Soccer gave away the golden goose to other sports at high school

[blam]

Never mind about how to improve soccer. You can always find faults if you look hard enough.

I think many of you are not questioning the other side of the coin.

Football is practically a sport on life support for children at the time my kid entered elementary school many years ago. Throughout my years, I barely seen any kid playing football on the fields. The number of soccer players far exceeds the number of football players.

Suddenly, at high school, football (which barely anyone played) suddenly became the most important sport friday night sport where the whole school attends. Why and how?

Unfortunately, our teens are too uncritical and just swallow up whatever comes their way by the school admin and tradition. If I were a student president, I would put to a vote on which sport gets to use the stadium on Friday night Fall-Spring.

I can already see how this high school tradition will groom them into NFL fans where they will attend because everyone in the neighbourhood is attending...although they themselves never played the game. They just watch it on the sofa with a beer on their right hand.

 

[dk_b]

Never mind about how to improve soccer. You can always find faults if you look hard enough.

I think many of you are not questioning the other side of the coin.

Football is practically a sport on life support for children at the time my kid entered elementary school many years ago. Throughout my years, I barely seen any kid playing football on the fields. The number of soccer players far exceeds the number of football players.

Suddenly, at high school, football (which barely anyone played) suddenly became the most important sport friday night sport where the whole school attends. Why and how?

Unfortunately, our teens are too uncritical and just swallow up whatever comes their way by the school admin and tradition. If I were a student president, I would put to a vote on which sport gets to use the stadium on Friday night Fall-Spring.

I can already see how this high school tradition will groom them into NFL fans where they will attend because everyone in the neighbourhood is attending...although they themselves never played the game. They just watch it on the sofa with a beer on their right hand.

There is nothing new about this - growing up in the 70s and 80s, a large number of us played soccer and then switched to American football once we started HS. And watching HS football was a community event unlike other HS sports. The HS soccer games I have attended since about 2012 or so (my oldest soccer player started HS in 2016) have decent support, especially the games after the holiday break. A lot more attend than attended back in the 80s. Is it like HS football? I doubt it but I have only been to a couple of football games in that time. But it is still a community gathering event and I see a lot of students watching. I don't hear anyone complaining although I know that a lot of the boys and girls who play soccer wish they could watch each others' games - that has only happened a couple of times since they are usually at opposite home/road or road/home venues)

(FWIW: I have watched NFL football since I was a tiny guy, attended most Niner home games from the late 70s until about 1997 and watched a ton of games on TV (I used to be a much bigger fan than I am now). I can count the total number of beers I have consumed while watching NFL games for those nearly 50 years and I still would not run out of fingers)

 

[Grace T.]

Never mind about how to improve soccer. You can always find faults if you look hard enough.

I think many of you are not questioning the other side of the coin.

Football is practically a sport on life support for children at the time my kid entered elementary school many years ago. Throughout my years, I barely seen any kid playing football on the fields. The number of soccer players far exceeds the number of football players.

Suddenly, at high school, football (which barely anyone played) suddenly became the most important sport friday night sport where the whole school attends. Why and how?

Unfortunately, our teens are too uncritical and just swallow up whatever comes their way by the school admin and tradition. If I were a student president, I would put to a vote on which sport gets to use the stadium on Friday night Fall-Spring.

I can already see how this high school tradition will groom them into NFL fans where they will attend because everyone in the neighbourhood is attending...although they themselves never played the game. They just watch it on the sofa with a beer on their right hand.

With football though there isn’t an issue picking up the sport. With the exception of the qb (which at the higher level schools have been recruited to attend those schools and have been playing since grade school 7v7 league), mostly it’s about physical form…you just need really fast athletes (who you can teach to catch) or really big ones (which you can teach to tackle and hold) or both (to cover the receivers and look for the interception. Soccer takes a lot more technical work. You can’t even throw the super athletic track kid in there. Basketball is somewhere in between.

 

[Socal-Soccer-Dad]

Once upon a time, many many years ago, I was at Oceanside for a soccer tournament for the very first time. It was a sunny Saturday morning. The parking lots were filled. So many American kids were playing soccer. And I thought to myself, man...if this continues, soccer will be the number 1 sport in America in less than 20 years...so many kids love soccer and are actually playing it. Compare that to American football where there just aren't many players playing football. Looks like football has a bleak future..I envisioned American football on life support....the same way I saw tennis.

Many years passed and then my kids went to high school.

Then came the first stab...Soccer at high school is a winter sport.

Soccer at high school is a winter sport!!!!????
That means spectators have to stand in the freezing cold?
How do you expect marching bands to come to the games to cheer the local soccer team in the winter?
How do you expect cheerleaders to come and cheer on the soccer team?
How do you expect parents to come cheer their kids? Wrapped in blankets???? And yes! I saw parents coming wrapped in blankets!

The next stab came when one day, my kids who never showed any interest in American football said they were going to watch their high school team play football. Obviously they were going for the social aspects of it. Neither of them had watched a football game on TV (not even superbowl) or shown any interest when they were young. At school, marching bands were there, cheerleaders were there, the crowds were there....like a phoenix rising from the ashes, American football is back!

The question then is what happened to soccer? Why did it get relegated? It got killed the instance it became a winter sport. Soccer needs to be a fall sport or a spring sport. We need to bring on the marching bands, the cheerleaders and the crowds to the games. There needs to be more pom pom.

Some of you may think its impossible but take a bigger picture. In the rest of the world, we also have a game very similar to American football called rugby. And when it comes to soccer vs rugby, soccer wins by a HUGE margin.

Do you think it'll change (a renaissance of soccer in America) after 2026?

 

[blam]

Do you think it'll change (a renaissance of soccer in America) after 2026?

I dont believe it will change if it is not changing now.

The main reason I see football being played on Fridays with Marching Bands and cheerleaders, the entire school cheering and it being a community event as pointed out by dk_b, is that it is out of tradition.

Its not because more people are playing football vs soccer. I have driven by many fields during my time in San Diego, and I have seen more adults and kids play soccer. I have barely seen any adults or kids play football, or flag football. If anyone want to challenge me on this observation, I would be glad to open a new thread.

If we can all agree that more people play soccer vs football, then we ought to challenge this tradition. Why are we not questioning the status quo?

 

[LouSag]

I have watched HS Soccer for four years. First off, the quality of play is different for each league. Awful is a complete put down on all the players who play HSS. Secondly and lastly, your post is awful!!! Hey Blam, this happens every year about HSS so get used to it. I love watching kids play for their HS team and yes, Winter soccer is lame!!!

The complete lack of college coaches at HS soccer matches speaks volumes.
Leadership opportunities, social relationships, playing for your school and possibly playing a different position are positives of the HS soccer experience. Quality of play is not a positive. Avoiding a major injury is of prime importance. As u mentioned, the referees are sub-par. Please enjoy watching your daughter play HS soccer, but the quality of play/tactics/majority of the coaching is substandard.
And that is why a large percentage of top players skip it.

 

[espola]

The complete lack of college coaches at HS soccer matches speaks volumes.
Leadership opportunities, social relationships, playing for your school and possibly playing a different position are positives of the HS soccer experience. Quality of play is not a positive. Avoiding a major injury is of prime importance. As u mentioned, the referees are sub-par. Please enjoy watching your daughter play HS soccer, but the quality of play/tactics/majority of the coaching is substandard.
And that is why a large percentage of top players skip it.

Experiences differ. I have seen college coaches at high school games. Many of the high school coaches I know are also club coaches. Most of the referees I have seen at high school games also work club games; some of them (I have been told but I have no personal knowledge) also work college games. As for the level of play, what standard are you expecting that you can judge some play is substandard?

 

[crush]

Lou's take on how awful HSS is and then Crush's take after. Jim Rome came around so maybe sweet Lou can too I love this stuff btw. Welcome to the forum. Is your dd playing High Dessert League? Blythe? Yucca Valley? 29 Palms? I love all those places btw but it's very hard to find a coach willing to live out there. My pal coached at Yucca years ago

LS: The complete lack of college coaches at HS soccer matches speaks volumes.
C: I have seen one college coache at my dd games this year and three last year. I agree 'most' college coaches do not watch HSS and will not drive far away to watch a HSS match

LS: Leadership opportunities, social relationships, playing for your school and possibly playing a different position are positives of the HS soccer experience.
C: 100% agree

LS: Quality of play is not a positive.
C: At your dd HS, yes. I saw lot's of quality play this past weekend in the Newport Beach/West Coast Classic.

LS: Avoiding a major injury is of prime importance.
C: 100% agree, as is anytime a athlete plays a sport. I have yet to see a torn ACL ((knock on wood)) in HSS match. I have witnessed with my own eyes over 9 torn ACLs in last 6 years in club. I have heard of many many more the the 9, including on this message board.

LS: As u mentioned, the referees are sub-par.
C: Ref's are not sub-par. Maybe have a few here good ones here and there but it's a big part of the problem with players not stopping and just go through the players after missing the ball completely.

LS: Please enjoy watching your daughter play HS soccer.
C: It's the most fun I have, no joke. I like watching the kids play for their local home town school. Our students come out, as does the community during League and CIF playoffs, if we make it. I need to see if the band will come.

LS: Quality of play/tactics/majority of the coaching is substandard.
C: I guess that's what's happening at your kids school. You need to find a top local coach who knows the game and then find students who want to represent the school. With your attitude Lou, no way it will work at your kids school.

LS: Large percentage of top players skip it.
C: Yes, at your kids schools and I guess some other awful schools with awful coaches and substandard standards for the soccer program. @ My dd kids school, all the top club players are playing. In fact Lou, this was Normal in all HS's before GDA took over and tried to kill HSS. Trust me, they put it on life support. HSS has been a blessing for my dd and she has learned so much. ECNL has been a great learning place as well.

Merry Christmas Lou Sag

 

[socalkdg]

The main reason I see football being played on Fridays with Marching Bands and cheerleaders, the entire school cheering and it being a community event as pointed out by dk_b, is that it is out of tradition.

Some schools are more know for their Marching band then they are for their football team. Know a couple schools that finish 2-7 but their band is award winning, even going to the Rose Parade.

By the way, 55 degrees for a 6 or 7 pm game isn't that cold to watch soccer. We are just spoiled by warm weather here.

 

[blam]

By the way, 55 degrees for a 6 or 7 pm game isn't that cold to watch soccer. We are just spoiled by warm weather here.

Sure. Its not too cold to watch football either. The quesiton is why soccer gave away the prime time slot to football when by nearly every measure, the participation rate, the interest among students if not for tradition? Is it not time to question the status quo and break from tradition?

 

[espola]

Some schools are more know for their Marching band then they are for their football team. Know a couple schools that finish 2-7 but their band is award winning, even going to the Rose Parade.

By the way, 55 degrees for a 6 or 7 pm game isn't that cold to watch soccer. We are just spoiled by warm weather here.

Marching band theme that was rejected -- death scenes from 19th-century Italian operas. I figured it to be a winner.

 

[twoclubpapa]

By the way, 55 degrees for a 6 or 7 pm game isn't that cold to watch soccer. We are just spoiled by warm weather here.

So true! Last week with game temperatures in the mid-50s I was laughing about my complaints about the "cold weather" while remembering 54 years ago I was walking to an 8am class in 26 degrees below zero temperatures. I did have the advantage last week of keeping warm by running around on the field while the spectators in the stadium were bundled up in heavy jackets and blankets.

 

[watfly]

Sure. Its not too cold to watch football either. The quesiton is why soccer gave away the prime time slot to football when by nearly every measure, the participation rate, the interest among students if not for tradition? Is it not time to question the status quo and break from tradition?

High school football is more social event than sporting event (at most schools). Plus participation doesn't equal interest. A lot of people understand/appreciate football that don't play it, most American's that don't play soccer tend to not understand it, i.e. can't appreciate game play other than a goal.

 

[LouSag]

Lou's take on how awful HSS is and then Crush's take after. Jim Rome came around so maybe sweet Lou can too I love this stuff btw. Welcome to the forum. Is your dd playing High Dessert League? Blythe? Yucca Valley? 29 Palms? I love all those places btw but it's very hard to find a coach willing to live out there. My pal coached at Yucca years ago

LS: The complete lack of college coaches at HS soccer matches speaks volumes.
C: I have seen one college coache at my dd games this year and three last year. I agree 'most' college coaches do not watch HSS and will not drive far away to watch a HSS match

LS: Leadership opportunities, social relationships, playing for your school and possibly playing a different position are positives of the HS soccer experience.
C: 100% agree

LS: Quality of play is not a positive.
C: At your dd HS, yes. I saw lot's of quality play this past weekend in the Newport Beach/West Coast Classic.

LS: Avoiding a major injury is of prime importance.
C: 100% agree, as is anytime a athlete plays a sport. I have yet to see a torn ACL ((knock on wood)) in HSS match. I have witnessed with my own eyes over 9 torn ACLs in last 6 years in club. I have heard of many many more the the 9, including on this message board.

LS: As u mentioned, the referees are sub-par.
C: Ref's are not sub-par. Maybe have a few here good ones here and there but it's a big part of the problem with players not stopping and just go through the players after missing the ball completely.

LS: Please enjoy watching your daughter play HS soccer.
C: It's the most fun I have, no joke. I like watching the kids play for their local home town school. Our students come out, as does the community during League and CIF playoffs, if we make it. I need to see if the band will come.

LS: Quality of play/tactics/majority of the coaching is substandard.
C: I guess that's what's happening at your kids school. You need to find a top local coach who knows the game and then find students who want to represent the school. With your attitude Lou, no way it will work at your kids school.

LS: Large percentage of top players skip it.
C: Yes, at your kids schools and I guess some other awful schools with awful coaches and substandard standards for the soccer program. @ My dd kids school, all the top club players are playing. In fact Lou, this was Normal in all HS's before GDA took over and tried to kill HSS. Trust me, they put it on life support. HSS has been a blessing for my dd and she has learned so much. ECNL has been a great learning place as well.

Merry Christmas Lou Sag

Merry Christmas to you too.
I watched both weekends of the Best of the West Newport tournament. Top flight CIF. I stand by all my comments. As a comparison, there were numerous coaches at the GA event the previous weekend at Silverlakes. Didn’t see a single college coach at the Newport event.
My HS reference point is club soccer (ECNL level) vs HS. You can throw barbs at my kids school all you want. She plays for a top CIF school and a top ECNL club. The difference in quality of play is wide.
Looks like you agree with many my points…except your flip flop on the referees. A few days ago you were preaching for the referees to “get the cards out early” to protect players. Does that apply to ECNL/GA games too?
I enjoy the debate with you, but you will never convince me that HS soccer quality is the equivalent of ECNL. A mid-table ECNL side would win CIF if given the chance.

 

[crush]

Merry Christmas to you too.
I watched both weekends of the Best of the West Newport tournament. Top flight CIF. I stand by all my comments. As a comparison, there were numerous coaches at the GA event the previous weekend at Silverlakes. Didn’t see a single college coach at the Newport event.
My HS reference point is club soccer (ECNL level) vs HS. You can throw barbs at my kids school all you want. She plays for a top CIF school and a top ECNL club. The difference in quality of play is wide.
Looks like you agree with many my points…except your flip flop on the referees. A few days ago you were preaching for the referees to “get the cards out early” to protect players. Does that apply to ECNL/GA games too?
I enjoy the debate with you, but you will never convince me that HS soccer quality is the equivalent of ECNL. A mid-table ECNL side would win CIF if given the chance.

I never said HSS is better quality then the Elite Club National League. Never ever did I, did I? You said in a blanket kind of a way that hss is awful. I took issue with that because now your saying in a way that the girls are awful and that's not fair. Most teams only have a few ecnl girls and maybe a ga and other travel club players. The others want to play soccer as a community, like the top club in Europe does. Take back awful and just say, "HSS is not on par with ECNL level play." That is true.

 

[GoldenGate]

I dont believe it will change if it is not changing now.

The main reason I see football being played on Fridays with Marching Bands and cheerleaders, the entire school cheering and it being a community event as pointed out by dk_b, is that it is out of tradition.

Its not because more people are playing football vs soccer. I have driven by many fields during my time in San Diego, and I have seen more adults and kids play soccer. I have barely seen any adults or kids play football, or flag football. If anyone want to challenge me on this observation, I would be glad to open a new thread.

If we can all agree that more people play soccer vs football, then we ought to challenge this tradition. Why are we not questioning the status quo?

Because 99% of boys' HS soccer is unwatchable. HS boys soccer is a terrible, awful spectator sport. Hardly anyone watches boys' HS soccer for the same reason you would never spend your Friday night watching high school kids play lacrosse, rugby, cross country, tennis or chess unless one of them is your kid. HS boys' soccer is dull and it is being played terribly. There is nothing pretty about it no matter how much soccer people keep calling it the "beautiful game" as if it's better than any other sport, which it is not. In reality, although it can be fun to watch at the very highest levels (which do not exist in the US), it is a terrible ugly sport when it is not, which makes it much less fun to watch than most any other sport at the HS level. On the other hand, football and basketball are often fun to watch even when they aren't being played at a very high level. There is often compelling drama in those sports that doesn't exist when a bunch of kids who usually aren't very popular or athletic are passing a ball around the back and/or playing boot ball for what seems like an eternity.

College football and soccer are both played the same seasons and often on same days, yet everyone watches football and no one watches soccer. This happens because football because it is fun to watch and soccer is still insufferable at the college level.

 

[crush]

I never said HSS is better quality then the Elite Club National League. Never ever did I, did I? You said in a blanket kind of a way that hss is awful. I took issue with that because now your saying in a way that the girls are awful and that's not fair. Most teams only have a few ecnl girls and maybe a ga and other travel club players. The others want to play soccer as a community, like the top club in Europe does. Take back awful and just say, "HSS is not on par with ECNL level play." That is true.

P.S Lou, I don't think all the teams were trying to won this Classic. No way. Playing two games in one day is not good. I believe most brought up JV players and hoped they had enough players to play because of Winter break. Is this your first year watching hss?

 

[blam]

College football and soccer are both played the same seasons and often on same days, yet everyone watches football and no one watches soccer. This happens because football because it is fun to watch and soccer is still insufferable at the college level.

What a person finds fun to watch is determined by the culture, the upbringing, the environment and it is not an objective fact. I will give you a point that what you say is valid for most people who had some kind of upbringing where they grew up watching football. However, I would challenge the assumption that football is more fun to watch as an objective fact and not just a matter of taste. The rest of the world can be an example in soccer vs rugby.

Like musical taste, you may think rock is the best music out there but it can be a ear sore for the younger generation who were never groomed to like that type of music.

Soccer can be more fun to watch than football. Its a matter of a person's environment, upbringing, experience, culture all playing a role to determine what he/she likes and enjoys watching more. Why then do we decide for the teenagers that they would enjoy watching football more than soccer and give the golden goose away to football? Do we not want this to change?

 

[oh canada]

And that is why a large percentage of top players skip it.

Almost every ecnl girl we know plays for their high school (O.C.). Your view may be skewed by your club's strongarm policy? Is it Surf?

 

[lafalafa]

HS and college sports are what the player, teams, coaches, make of it.

Some schools and programs have good turnouts others not so much. HS can have more attendance and better fields vs some colleges depending on which division and university.

Local scouts regularly show up at the post season for the CIF playoffs, there where plenty of college coaches around, some academy, some forgien. Every year by kids played there where scouts, our youngest talked to 3 different ones at one of his 2nd round game this year for example.

Soccer is the USA is still way behind football, basketball and baseball/softball and likely will never catch those three from a financial standpoint.

For the causal observer soccer is a boring sport to watch like golf. Just not enough action or scoring to get people excited much. HS, College, MLS can be hard to watch if you're a soccer purist. When there is something to play for like in the post season some excite me can be brought but for regular season games yeah not so much.

Every players journey is different some think the letter leagues help them get noticed more while others play locally for their HS or fringe leagues like UPSL and they can be recuited from those as well so it's no one sized fits all. The galaxy academy put together a u19 showcase team for the NEXT event in Norco that was made up of mostly UPSL players and they went undefeated and didn't give up a goal.