AYSO United?

[Matt K]

Ayso not ayso united since guy makes money charging more money via bigger club names.

On their web site for AYSO United it states that the SIX Philosophies.

How is AYSO United different from other club soccer programs?

What makes AYSO United different from other clubs is our Six Philosophies and the integrity of staying within those Philosophies. Our teams aren’t motivated by large rosters and a win at all costs mentality. If a player is selected to play for AYSO United, the coach will strive to ensure that a players receives 50 percent playing. AYSO United Coaches will focus on developmental training philosophies which falls in line with our U.S. Soccer approved curriculum. U.S. Soccer’s Zone 1 initiatives fall directly in line with AYSO’s “Development over Winning” approach to our club program. No other clubs can boast these credentials. We want to win…but respect and appreciate the entire process of competition.

http://aysounited.org/f-a-q/

 

[Matt K]

United is still a “club” team, which means selection process each spring. Looks like the 06 team (13-0-1) is moving to Silver; means they will need to have silver-level players to advance next year. You might need to look at some other Flight 2s in your area. Sucks, but sounds like that’s where you’re at.

Correct, but I recorded the last 3 games and my son scored in the first game, he played more then 50% in the second game and 2 overtimes till they won the game. If my son was not good enough the Coach should have not played him as much.

 

[Matt K]

Correct, but I recorded the last 3 games and my son scored in the first game, he played more then 50% in the second game and 2 overtimes till they won the game. If my son was not good enough the Coach should have not played him as much.

If a player is excepted to a team good or bad they should stay there when they move up.
Player development is physical and mental.
Politics should have nothing to do with it at this age.

 

[Matt K]

Let me emphasize on the points that I am trying to make. When a club like AYSO United South OC charges $1600 per player plus Ref and coach travel accommodation fees that is not a problem. It is when they break the AYSO United rules. Let’s again read what is in AYSO United web Site. http://aysounited.org/f-a-q/

How is AYSO United different from other club soccer programs?


What makes AYSO United different from other clubs is our Six Philosophies and the integrity of staying within those Philosophies. Our teams aren’t motivated by large rosters and a win at all costs mentality. If a player is selected to play for AYSO United, the coach will strive to ensure that a players receives 50 percent playing. AYSO United Coaches will focus on developmental training philosophies which falls in line with our U.S. Soccer approved curriculum. U.S. Soccer’s Zone 1 initiatives fall directly in line with AYSO’s “Development over Winning” approach to our club program. No other clubs can boast these credentials. We want to win…but respect and appreciate the entire process of competition.


Look at the part:” AYSO United Coaches will focus on developmental training philosophies which falls in line with our U.S. Soccer approved curriculum.”

In this part it should be very clear to an A licensed coach that developmental means physical and mental.

The second part: “U.S. Soccer’s Zone 1 initiatives fall directly in line with AYSO’s “Development over Winning””

It is clear that you must develop a kid once accepted to a team and develop them over winning. But an A class Coach prefers to bring kids to the team he did not coach before. How can we be assure that they will fit with a team that is moving one level up?
If not then there is a loophole that needs to be corrected, but then again it says “We want to win…but respect and appreciate the entire process of competition.” So no loophole here for the Coach and the club.

I hope I made my self-clear. Where is the integrity for AYSO United South OC as stated above.

 

[Grace T.]

First, just let me say that my family loved a lot of the United experience. Our own coach was really great and fixed a lot of the problems with my son's field work (but he didn't know a whole lot about goalkeeping). We also love that AYSO is trying to develop multiple tiers so that every kid has a place to play at their appropriate level.

However, the big downside I'd have to say with the United experience was that our club was obsessed at all levels with winning. Granted, it's a problem throughout US Soccer. But I'd say it's especially true of United. In part it's because the club has a chip on its shoulder about being disrespected by other clubs. In part it's because the leadership wants to prove itself against the other marquee clubs and they know winning is what they are judged on. In part it's the coaches want to prove themselves. In part it's that a lot of families are coming out of Extras (where a strong emphasis is placed on winning with all their tournaments). In part it's the need to move teams up so that they have tiers at all levels to feed kids into.

That, in our experience, led them to sometimes bend the rules of the six philosophies. I'm not going to spill all over the club here, because as a whole it was a good experience, but some of the things that came up (with my own kid, with others, and with other teams) were just unexpected given the emphasis they placed on the six philosophies.

 

[wheresourfield]

Maybe he is forcing you to move teams because his parents are a bit much to deal with?

 

[Matt K]

First, just let me say that my family loved a lot of the United experience. Our own coach was really great and fixed a lot of the problems with my son's field work (but he didn't know a whole lot about goalkeeping). We also love that AYSO is trying to develop multiple tiers so that every kid has a place to play at their appropriate level.

However, the big downside I'd have to say with the United experience was that our club was obsessed at all levels with winning. Granted, it's a problem throughout US Soccer. But I'd say it's especially true of United. In part it's because the club has a chip on its shoulder about being disrespected by other clubs. In part it's because the leadership wants to prove itself against the other marquee clubs and they know winning is what they are judged on. In part it's the coaches want to prove themselves. In part it's that a lot of families are coming out of Extras (where a strong emphasis is placed on winning with all their tournaments). In part it's the need to move teams up so that they have tiers at all levels to feed kids into.

That, in our experience, led them to sometimes bend the rules of the six philosophies. I'm not going to spill all over the club here, because as a whole it was a good experience, but some of the things that came up (with my own kid, with others, and with other teams) were just unexpected given the emphasis they placed on the six philosophies.

I love AYSO that is where my kids started soccer, not everything is as we expect, but fair is fair and I don't want AYSO to lose it's reputation because of AYSO United not following there six philosophies and getting the benefits that comes along with it. We won every game but the last one, that should be enough to prove they can compete.
If we don't show our concerns and they don't fix the problems other kids will be a victim of the same problem.
Politics should be stopped with the Kids lives.
If we don't say anything it will continue in AYSO united and people like me and you will not love AYSO anymore.

 

[jrcaesar]

@Matt K - I hear ya, I just don't think that AYSO United is guaranteeing that the teams are going to stay together year over year within those six philosophies, which I think is the loophole you're overlooking

But as to the Winning part, agree with you. (Opinion: Some of this is because they will have to play in Coast, and virtually all the United teams swept through Bronze quickly in year 1. Getting out of Silver - top-two finishes - is harder. Teams can go 10-4 and not advance. I'm sure this is a concern for United as a whole, as Grace alludes.) Anyway, we know a number of families playing and their experience sounds more like Grace's, too.

 

[Matt K]

@Matt K - I hear ya, I just don't think that AYSO United is guaranteeing that the teams are going to stay together year over year within those six philosophies, which I think is the loophole you're overlooking

But as to the Winning part, agree with you. (Opinion: Some of this is because they will have to play in Coast, and virtually all the United teams swept through Bronze quickly in year 1. Getting out of Silver - top-two finishes - is harder. Teams can go 10-4 and not advance. I'm sure this is a concern for United as a whole, as Grace alludes.) Anyway, we know a number of families playing and their experience sounds more like Grace's, too.

What guaranties a Coach that the new players are better? Why not stay with your six philosophies and beat the competition? Good reputation is where you get players come to you, I saw very good players during the tryouts this year none of them joined the team. Last year I personally talked to 3 families to join AYSO United that their kids did not think AYSO United was a club and that is because I love AYSO and we were short of players for a long time. I have been coaching in AYSO and have made many friends with many families. Good reputation goes a long way. If a A class Coach had a good attitude and demeanor's with the families last year he would not have lost that many players. A dedicated Coach is not enough. I don't want to say here what he told my son after his evaluation in front of me and he is a 12 year old Kid. Many families have mentioned to me from his past that he is a terrible communicator.

 

[Matt K]

Maybe he is forcing you to move teams because his parents are a bit much to deal with?

That is a very good point. During the hole year I asked to speak to him one time. I had to wait 2 weeks to speak to him and that was it. I was a coach so I understand what you are saying.

 

[SPChamp1]

I know this is slightly off topic, but I love the fact that AYSO uses "Score" for their uniforms, instead of Nike, Adidas, etc. $29 kit v. $110 kit for 12 year olds that will outgrow the damn thing in 6 months.

AYSO United just announced New Balance as their new kit maker for the upcoming season. Prior to that they did actually use Score as you mentioned, however, AYSO United used custom kits which ran significantly more than the usual <$30 kits you would see in their Rec program. The custom kits ran about $90 for home and away kits plus shorts and socks.

 

[Messi>CR7]

What guaranties a Coach that the new players are better? Why not stay with your six philosophies and beat the competition? Good reputation is where you get players come to you, I saw very good players during the tryouts this year none of them joined the team. Last year I personally talked to 3 families to join AYSO United that their kids did not think AYSO United was a club and that is because I love AYSO and we were short of players for a long time. I have been coaching in AYSO and have made many friends with many families. Good reputation goes a long way. If a A class Coach had a good attitude and demeanor's with the families last year he would not have lost that many players. A dedicated Coach is not enough. I don't want to say here what he told my son after his evaluation in front of me and he is a 12 year old Kid. Many families have mentioned to me from his past that he is a terrible communicator.

The one overwhelming advise from people on this forum is to make your team decision based on the coach, not the club.

You need to have a coach that you trust, and in return he believes in your kid. It sounds like you have neither in this situation. It's time to move on and find a better situation for your kid. It really doesn't matter the club in question is AYSO United, CSL Flight 1, or Manchester United (see Pogba vs Mourinho).

Best of luck.

 

[timbuck]

The one overwhelming advise from people on this forum is to make your team decision based on the coach, not the club.

You need to have a coach that you trust, and in return he believes in your kid. It sounds like you have neither in this situation. It's time to move on and find a better situation for your kid. It really doesn't matter the club in question is AYSO United, CSL Flight 1, or Manchester United (see Pogba vs Mourinho).

Best of luck.

Problem is that many clubs won’t tell you who your coach will be. You sign to pay (play) for the club and they reserve the right to make changes at will.

 

[wheresourfield]

Problem is that many clubs won’t tell you who your coach will be. You sign to pay (play) for the club and they reserve the right to make changes at will.

Or they switch it on you half way through the season....without any warning. Part of the game, keep it moving if it doesn't feel right. You and your kid will be better off in the long run.

 

[Grace T.]

@Matt K - I hear ya, I just don't think that AYSO United is guaranteeing that the teams are going to stay together year over year within those six philosophies, which I think is the loophole you're overlooking
.

That's really the heart of the problem. Ideally AYSO wants to make it so that every place has an appropriate to play (and no, playing up isn't really appropriate unless the kid is huge and gifted). It's not that they have to stay together, but there should be a commitment that once they are in the United track United will foster their progress and try to develop the individual players. Instead, their emphasis (for the reasons I outlined above) seems to be putting together winning teams.

But the way they are structured is that every coach runs his own little fiefdom with very little supervision from the DoCs. It's less true of those United programs receiving a salary, but then if they get unhappy they'll just hop to another club (and I expect we'll see more stories like that). To make it really about player development over the course of a career, things have to be more centrally managed, but United is structured like other clubs where teams get a great deal of autonomy.

The situation with United is made more stark because of the open tryouts every year...teams don't carry forward year after year (nor do coaches) and everyone has to compete for a new spot. This fosters a one-and-done attitude with the team and staff where they know that they will be judged for a year and not necessarily stay together

It was clear with my own son that his coach didn't feel he was quite ready for silver (maybe 1 more year out)...because of his various issues I sort of agreed with it, on the whole. They invited him to place on the new bronze team that was forming but there wasn't really any guidance to see he actually gets place on the team. His coach didn't care (he had already moved on to recruiting new players and no longer considered it his problem). The DoC, who I consider a friend, didn't really do much...he had no transparency into the teams, only the coaches. It took them a while to pick a coach for the new team, and the rains had the tryouts constantly being washed out. No one said, hey we'd really like to see him on such and such date despite all the words that there's definitely a place for him here, we don't want to lose you guys, and if he keeps at it he'll make it there. He would up instead getting an offer for another club right next door right away and we took it.

 

[SPChamp1]

It was inevitable that for AYSO to remain relative would eventually have to look toward a Club Program. They rolled out their Regional Matrix program several years ago with pretty decent results in the surrounding SD area. They then launched their National Pilot program “Challenge” to varying degrees of success. About 6 years ago, (when I was still involved with AYSO) I pitched some ideas to expand this Club Circuit idea and was told it wouldn’t work. There was no dialog, no discussion, just NO, We are a Rec Program.

IMO, they adopted too late and are trying too hard to still advertise that they are AYSO. In order to be successful, I think they need to do the following things.

1) Drop AYSO from the name and distance the “affiliation”. (Yes, take the AYSO patch off the sleeve of the jersey) You can still be guided by the Philosophies and Vision statements without plastering the name all over.

2) Look to merge or partner with established smaller clubs to expand your coach and player base. Your first choice for identifying players shouldn’t come from your Extra Program or from families that are disgruntled with their current Club organization.

3) Keep cost barriers low. Prices apparently vary, but in my area it appears that it is about $1500+team fees. Keep it around there.

4) Try to move away as much as possible from “volunteer” coaches. I know many of these coaches take a salary, but at the end of the day, a lot of them are still just moms and dads who happen to be good coaches.

 

[Grace T.]

It was inevitable that for AYSO to remain relative would eventually have to look toward a Club Program. They rolled out their Regional Matrix program several years ago with pretty decent results in the surrounding SD area. They then launched their National Pilot program “Challenge” to varying degrees of success. About 6 years ago, (when I was still involved with AYSO) I pitched some ideas to expand this Club Circuit idea and was told it wouldn’t work. There was no dialog, no discussion, just NO, We are a Rec Program.

IMO, they adopted too late and are trying too hard to still advertise that they are AYSO. In order to be successful, I think they need to do the following things.

1) Drop AYSO from the name and distance the “affiliation”. (Yes, take the AYSO patch off the sleeve of the jersey) You can still be guided by the Philosophies and Vision statements without plastering the name all over.

Well, they don't want to do that because they fall under the AYSO National Office, which wants to make clear it's an AYSO program for which they take responsibility. Plus, the goal (and it's a good one) is to make sure there's an appropriate level for every kid to place, from Core, to All Stars, to Extras, to United B/S/G, to Is64. If you want to have those tiers, you need them linked, but what's missing is a mechanism for moving kids up and down the pole.

=

2) Look to merge or partner with established smaller clubs to expand your coach and player base. Your first choice for identifying players shouldn’t come from your Extra Program or from families that are disgruntled with their current Club organization.

The problem is those other organizations don't have the 6 philosophies and would have to be indoctrinated in them (it's all over even the intermediate ref exam, for example). A merger wouldn't go well. It would have to be a takeover so United could be in a position to impose the way they do things. You'd also have to change the emphasis away from winning since the power AYSO receives in competitions largely comes from taking the best of the Extras and cherry picking from other clubs....merging with smaller clubs and not altering that emphasis means those smaller clubs players get cut except for maybe 1 or 2 top players, particularly if they aren't fast runners (the AYSO exams put a great deal of emphasis on running)

3) Keep cost barriers low. Prices apparently vary, but in my area it appears that it is about $1500+team fees. Keep it around there.

In ours it was $500 but only one tournament included and coaches were volunteers and DOCS were volunteer board member. You start to throw in multiple tournmanets, salaried coaches, and a living wage for the DOC and you are comparable now to the other clubs in the area.

4) Try to move away as much as possible from “volunteer” coaches. I know many of these coaches take a salary, but at the end of the day, a lot of them are still just moms and dads who happen to be good coaches.

The AYSO National Office is trying to do that. They believe it will create more accountability since a volunteer can just say "this is my kingdom, if you don't like it, go ahead and fire me". The problem is it will raise costs to comparable costs in the area for small indie clubs that do 1 or 2 tournaments a year....not those clubs that may furnish a DOC was the Mercedes he is so accustomed to, or that are subsidizing a DA program....but comparable. As to the daddy ballers, they are really making a push for all United coaches to hold at least a D license and in our area the message went out that if they want to keep their teams (irrespective of winning records) they better be expanding their coaching education.[/QUOTE]

 

[soccersc]

I love AYSO that is where my kids started soccer, not everything is as we expect, but fair is fair and I don't want AYSO to lose it's reputation because of AYSO United not following there six philosophies and getting the benefits that comes along with it. We won every game but the last one, that should be enough to prove they can compete.
If we don't show our concerns and they don't fix the problems other kids will be a victim of the same problem.
Politics should be stopped with the Kids lives.
If we don't say anything it will continue in AYSO united and people like me and you will not love AYSO anymore.

I understand you are upset with what you believe is a club not following its policies. You have complained a lot about how they are handling the situation and you've even mentioned videoing the games, but what does that help with your kid? Are you trying to get him to stay at the club at that age level? It sounds like the coach doesn't think your son should be on his team, there might be many reasons he feels that way, and perhaps it doesn't even have to do with his skills, and it might not even be right, but it seems clear that's the way he feels. I'm sure you've had a teacher, sometime in your life, that you felt didn't give you the grade you deserved, well it goes the same for coaches....its subjective, might not be right or fair, but it's their opinion!!!

You also mention the worry about playing with bigger kids...If your son is planning on playing in high school hes going to have to get used to playing with bigger kids, most high school teams mix the freshman and sophomores on a frosh/soph team anyway. Not sure if your son in a 7th grader as an 06 but I can tell you that there are 05s that are also 7th graders also he would/could actually be playing with his same grade level. The size of players starts to level a bit as kids get to high school.

Not sure if I agree with you on them not standing by their philosophies. I didn't see anywhere where it stated that if you are on a team you have the right to be on the same team again the next season. I must have missed that part.
Find a new place to play, were the coach believes in your son and wants them on the team. It will do great for you and your son!

 

[lastkid]

I understand you are upset with what you believe is a club not following its policies. You have complained a lot about how they are handling the situation and you've even mentioned videoing the games, but what does that help with your kid? Are you trying to get him to stay at the club at that age level? It sounds like the coach doesn't think your son should be on his team, there might be many reasons he feels that way, and perhaps it doesn't even have to do with his skills, and it might not even be right, but it seems clear that's the way he feels. I'm sure you've had a teacher, sometime in your life, that you felt didn't give you the grade you deserved, well it goes the same for coaches....its subjective, might not be right or fair, but it's their opinion!!!

You also mention the worry about playing with bigger kids...If your son is planning on playing in high school hes going to have to get used to playing with bigger kids, most high school teams mix the freshman and sophomores on a frosh/soph team anyway. Not sure if your son in a 7th grader as an 06 but I can tell you that there are 05s that are also 7th graders also he would/could actually be playing with his same grade level. The size of players starts to level a bit as kids get to high school.

Not sure if I agree with you on them not standing by their philosophies. I didn't see anywhere where it stated that if you are on a team you have the right to be on the same team again the next season. I must have missed that part.
Find a new place to play, were the coach believes in your son and wants them on the team. It will do great for you and your son!

He even said his son got to play 50% plus in games after being cut. Sounds like "Everyone Plays" was being enforced. Even AYSO Extra teams have tryouts each year and will cut players. Everyone Plays means that they are supposed to play at least 50% of the game not that they are guaranteed a spot on a competitive level team. Time to move on and find a team where the coach wants the kid.

 

[lastkid]

Some guy, with a big ego, in South OC uses AYSO to get the break on the fields from the city. He then added club and switches name of club every year - needs to get the best value. He changed the name (for marketing) of the rec side but still AYSO. So club gets primo fields and the guy is the exec director, manager of all teams, assistant coach on all teams and coach of 4 teams - not listed as coach of one team but is the guy yelling from the bench every game. No one performs that many jobs at a club -but a good way for no one to see how you manage the paperwork and money. So might be volunteer on the AYSO side but making the $ on the club side. The coaching isnt better but the club prices are the same. In many parts of South OC AYSO has fallen apart due to politics and coaching quality. Some people also abuse what AYSO can get you from an administrative point of view.

Are you sure you are not talking about South Slammers? There has been only one name change for AYSO United in South OC. It was Pacific Soccer Club for a number of years, then changed to AYSO United last year as part of AYSO national's effort to control the brand. The main guy for AYSO United in South OC is definitely not a volunteer, not the coach of 4 teams and not an assistant coach on the rest of the teams.

 

[Matt K]

The one overwhelming advise from people on this forum is to make your team decision based on the coach, not the club.

You need to have a coach that you trust, and in return he believes in your kid. It sounds like you have neither in this situation. It's time to move on and find a better situation for your kid. It really doesn't matter the club in question is AYSO United, CSL Flight 1, or Manchester United (see Pogba vs Mourinho).

Best of luck.

You are absolutely correct about that. I was the fool because after 3 years of trying to get into the AYSO United team last year he picked him because he did not have enough players. He did not like my son even though he was the second highest scorer on the team during the year and when I discussed it with the coach he said it does not count.