Do ref complaints matter?

and my point is, that there are no guarantees that cards, send offs, etc., cures all ills. the responsibility lies with the coaches, players, and the parents of the players.

also, as has been mentioned repeatedly in this thread, at younger ages, and on lower level games, the referee might not be experienced enough to know exactly how to manage thuggery.

Of course there are no guarantees but if those tools aren't used - or used even close to correctl
I agreed with your initial statement about safety, but not about your assertion that multiple injuries are the refs fault. Too many people blame the Referee for injuries that the referee had no control over. Sure if there is A player that commits a dangerous tackle and the referee does not give a card and it happens again and someone is hurt than it may fall on the referee as the one at fault, but the layer is still also responsible for the dangerous tackle. I had a game last week that resulted in four bad injuries, two players going to the hospital via ambulance, another taken by POV to the ER and a forth that probably should have gone to the ER. None of them were the Referee team’s fault.

Injury 1 & 2 were from from a ball out in the open that two players ran at full speed to get and kicked it at the same time. Result was complete tib/fib break and ambulance ride for player 1 and broken wrist for player 2. Completely clean play. Injury 3 was the keeper diving to make a save hit his head on the goalpost and had to leave the game with concussion symptoms. No fault of the Referee. Injury 4 and second ambulance was a player taking off in a sprint to catch a through ball tore his Achilles’ tendon (it rolled up into his calf. No fault of the referee.

I think that is what most people are saying. The player/coach (maybe even parent of player) is responsible for the dirty play and injury the first time. When there are a dozen wreckless fouls with many of them bordering on violent with teammates congratulating each other for injuring players and the referee has done NOTHING other than call some of them fouls then the referee becomes complicit in the carnage. Yes, it is not the referee slamming a players head into the ground, yes it is not the referee who throws a punch at someone's face -- but when the referee utterly fails to act on it then he/she has enabled those dirty players to continue what they are doing. Yes, the players and teams are the ones who should be punished but that referee needs to be retrained or find another low paying hobby.
 
I agreed with your initial statement about safety, but not about your assertion that multiple injuries are the refs fault. Too many people blame the Referee for injuries that the referee had no control over. Sure if there is A player that commits a dangerous tackle and the referee does not give a card and it happens again and someone is hurt than it may fall on the referee as the one at fault, but the layer is still also responsible for the dangerous tackle. I had a game last week that resulted in four bad injuries, two players going to the hospital via ambulance, another taken by POV to the ER and a forth that probably should have gone to the ER. None of them were the Referee team’s fault.

Injury 1 & 2 were from from a ball out in the open that two players ran at full speed to get and kicked it at the same time. Result was complete tib/fib break and ambulance ride for player 1 and broken wrist for player 2. Completely clean play. Injury 3 was the keeper diving to make a save hit his head on the goalpost and had to leave the game with concussion symptoms. No fault of the Referee. Injury 4 and second ambulance was a player taking off in a sprint to catch a through ball tore his Achilles’ tendon (it rolled up into his calf. No fault of the referee.

I don't think that anyone is saying that most injuries are the primary fault of the referee. However, its the USSF's position that the referee's fundamental responsibility is for the safety of the players. We have all seen refs, although, very few, that have not fulfilled that responsibility. What I believe the non-ref posters are trying to articulate is the safety situation that you described below (emphasis added). No one can deny that allowing nasty play can easily lead to unneeded injuries. For me the only reason a complaint should be filed against a ref should be in those situations where the ref compromised player safety or was abusive.

After games my DD sometimes refers to college soccer as a rugby match. DD is also a referee and she tends to blame the college refs for letting games get out of hand to the point that the players will take enforcement into their own hands. She had a game last week that was like this. On one play with the ball at my DD feet, the defender had a hold of her collar and was pulling back and down. The referee had a good view of this from about 10 yards away and did not make the call. The next thing that happened was a reminder to me that my little 5'2" daughter is not always nice and sweet. DD sent an elbow into the defenders ribs than a straight arm to her face before the defender let go. No call from the referee. Most of the overly physical nasty play I have seen during college games is in a large part due to the referee not keeping the game under control and allowing the nasty play.
 
Of course there are no guarantees but if those tools aren't used - or used even close to correctl


I think that is what most people are saying. The player/coach (maybe even parent of player) is responsible for the dirty play and injury the first time. When there are a dozen wreckless fouls with many of them bordering on violent with teammates congratulating each other for injuring players and the referee has done NOTHING other than call some of them fouls then the referee becomes complicit in the carnage. Yes, it is not the referee slamming a players head into the ground, yes it is not the referee who throws a punch at someone's face -- but when the referee utterly fails to act on it then he/she has enabled those dirty players to continue what they are doing. Yes, the players and teams are the ones who should be punished but that referee needs to be retrained or find another low paying hobby.

I made $1337 last month with an average of $44 an hour. Doesn’t sound low paying to me and it definitely is not a hobby. The IRS auditor that reviewed my tax return two years ago refered to refereeing as a professional career since we have to be credentialed and maintain continuing education.

I will agree with you that if the Referee does not use the tools (fouls, cards, voice, advantage) at their disposal to manage the game that they are partially responsible. The majority of the time referees do use their tools and players still act badly, but the Referee gets the blame when it should be the coach and player. There are a few referees out there that probably should drop their whistle in the trash and go find something else to do on the weekends. The majority, 99 percent, of refs enter the field with the intention of calling a good, safe, and competitive game.
 
"We" the paying customer need to start holding our Clubs responsible for the quality of officiating at our home games. Anyone can take a weekend course and watch a couple of videos on the internet (while doing something else) and become a "Referee".
Clubs are just submitting a need to their associations and the associations are just filling spots, no quality assurance, no process improvement, just bodies, and sometimes not even that.
Where is the emphasis to provide a quality product?

I applaud the ref's that work to improve their knowledge of the game, unfortunately you are in the minority.

In the end, it's just youth soccer and not personal.
I'm sorry, you got the customer part wrong. The player is the ustomer.
 
According to what I've heard from quite a few coaches, ref complaints don't matter. I think the most common response I've heard is that its a "waste of time". Why? I can only guess because there is a shortage of refs and probably because the associations either don't have, or aren't interested in devoting, the resources to investigating ref complaints. But really is that any different to complaints about coaches? We've all seen the refs and coaches that have no business being on the pitch, but there they are week-to-week...year to year despite complaints. Club soccer is not a customer oriented business, in fact, I don't think I've seen a business that complains about or ignores its customers more than the "service providers" within club soccer. But, hey these are 1st world problems and we love to watch our kids play.
Most coaches do not know how or what to complain about or even who to complain to. They hide their ignorance by making up stories.
 
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