Bad News Thread

texanincali said:
I really appreciate the way you post and I admire that you stay true to your convictions, but your statement above is literally the definition of virtue signaling.

It is entirely contradictory to your stance of “if we can avoid xxx amount of deaths.” I’ve attempted to engage you and others before on masks because I am confused as to the sudden need.

What confuses me is why you and others haven’t made a stance for masks if they can save xxx amount of flu deaths. I am confused how our experts can just now come to the conclusion that masks prevent or even drastically reduce the spread of any virus when they have been around for decades. I am confused as to why these experts haven’t been called out for being complicit in past deaths caused by viruses that could have been prevented by a simple piece of cloth over a nose and mouth.

I don’t know the reason you and people that share your belief have chosen this virus to make a stand on. In a world where we like to say “if we can save just one life...”, why is it acceptable to watch people die every year from something that is supposedly preventable.

It simply doesn’t add up and points to virtue signaling if for no other reason that this seems to be the only virus we try and save people from.
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<why the experts didn’t recommend masks 5 years ago.>

From what I can tell, masks work pretty well at preventing me from breathing directly into the air that you breathe in. Masks work considerably less well as a filter, unless you go for the N95 type.

Because of this, the person protected by the mask is not the person wearing the mask. It’s the person in front of the person wearing the mask.

This makes masks hard to study. It’s easy enough to put masks on half your nurses, and then measure the rate of respiratory disease amongst them. This measures the ability of the mask to protect the wearer. Years ago, they ran several of these studies and found out that masks are not great at protecting the wearer. We ran our studies and found out that masks are only slightly effective against flu. Case closed. Time to put up the hand washing posters, because the hand washing studies were much more impressive.

This kind of stalled research on masks. We thought we knew the answer, and we were wrong. (Or half wrong. We were right about hand washing.)

I’m not really a save one life kind of person. I’m more of a save 100,000 lives kind of person. My opinion on masks this fall depends on whether Delta is likely to cause 10,000 or 100,000 deaths. If it is 10,000, do what you like. If it is 100,000, then bring out the masks this fall. If it is a million, then close down high risk indoor businesses.
 
texanincali said:
I promise, I’m not coming after you, but I can’t let this go.

Slavery was a social norm in parts of the world, genitalia mutilation is a social norm in parts of the world..:there are/have been many social norms that just aren’t right. Making decisions around whether or not you will be ridiculed, chastised or singled out is nothing more than a fear of not fitting in.

If I went to a tournament in Phoenix and there was a sideline full of people wearing jackets in the 115 degree heat, I am not putting on a jacket. It’s not me that has the problem, it’s the idiots with the jackets on.

Social norms change and social norms can be widely held or only held in much smaller groups. The biggest issue we face today is more and more people are giving in to the supposed norms of the smaller factions of groups and thought. It’s why we change policy based on such small percentages of people and their specific social norm.
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You are seriously comparing a cloth mask to genital mutilation and slavery?

Really? Do I read the above paragraph correctly? I am supposed to think about genital mutilation and slavery, and use those thoughts to draw some conclusion about the social conventions around masks? Do you want to include cannibalism in that list as well? It’s also one of those social norms we have moved beyond.

Good grief. I thought we were having a rational discussion here.
 
dad4 said:
You are seriously comparing a cloth mask to genital mutilation and slavery?

Really? Do I read the above paragraph correctly? I am supposed to think about genital mutilation and slavery, and use those thoughts to draw some conclusion about the social conventions around masks? Do you want to include cannibalism in that list as well? It’s also one of those social norms we have moved beyond.

Good grief. I thought we were having a rational discussion here.
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The rational cow left the barn months ago.
 
dad4 said:
You are seriously comparing a cloth mask to genital mutilation and slavery?

Really? Do I read the above paragraph correctly? I am supposed to think about genital mutilation and slavery, and use those thoughts to draw some conclusion about the social conventions around masks? Do you want to include cannibalism in that list as well? It’s also one of those social norms we have moved beyond.

Good grief. I thought we were having a rational discussion here.
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I’m not comparing the two - simply stating they could be considered social norms.

You brought up social norm as a reason to do or not do something.
 
Desert Hound said:
It is why people have been so willing to go along with so many bad things in the past. They don't want to stand out or be singled out.

I have a friend who isn't worried about the virus but will wear a mask if she sees others doing it. I tell her why? There is no mandate, you don't need to wear one. Her response? Well some of those people wearing a mask might get mad and say something to me.

My response? So you are going to wear a mask you don't need and is not required because some people you don't know might not like it?

Screw that mindset.
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I was the same way the first few days. I'm over it, now. If a place doesn't require me (vaccinated) to wear a mask, I don't. So far, I haven't noticed anyone giving me the evil eye and no one has said anything that I have heard.
 
texanincali said:
I’m not comparing the two - simply stating they could be considered social norms.

You brought up social norm as a reason to do or not do something.
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Yes, putting on a mask is a social norm on par with removing a hat. It is not a social norm on par with clitorectomy.

Espola mentioned a rational cow. I’m going to go see if I can find it. Perhaps the two of us can have a nice discussion.
 
dad4 said:
Yes, putting on a mask is a social norm on par with removing a hat. It is not a social norm on par with clitorectomy.

Espola mentioned a rational cow. I’m going to go see if I can find it. Perhaps the two of us can have a nice discussion.
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The usual cliche is "horse left the barn", but I am seeking every chance to use "cow" since Vermont dairy farmer Elle Purrier St Pierre qualified for the Olympics in the Women's 1500 meters yesterday.

 
Chelsea dad g09 said:
Wearing unneeded masks is not normal behavior.
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You really think that most people choose their mask habits based on need?

Looking around, I‘d say mask usage might even correlate negatively with need. Plenty of unmasked, unvaccinated folks in the deep south. Plenty of masked, vaccinated people near me. Those two groups might outnumber the people who dropped their masks after they got their shots.
 
dad4 said:
Yes, putting on a mask is a social norm on par with removing a hat. It is not a social norm on par with clitorectomy.

Espola mentioned a rational cow. I’m going to go see if I can find it. Perhaps the two of us can have a nice discussion.
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How about standing up for the national anthem? How's that one going?
 
dad4 said:
You really think that most people choose their mask habits based on need?

Looking around, I‘d say mask usage might even correlate negatively with need. Plenty of unmasked, unvaccinated folks in the deep south. Plenty of masked, vaccinated people near me. Those two groups might outnumber the people who dropped their masks after they got their shots.
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Of the three groups you just mentioned, which two are at extreme ends of the spectrum and which one is in the middle following the guidelines about when masks are needed?
 
dad4 said:
What? It is not virtue signaling. It is simply basic manners. If you walk into a room and everyone has removed their hat, you remove your hat.

You don't lecture them about why removal of hats is not necessary. You just take off your hat, because that is the social norm.

I wore my mask at WalMart because that was the norm. That is all.

I skipped my mask at practice, because we all are vaccinated and that was the norm there.
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“ but, but . . . BUT!”
 
dad4 said:
Cards can be faked. We hired a lab to verify antibody response in the blood samples. All part of team fees.
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I heard of someone who bought a vax card so they can travel. I wonder how it would be to be stuck in some foreign countries jail for falsifying travel documents?
 
Hüsker Dü said:
I heard of someone who bought a vacuum card so they can travel. I wonder how it would be to be stuck in some foreign countries jail for falsifying travel documents?
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It has probably already happened. A college kid got months in jail on Grand Cayman for skipping out on quarantine. I don't imagine they would be any more lenient for a fake vaccine card.
 
Hüsker Dü said:
I heard of someone who bought a vax card so they can travel. I wonder how it would be to be stuck in some foreign countries jail for falsifying travel documents?
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I heard 4 piloits died after the jab and flying. Coincidence? I heard 13 year old.died of enlarge heart after the 2nd jab. I heard a guy was shot and killed after the jab too and now some want to blame it on the jab, just like dad and his gang tried to say that the motorcycle dude who had the Rona when he died because of Rona, not had Rona when the drunk dude ran a red light and killed him. Husker, you guys cheated. Just wait until you find out the real truth behind the cheating.
 
crush said:
I heard 4 piloits died after the jab and flying. Coincidence? I heard 13 year old.died of enlarge heart after the 2nd jab. I heard a guy was shot and killed after the jab too and now some want to blame it on the jab, just like dad and his gang tried to say that the motorcycle dude who had the Rona when he died because of Rona, not had Rona when the drunk dude ran a red light and killed him. Husker, you guys cheated. Just wait until you find out the real truth behind the cheating.
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Do you ever tire of being a fool?
 
N00B said:
Expounding on that point, this forum is basically a discussion that became an argument. (Not that unusual in an online forum) You may be able to discuss things in a forum setting and occasionally convince others to adopt your viewpoint… What I’ve never seen is the value of argument in lieu of discussion in an online forum. Personal attacks don’t ever add value to a the viewpoint you’re expressing.
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I prefer the same.
 
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