Vaccine

[dad4]

Nah...I'm blaming them for giving scientific veneer to the policies the politicians want to implement instead of standing up for reason and science (going so far as to actively lie to the population as Fauci admitted with masks and herd immunity thresholds), and in so doing, having destroyed the reputation of public health for a generation.

Remember the timeline on indoor dining, and wearing masks while walking to the table.

Team virus spends months demanding their tiramisu. Eventually, the politicians open up restaurants to make you happy. When they do, you point out that it is stupid.

Yes, opening indoor dinging was stupid. And wearing a mask to the table did not make it less stupid. If you wanted a smart plan, you should have supported the vaccine requirements in summer 2021.

 

[watfly]

Which do you prefer, misinformation siding with safety and health concerns or misinformation siding with increased infection, hospitalizations, possible long term effects and death? Oh wait, never mind.

Neither is good, but in terms of what's happened in regards to Covid policy, the former has caused far more damage than the latter. If you're Covid myopic, you prefer the fear mongering under the misguided notion of "better safe than sorry". If you have any concept of cost benefit you'd understand that fear based, blanket covid policies have created far more collateral damage than any damage from covid, particularly to our children.

Call me a whiner for this opinion, but adults that think children should protect them are far bigger cowards.

 

[Grace T.]

Remember the timeline on indoor dining, and wearing masks while walking to the table.

Team virus spends months demanding their tiramisu. Eventually, the politicians open up restaurants to make you happy. When they do, you point out that it is stupid.

Yes, opening indoor dinging was stupid. And wearing a mask to the table did not make it less stupid. If you wanted a smart plan, you should have supported the vaccine requirements in summer 2021.

They should have stood up to the politicians and said allowed it's stupid. That way, instead of this fabrication and security fiction, we can have an honest debate about the merits of indoor dining and restaurant survival v. virus containment. Instead they acted as pawns for the politicians giving them a veneer for a policy which made no sense.

 

[kickingandscreaming]

Sure there are politics. Plenty of researchers were perfectly willing to make misleading statements about covid origins, possibly to protect their grant funding in the future.

But, what better option is there? Politicians? Pod cast hosts? News anchors? Pretend I understand everything all on my own? None of those options looks at all viable as an information source.

the viable option is to let it all hang out there, to engage in active debate instead of censorship, and to let people act like adults and make up their own decisions and bear their own consequences.

Grace states it concisely above.

I'll add to it that I believe censorship makes things worse. It keeps the drama going. It drives a bigger divide by promoting uncivil accusations to go back in forth. As the emotion on both sides rises, rationality decreases, and tribalism is reinforced. Simply state the case against a viewpoint and move on.

 

[Desert Hound]

Unless you were a child.

Or had a business, or worked at a biz that was shut down, or had to drain savings, etc etc. And don't forget about 7+% inflation over the past year that affects everyone, but especially those on the lower economic scales.

But yeah....Outside of that the experts nailed it and helped everyone.

 

[soccersc]

So when one person dies of covid and did not get the vaccine, main stream media, @Soccermaverick, @espola, and others are all over it. It made headlines in many LA and OC papers when an assistant district attorney died and was against mandates....but when someone dies like this unfortunate lady after she took the shot....all we hear is crickets....That is not right @dad4 that is what I am talking, no transparency and the government and many health officials have lost trust because of it. If there is any risk in taking a vaccine then it should be up to each person to make that decision

Autopsy confirms Kansas woman died from allergic reaction to COVID-19 vaccine

Nearly a year after her death, a Kansas woman’s autopsy report has confirmed she died from an allergic reaction to the Moderna COVID-19 vaccine.

www.live5news.com

 

[Brav520]

Neither is good, but in terms of what's happened in regards to Covid policy, the former has caused far more damage than the latter. If you're Covid myopic, you prefer the fear mongering under the misguided notion of "better safe than sorry". If you have any concept of cost benefit you'd understand that fear based, blanket covid policies have created far more collateral damage than any damage from covid, particularly to our children.

Call me a whiner for this opinion, but adults that think children should protect them are far bigger cowards.

Lying is good if we are trying to keep you safe and healthy

Same People: why has trust eroded in our government and health officials regarding Covid ?( must be Joe Rogan)

 

[espola]

This, for example:

Science | AAAS

www.science.org

Not a shining moment for science. Other moments were better, but not that one.

That's old news. Has there been some recently disclosed information of which I am not aware?

 

[watfly]

Lying is good if we are trying to keep you safe and healthy

Same People: why has trust eroded in our government and health officials regarding Covid ?( must be Joe Rogan)

The government and "experts" have screwed themselves for the next pandemic.

The "government that cried wolf"...turned out to be a coyote.

 

[espola]

So when one person dies of covid and did not get the vaccine, main stream media, @Soccermaverick, @espola, and others are all over it. It made headlines in many LA and OC papers when an assistant district attorney died and was against mandates....but when someone dies like this unfortunate lady after she took the shot....all we hear is crickets....That is not right @dad4 that is what I am talking, no transparency and the government and many health officials have lost trust because of it. If there is any risk in taking a vaccine then it should be up to each person to make that decision

Autopsy confirms Kansas woman died from allergic reaction to COVID-19 vaccine

Nearly a year after her death, a Kansas woman’s autopsy report has confirmed she died from an allergic reaction to the Moderna COVID-19 vaccine.

www.live5news.com

It's not really noteworthy when some unvaccinated person dies of covid -- happens every day. What is noteworthy is when someone who has made a loudly public anti-vax statement dies.

As for the unfortunate Kansas woman -- the medical history given in that news article should have told her to stay away.

 

[Kicker 2.0]

the viable option is to let it all hang out there, to engage in active debate instead of censorship, and to let people act like adults and make up their own decisions and bear their own consequences.

And the Woke Cancel Culture needs to be reigned in. Because if they go after one, then they need to go after all and that won’t get us anywhere.

 

[dad4]

Neither is good, but in terms of what's happened in regards to Covid policy, the former has caused far more damage than the latter. If you're Covid myopic, you prefer the fear mongering under the misguided notion of "better safe than sorry". If you have any concept of cost benefit you'd understand that fear based, blanket covid policies have created far more collateral damage than any damage from covid, particularly to our children.

Call me a whiner for this opinion, but adults that think children should protect them are far bigger cowards.

There were plenty of voices saying that we should increase the mandates on adults and weaken them on kids.

As I recall, you never once supported the idea.

It weakens the argument. There is a huge difference between saying “let’s help the kids” and saying “no rules for anyone”.

Most of this board has been saying “no rules for anyone”, and then looking for ways to pretend nothing is wrong.

 

[watfly]

There were plenty of voices saying that we should increase the mandates on adults and weaken them on kids.

As I recall, you never once supported the idea.

It weakens the argument. There is a huge difference between saying “let’s help the kids” and saying “no rules for anyone”.

Most of this board has been saying “no rules for anyone”, and then looking for ways to pretend nothing is wrong.

Mischaracterizing again. While not in favor of masks, I said whatever you want to do with adults is one thing, but f'ing with kids is straight up wrong.

You can't take the high road here, you are still supporting masks for children only a few pages ago, saying something to the effect that teachers shouldn't have to work in front of 30 unmasked kids.

 

[dad4]

Or had a business, or worked at a biz that was shut down, or had to drain savings, etc etc. And don't forget about 7+% inflation over the past year that affects everyone, but especially those on the lower economic scales.

But yeah....Outside of that the experts nailed it and helped everyone.

As long as you’re supporting businesses, any thoughts on the factory workers who are out of work because anti-government radicals shut down the Ambassador Bridge?

 

[kickingandscreaming]

Or had a business, or worked at a biz that was shut down, or had to drain savings, etc etc. And don't forget about 7+% inflation over the past year that affects everyone, but especially those on the lower economic scales.

But yeah....Outside of that the experts nailed it and helped everyone.

Yeah, as soon as I posted I realized I forgot to add anyone whose paycheck was affected. I'm wondering how many of the people that were responsible for the mandates, etc. actually had their paycheck reduced.

 

[soccersc]

There were plenty of voices saying that we should increase the mandates on adults and weaken them on kids.

As I recall, you never once supported the idea.

It weakens the argument. There is a huge difference between saying “let’s help the kids” and saying “no rules for anyone”.

Most of this board has been saying “no rules for anyone”, and then looking for ways to pretend nothing is wrong.

There is a difference with "no rules for anyone" and understanding when the rules need to be lifted. We have a much better understanding of the virus now than we did at the beginning but in our State still thinks we are still in a State of Emergency...but wait, we are inviting people to the biggest sporting event in America to our state this weekend. You don't find that kinda odd?

 

[kickingandscreaming]

As long as you’re supporting businesses, any thoughts on the factory workers who are out of work because anti-government radicals shut down the Ambassador Bridge?

This is a typical response to governmental authoritarianism. No one should be surprised at this point.

 

[watfly]

Or had a business, or worked at a biz that was shut down, or had to drain savings, etc etc. And don't forget about 7+% inflation over the past year that affects everyone, but especially those on the lower economic scales.

But yeah....Outside of that the experts nailed it and helped everyone.

Or the mental health issues, the missed cancer treatments and screenings, the postponed surgeries, etc.

 

[Desert Hound]

When they do, you point out that it is stupid.

We point out the nonsensical rules. Mask to walk in, none to eat. Pointless. It is theater nothing more.

And the part you forget time and time again is nobody can afford to shut down for extended periods of time. Biz has to be open.

That is the reality.

 

[Desert Hound]

As long as you’re supporting businesses, any thoughts on the factory workers who are out of work because anti-government radicals shut down the Ambassador Bridge?

They are not anti gov radicals.

They want pointless restrictions removed.

The press characterizes them as ant vaxx. They are anti mandate. They as a group have a vax rate of 90%. Canada overall is around 78%.

The gov there and here and elsewhere has acted in rather authoritarian ways. They want those restrictions gone.

They are not anti gov radicals.