Academy vs. ECNL

meatsweats said:
In theory, a higher number of players would definitely see more "game" time with ECNL.

DA will feature three combined age groups in the Girls’ Development Academy: Under-14/15, Under-16/17 and Under-18/19. 23 will be rostered for each team. Supposedly divided evenly for each birth year. Of those 23, 18 are rostered for each game. Of those 18, 11 start and 3 are subs, no re-entry. The other 4? Well, they watch and learn, I guess.

ECNL is set by year. U13, 14, 15, 16, etc. There are up to 30 on main roster, 18 rostered for each game. 7 substitutions allowed each half. No re-entry per half.

So, with year breakdown (meaning more teams) and substitution rules, yes, more players get a chance to see more game play in ECNL. BUT, that 18'th kid who is part of the 18 rostered for a game might never see the pitch. This DOES happen and especially in big game situations on ECNL teams. Don't be fooled. All ECNL coaches will tell their players and parents that game time is NOT guaranteed.

By shear numbers....it's easy to see that ECNL promises more "game" time, but DA promises more "development" (translating into training sessions). It's plain as mud, isn't it?
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Just like anything as a parent we all need to be realistic about our player's ability. Getting sold by a coach isn't something that we as parents can afford to allow. Young girls are impressionable and need parenting.
 
Swoosh said:
You don't think they will explain the environment US Soccer is trying to implement? Four sessions a week, higher coaching standards, etc. After all, they are the ones creating the league. I believe it will be very clear where the top players will be playing. US Soccer coaches didn't push players to USYSA or ECNL I agree there, but they have skin in the game now.
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There are US soccer coaches that coach ECNL, USYS and high school teams. I bet that they aren't going to prefer a DA team with a lesser skilled coach (in their opinion)
 
MakeAPlay said:
There are US soccer coaches that coach ECNL, USYS and high school teams. I bet that they aren't going to prefer a DA team with a lesser skilled coach (in their opinion)
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What are you saying? April Kater, BJ Snow, April Heinrichs, Marc Carr and Michelle French all coach club? Those are the US Soccer Coaches I'm referring to. Not the US Market Training centers. US Soccer will win this one by a landslide.
 
Swoosh said:
What are you saying? April Kater, BJ Snow, April Heinrichs, Marc Carr and Michelle French all coach club? Those are the US Soccer Coaches I'm referring to. Not the US Market Training centers.
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Jen Lawlor (an assistant with the YNT)
Tricia Tagluaferri (u15 coach)
Damon Nahas

Those are just 3 off the top of my head.
 
meatsweats said:
I only disagree with one point. The first year will be an all in situation. There's pressure from many angles and if rumors are true and more clubs are to be added to DA, it really gets to the point that forces a shift from ECNL to DA for top teams and players. However, I think it's the SECOND and following years that might tell us more than 2017, as to whether DA can reign supreme or not. Because you're right, when kids are sitting the bench game after game, things will change quickly!! And we're talking about a LOT of kids getting little to no game time.
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Look up Boys DA rosters. It shows the % of games kids start and play. The majority of the starts and play time are dominated by 14-15 players.

What parents aren't realizing is that a girl's confidence wanes quickly, if they aren't playing.
 
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MakeAPlay said:
That is not at all what I am saying. You said that they would push them to DA. I disagree and provided reasons why.
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I think it will be clear where they will need to play in order to earn more call ups. Not saying I agree with that, but it's the way it is now on the Boys DA.
 
MakeAPlay said:
Not once has any of the YNT coaches suggested to any of the YNT players that I know where she should play. I have heard of college coaches suggesting where a player should play but never a YNT coach. Nice try. Legends will have to develop their players or recruit them early.
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I know of at least one YNT coach that made their views known to a player about what they thought of each club and what clubs were better/more helpful to their development.
 
Lots of bitterness, cynicism, and regrets in this thread (or maybe just one poster repeating their views over and over.)

Enjoy the ride. If the ride is not a net positive for you or your child, do something else. No one is holding a gun to your head and making anyone play club soccer, or pay for ECNL or DA.

For those that like to compete at a high level, they will compete. The memories they have are always of the friendships and relationships. Maybe they'll remember a handful of key games, but its more the people they'll remember.

Soccer is a beautiful sport and its a great way to develop leadership, learn the value of sacrifice, be self-disciplined, embrace teamwork, be focused, and develop a great work ethic. So you missed some parties along the way, but what did you REALLY miss?

Those that are fortunate enough to play and start at a D1 school (or any level really) can make up their own minds. They can either be drinking and partying, or they can go on the road and build great friendships and compete in the sport they love. Does playing soccer at the college level make you happy? If so, then you should have no regrets. If it doesn't make you happy, or the sacrifice you have to make doesn't feel worth it, do something else. If you have an all-encompassing major you'd rather do than meet the demands of college soccer, quit soccer and pursue your major.

For some young women, starting for UCLA or USC or Stanford or North Carolina or Penn State or Notre Dame is a big deal and the achievement of a dream. Its a highpoint, possibly THE high point of their life. I'm not discounting it doesn't work out for some, or that priorities and passions change, or that injuries cut someone's journey short, or that some may get screwed over by a coach, or some just have unrealistic estimates of their talents. Some may certainly feel they wasted their time in the end about soccer after they graduate. Its a competitive situation and there are winners and losers and usually the cream rises to the top, but not always.

At the same time, I've spoken to many college graduates who played at a high level that wouldn't change a thing. It was the best time of their lives.
 
soccermanifesto said:
Lots of bitterness, cynicism, and regrets in this thread (or maybe just one poster repeating their views over and over.)

Enjoy the ride. If the ride is not a net positive for you or your child, do something else. No one is holding a gun to your head and making anyone play club soccer, or pay for ECNL or DA.

For those that like to compete at a high level, they will compete. The memories they have are always of the friendships and relationships. Maybe they'll remember a handful of key games, but its more the people they'll remember.

Soccer is a beautiful sport and its a great way to develop leadership, learn the value of sacrifice, be self-disciplined, embrace teamwork, be focused, and develop a great work ethic. So you missed some parties along the way, but what did you REALLY miss?

Those that are fortunate enough to play and start at a D1 school (or any level really) can make up their own minds. They can either be drinking and partying, or they can go on the road and build great friendships and compete in the sport they love. Does playing soccer at the college level make you happy? If so, then you should have no regrets. If it doesn't make you happy, or the sacrifice you have to make doesn't feel worth it, do something else. If you have an all-encompassing major you'd rather do than meet the demands of college soccer, quit soccer and pursue your major.

For some young women, starting for UCLA or USC or Stanford or North Carolina or Penn State or Notre Dame is a big deal and the achievement of a dream. Its a highpoint, possibly THE high point of their life. I'm not discounting it doesn't work out for some, or that priorities and passions change, or that injuries cut someone's journey short, or that some may get screwed over by a coach, or some just have unrealistic estimates of their talents. Some may certainly feel they wasted their time in the end about soccer after they graduate. Its a competitive situation and there are winners and losers and usually the cream rises to the top, but not always.

At the same time, I've spoken to many college graduates who played at a high level that wouldn't change a thing. It was the best time of their lives.
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What ECNL only clubs hold a strong position right now........What Academy Clubs only hold a strong position..........i know there will be opinions.....but as a parent I am trying to paint a picture of what other parents views are......and what choices one would have based on some of you that are experienced in the competitive world.......both my daughters are very good and I'm positive the will pave their own roads at the level they play.........but the youngest faces whats ahead in a choice of direction, rather than my older ones choice now.
 
soccermanifesto said:
Lots of bitterness, cynicism, and regrets in this thread (or maybe just one poster repeating their views over and over.)

Enjoy the ride. If the ride is not a net positive for you or your child, do something else. No one is holding a gun to your head and making anyone play club soccer, or pay for ECNL or DA.

For those that like to compete at a high level, they will compete. The memories they have are always of the friendships and relationships. Maybe they'll remember a handful of key games, but its more the people they'll remember.

Soccer is a beautiful sport and its a great way to develop leadership, learn the value of sacrifice, be self-disciplined, embrace teamwork, be focused, and develop a great work ethic. So you missed some parties along the way, but what did you REALLY miss?

Those that are fortunate enough to play and start at a D1 school (or any level really) can make up their own minds. They can either be drinking and partying, or they can go on the road and build great friendships and compete in the sport they love. Does playing soccer at the college level make you happy? If so, then you should have no regrets. If it doesn't make you happy, or the sacrifice you have to make doesn't feel worth it, do something else. If you have an all-encompassing major you'd rather do than meet the demands of college soccer, quit soccer and pursue your major.

For some young women, starting for UCLA or USC or Stanford or North Carolina or Penn State or Notre Dame is a big deal and the achievement of a dream. Its a highpoint, possibly THE high point of their life. I'm not discounting it doesn't work out for some, or that priorities and passions change, or that injuries cut someone's journey short, or that some may get screwed over by a coach, or some just have unrealistic estimates of their talents. Some may certainly feel they wasted their time in the end about soccer after they graduate. Its a competitive situation and there are winners and losers and usually the cream rises to the top, but not always.

At the same time, I've spoken to many college graduates who played at a high level that wouldn't change a thing. It was the best time of their lives.
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I was part of the cult once so I understand your need to defend and lash out at those that leave or question it. I still go to temple but am far removed from the inner sanctum. I'm just saying that the new effort required to get to the highest sect may be pushing it too far.
 
Thank you for reminding me why I rarely frequent these boards.

When I visit my daughter, I'll try and tell her she shouldn't be proud of getting into that school or what she's accomplished by her hard work, she is just wasting her time. Her happiness and friendships she's made and her relationship with her coaches are just self-delusion.

I will have her change majors to something guaranteed to make her lots of money because money is all that matters right? I'm thinking of putting her in acting because clearly she's faking her love for her school and her sport and regrets ever having done it.

Thanks for setting me straight.
 
NoGoal said:
Look up Boys DA rosters. It shows the % of games kids start and play. The majority of the starts and play time are dominated by 14-15 players.

What parents aren't realizing is that a girl's confidence wanes quickly, if they aren't playing.
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Which is why I don't see DA falter the first year. It's the second year that we will see the impact. I don't know if most players and parents understand the DA game and numbers. Those 7-8 players that get very little playing time, if any, will be very upset. But by then, they will be half a season in.

This year will tell most players where they stand (true DA starter or bench player)....but, will these players and parents listen and be realistic. And how will clubs sell this to get a roster of 23 on? We all know how it is for some....chasing the dream, without regard for the ability or desire of the player.

Plus, I've heard on the boys side that the younger of the 2 year age group tends to get the shaft. So players go in and out of the system, every other year, essentially, as they age up. Is that true?
 
meatsweats said:
Which is why I don't see DA falter the first year. It's the second year that we will see the impact. I don't know if most players and parents understand the DA game and numbers. Those 7-8 players that get very little playing time, if any, will be very upset. But by then, they will be half a season in.

This year will tell most players where they stand (true DA starter or bench player)....but, will these players and parents listen and be realistic. And how will clubs sell this to get a roster of 23 on? We all know how it is for some....chasing the dream, without regard for the ability or desire of the player.

Plus, I've heard on the boys side that the younger of the 2 year age group tends to get the shaft. So players go in and out of the system, every other year, essentially, as they age up. Is that true?
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Yes, my buddy has a son on a boys DA club. He told me in the DA 2 year combined age groups, usually the Uodd year players (older) play more than the Ueven year players (younger).

He also told me, the DA clubs have a decision after 5-6 games played to either keep a player on the roster or drop them. After 5-6 games, the player is on the roster permanently. So, if my DD was not playing much after 5 games on the DA team. I would then request for her to be dropped to the ECNL team, so she gets play time and college exposure instead.
 
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silverstreak said:
What ECNL only clubs hold a strong position right now........What Academy Clubs only hold a strong position..........i know there will be opinions.....but as a parent I am trying to paint a picture of what other parents views are......and what choices one would have based on some of you that are experienced in the competitive world.......both my daughters are very good and I'm positive the will pave their own roads at the level they play.........but the youngest faces whats ahead in a choice of direction, rather than my older ones choice now.
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Top So Cal ECNL only clubs would be WCFC, Eagles and Real So Cal at the moment. Beach, LAGSD, Legends and LA Premier would probably head the DA only clubs. As far as strong position, I don't think any of of them are thinking that way. I know WC and RSC are still most concerned with getting their kids into college. DA new additions are so happy to be able to compete with ECNL, they haven't even stopped to breath. They know the battle isn't over and have fought for so long, this is nothing new. Just leveled the playing ground for them.

As many before me have said. If you can get into a club with both, probably the best scenario. More options. Otherwise, choose what best fits your logistics and player. There are opportunities for players that work hard, show well and stay focused. Some roads are just easier than others, doesn't mean they don't all lead to the same destination.
 
meatsweats said:
Top So Cal ECNL only clubs would be WCFC, Eagles and Real So Cal at the moment. Beach, LAGSD, Legends and LA Premier would probably head the DA only clubs. As far as strong position, I don't think any of of them are thinking that way. I know WC and RSC are still most concerned with getting their kids into college. DA new additions are so happy to be able to compete with ECNL, they haven't even stopped to breath. They know the battle isn't over and have fought for so long, this is nothing new. Just leveled the playing ground for them.

As many before me have said. If you can get into a club with both, probably the best scenario. More options. Otherwise, choose what best fits your logistics and player. There are opportunities for players that work hard, show well and stay focused. Some roads are just easier than others, doesn't mean they don't all lead to the same destination.
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i looked into WCFC and the other 2 are a distance, but you didnt mention Strikers, are they ECNL only? and how are they? I imagine to see lots of movement again in the youth soccer world, just like this past season with the age change.......us parents are scrambling to put our kids on the right path because we want to get the best for our money........and a lot of money it is...........
 
silverstreak said:
i looked into WCFC and the other 2 are a distance, but you didnt mention Strikers, are they ECNL only? and how are they?
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Of the 84 clubs across the USA currently in the ECNL, only 1 club lost more matches than Strikers last season. Don't forget, the ECNL is just another league that gets college coach exposure. Teams that earn their spot in the US Youth Soccer National League get a ton of college coach exposure as well, and you shouldn't limit your choices to clubs that have DA/ECNL or ECNL only status.
 
CaliKlines said:
Of the 84 clubs across the USA currently in the ECNL, only 1 club lost more matches than Strikers last season. Don't forget, the ECNL is just another league that gets college coach exposure. Teams that earn their spot in the US Youth Soccer National League get a ton of college coach exposure as well, and you shouldn't limit your choices to clubs that have DA/ECNL or ECNL only status.
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you forgot to add or DA only status!
 
NoGoal said:
Yes, my buddy has a son on a boys DA club. He told me in the DA 2 year combined age groups, usually the Uodd year players (older) play more than the Ueven year players (younger).

He also told me, the DA clubs have a decision after 5-6 games played to either keep a player on the roster or drop them. After 5-6 games, the player is on the roster permanently. So, if my DD was not playing much after 5 games on the DA team. I would then request for her to be dropped to the ECNL team, so she gets play time and college exposure instead.
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That assumes ECNL teams keep room open. How far into the season will the DA team play it's 5-6th game? And what if you're DA at a non-ECNL club (Carlsbad, for instance)? Do you leave that club all together or stay on the top team?
 
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