him in the near future. So, I don’t want to be dismissive of what these young ladies have experienced and although I am concerned, I am not yet convinced there is a problem.

From the letters I read, I kind of felt some of the ladies lack grit and wanted to be coddled and have their hands held in a cutthroat competitive environment. Seriously?

Many of the things these ladies are complaining about are present in ALL competitive environments. I remember @MakeAPlay mentioning the hunger games at UCLA and warning about the high transfer rate at FSU. What about the high turnover rates of associates at accounting and law firms? Is it Neil or are these ladies having a hard time accepting the finality of the biggest failure of their lives?

I am a “straight shooter” and that is one of the qualities I like most about Neil. I have no problem with him being direct.

The central theme is that he is trying to get girls to quit who are under performing to their scholarship (or expectations). This isn't uncommon in College athletics, and I'm sure it is a bigger deal now that the Power 5 have 4 year scholarships.

Even though he may not be criminally abusive, he does sound like a big baby and I wouldn't play for him (not that he would ask me). I just don't think those tactics work that well to improve play. Maybe the athletically gifted, multi-sport athletes of years ago had a longer runway to reach their potential, and applying that sort of pressure seemed to work. But these days, the kid's youth career has been so dominated by a single sport and personal trainers, that I'll bet they reach their breaking point a little quicker (and the come into programs closer to their ceiling).

It is notable that we aren't hearing from ex-players who support him.

bottom line is NEIL has underperformed when compared to other coaches in the Pac-12 with similar acadmeic profiles. Stanford, UCLA Zane USC have all won national championships and he barely gets out of the first round. That IMO is enough to dump him and replace him with a top female coach like Tiffany Roberts and others.

 

[dad4]

bottom line is NEIL has underperformed when compared to other coaches in the Pac-12 with similar acadmeic profiles. Stanford, UCLA Zane USC have all won national championships and he barely gets out of the first round. That IMO is enough to dump him and replace him with a top female coach like Tiffany Roberts and others.

Different people have different bottom lines.

For my family, I care about academics, health, character growth, and a pleasant college experience.

Win/loss is not the bottom line; it isn't even a line item. For others, it may be completely different.

 

[suzysoccer1]

What behavior? What misconduct? Telling a player they are not fit? Encouraging them to quit and focus on something that they are actually good at?

I also don’t think these women are weak or soft. I do think it is very possible however that these ladies aren’t good enough to distinguish themselves from others at the highest levels of the game. I also think that there are several athletes in every sport that have to face the reality that they ain’t good enough every year at Cal so I don’t think those statements over several years are dispositive on the issue.

I agree that all players matter and are of equal value; I just don’t understand why you think this has anything to do with playing time or being welcome on a team. If you can’t contribute and you don’t fit in...kick rocks!

Kick rocks seriously? Your making my point. Dads that didn’t play soccer who talk like they know what’s it a like to be a female soccer player. This is an issue of a coach acting like a jackass. I hope all your daughters are good enough to “distinguish themselves at the highest levels” (also didn’t known Cal was considered highest level) when they get to college.

 

[GT45]

College rosters are always lighter in size at the oldest classes. Example, 8 frosh are signed. One gets seriously injured and eventually quits. A couple are not happy with their playing time so one or both may transfer, the other may just quit and focus on other things at the school. Another redshirts due to injury. And, just like that you are down to 4 seniors. It is extremely rare for an entire signing class to start together and leave 4 years later together. It is nearly impossible. When you sign a large class it is more pronounced.

 

[dad4]

College rosters are always lighter in size at the oldest classes. Example, 8 frosh are signed. One gets seriously injured and eventually quits. A couple are not happy with their playing time so one or both may transfer, the other may just quit and focus on other things at the school. Another redshirts due to injury. And, just like that you are down to 4 seniors. It is extremely rare for an entire signing class to start together and leave 4 years later together. It is nearly impossible. When you sign a large class it is more pronounced.

But that is part of what I want to know. So, if you sign D1, what do you expect? Your description is a 1/4 chance of injury, a 1/4 chance of less than expected playing time, and a 1/2 chance of wanting to finish out 4 years.

If that’s true, then studying hard and playing for Harvey Mudd or CalTech is starting to look mighty good.

 

[full90]

I’m ok with tough coaches. I also get that D1 sports is really hard. Lots of kids quit at most programs. It’s a grind and a lot don’t make it even at well run programs.
And a coach can make mistakes, lose their cool, get frustrated etc. just like all of us.

but some of what the letters relate that he’s said (to more than one player) is really rough. “Waste of a scholarship” is abusive. There’s never a time to say that to someone. Even if they are and you’re trying to get them to quit or transfer. It’s just an asshole thing to say.

so combine that with the fact that HIS TEAMS ARE SO AVERAGE and I don’t see him surviving.

I’ve seen cal play for years. They have insanely good players and he’s never won two games in the ncaas. Why do kids keep going there and then act surprised when they don’t win and he’s a jerk to them?

Mac have you seen how average they are? Why is that appealing? Just the education? I’m genuinely asking.

 

[crush]

What behavior? What misconduct? Telling a player they are not fit? Encouraging them to quit and focus on something that they are actually good at?

I also don’t think these women are weak or soft. I do think it is very possible however that these ladies aren’t good enough to distinguish themselves from others at the highest levels of the game. I also think that there are several athletes in every sport that have to face the reality that they ain’t good enough every year at Cal so I don’t think those statements over several years are dispositive on the issue.

I agree that all players matter and are of equal value; I just don’t understand why you think this has anything to do with playing time or being welcome on a team. If you can’t contribute and you don’t fit in...kick rocks!

Dre, that is harsh and the reason men have been treating woman like sh*t. I knew a cold husband that told his wife to "get a job and contribute like me or kick rocks." Woman had three of this asses kids and he bailed on her for something younger. Not all men act like this and we all see improvements being made everyday. We also see rich billionaires getting their asses thrown in jail for being jerks to young girls. I told Vegas Guy a long time ago that much is coming out that has not been reveled. Dec 21st is the beginning of the big reset. Woman will be truly be equal to the jerks that have ruin their souls and their life over centuries. It's time to fix this wrong and make so much improvement that this kind of behavior is never allowed.
Color me this Dre. I'm still shocked that the strip joint in SD got a judge to allow dads to watch the ladies dance naked inside the club but dads can;t watch their dd play club soccer outside? Something very wrong in our society and it needs some fixing and blowing up quickly.

 

[Kicker4Life]

Are you a coach Face? Where you coach at? Doc? Let's not forget, my kid got pushed for decision in 7th and 8th grade.

So many others did as well. There were 2 Coaches pressing my DD before the rule change (DD was in 8th grade at the time). She told them both, “I’m not sure what I want to do with my life yet. I know soccer is one thing, but my education is another. I hope you can understand that. When June 15th 2021 come around, I hope we will talk again.”

The situation you describe is not unique to you, some use it as a Sail, others an Anchor.....

 

[crush]

So many others did as well. There were 2 Coaches pressing my DD before the rule change (DD was in 8th grade at the time). She told them both, “I’m not sure what I want to do with my life yet. I know soccer is one thing, but my education is another. I hope you can understand that. When June 15th 2021 come around, I hope we will talk again.”

The situation you describe is not unique to you, some use it as a Sail, others an Anchor.....

First off Kicker, my dd NEVER talked to a college coach in 7th or 8th grade. So no pressure from them to be clear. Other friends of hers did and some said" hi" like your goat and some took the deal and now want out of that deal. Why? Because their 17 now and think for themselves. The pressure did come from a few assholes in the middle of this family sport, who said all they have to do is make a call on her behalf and she's all in with a deal. Same ones saying I had to get my dd to send fake emails and pay $900 for a high end video to get to the coach to call her. Video dude is a freind too so everyone get's a slice of the pie. That is my rant and always has been my rant, got it? The youth club soccer arena knows that parents want their kid to go to college or their a failure as a parent and so is little Susie Soccer. Keeping up with the Jones in Socal is to make sure your kids go to college. Add some Title 9 to the mix and you got yourself a billion dollar industry. What do the girls get from all the Billions? A fuc*ing full time job, told to act like a pro and get paid zero and all pressure pressure pressure and a chance a coach will treat you like sh*t and cause many to have mental breakdowns. Dam dude, dont you get it? This was all built for the men and it should be all about the girls first. TGIF bro. My wife is 50 and looks 30. Peace!!! P.S. Follow the money and see how much the girls get out of all this club soccer. They need be treated way better.

 

[MacDre]

Kick rocks seriously? Your making my point. Dads that didn’t play soccer who talk like they know what’s it a like to be a female soccer player. This is an issue of a coach acting like a jackass. I hope all your daughters are good enough to “distinguish themselves at the highest levels” (also didn’t known Cal was considered highest level) when they get to college.

Okay, I am fully aware that oftentimes I am a complete tool when it comes to women. I’m a caveman trying to do better. Could you please explain to me the plight of the female soccer player so that I will have a better understanding of where you are coming from?

Why is Neil being a jackass as opposed to being honest?
Only approx %2 of all players make D1 rosters so I think all schools in the P5 conferences are considered highest level. If Neil told my kid she sucked and to kick rocks, she’d focus on math and physics.

 

[dad4]

Okay, I am fully aware that oftentimes I am a complete tool when it comes to women. I’m a caveman trying to do better. Could you please explain to me the plight of the female soccer player so that I will have a better understanding of where you are coming from?

Why is Neil being a jackass as opposed to being honest?
Only approx %2 of all players make D1 rosters so I think all schools in the P5 conferences are considered highest level. If Neil told my kid she sucked and to kick rocks, she’d focus on math and physics.

The problem comes when she wants to study math and physics, but likes to play soccer to blow off steam. Not every coach is happy to have a STEM major on the team. “sorry coach, O-Chem lab is from 2 to 6 that day.”

 

[MacDre]

I’m ok with tough coaches. I also get that D1 sports is really hard. Lots of kids quit at most programs. It’s a grind and a lot don’t make it even at well run programs.
And a coach can make mistakes, lose their cool, get frustrated etc. just like all of us.

but some of what the letters relate that he’s said (to more than one player) is really rough. “Waste of a scholarship” is abusive. There’s never a time to say that to someone. Even if they are and you’re trying to get them to quit or transfer. It’s just an asshole thing to say.

so combine that with the fact that HIS TEAMS ARE SO AVERAGE and I don’t see him surviving.

I’ve seen cal play for years. They have insanely good players and he’s never won two games in the ncaas. Why do kids keep going there and then act surprised when they don’t win and he’s a jerk to them?

Mac have you seen how average they are? Why is that appealing? Just the education? I’m genuinely asking.

I agree that Cal has underperformed. My kid was born in Berkeley and is very familiar with the environment. My kid is also a little advanced academically and the plan was to send her to Cal during her high school years. My kid was involved with ATDP at Cal years before anyone knew she had any talent in soccer.

But most importantly, I am being pressured by Cal boosters so to speak. I have strong ties to Cal football (meathead friends and cousins) and they want to see my kid in a Cal uniform. Also Dr. Lewis is my kids pediatrician and he wants my kid to go to Cal so bad. Doc introduced my kid to sports and has been taking her to Cal games since she was knee high to a grasshopper. She also won a prize at a basketball halftime show for screaming “Beat Stanford.” He’s retired now but still takes her to Donner Lake every year to snowboard. Doc is really more of a grandpa than a Doc to her. So, I hope that my kid can show Doc some love and put on a Cal jersey at least 1 year.

As soon as I heard the KTVU report I called Doc and asked if he saw the report. He laughed and said did you know Neil recruited the #1 ranked class and did you see how diverse the group is?

 

[crush]

Okay, I am fully aware that oftentimes I am a complete tool when it comes to women. I’m a caveman trying to do better. Could you please explain to me the plight of the female soccer player so that I will have a better understanding of where you are coming from?

Why is Neil being a jackass as opposed to being honest?
Only approx %2 of all players make D1 rosters so I think all schools in the P5 conferences are considered highest level. If Neil told my kid she sucked and to kick rocks, she’d focus on math and physics.

Being honest to one's short comings is good Dre and how one can change. However, if you keep going back to being like Cain the caveman and use that as an excuse, you will NEVER change because you actually like being in control. Woman are the most important human on the planet. Think about it. Only they can take a seed, have it in their body and produce life. They can also be a black widow. Think about that for a second. I have so much more respect for woman today. I see their pain & power and I'm super sorry. I even got mad at woman for abortion and that was wrong. I totally get it now. Be loving and kind Dre and help us fix this. You might be a yeller because you were in Marine, but it doesnt give us all the right to yell at girls, unless of course they joined the Marines

 

[happy9]

Kick rocks seriously? Your making my point. Dads that didn’t play soccer who talk like they know what’s it a like to be a female soccer player. This is an issue of a coach acting like a jackass. I hope all your daughters are good enough to “distinguish themselves at the highest levels” (also didn’t known Cal was considered highest level) when they get to college.

Don't worry, he should have lost you when he said being a D1 athlete and/or a pro is harder than being a Marine

 

[MacDre]

Dre, that is harsh and the reason men have been treating woman like sh*t. I knew a cold husband that told his wife to "get a job and contribute like me or kick rocks." Woman had three of this asses kids and he bailed on her for something younger. Not all men act like this and we all see improvements being made everyday. We also see rich billionaires getting their asses thrown in jail for being jerks to young girls. I told Vegas Guy a long time ago that much is coming out that has not been reveled. Dec 21st is the beginning of the big reset. Woman will be truly be equal to the jerks that have ruin their souls and their life over centuries. It's time to fix this wrong and make so much improvement that this kind of behavior is never allowed.
Color me this Dre. I'm still shocked that the strip joint in SD got a judge to allow dads to watch the ladies dance naked inside the club but dads can;t watch their dd play club soccer outside? Something very wrong in our society and it needs some fixing and blowing up quickly.

Are you suggesting that we lower the bar for women because they can’t handle the pressure? Male players are released from teams too. I just don’t understand, why a coach can’t tell a male or female player that they suck and to kick rocks. D1 sports ain’t the damn 4H club; everyone isn’t a winner; everyone doesn’t get a trophy. Fuck that. Kick rocks, you suck, and move on to something that you are good at. What happened to good old fashioned honesty folks?

I don’t see this as a male/female issue. I see it as a talent issue; either you have what it takes or you don’t.