This post is Exhibit A of why the US still sucks at soccer and, in fact, loses so much. No style, no system, you lose. Ask Greg Popovich or Phil Jackson or Jurgen Klopp or Pep Guardiola.
D1 college soccer under threat
- Thread starter jpeter
- Start date
Simisoccerfan
PREMIER
Yes this last cycle was a train wreck. But you might be surprised that the men’s team has been in 10 World Cups. More than all but 14 nations.
Simisoccerfan
PREMIER
Barcelona went to far with their style. Even they had to start playing more direct on occasion.
MacDre
PREMIER
Thanks for sharing. Your son is a perfect example of kids that I’m trying to help. I’ve heard several times that are men fall behind developmentally during college years. From what I’m seeing in Mexico, are boys are at a disadvantage after 12. In Mexico, 2008 boys will either sink or swim this upcoming year. I think we are falling behind developmentally way before college.My son and I have attended over a 100 college games over the years and he's trained with a few of them, knows several coaches.
Mens college soccer has some great players and universities do a good job in helping students athletes prepare for professions outside the sport.
With the short season and general style of play in the past they have done a rather poor job of preparing athletes for higher levels of play behind college. Very few even make to the MLS, out of those even fewer stick around most linger on the second team or USL. Besides Jordan Morris most would be hard pressed to name college soccer players who have made it professionaly.
Apparently the proposed split season for men is not going to happen in the foreseeable future now
NCAA hits pause button on men's college soccer's quest for split-season @21stCMSoccer
Thanks to an effort spearheaded by University of Maryland coach Sasho Cirovski, the NCAA seemed on the brink of approving major reform for men’s college soccer with a Division ICouncil vote in late April. But a decision on the proposal to switch to a fall-spring split season has been put on hold...www.socceramerica.com
For the serious soccer athletes playing 3 months doesn't get it done for what should be some prime development years.
My son's first soccer mentor was a college star who's had a nice long, and lucrative career in the MX league since. He remembers all the things he used to have to run around to do in the off-season including playing as a amateur on a semi-pro team and was hoping there would be a better way when he gets to that point.
He's always had a hard time seeing the return on investment from a pure soccer standpoint in the college mens game. So much so he didn't even want to consider college soccer until he was a HS sophomore when one of the schools advocating the split season told him things where going to be different by the time he would be a college freshman. Now with that out of the picture he had a video conference on Friday about that and the scholarship pool money that's now is up in the air. He is now reassessing his options and verbal commitment.
Your kid sounds like he’s close to 18...maybe he can come to TJ and see how it goes. PM if you’re interested.
Simisoccerfan
PREMIER
Don‘t try to read that into my statement! There is no room for dirty play. If you knew me and what my dd went through you would know that is not what I meant.
MacDre
PREMIER
How many have they won? Almost only counts in horseshoes!
Yes, I witnessed that style years back and still do. The only time my wife ever yelled at a kid on the other team was years ago when a Ref was not looking and one kid whacked another kid in the back of the leg all because the other kid scored on her. HS school is tough too and I hear college as well. DAD4, 100% I agree that soccer in some places have been rugby and very dangerous. I have pics of my dd with a broken foot, broken wrist, mild concussion and and other injury I don;t remember. My dd was not allowed to do headers either. Now she is but very selective. Too many dumb injuries in girls soccer and we need safety rules and maybe Corona can help us with that. No more rough play.
Look what Coach Mirelle said from the woman's side of this. This is why we went for GDA. Not college. Sorry, we went for pro because of statements like this. We didnt join the GDA for college. Why would we? We would just go to ECNL. because that's what ECNL was selling, not pros. It got all mixed up everyone and we need to separate the players.My son and I have attended over a 100 college games over the years and he's trained with a few of them, knows several coaches.
Mens college soccer has some great players and universities do a good job in helping students athletes prepare for professions outside the sport.
With the short season and general style of play in the past they have done a rather poor job of preparing athletes for higher levels of play behind college. Very few even make to the MLS, out of those even fewer stick around most linger on the second team or USL. Besides Jordan Morris most would be hard pressed to name college soccer players who have made it professionaly.
Apparently the proposed split season for men is not going to happen in the foreseeable future now
NCAA hits pause button on men's college soccer's quest for split-season @21stCMSoccer
Thanks to an effort spearheaded by University of Maryland coach Sasho Cirovski, the NCAA seemed on the brink of approving major reform for men’s college soccer with a Division ICouncil vote in late April. But a decision on the proposal to switch to a fall-spring split season has been put on hold...
For the serious soccer athletes playing 3 months doesn't get it done for what should be some prime development years.
My son's first soccer mentor was a college star who's had a nice long, and lucrative career in the MX league since. He remembers all the things he used to have to run around to do in the off-season including playing as a amateur on a semi-pro team and was hoping there would be a better way when he gets to that point.
He's always had a hard time seeing the return on investment from a pure soccer standpoint in the college mens game. So much so he didn't even want to consider college soccer until he was a HS sophomore when one of the schools advocating the split season told him things where going to be different by the time he would be a college freshman. Now with that out of the picture he had a video conference on Friday about that and the scholarship pool money that's now is up in the air. He is now reassessing his options and verbal commitment.
SA: Do you imagine a future in which the girls' pathway to the full national team doesn't include college soccer?
MIRELLE VAN RIJBROEK: I could imagine everything. What really happens I don’t know. For 98% of the players college is perfect. If your goal is to get a scholarship via soccer. If you like playing but your main goal is getting your degree.
If you have the dream and ambition to become a professional player and want to become a national team player, the college program and the way it is organized now will not be enough anymore. This basically has to do with the development of high-performance programs in some other leading nations. Three and a half months doesn’t help you to develop yourself internationally, if you compare this with other countries like France, Spain, England, Germany, Netherlands, Japan, etc. Girls in those countries from the age of 17 years already play in senior women’s leagues. With a year-around program, high-quality programs. The best with the best.
So, for the top 2% players in the United States I could imagine a hybrid model. A year-around performance program that prepares players for international soccer but also helps you to get a degree. This could be in collaboration with college. Or it could also be a different pathway.
College soccer has been very good for the system for many years. It was good in an era when it was advanced compared to soccer programs in the rest of the world. Other countries didn’t have this sort of program and equal opportunities. This has changed and continues to change. Nowadays, to play and compete on the elite international level the college program is not enough anymore. It’s too short. The competition in three months is too many games in a short period. It impacts the physical health of the player. For the top 2% of the players. college soccer will not be good enough anymore in the future.
Agreed...at least after a while and new personnel.
We don't have systems or stars.
The US women, at least, always have stars and a great psychology.
vegasguy
GOLD
Thank you for the clarification i truly appreciate that and the kind words.
For debate purposes you did say there is no place for college soccer above the club level. You will miss out on doctors and lawyers and teachers who pulled themselves out their neighborhoods and found good mentors in college if they are only playing club level. I do not have numbers as club v college has never been studied but on one of my squads I can say that if they can not play college soccer they will most likely not have the means to go or the want to go. Club sports are paid and funded by the players. Intramural sports are free but different too.
America does have a style but we have lost our way. Not sure if you remember the 94 team, the 98, 02, team 06, & 10 and even 14 to a point. We are gritty, we defend and counter.. we do not possess like others and do not have the on the ball skill with a full team that others do but we have our style. We are adrift because everyone gets caught up we need to play more this way so we bring in players from Germany... or we need to play more Latin players because it is in their culture.. I do not deny we need to bring in our best but we need to bring in our best and play our way. Million ways to skin a cat.
It is not always pretty but not every La Liga or Serie A team plays pretty. Watch the ANC and you will not be watching pretty soccer but you will see pretty players. we have very very talented players but we are so caught up in the next Messi we lose our way. Be the next them.. Marta actually said that best.
I am a possession wanting to play out of the back coach. Others may disagree. The other team can not score if they do not have the ball but there are times you need to get past your own philosophy and change a bit to have success. I most recently told a squad do you want to be Arianna Grande or Meltallica. They got the point and really picked it up and before the end of it all this year we had hit our stride and had high hopes in the final four of state cup. Metallica is not always pretty but trust me their style is definitely effective and there is beauty in a mosh pit and a stage dive.
Hiding your daughter from a style whether you like it or not is not always the best. Tobin Heath has flair.. brash confidence and is setting you up for her next nutmeg.. you may not like it but it is awesome.. we all see the Ronaldino flair and successes.. you do not see the thousands of times it did not come off. Many would rather watch Messi but me.. I liked Inesta better. Give me Oliver Kahn over Ederson any day. We all have our opinions of beauty or most of us would still be single.
Lastly, no one is making excuses for skill or say it is ok to suck as long as you play with passion. We are competitive and want to win it is in our nature. The true soccer culture is not complacent in our desire to build better soccer and we are frustrated that the needle is not being moved faster. But we also are realists and know the managers of the pyramid may be the one making it crumble.
vegasguy
GOLD
College game is much much different than the pro game. In some cases college is influencing the pro games.
Which way is in accordance with the LOTG?
foreveryoung
SILVER ELITE
What I see is that in the US, soccer is played like football, which makes sense as that is the predominant sport here. We choose soccer players that are big and fast and we like to send long balls down the field like a quarter back to a wide receiver. We use size and strength to beat opponents versus skill. You are right in that there’s nothing “wrong” with this, except that the game of soccer has evolved over the past 20 years to a more sophisticated style and we will not be able to compete internationally if we don’t also evolve our play, starting at the youth level.
On a personal level, I find US soccer boring to watch and find international soccer much more entertaining.
LOTG as written, or as interpreted? They don’t match.
I have no problem with long ball. It is an essential part of keeping the opposing team honest as they pressure.
But a significant fraction of “direct” or “physical” soccer is really just a euphemism for running into the other players and shoving people around. To me, it’s clearly against LOTG, but seldom called.
MacDre
PREMIER
I liked basketball as a kid. US soccer has the same problems as this small town basketball team in Hoosiers.
Hoosiers (film) - Wikipedia
MacDre
PREMIER
Is Tobin Heath considered world class? Is it uncommon to see players like Heath? I’ve heard the term Coever monkey used for kids that are skillful but don’t know how to apply the skill because it wasn’t learned in the proper context-Do you think this term applies to Heath? What are your thoughts on Heath’s world cup performance? What am I missing?
Simisoccerfan
PREMIER
Perspective. She won three NCAA Championships. Two Olympics. Two World Cups. Two NASL Championships. Countless other lesser events. Two time US Soccer Female Athlete of the Year. Runner up MAC Hermann Award. I’d say that qualifies as World Class.
MacDre
PREMIER
Deyna Castellanos was nominated by FIFA in 2017 for the best player award. I also heard there were problems with awards in the NWSL this year so those trophies don’t help much.
I’m looking for personal views not just jumping on the bandwagon!
Kicknit22
GOLD
You’re missing everything! Geez! Are you kidding me?