BANNED FOR 1 WEEK
DOMINIC
Why keep arguing, NO FALL SOCCER!
- Thread starter Anon9
- Start date
DOMINIC
Some of the kids and teachers live with people over 65 years old. The amount of people headed to the hospital if there is an outbreak at a school, which spreads into the community, can affect people over 65. Let us not forget all of the health care workers who have lost their own lives while treating people for Covid.
JumboJack
SILVER ELITE
Ok. Then those kids stay home and distance learn if there is no way for them to distance themselves from at risk people inside their home. Of course those kids should also avoid just about any other type of movement that could expose them to the virus that they could then bring home.
You are absolutely being played. It's so clear from where I sit. It's unfortunate. I know that for us it's all about soccer, but it goes beyond that - long term small business health, mental health, you name it, will be impacted by decisions being driven by political ideology. It's unfortunate. A prudent, safe, scientific, non partisan approach isn't even being attempted.
On a bright note, I did see CA teams in AZ today playing scrimmages. It was hot. they played well considering they were playing in conditions they are not used to.
Paul Spacey
SILVER ELITE
Yeah for sure it extends way beyond soccer and sport and that’s the scary thing; we know it will negatively affect the mental health of young people (and adults to be fair) and that’s the absolute tragedy and scandal of this approach in CA.
I heard CA teams were going to AZ this weekend; long way to go but they are desperate to play!
Seasonal flu is not as contagious as covid-19. There is a seasonal flu shot. Covid-19 seems to be causing more inflamatory disease than the flu, possibly long term effect on the heart of even healthy individuals who get covid. Covid-19 does not seem to be seasonal. There isn't a vaccine for covid (yet), antivirals will become available soon. And yet, with all the lock downs and prevention measure across the country we have still lost over 180,000 people in less than 8 months. So, without all those measures things could have been a lot worse and hopefully won't get worse. Info only, there were school shut downs for H1N1 outbreaks, but it is much easier to contain and not nearly as contagious.
You can't just look at the positive of saving one life. You have to look at the costs. The negatives include deaths from delayed screenings, suicides, and overdoses. The loss of productivity in the economy and businesses lost. The increase in spousal abuse, child abuse, and crime. The loss in education suffered by kids. The increase in depression and alcholism among people.
We could save lots of lives by dropping the speed limits to 20 mph. We don't do that because it's not worth the cost.
In my own case, my current medical condition should have been resolved in a month in normal times-- they would have just admitted me to the hospital and bombarded me with tests. But I've been ill for 3 months and going because of the backup in labs, and because the hospitals are restricted.
Cal south discussing this in the outdoor setting about scrimmages indicates there is not a distinction about cohort size indoor vs outdoor, limit to 14 .... suggested for youth
The Cal South cite to this was definitely unclear, since the guidance is itself very specific in limiting its applicability to “indoor environments.” It May be that, as I said, the State meant to apply the 14 limit to all cohorts, including the ones previously applicable guidance for youth sports and sent it to Cal South in advance with that explanation. It’s also possible Cal South just inferred this, without getting any special interpretation by the state. The problem is that Cal South simply passed along the information and didn’t offer any explanation. If the 14 player cohort rule applied to outdoor sports, then scrimmages would be the least of a team’s problems. It would mean Cal South and the State would not permit even a physically distanced and masked practice involving more than 14 players. I haven’t seen Cal South say that.
I would hope that's not the case either but the language says and indoor environment
Follow the guidance for cohorts of children and youth in controlled & supervised settings.. not limited to....
How my County interprets that may lead to additional restrictions in LA which are stronger vs the state guidance for example. Masks for all players this week at UCLA and limited group size, 2 coaches only.
That language ("This guidance applies to groups of children and youth in controlled, supervised, and indoor environments") means all three items in the sentence - controlled, supervised, AND indoor environments - must be present for the cohort guidance to apply.
Of course, LA County can impose stricter regulations than what the state requires, so in that sense it really doesn't matter what that language means as long as the county doesn't do something less than what the state requires.
kickingandscreaming
PREMIER
Does anyone believe San Diego will get the OK to start up soccer games but OC and LA County will not? I can't imagine that would go over well and I'd be surprised if leaders allowed it to happen. Maybe it's a moot point as the new "requirements" make it pretty much impossible to reach and, of course, the goalposts can always be moved again.
We have quite a few people on this forum who are lawyers or others who spend a lot of time studying these situations where regulations are written more like complicated contracts with seemingly conflicting or unclear sentences and paragraphs with references to other past restrictions that make it somewhat complicated to be confident as to what they really say or how they may apply .
The cohort restrictions appear they may have major consequences for youth soccer . If you are lawyer or a person who has experience with contracts or someone who has taken the time to study these restrictions in detail , what would you recommend to youth clubs who have practices scheduled for next week and beyond. I'm hoping for actual action items based on your opinion that you would recommend to a club versus just saying something in general like " just do what you think is right " especially since many clubs may not know what is right.
I hope I get at least a few responses. Thank you
To me, it all seems to do with the level of risk involved, and who is permitted to accept that risk - and which organizations are willing to bow to pressure when the prudent decision isn’t the popular decision.
University Presidents that originally allowed in-person classes and football knew it wasn’t the right decision but in certain regions where the politics allow it are going to try, only to realize in a few weeks/months that college kids cannot not-be-social. It will spread to the point that all in-person classes and sports will be cancelled.
Youth-sports is a little different because coaches and parents can enforce responsible behavior and social distancing to a greater degree than can be required of college kids. Also, parents have a more direct right to intervene in their behavior. If teams can maintain some semblance of distance and follow the rules, it could work. And you add that the risk - exercise, physical and emotional health of the kids - is probably worth it. We live in Az and I am happy that my daughter is able to practice. But I cringe at the end of practice when coach calls everyone in and they stand on top of each other - I have seen coaches in our same Club who enforce the distance rules better.
Grade school is the toughest call of all - the reward is even higher, but the risk is great too. Similar to college there is not a real way to enforce social distancing or mask wearing with kids that age. Therefore, the virus will absolutely work it’s way through that population. Absent shifting the entire demographic of teachers, bus-drivers, school administrators, to young adults in their 20’s and 30’s, more vulnerable adults and the population in general will become sick at a much higher rate. There is no way around that.
The one thing I an sick of is the brain dead people who make the claim that this is all the work of the new work order, that it’s the same as the season flu, that those who make the more cautious decision are doing so with the intent of stealing your rights.
What we’re doing right now is trying to determine the right speed limit - just as 20 MPH isn’t worth the risk, neither is abolishing the speed limit. I can’t drive 80 through a school zone because my car is better and I’m a better driver. Living in a society means sometimes you accept rules that don’t directly benefit you but the people you live in and around.
University Presidents that originally allowed in-person classes and football knew it wasn’t the right decision but in certain regions where the politics allow it are going to try, only to realize in a few weeks/months that college kids cannot not-be-social. It will spread to the point that all in-person classes and sports will be cancelled.
Youth-sports is a little different because coaches and parents can enforce responsible behavior and social distancing to a greater degree than can be required of college kids. Also, parents have a more direct right to intervene in their behavior. If teams can maintain some semblance of distance and follow the rules, it could work. And you add that the risk - exercise, physical and emotional health of the kids - is probably worth it. We live in Az and I am happy that my daughter is able to practice. But I cringe at the end of practice when coach calls everyone in and they stand on top of each other - I have seen coaches in our same Club who enforce the distance rules better.
Grade school is the toughest call of all - the reward is even higher, but the risk is great too. Similar to college there is not a real way to enforce social distancing or mask wearing with kids that age. Therefore, the virus will absolutely work it’s way through that population. Absent shifting the entire demographic of teachers, bus-drivers, school administrators, to young adults in their 20’s and 30’s, more vulnerable adults and the population in general will become sick at a much higher rate. There is no way around that.
The one thing I an sick of is the brain dead people who make the claim that this is all the work of the new work order, that it’s the same as the season flu, that those who make the more cautious decision are doing so with the intent of stealing your rights.
What we’re doing right now is trying to determine the right speed limit - just as 20 MPH isn’t worth the risk, neither is abolishing the speed limit. I can’t drive 80 through a school zone because my car is better and I’m a better driver. Living in a society means sometimes you accept rules that don’t directly benefit you but the people you live in and around.
Lifeisnotfare
SILVER
Goal posts are being moved as i write. So unfair all this is but get used to it some like to say.
Soccerfan2
GOLD
small-groups-child-youth
www.cdph.ca.gov
I would not recommend any change for teams practicing outside. Continue to operate under the plan established in conjunction with your county.
ITFC Blues
SILVER
It seems pretty clear that the guidance from 08/25 is not intended to apply to youth sports indoors or outdoors. ( the bold type is not added, it exists like this on the guidance document)
"This guidance applies to groups of children and youth in controlled, supervised, and indoor environments operated by local educational agencies, non profits, or other authorized providers, including, but not limited to, public and private schools; licensed and license-exempt child care settings; organized and supervised care environments, i.e., "distance learning hubs"; recreation programs; before and after school programs; youth groups; and day camps. Guidance and directives related to schools, child care, day camps, youth sports, and institutions of higher education are not superseded by this document and still apply to those specified settings."
"This guidance applies to groups of children and youth in controlled, supervised, and indoor environments operated by local educational agencies, non profits, or other authorized providers, including, but not limited to, public and private schools; licensed and license-exempt child care settings; organized and supervised care environments, i.e., "distance learning hubs"; recreation programs; before and after school programs; youth groups; and day camps. Guidance and directives related to schools, child care, day camps, youth sports, and institutions of higher education are not superseded by this document and still apply to those specified settings."
COVID-19 Provisional Counts - Weekly Updates by Select Demographic and Geographic Characteristics
Tabulated data on provisional COVID-19 deaths by age, sex, race and Hispanic origin, and comorbidities. Also includes an index of state-level and county-level mortality data available for download.
www.cdc.gov
Reading 9,210 deaths attributed only to Covid. The rest had serious illnesses or much older.