Soccer gave away the golden goose to other sports at high school

[Grace T.]

As long as the NFL, NBA, and MLB exist soccer will never get the priority at the youth level. Too much money, power and politics involved. Women's sports generally get a small fraction of viewership that even mediocre men's sports get. On the boy's soccer side youth soccer in SoCal is dominated by Hispanic players and their supporters just don't have the political power yet that they should have to demand equal access to facilities that other sports enjoy. I wish it was different but though soccer is making slow progress I don't envision soccer being a top HS sport anytime soon with cheerleaders and playing in a warmer season.

There are multiple problem with baseball on all levels (major leagues, minor leagues, youth). Soccer should have passed MLB baseball by now but due to its own problems it will still likely take some time (unless baseball magically reforms itself at all levels).

Gridiron football too has had issues from declining participation to the concussion problems to the politics, but you are right, it's a very powerful sport. Basketball isn't going anywhere. Soccer, at least for the men, will be the no. 3 sport for a long time to come.

Strike Three: Baseball Is Dead

Baseball has declined in popularity, and that will have a long-lasting effect on the culture at large. Years from now, a young child will ask, "Grandpa, what was baseball?"

howtheyplay.com

 

[Simisoccerfan]

There are multiple problem with baseball on all levels (major leagues, minor leagues, youth). Soccer should have passed MLB baseball by now but due to its own problems it will still likely take some time (unless baseball magically reforms itself at all levels).

Gridiron football too has had issues from declining participation to the concussion problems to the politics, but you are right, it's a very powerful sport. Basketball isn't going anywhere. Soccer, at least for the men, will be the no. 3 sport for a long time to come.

Strike Three: Baseball Is Dead

Baseball has declined in popularity, and that will have a long-lasting effect on the culture at large. Years from now, a young child will ask, "Grandpa, what was baseball?"

howtheyplay.com

It is ambitious to say men's soccer in the US is the No 3 sport. More like No 6 (maybe). NHL and MLB annually TV contract is at least double of the MLS contract. Nascar, Football and NFL is 10's of times higher. Golf is higher than MLS. So actually maybe No 7 unless you include the Olympics. I think if you include the EPL US rights and other European leagues it is still not in the top 5.

 

[Grace T.]

It is ambitious to say men's soccer in the US is the No 3 sport. More like No 6 (maybe). NHL and MLB annually TV contract is at least double of the MLS contract. Nascar, Football and NFL is 10's of times higher. Golf is higher than MLS. So actually maybe No 7 unless you include the Olympics. I think if you include the EPL US rights and other European leagues it is still not in the top 5.

Fair point re the NHL though the closure of ice rinks in the South and West over the last decade has also impacted that sport.

As to Nascar/Golf/Tennis while certainly sports, I don't think it's fair to compare them to team sports, which are quite a different animal.

 

[way up]

Very interesting thread here. I don't even know what dd is, but I have a feeling that my daughter is my dd. I like to learn a bit about what's to come for a young lady (10 years old) with this sport. I think this thread has exposed several of the challenges with soccer in America. The 2 I can't help, but focus on are:

#1. sport popularity (viewership, audience)
#2. club soccer dominance for upward mobility

American Football pays the bills for many other sports and activities in high school and college. People pay money to watch football. My opinion is that to help women make more money playing soccer, you need to get more people to pay money to watch it or at least watch it on the t.v. I learned to love watching women's college soccer even more so than men. I am invested with my own daughter of course, but I have developed a love for women's soccer as a man (dad). This is what I think we need to focus on. We need an ambassador of marketing to expand women's soccer viewership somehow.

I kind of agree with the beginning post here though and there are advantages to American Football with the season and existing popularity. I am rushed here, because I can't wait to go watch my daughter's team and other team's play at the 10 year old level. I think the more you love the sport, the more you don't care about the level of play.

I'm a solution guy and would really love to see soccer grow as a sport in America especially for women's soccer and can't help, but wonder if the dominance of club soccer where viewership/audience is going to be less vs high school reduces the potential for growing the popularity of soccer. American Football also has a huge advantage with the number of players with families. There are more than 50 players on a high school football team and like 10 or more coaches. They have an instant audience of 200 plus people ONE EACH SIDE before spectators are even counted.

I wish we had a soccer ambassador in America and if we currently do, I'm not so sure they are doing it well??

 

[espola]

Very interesting thread here. I don't even know what dd is, but I have a feeling that my daughter is my dd. I like to learn a bit about what's to come for a young lady (10 years old) with this sport. I think this thread has exposed several of the challenges with soccer in America. The 2 I can't help, but focus on are:

#1. sport popularity (viewership, audience)
#2. club soccer dominance for upward mobility

American Football pays the bills for many other sports and activities in high school and college. People pay money to watch football. My opinion is that to help women make more money playing soccer, you need to get more people to pay money to watch it or at least watch it on the t.v. I learned to love watching women's college soccer even more so than men. I am invested with my own daughter of course, but I have developed a love for women's soccer as a man (dad). This is what I think we need to focus on. We need an ambassador of marketing to expand women's soccer viewership somehow.

I kind of agree with the beginning post here though and there are advantages to American Football with the season and existing popularity. I am rushed here, because I can't wait to go watch my daughter's team and other team's play at the 10 year old level. I think the more you love the sport, the more you don't care about the level of play.

I'm a solution guy and would really love to see soccer grow as a sport in America especially for women's soccer and can't help, but wonder if the dominance of club soccer where viewership/audience is going to be less vs high school reduces the potential for growing the popularity of soccer. American Football also has a huge advantage with the number of players with families. There are more than 50 players on a high school football team and like 10 or more coaches. They have an instant audience of 200 plus people ONE EACH SIDE before spectators are even counted.

I wish we had a soccer ambassador in America and if we currently do, I'm not so sure they are doing it well??

Perhaps 20 colleges have profitable football programs. Maybe in Texas a popular school football turns a profit, but I have seen nothing in California high schools that would lead me to believe any of them turn a profit.

Growth in Division I athletics expenses outpaces revenue increases

Revenue generated by athletics through ticket sales, broadcast agreements and other sources continues to rise among Division I schools, but athletics-related expenses

www.ncaa.org

 

[LASTMAN14]

Very interesting thread here. I don't even know what dd is, but I have a feeling that my daughter is my dd. I like to learn a bit about what's to come for a young lady (10 years old) with this sport. I think this thread has exposed several of the challenges with soccer in America. The 2 I can't help, but focus on are:

#1. sport popularity (viewership, audience)
#2. club soccer dominance for upward mobility

American Football pays the bills for many other sports and activities in high school and college. People pay money to watch football. My opinion is that to help women make more money playing soccer, you need to get more people to pay money to watch it or at least watch it on the t.v. I learned to love watching women's college soccer even more so than men. I am invested with my own daughter of course, but I have developed a love for women's soccer as a man (dad). This is what I think we need to focus on. We need an ambassador of marketing to expand women's soccer viewership somehow.

I kind of agree with the beginning post here though and there are advantages to American Football with the season and existing popularity. I am rushed here, because I can't wait to go watch my daughter's team and other team's play at the 10 year old level. I think the more you love the sport, the more you don't care about the level of play.

I'm a solution guy and would really love to see soccer grow as a sport in America especially for women's soccer and can't help, but wonder if the dominance of club soccer where viewership/audience is going to be less vs high school reduces the potential for growing the popularity of soccer. American Football also has a huge advantage with the number of players with families. There are more than 50 players on a high school football team and like 10 or more coaches. They have an instant audience of 200 plus people ONE EACH SIDE before spectators are even counted.

I wish we had a soccer ambassador in America and if we currently do, I'm not so sure they are doing it well??

DD is darling daughter. It’s a term that has been used on the forum here for a very long time.

 

[SoccerJones]

Perhaps 20 colleges have profitable football programs. Maybe in Texas a popular school football turns a profit, but I have seen nothing in California high schools that would lead me to believe any of them turn a profit.

Growth in Division I athletics expenses outpaces revenue increases

Revenue generated by athletics through ticket sales, broadcast agreements and other sources continues to rise among Division I schools, but athletics-related expenses

www.ncaa.org

Yes it's true that at the D1 level, very few (I think it was like 70 out of 300) make a profit. As for high schools, there are a high number of programs that do make good money (it'd be interesting to see if this was the case in the covid years) in Norcal and Socal. Many come from the Trinity league and there are quite a few that pack the stands at the high school level.

I would agree that Texas football is king in the USA

 

[Yak]

Iwould

Yes it's true that at the D1 level, very few (I think it was like 70 out of 300) make a profit. As for high schools, there are a high number of programs that do make good money (it'd be interesting to see if this was the case in the covid years) in Norcal and Socal. Many come from the Trinity league and there are quite a few that pack the stands at the high school level.

I would agree that Texas football is king in the USA

Football is king in Texas but Texas isn't king in high school football. There are 4 SoCal teams in the top 10, more than any other state, including Mater Dei at #1.

 

[espola]

Yes it's true that at the D1 level, very few (I think it was like 70 out of 300) make a profit. As for high schools, there are a high number of programs that do make good money (it'd be interesting to see if this was the case in the covid years) in Norcal and Socal. Many come from the Trinity league and there are quite a few that pack the stands at the high school level.

I would agree that Texas football is king in the USA

More like 25 colleges have profitable football programs.

Do Colleges Make Money From Athletics? | BestColleges

Although college sports play a big role in bringing in money for universities, they rarely generate a positive net revenue.

www.bestcolleges.com

"Pack the stands" is meaningless without knowing stadium size and ticket prices, and whether they turn a profit depends on knowing the expenses.

 

[Carlsbad7]

College Football is advertising more than anything for most schools. I'm sure the PHD eggheads hate it but they also realize that it's something the kids like so it's a necessary evil.

Regarding soccer instead of continuing to force the field game on people. Colleges should focus on a collegiate level Futsal league utilizing the indoor basketball courts when they're not in use for basketball / volleyball / etc. Give people a more consumable taste of the action / suspense. Then once they're hooked the field game will make more sense.

 

[espola]

College Football is advertising more than anything for most schools. I'm sure the PHD eggheads hate it but they also realize that it's something the kids like so it's a necessary evil.

Regarding soccer instead of continuing to force the field game on people. Colleges should focus on a collegiate level Futsal league utilizing the indoor basketball courts when they're not in use for basketball / volleyball / etc. Give people a more consumable taste of the action / suspense. Then once they're hooked the field game will make more sense.

I'm sure those PhD eggheads think that colleges are founded to educate their students or something like that.

 

[timbuck]

Quick HS soccer comment. Our HS has a solid soccer program. Varsity is stacked with ECNL, GA, etc players. But we also have a pretty big roster.
At our game on Thursday, only about 14 of the 22 rostered players saw the field. Would those 8 other players be better off skipping HS and training with their club (assuming these 8 players want to play in college).

 

[Carlsbad7]

I'm sure those PhD eggheads think that colleges are founded to educate their students or something like that.

Education shouldn't be limited to books. The skills and tactics learned from working in a + on a team are just as important as what's taught in class.

Also they should serve beer in the stands.

 

[whatithink]

Quick HS soccer comment. Our HS has a solid soccer program. Varsity is stacked with ECNL, GA, etc players. But we also have a pretty big roster.
At our game on Thursday, only about 14 of the 22 rostered players saw the field. Would those 8 other players be better off skipping HS and training with their club (assuming these 8 players want to play in college).

If the team is that stacked, wouldn't they be better off practicing with all those (better than them) ECNL/GA players and trying to get a starting slot, versus practicing with a few club players in meaningless sessions.

For ref, my son's HS team is pretty stacked with letter league players and he's said that practices are more intense than club as everyone is always trying to be a starter and/or max. minutes. His club team would prob. beat his HS team, but he gets more out of the HS practices. Its the opposite to what the club coaches tell him/me - in his instance only, I'm sure others have very different experiences.

 

[Kicker 2.0]

If the team is that stacked, wouldn't they be better off practicing with all those (better than them) ECNL/GA players and trying to get a starting slot, versus practicing with a few club players in meaningless sessions.

That would depend on the quality of training offered at the HS versus Club sessions.

For reference, my DD and 2 of her friends essentially run the HS training sessions. No offense to my DD, but it’s pretty safe to assume the Club sessions are a bit more challenging.

Conversly, the Boys Varsity sessions are very well run and would say on par or better than current Club sessions.

 

[whatithink]

That would depend on the quality of training offered at the HS versus Club sessions.

For reference, my DD and 2 of her friends essentially run the HS training sessions. No offense to my DD, but it’s pretty safe to assume the Club sessions are a bit more challenging.

Agreed. Generally, from what I've seen, its a combo of a coach that knows what they are doing and kids that want to max what they get. In this instance, if the team is that loaded, I'd expect the second to be a given.

 

[espola]

Education shouldn't be limited to books. The skills and tactics learned from working in a + on a team are just as important as what's taught in class.

Also they should serve beer in the stands.

I agree with the teamwork (and beer!). However, there is something mildly corrupt about those situations where the football coach is the highest-paid employee of the college (and in most states, the highest paid public employee in the state).

College coaches dominate list of highest-paid public employees with seven-digit salaries

College sports are major revenue engines at American schools, and coaches are often well compensated to maintain winning programs.

www.usatoday.com

 

[Ellejustus]

I agree with the teamwork (and beer!). However, there is something mildly corrupt about those situations where the football coach is the highest-paid employee of the college (and in most states, the highest paid public employee in the state).

College coaches dominate list of highest-paid public employees with seven-digit salaries

College sports are major revenue engines at American schools, and coaches are often well compensated to maintain winning programs.

www.usatoday.com

Let's get back to the Goose and why HS gave away all the gold that soccer can bring.

 

[Kicker 2.0]

Let's get back to the Goose and why HS gave away all the gold that soccer can bring.

How many professional games do you watch on a weekly basis? Premier League, La Liga, MLS, NWSL, WSL (Women’s Super League)?

what “gold” is being given away if no one is watching?

That is the biggest travesty….so many complaining about the state of the game and “pay to play” but don’t watch the games on TV/Streaming, go to games, shop their sponsors or buy Merch to financially support the game. Yet want all the benefits.

 

[Jar!23]

Quick HS soccer comment. Our HS has a solid soccer program. Varsity is stacked with ECNL, GA, etc players. But we also have a pretty big roster.
At our game on Thursday, only about 14 of the 22 rostered players saw the field. Would those 8 other players be better off skipping HS and training with their club (assuming these 8 players want to play in college).

Is the big roster common? Does the coach tell players who won't play in advance not to dress or are they expected to still show and sit on the bench? Trying to learn about high school soccer since I have a middle schooler.