Young Parents: Why youth soccer should be your last resort

[Grace T.]

How many of you went to NWSL or MLS games last season?
How many bought jerseys or Team gear?
How many games did you watch on TV?

In short...the more everyone in this board starts watching and supporting (buying jerseys, going to games, etc) the more money the clubs have which in theory they would invest in developing players (ie Academies) like European Clubs do.

What is this tv thing you all are talking about?

mls games are pretty unwatchable. And I say this as a long time fan of an mls team that catches 3-4 games a year. If they want to build an audience they have to remove the salary caps and install pro rel. I get the business reasons why not but as long as the mls is out of step here they’ll always be an also ran. While it may not be able to overtake the epl there’s no reason the mls at this point couldn’t give la liga bundes and seria a run for its money

dont Even get me started on women’s soccer. Outside the context of the highest national team games, also unwatchable.

 

[dad4]

First, academic scholarships are not much easier. Oldest did dance (most expensive "sport") had 10 AP classes and was in top 10 of her senior class. Zero scholarships for UC and Cal State schools available. Private schools, yes, but they are so expensive they are still more than a Cal State even with the scholarship.

Second, total applied is a complete BS number for many sports because all they do is look at participants in the sport for High School. I've looked at my daughters High School soccer team, JV and Varsity. 60 players and maybe 3 can play college since most are average athletes with average skill. If your kid is ECNL level (not saying you have to play ECNL, but your kid is as good as ECNL players), you can get a scholarship to a college.

Third, "make my finances look tight" ???? I've worked at the same job for 33 years, wife 25. We make enough to own a house and cars, which means we make too much for any type of scholarship, but we also don't have any extra money.

Lastly, we never played ECNL, GA, ECRL, etc. Is it really 10K a year that people like to throw out? Honestly I never paid more than $2000 in a year and that included keeper training that we paid on our own.

To understand 10K on youth soccer, add up a normal ECNL season: Two showcases in Phoenix, one post season event in Seattle or SD, and one trip to Surf Cup.

3K on club and team fees.
6K for “stay and play” tournaments or showcases. (1.5K each: 600 hotel, 600 flights, 300 car and food.)
5K for private trainers. (100 per week X 50 weeks)
1K in car mileage for league games.

That’s 15K. 10K if you skip the private trainers.

Solo was right when she said we’ve made it too expensive.

 

[Carlsbad7]

I like chasing wins. We have been on teams where passing the ball to a teammate means the ball is lost. My son once played a scrimmage with players his level. He was so happy after the game. Good passes lead to good things and kids pass the ball back after you make a good run. There are teams that always preach development and there are teams that already have good players.

Going for Wins are fine.

In the example I relayed the implication was that we should only play against predetermined opponents that were guaranteed wins for our team.

This is the slippery slope when chasing wins. If you're avoiding top teams to guarantee wins or searching out worse teams (or playing down a level) again to guarantee wins something is wrong.

 

[Kicker4Life]

What is this tv thing you all are talking about?

mls games are pretty unwatchable. And I say this as a long time fan of an mls team that catches 3-4 games a year. If they want to build an audience they have to remove the salary caps and install pro rel. I get the business reasons why not but as long as the mls is out of step here they’ll always be an also ran. While it may not be able to overtake the epl there’s no reason the mls at this point couldn’t give la liga bundes and seria a run for its money

dont Even get me started on women’s soccer. Outside the context of the highest national team games, also unwatchable.

Gotta start somewhere and based on what I’ve seen over the past 5 years, NWSL is evolving quickly as is the MLS. We are only a century or so behind Europe in our development of the game in our country and our best players will export to Europe if the opportunity presents itself.

hopefully There will be more interplay between Eu and US Women’s pro teams.

 

[espola]

What is this tv thing you all are talking about?

mls games are pretty unwatchable. And I say this as a long time fan of an mls team that catches 3-4 games a year. If they want to build an audience they have to remove the salary caps and install pro rel. I get the business reasons why not but as long as the mls is out of step here they’ll always be an also ran. While it may not be able to overtake the epl there’s no reason the mls at this point couldn’t give la liga bundes and seria a run for its money

dont Even get me started on women’s soccer. Outside the context of the highest national team games, also unwatchable.

I would rather watch a women's pro game than an MLS game

 

[crush]

To understand 10K on youth soccer, add up a normal ECNL season: Two showcases in Phoenix, one post season event in Seattle or SD, and one trip to Surf Cup.

3K on club and team fees.
6K for “stay and play” tournaments or showcases. (1.5K each: 600 hotel, 600 flights, 300 car and food.)
5K for private trainers. (100 per week X 50 weeks)
1K in car mileage for league games.

That’s 15K. 10K if you skip the private trainers.

Solo was right when she said we’ve made it too expensive.

The Travel Leagues that mandate "Stay Here or No Play" and the "Train Extra & Pay or No Play" is the big cause of out of control high prizes. It's also understood now that you should and need to support the local Pro teams financially and go to games, buy merch and watch the great game on TV. That is a hard ask for most families in the lower classes of the food chain.

 

[Jamisfoes]

Going for Wins are fine.

In the example I relayed the implication was that we should only play against predetermined opponents that were guaranteed wins for our team.

This is the slippery slope when chasing wins. If you're avoiding top teams to guarantee wins or searching out worse teams (or playing down a level) again to guarantee wins something is wrong.

I guess we were referring to different things.
What I mean by "chasing wins" is joining a stacked roster and seek out the best teams. Do it too much it becomes "club hopping". My point is play soccer for the competition and love of the game. Continue to challenge yourself against the best competition.

 

[Carlsbad7]

I guess we were referring to different things.
What I mean by "chasing wins" is joining a stacked roster and seek out the best teams. Do it too much it becomes "club hopping". My point is play soccer for the competition and love of the game. Continue to challenge yourself against the best competition.

It's funny how that works. Every time my kids team gets hot parents come out of the woodwork asking for the coaches info so they can reach out. Also you start seeing new players at sessions.

I'm in between is this is good or bad behavior by parents. Sometimes players really are frustrated playing on a lower level teams + want an additional challenge. However often it's the parents just trying to get involved with whatever is the hot team of the moment.

 

[Jamisfoes]

It's funny how that works. Every time my kids team gets hot parents come out of the woodwork asking for the coaches info so they can reach out. Also you start seeing new players at sessions.

I'm in between is this is good or bad behavior by parents. Sometimes players really are frustrated playing on a lower level teams + want an additional challenge. However often it's the parents just trying to get involved with whatever is the hot team of the moment.

Can you really fault the parents though? The college scholarships are peanuts and the pro level is making 70k a year. America kids really are playing soccer for the love of the game. If winning makes them happy, they should chase the winning teams. Rich kids play in ECNL, poor kids in EA. None of them are getting meaningful college scholarship. None of them are making millions in a pro league. Afterall, they are just playing soccer for the love of the game.

 

[socalkdg]

To understand 10K on youth soccer, add up a normal ECNL season: Two showcases in Phoenix, one post season event in Seattle or SD, and one trip to Surf Cup.

3K on club and team fees.
6K for “stay and play” tournaments or showcases. (1.5K each: 600 hotel, 600 flights, 300 car and food.)
5K for private trainers. (100 per week X 50 weeks)
1K in car mileage for league games.

That’s 15K. 10K if you skip the private trainers.

Solo was right when she said we’ve made it too expensive.

3K on club and team fees. That is fine.
6K for “stay and play” tournaments or showcases. (1.5K each: 600 hotel, 600 flights, 300 car and food.) We are in So Cal. Keep everything here locally and save a huge amount of money. I could easily see this being 1,000.
5K for private trainers. (100 per week X 50 weeks). I've paid $50 per week for keeper training, two sessions. Usually about 40 weeks out of the year. $2000
1K in car mileage for league games.

 

[socalkdg]

Going to amend I never paid more than $2000 in a year and that included keeper training that we paid on our own. Make it $3500 but I'm not counting gas.

ECNL should be able to keep everything in SoCal, still have 4 per year tourneys using Silverlakes and San Diego, get kids 3 practices per week plus an additional private training for just above $5000 per year and the kids will be just as good as they are.

 

[Grace T.]

3K on club and team fees. That is fine.
6K for “stay and play” tournaments or showcases. (1.5K each: 600 hotel, 600 flights, 300 car and food.) We are in So Cal. Keep everything here locally and save a huge amount of money. I could easily see this being 1,000.
5K for private trainers. (100 per week X 50 weeks). I've paid $50 per week for keeper training, two sessions. Usually about 40 weeks out of the year. $2000
1K in car mileage for league games.

“Keep it in SoCal”. Mls next is expressly dedicated to at least exposing the kids to competition to other regions. It’s the only way to build a truly national system. For the academies, the only way they can get equivalent play is national travel to the other academies. If the girls are ever to get a true elite level it will be the same for them

“$50 per week for keeper training, two sessions.” Your club forcing you to pay for keeper training (this is a bit of a trend and it’s not really a great one considering how little control you have with the instructor and classes available at the applicable age and skill level…it’s a keeper tax)? Because if private, even for group lessons that’s really light. Most coaches these days are charging $40-50 for a single group class. The really good ones that can actually take your kid to an higher level are substantially more expensive.

 

[Socal-Soccer-Dad]

First, academic scholarships are not much easier. Oldest did dance (most expensive "sport") had 10 AP classes and was in top 10 of her senior class. Zero scholarships for UC and Cal State schools available. Private schools, yes, but they are so expensive they are still more than a Cal State even with the scholarship.

I meant nationally. I don't know too much in CA but I went to a state school in FL. Tuition 100% covered via their state academic scholarship program. I believe GA and some other states have something similar. Pretty easy to get tuition completely covered if you did pretty well in high school academically (don't have to have 3.8 or anything). You can get a good portion covered with like a 3.0 and 1200 (out of 1600 back then) SATs. MUCH easier to achieve 3.0/1200 than being an elite national level athlete.

Third, "make my finances look tight" ???? I've worked at the same job for 33 years, wife 25. We make enough to own a house and cars, which means we make too much for any type of scholarship, but we also don't have any extra money.

Yea that's the middle class hell - "make too much for financial aid but not enough to have any extra for college". I'm right there with you. What I meant was as kids get nearer to college age, there are ways to make your finances "look worse" to get more financial aid. You need to reduce your Expected Family Contribution (EFC) and there are ways to do that and consultants/advisors to help you for a fee.

It's much easier if one of the spouses is self employed and is able to defer income and increase expenses for a few years. I've also heard (from a friend who used a third party advisor) to switch his 30 year mortgage to a 15 year as primary housing isn't counted as an asset in the same way like an investment or cash in bank is and it significantly reduced expected contribution... then after kids finish college, refinance it back to a 30 year...

I've also heard - and this is highly unethical in my view - get a divorce on paper and have the kid apply for financial aid as child of a single parent household. Voila. Full ride on financial aid. Again, I don't think they're teaching their kid anything good by doing that... but I've heard it being done.

All this to say... I agree with most of the people here saying playing soccer or any sport for the athletic scholarship isn't supported by math. Play it because it allows for other benefits... college money, if any, is a nice bonus but not the goal.

 

[Socal-Soccer-Dad]

“Keep it in SoCal”. Mls next is expressly dedicated to at least exposing the kids to competition to other regions. It’s the only way to build a truly national system. For the academies, the only way they can get equivalent play is national travel to the other academies. If the girls are ever to get a true elite level it will be the same for them

Our country is just too damn big is what the problem is

That coupled with soccer not being the top sport in the country... means top talent is spread out by thousands of miles...

 

[Yak]

We only have boys but have enjoyed a variety of lower cost options over the years at every level:

AYSO and AYSO Extra
Sunday leagues - the most fun
High school - surprisingly the least fun
Local teams that affiliate with larger clubs - playing Coast Premier, Discovery, Flight 1
Fully-sponsored teams - USDA at the time
MLS academy

Aside from the cost benefits, this also created opportunity to socialize outside of their coastal OC bubble.

One DS is now playing ECNL in his junior year for college exposure but I’m glad not to have been paying this much in years past.

 

[Zoro]

I read the OP. I don't see it so much different than anything else.

I had one kid do soccer and got her choice of schools (as she also met the grade bar).
I had another kid do cycling and that is so filled with politics. He got "free" school plus paid $40K (as he also met the grade bar).

Both had other goals than being pros in their sports. Sports were a tool to something else.

Now (10+ years later), wife and I see the sports as far more important than any academics ever were. It taught both to do hard things and taught both things are not fair. Both look for angles, or learn to deal with things they can't change.

 

[focomoso]

He got "free" school plus paid $40K (as he also met the grade bar).

Got "free" school and _was payed_ 40k or _had to pay_ 40k?

 

[Zoro]

Got "free" school and _was payed_ 40k or _had to pay_ 40k?

Was paid $40K to attend school.

 

[Carlsbad7]

Was paid $40K to attend school.

At least it wasnt the 60k other students pay per year.

It's like bragging about only being kicked in the left nut, not both.

 

[Zoro]

At least it wasnt the 60k other students pay per year.

It's like bragging about only being kicked in the left nut, not both.

The point of this thread was soccer (sports) should be the last resort. Nope.
My wife and I strongly disagree with that. The money part is different, but I did mention it - sorry.

I am pretty confident the things done to succeed in sports are quite similar to the things done to be successful after sports.
Simply - I do not agree with the OP.

Both my kids (23, 28) now do hard things and can tolerate a lot. They are still single, so maybe the tough stuff has not come up yet.
Did sports build that, or reveal it - I don't know. I can say that not doing hard things was not an option. Growing up for them was hard, and things now are hard. But in a good way.