Game fixing

There certainly is some strategy and game planning involved, but calling it game fixing is quite the stretch. both teams just needed a tie, they earned the right to be in that position.
happens at all levels. remember the portugal/croatia match in the recent euros? yeah probably not, because portugal ended up winning it all and nobody cares how they did it.
that being said it would be hard to believe that the players did this on their own and the game "just fell that way", coaches are always in charge. No doubt the 2nd stringers would have loved to show off their goods while the 1s were being rested.
 
Doesn't "match fixing" usually involve gambling? Unless somebody had money betting that there would be a tie, then I think the term "matching fixing" or collusion are not the right terms here.
 
dfbmike said:
There certainly is some strategy and game planning involved, but calling it game fixing is quite the stretch. both teams just needed a tie, they earned the right to be in that position.
happens at all levels. remember the portugal/croatia match in the recent euros? yeah probably not, because portugal ended up winning it all and nobody cares how they did it.
that being said it would be hard to believe that the players did this on their own and the game "just fell that way", coaches are always in charge. No doubt the 2nd stringers would have loved to show off their goods while the 1s were being rested.
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One correction that seems minor but is actually very important. Neither team needed a tie. Carlsbad didn't need anything. They could have lost by a hundred and Carlsbad was still going through. Ambassadors didn't need a tie either. They simply needed to not lose by more than 3. At the start of the game, actually, the goal differential that 3rd place Syracuse needed to make up to go through was 7 goals. Syracuse got 3 of those goals on their own, but how could they expect a totally unmotivated Carlsbad team to make up the other 4 for them when Carlsbad was resting for the semis? Carlsbad's play in the first 2 games afforded them the right to simply rest. So what's the coaches' and teams' obligations here? To look out for their team and do what's in the team's best interest and the health of their players? Or look out for "the optics of the game?"

Had this game been reported correctly from the outset, this would never have been a story. "Watch two teams that are already through to the semi finals affect nothing in the tournament as they smartly rest their players in 110 degree heat."
 
LA Galaxy SD - GK Dad said:
One correction that seems minor but is actually very important. Neither team needed a tie. Carlsbad didn't need anything. They could have lost by a hundred and Carlsbad was still going through. Ambassadors didn't need a tie either. They simply needed to not lose by more than 3. At the start of the game, actually, the goal differential that 3rd place Syracuse needed to make up to go through was 7 goals. Syracuse got 3 of those goals on their own, but how could they expect a totally unmotivated Carlsbad team to make up the other 4 for them when Carlsbad was resting for the semis? Carlsbad's play in the first 2 games afforded them the right to simply rest. So what's the coaches' and teams' obligations here? To look out for their team and do what's in the team's best interest and the health of their players? Or look out for "the optics of the game?"

Had this game been reported correctly from the outset, this would never have been a story. "Watch two teams that are already through to the semi finals affect nothing in the tournament as they smartly rest their players in 110 degree heat."
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not at all disagreeing with you...non issue to me
 
LA Galaxy SD - GK Dad said:
One correction that seems minor but is actually very important. Neither team needed a tie. Carlsbad didn't need anything. They could have lost by a hundred and Carlsbad was still going through. Ambassadors didn't need a tie either. They simply needed to not lose by more than 3. At the start of the game, actually, the goal differential that 3rd place Syracuse needed to make up to go through was 7 goals. Syracuse got 3 of those goals on their own, but how could they expect a totally unmotivated Carlsbad team to make up the other 4 for them when Carlsbad was resting for the semis? Carlsbad's play in the first 2 games afforded them the right to simply rest. So what's the coaches' and teams' obligations here? To look out for their team and do what's in the team's best interest and the health of their players? Or look out for "the optics of the game?"

Had this game been reported correctly from the outset, this would never have been a story. "Watch two teams that are already through to the semi finals affect nothing in the tournament as they smartly rest their players in 110 degree heat."
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I guess you missing the most important point in all this - Spirit and Fairness of the GAME. Nobody cares about the end result or who needed what to advance. There are plenty options for the coach to rest his/her starters. I'm sure both teams had at least 18 players there and few of them don't get to play much in a REAL competitive game, so why not let them play? It's not about this at all, it's about the GAME itself. It was disrespectful to the GAME to come on the field and have this kind of circus. I don't believe for a second that it was initiated by the players without coaches being involved. Don't start throwing excuses - it was hot, it means nothing, resting players....Nonsense. This was the worst I've seen, and I've seen quite of few games at very different levels.
I coach myself and have been in exactly the same situations few times - 2 teams advancing anyway and the game don't matter, besides who is first or second. However, not for a second it crossed my mind that I will let my players perform this kind of spectacle. Normally in games like this, I let players play in different positions, work on certain things... few things I can think of. Using another game to get ready for the next without any pressure - perfect scenario for any coach. However your coach, and I'm guessing other team coach, decided to put up the side show....It's just wrong on all counts.
 
Eagle33 said:
I guess you missing the most important point in all this - Spirit and Fairness of the GAME. Nobody cares about the end result or who needed what to advance. There are plenty options for the coach to rest his/her starters. I'm sure both teams had at least 18 players there and few of them don't get to play much in a REAL competitive game, so why not let them play? It's not about this at all, it's about the GAME itself. It was disrespectful to the GAME to come on the field and have this kind of circus. I don't believe for a second that it was initiated by the players without coaches being involved. Don't start throwing excuses - it was hot, it means nothing, resting players....Nonsense. This was the worst I've seen, and I've seen quite of few games at very different levels.
I coach myself and have been in exactly the same situations few times - 2 teams advancing anyway and the game don't matter, besides who is first or second. However, not for a second it crossed my mind that I will let my players perform this kind of spectacle. Normally in games like this, I let players play in different positions, work on certain things... few things I can think of. Using another game to get ready for the next without any pressure - perfect scenario for any coach. However your coach, and I'm guessing other team coach, decided to put up the side show....It's just wrong on all counts.
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Well said. It defies logic to think that some are "ok" with what took place on that field.

I am trying to think of comparisons but even those are difficult to come up with - without being completely outlandish.

I'll give it a try none the less.
  • Last game of NBA season - Lakers vs Clippers - both teams already in playoffs - playoff seeds set - Kobe (or 10th guy on the bench) and CP3 (or 10th guy on the bench) pass back and forth for 48 minutes...this would NEVER happen
  • Last game of NFL season - Cowboys vs Giants - Cowboys are in playoffs and Giants are not - Romo hands off to running back who falls down 3 times - punt - Eli hands off to running back who falls down 3 times - punt...this would NEVER happen.
  • Last game of NHL season - Blues vs Sharks - Blues locked in a #3 seed and Sharks at #5 seed - puck drops - no one skates - pass back and forth - game over...this would NEVER happen
In reality this argument is going in circles and I don't see either side changing their opinion. However, no one with a competitive bone in their body would advocate for making a mockery of their sport.

I guess karma came back to bite both these teams - maybe that match broke a decent rhythm that each team had, maybe it didn't. In the end, I think most are glad neither one of these teams won the tournament.
 
texanincali said:
Well said. It defies logic to think that some are "ok" with what took place on that field.

I am trying to think of comparisons but even those are difficult to come up with - without being completely outlandish.

I'll give it a try none the less.
  • Last game of NBA season - Lakers vs Clippers - both teams already in playoffs - playoff seeds set - Kobe (or 10th guy on the bench) and CP3 (or 10th guy on the bench) pass back and forth for 48 minutes...this would NEVER happen
  • Last game of NFL season - Cowboys vs Giants - Cowboys are in playoffs and Giants are not - Romo hands off to running back who falls down 3 times - punt - Eli hands off to running back who falls down 3 times - punt...this would NEVER happen.
  • Last game of NHL season - Blues vs Sharks - Blues locked in a #3 seed and Sharks at #5 seed - puck drops - no one skates - pass back and forth - game over...this would NEVER happen
In reality this argument is going in circles and I don't see either side changing their opinion. However, no one with a competitive bone in their body would advocate for making a mockery of their sport.

I guess karma came back to bite both these teams - maybe that match broke a decent rhythm that each team had, maybe it didn't. In the end, I think most are glad neither one of these teams won the tournament.
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Not a good comparison of 18 year old girls -vs- professional teams with Vegas odds and legal gambling.
 
Eagle33 said:
...It's just wrong on all counts.
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Just asking you what I asked another poster - and got no answer. Two parts.
Given - no laws or rules were broken...

1 What would you do about what happened?

2 How would you justify your sanctions?
 
The funniest thing about this whole game is all of the trolls here, that had nothing to do with the game that was played, complaining. Sounds like a lot of people with hidden agendas. The true issue was that they were even holding the game in that heat. Kudos to both teams in finding a legal way to expend as little energy as possible while still advancing.
 
texanincali said:
So professional teams are required to actually play - but only because of betting lines?
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I expect because they are professionals and paid to play.

I also expect if they did this and won the tournament they would be hailed as heroes.
 
Zoro said:
I expect because they are professionals and paid to play.

I also expect if they did this and won the tournament they would be hailed as heroes.
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You are quite obviously a WUM and quite honestly it is like debating my 6 year old about politics.

The fact that you saw nothing wrong with the way that match played out, quite frankly, speaks volumes about you. Also, the fact that you are at all involved in this game, especially at the youth level is quite worrisome.

Good day.
 
It happens when your kid or the win is more important than the game, morality, right and wrong, truth, fairness, and sportmanship. It happens when God becomes god and the blind lead the blind.
 
texanincali said:
You are quite obviously a WUM and quite honestly it is like debating my 6 year old about politics.

The fact that you saw nothing wrong with the way that match played out, quite frankly, speaks volumes about you. Also, the fact that you are at all involved in this game, especially at the youth level is quite worrisome.

Good day.
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What is a WUM?
 
Not quite sure how one's playing style (within rules) is now about morality, right and wrong...
 
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I kick the ball down the field, and people complain because I don't pass enough.

My teammates and I pass the ball 64 times, and people complain because we don't kick the ball down the field enough.
 
Zoro said:
Not quite sure how one's playing style (within rules) is now about morality, right and wrong...
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It obviously goes against the spirit of the game as evidenced by USYS statement

"US Youth Soccer will review its policies and make any necessary alterations to ensure this type of display doesn’t happen in the future". That's the BS the academy is trying to do away with.
 
How many people on this forum were the ones hauling themselves up and down the field in the Texas heat? Our kids play too many games, and tournaments put those games too close together. Through strong play the two previous days, the 17 and 18 year old players that actually were on the field had put themselves into a position where the game was meaningless to them. They also probably know more about the game of soccer than most of those posting. Those who were not on the field yet still feel the need to denigrate those who were should maybe get a life and move along.
 
outside! said:
How many people on this forum were the ones hauling themselves up and down the field in the Texas heat? Our kids play too many games, and tournaments put those games too close together. Through strong play the two previous days, the 17 and 18 year old players that actually were on the field had put themselves into a position where the game was meaningless to them. They also probably know more about the game of soccer than most of those posting. Those who were not on the field yet still feel the need to denigrate those who were should maybe get a life and move along.
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You make a good point. When these girls go away to college next year, they will NEVER again play 2 or 3 games in a day. And I don't think they'll ever play a game on back to back days.
Sure, it's cool to crown a "champion" but why do we expect "kids" to be able to perform at their peak across 3 games in 24-48 hours when we don't ask the same of adults.
 
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