GA departures

Goforgoal said:
I'm not sure why you think it's strange. The GA has holes to fill in the SW with the conference reshuffling and I guessed Murrieta Surf would be one of the clubs added. It makes sense geographically. I think SD Force is a likely addition as well, although this would make less geographic sense with SDSC literally sharing the one of their practice facilities. These club announcements likely won't blow anyone's minds but it is what it is at this point.
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This is a great move for GA. They have to start somewhere but expansion is critical for them to survive. That area is growing significantly and they will have a pipeline for kids looking for a challenge. They need a couple of more clubs in other areas to fill the geographic gap. As an example, we see so many kids from North OC driving to the great park to be part of the ECNL program.
 
SoccerFan4Life said:
This is a great move for GA. They have to start somewhere but expansion is critical for them to survive. That area is growing significantly and they will have a pipeline for kids looking for a challenge. They need a couple of more clubs in other areas to fill the geographic gap. As an example, we see so many kids from North OC driving to the great park to be part of the ECNL program.
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I don't know if its "critical" for GA to bring on a bunch of teams to survive. Quantity and Quality you need a mix of both.

But, I'm sure the GA bean counters prefer Quantity over Quality.
 
Carlsbad7 said:
I don't know if its "critical" for GA to bring on a bunch of teams to survive. Quantity and Quality you need a mix of both.

But, I'm sure the GA bean counters prefer Quantity over Quality.
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No reason for the snub. GA looked at things and decided that critical mass and shorter travel are important. ECNL made the same call. They're both right.
 
Calikid said:
My DD plays in the GA and we have had a very nice expiernece. Florida was fantastic and the girls and the parents had a great time! We moved form ECNL to GA because my daughter wanted to play for a specific coach. Best move we have ever made!
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Even though the jury is still out on the GA, their first year went as well as it could. Their hasn't been a disruption in access to NCAA/YNT coaches/scouts for those top clubs that remained in the GA. The newer clubs will attract talent - not enough room in ECNL for all of the talent to consolidate. The administration of the league has been efficient and their hiring of key corporate positions has been done deliberately and strategically.

Many parents knowingly took the "risk" and stayed in clubs that were not allowed back into ECNL. In AZ specifically, arguably the best girl's club, retained most of their players, even with another club being let back in to ECNL. We will see what happens in a few years, as players age out and go on about their way.

In a state like AZ, two leagues and 4 teams are too many and dilutes the talent. Parents know this and will likely revert to going with coaches with known results VS being attracted to leagues. Of course, coaches will tout their league as the best league. ECNL clubs in AZ will leverage their access to CA teams as the reason to join ECNL, which is smart. The other club will have to rely on their YNT/D1 placement success and known coaching commodities.

The joy of youth soccer. Pay to play is such a distraction and likely causes a lot of stress and anxiety for those involved. Great for pharma companies.
 
what-happened said:
In AZ specifically, arguably the best girl's club, retained most of their players, even with another club being let back in to ECNL. We will see what happens in a few years, as players age out and go on about their way.
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Ok, I'll bite. How did that "arguably best girls club" who's staying in GA, finish this year:

08 9th
07 4th
06 5th
05 3rd
04 4th
03 3rd

How did "another club" who's moving to ECNL finish in GA this year:

08 1st
07 1st
06 6th
05 1st
04 1st
03 2nd

Best of luck to you and your DD, and the extra unnecessary travel next year. If you think players aren't going to move to ECNL clubs in AZ, I have a dog based coin to sell you...
 
SoccerLocker said:
Ok, I'll bite. How did that "arguably best girls club" who's staying in GA, finish this year:

08 9th
07 4th
06 5th
05 3rd
04 4th
03 3rd

How did "another club" who's moving to ECNL finish in GA this year:

08 1st
07 1st
06 6th
05 1st
04 1st
03 2nd

Best of luck to you and your DD, and the extra unnecessary travel next year. If you think players aren't going to move to ECNL clubs in AZ, I have a dog based coin to sell you...
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My DD is aging out, moving on to the next level. My travel will consist of plane rides to home games, hopefully. Plenty of nuance in your post. I get it, based on points. What's wrong with the dog based coins? I appreciate your wit, it's refreshing.

08 - way too young to determine what is going on.
07 - 1 win (for the other club) 2nd game tie
06 - 1 win for arguable club, 1 tie: both games completely dominated by arguable club
05 - 1 tie, one blowout for arguable club
04 - Arguable club's team has been in rehab for 3 yrs
03 - Split the season

5 YNT players on the Arguable 06 team, 1 on the 05 and 1 on the 02/03. Plenty of girls moving on to P5 schools across the country. Utah Royals have their contingent of YNT and D1 players.

By the way, I'm not casting shade on Utah Royals. They are a much improved club that deserve their spot in ECNL and earned it by their performance in the GA. They will be the best AZ team in ECNL. If you know the history of the "other club" you would know that it's likely they would not have been asked back into ECNL even if their GA season had been perfect You probably already know this though. Whatever bridge they burned isn't going to be rebuilt.

Yes, travel is going to be different. CO and Utah may present transportation problems to some, maybe. NM and NV will not. In spite of the conference move, they still managed to pull players from other clubs during the tryout season. Its' all about the coaches. You will argue that it's about leagues. That argument can go on forever. Adjourn after next season to see how it plays out.
 
what-happened said:
Even though the jury is still out on the GA, their first year went as well as it could. Their hasn't been a disruption in access to NCAA/YNT coaches/scouts for those top clubs that remained in the GA. The newer clubs will attract talent - not enough room in ECNL for all of the talent to consolidate. The administration of the league has been efficient and their hiring of key corporate positions has been done deliberately and strategically.

Many parents knowingly took the "risk" and stayed in clubs that were not allowed back into ECNL. In AZ specifically, arguably the best girl's club, retained most of their players, even with another club being let back in to ECNL. We will see what happens in a few years, as players age out and go on about their way.

In a state like AZ, two leagues and 4 teams are too many and dilutes the talent. Parents know this and will likely revert to going with coaches with known results VS being attracted to leagues. Of course, coaches will tout their league as the best league. ECNL clubs in AZ will leverage their access to CA teams as the reason to join ECNL, which is smart. The other club will have to rely on their YNT/D1 placement success and known coaching commodities.

The joy of youth soccer. Pay to play is such a distraction and likely causes a lot of stress and anxiety for those involved. Great for pharma companies.
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SC DelSol is definitely not the best club in AZ. Several years ago they were clearly the best in AZ. They are still placing players in good programs, but the teams are slipping. They could not even field a DPL team at the 08 age, and their pre GA teams were mediocre in AZ league play. Not to mention where their GA teams finished in the standings.
 
what-happened said:
Best of luck to your DD. That is fortunate timing. For any younger team, it's an issue.

They have always been a recruitment model, with no youth program to draw from. So now, they have to convince players to move clubs to travel UT, NM, NV and CO against what's perceived to be 2nd tier competition. That's going to be quite a sales job. They are already at paper thin rosters, with no DPL strength to fall back on. Current results have been a canary in the coal mine. Any injuries and you stop winning. How long will parents want to stick that out?

P5 commitments have slowed dramatically. Yes, there were some who committed as freshmen under the old rules, and I don't fault those for sticking around, but it's been largely quiet since.

They do have 1 team (06) that is arguably the best. It's a very thin age group, and they will have to keep them together.

They did have 2 players make the virtual camps for 05s and older, but none made it beyond. Only 3 05s and 2 04s made it beyond, and all at other (ECNL) clubs.

How long can you lean on: Back in the day one of our coaches who hasn't coached in years trained senior USWNT players when there was no competition to speak of? We will find out.
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soccermom74 said:
SC DelSol is definitely not the best club in AZ. Several years ago they were clearly the best in AZ. They are still placing players in good programs, but the teams are slipping. They could not even field a DPL team at the 08 age, and their pre GA teams were mediocre in AZ league play. Not to mention where their GA teams finished in the standings.
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I'm no here to argue on behalf of Del Sol. I'll leave it up to you and others to cast shade on clubs and coaches. Unusual season for all and many teams were injury plagued, which was a common theme across all clubs in AZ. Del Sol can be polarizing and can generate plenty of hate mail.

My oldest will age out after a very good run with them and will play at the next level at a P5 program. My youngest played for them for years and wasn't selected for a DA team. We moved her to another club and league where she did make the cut. That team isn't nearly as good as where she came from and struggles at best against lower table teams.

Many parents get caught up in wins/losses at the younger age groups, many don't. Your points about DPL and AZ league play are valid. It's not their strength and their model. Their focus is always on their platform teams and recruiting away from other clubs, finding players where no one else is looking.

I guess I don't understand your downplaying of where they finished in the standings - 4 of the 6 teams finished in the top 5, 2 in the top 3.

I agree their teams may be slipping a bit, but so are all teams in AZ. It's a result of too many teams and too many leagues. It's bound to happen and it doesn't favor our players. We don't have the population to feed that many teams and leagues. Money drives the train and parents feed that train with their ego. It's unfortunate.
 
SoccerLocker said:
Ok, I'll bite. How did that "arguably best girls club" who's staying in GA, finish this year:

08 9th
07 4th
06 5th
05 3rd
04 4th
03 3rd

How did "another club" who's moving to ECNL finish in GA this year:

08 1st
07 1st
06 6th
05 1st
04 1st
03 2nd

Best of luck to you and your DD, and the extra unnecessary travel next year. If you think players aren't going to move to ECNL clubs in AZ, I have a dog based coin to sell you...
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You beat me to the punch. Of the 2 clubs in GA in AZ this year, the better club went back to ECNL. To be honest Royals are probably the best club out of the ECNL/GA clubs in AZ.

del Sol will have issues going forward at the younger ages coming in.

Parents and kids know in the SW ECNL is the stronger option. So they will go to the 3 ECNL clubs first.

del Sol also has the problem that now they are not in the SW playing So Cal teams. They are offering competition vs NM, NV, CO and UT. That competition isn't as good. The other issue? The travel for them got a lot worse considering they now have to fly to games in UT and CO.

All that adds up to them being option 4 out of the 4 clubs offering ECNL or GA.
 
SoccerLocker said:
Best of luck to your DD. That is fortunate timing. For any younger team, it's an issue.

They have always been a recruitment model, with no youth program to draw from. So now, they have to convince players to move clubs to travel UT, NM, NV and CO against what's perceived to be 2nd tier competition. That's going to be quite a sales job. They are already at paper thin rosters, with no DPL strength to fall back on. Current results have been a canary in the coal mine. Any injuries and you stop winning. How long will parents want to stick that out?

P5 commitments have slowed dramatically. Yes, there were some who committed as freshmen under the old rules, and I don't fault those for sticking around, but it's been largely quiet since.

They do have 1 team (06) that is arguably the best. It's a very thin age group, and they will have to keep them together.

They did have 2 players make the virtual camps for 05s and older, but none made it beyond. Only 3 05s and 2 04s made it beyond, and all at other (ECNL) clubs.

How long can you lean on: Back in the day one of our coaches who hasn't coached in years trained senior USWNT players when there was no competition to speak of? We will find out.
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All valid points.

They've always driven the recruitment train. The GA has to prove they are a platform that can place girls, which it appears it's going to do. They have their pitch ready to go, just like the other clubs do. They've always ran thin rosters in order to generate playing time and have never relied on DPL/2nd teams as backfill. They've always relied on moving talented players up from the younger teams. Sometimes for development, often times to fill holes until they can weather the injury storm. Parents are fickle. When injuries occur, complain about not having a bigger roster. When everyone is healthy, complain about big rosters and less playing time. 15 seems to be the magic number but many parents still complain.

This year has been an injury explosion for many of the teams (and has been an issue for the other top clubs in AZ). They've had players that have missed almost all of the season and MAY early next season. Injuries are always the wildcard. How a club manages them is important to parents.

The 05s will set the stage for future results. Where they go will help/hurt recruitment. Talented team but small this year due to injuries. The best 05 team in the state (in head to head Utah Royals). Plenty of buzz around them concerning which schools are looking at them and where they will go.

The 06s are very talented, with 3 YNT players (who went to Chula Vista last FEB) and 2 more who were invited to the virtual camp this year. They've had their injuries this year and may now be healthy. Rumor is they are sitting on an 18 player roster after tryouts, with some players coming over from other league teams. 18 players is larger than normal so who knows what the truth really is.

How long can they lean on the past? As long as other clubs do I guess. As long as the Bulls can lean on Phil and Michael. Legacy is a thing.

At the end of the day, go where your player can play and where she is happiest. Avoid the inevitable youth sports chaos and politics, put your chair by the corner flag and enjoy the time, it passes quickly.
 
Desert Hound said:
You beat me to the punch. Of the 2 clubs in GA in AZ this year, the better club went back to ECNL. To be honest Royals are probably the best club out of the ECNL/GA clubs in AZ.

del Sol will have issues going forward at the younger ages coming in.

Parents and kids know in the SW ECNL is the stronger option. So they will go to the 3 ECNL clubs first.

del Sol also has the problem that now they are not in the SW playing So Cal teams. They are offering competition vs NM, NV, CO and UT. That competition isn't as good. The other issue? The travel for them got a lot worse considering they now have to fly to games in UT and CO.

All that adds up to them being option 4 out of the 4 clubs offering ECNL or GA.
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Let's hope they have their sales pitch together. Honestly, many are flying now but not having the option to drive is not a good thing. This new travel didn't deter parents from coming over after tryouts. It may drive them out once they put it into practice for one season.

Royals are in the best position for sure.
 
what-happened said:
It's not their strength and their model. Their focus is always on their platform teams and recruiting away from other clubs, finding players where no one else is
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This is what they did.

When they had ECNL it was just del Sol and Sereno. Sereno had gotten lazy about recruiting. del Sol wasn't. They offered the top league. At the age when kids could start ECNL, the best players moved to del Sol. It was easy pickings for them. They had the best platform.

So for years they had the best teams in AZ. They got comfy with that arrangement. They on the girls sides don't have a lot of state teams anymore and the ones that they do are not good. They have a very small rec program.

Things started to change when Sereno became RSL/Royals and merged with Legacy and some other clubs in the Valley. Suddenly not all the best players were going to del Sol. Then when Rising and Arsenal got ECNL things changed. Rising usually has some of the best girls teams at the younger ages. The problem they always had was when those kids were old enough to play in ECNL the best one left for del Sol. With Rising having ECNL that pipeline is gone. With RSL/Royals having ECNL that pipeline is gone. Same with Arsenal. And those 3 clubs are now very actively recruiting non ECNL clubs...ie places where del Sol used to be the only game in town.


So they have a problem going forward. They wont get the pick of the litter anymore like they used to a few years ago. They now offer a league that parents and players know isn't as good in the SW area as ECNL. Then factor in travel...and they have problems.

People talk about coaching, etc. If del Sol had never had ECNL/DA/GA in the past, the vast vast majority of the players they had would not have moved over. The reality is that parents/kids prioritize leagues over coaching. We can all agree that a good coach is vital. But the reality is league takes priority for most people. That is simply just a fact. What del Sol is offering vs the other 3 ECNL clubs is not as good of an option marketing wise.
 
Desert Hound said:
This is what they did.

When they had ECNL it was just del Sol and Sereno. Sereno had gotten lazy about recruiting. del Sol wasn't. They offered the top league. At the age when kids could start ECNL, the best players moved to del Sol. It was easy pickings for them. They had the best platform.

So for years they had the best teams in AZ. They got comfy with that arrangement. They on the girls sides don't have a lot of state teams anymore and the ones that they do are not good. They have a very small rec program.

Things started to change when Sereno became RSL/Royals and merged with Legacy and some other clubs in the Valley. Suddenly not all the best players were going to del Sol. Then when Rising and Arsenal got ECNL things changed. Rising usually has some of the best girls teams at the younger ages. The problem they always had was when those kids were old enough to play in ECNL the best one left for del Sol. With Rising having ECNL that pipeline is gone. With RSL/Royals having ECNL that pipeline is gone. Same with Arsenal. And those 3 clubs are now very actively recruiting non ECNL clubs...ie places where del Sol used to be the only game in town.


So they have a problem going forward. They wont get the pick of the litter anymore like they used to a few years ago. They now offer a league that parents and players know isn't as good in the SW area as ECNL. Then factor in travel...and they have problems.

People talk about coaching, etc. If del Sol had never had ECNL/DA/GA in the past, the vast vast majority of the players they had would not have moved over. The reality is that parents/kids prioritize leagues over coaching. We can all agree that a good coach is vital. But the reality is league takes priority for most people. That is simply just a fact. What del Sol is offering vs the other 3 ECNL clubs is not as good of an option marketing wise.
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Great AZ takes Hound. It's not like Docs don't sell parents on the "Elitistness" of their league and why their league is the true and only pathway to greatness. When my dd was 10, Blackhawks were the top team in AZ, hands down. They played really good soccer.
 
Desert Hound said:
This is what they did.

When they had ECNL it was just del Sol and Sereno. Sereno had gotten lazy about recruiting. del Sol wasn't. They offered the top league. At the age when kids could start ECNL, the best players moved to del Sol. It was easy pickings for them. They had the best platform.

So for years they had the best teams in AZ. They got comfy with that arrangement. They on the girls sides don't have a lot of state teams anymore and the ones that they do are not good. They have a very small rec program.

Things started to change when Sereno became RSL/Royals and merged with Legacy and some other clubs in the Valley. Suddenly not all the best players were going to del Sol. Then when Rising and Arsenal got ECNL things changed. Rising usually has some of the best girls teams at the younger ages. The problem they always had was when those kids were old enough to play in ECNL the best one left for del Sol. With Rising having ECNL that pipeline is gone. With RSL/Royals having ECNL that pipeline is gone. Same with Arsenal. And those 3 clubs are now very actively recruiting non ECNL clubs...ie places where del Sol used to be the only game in town.


So they have a problem going forward. They wont get the pick of the litter anymore like they used to a few years ago. They now offer a league that parents and players know isn't as good in the SW area as ECNL. Then factor in travel...and they have problems.

People talk about coaching, etc. If del Sol had never had ECNL/DA/GA in the past, the vast vast majority of the players they had would not have moved over. The reality is that parents/kids prioritize leagues over coaching. We can all agree that a good coach is vital. But the reality is league takes priority for most people. That is simply just a fact. What del Sol is offering vs the other 3 ECNL clubs is not as good of an option marketing wise.
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Thanks for the analysis. At the end of the day, none of this is good for clubs in AZ but great for club pockets. I've been around for a while - almost too long and know the story well. What I do know is that things change in a heart beat. This year the GA re-aligns conferences based on the desire of one of their top markets. Next year could happen in ECNL. The rumblings are getting louder in CA. Why travel to AZ to play 3 teams, when we have teams down the street. Allow a few more teams in and ECNL re-aligns as well. The writing is on the wall.

Arsenal is in the worst position. They've lost a top player here and there.

I do wish them all luck. It's unfortunate that club/league greed gets in the way of providing a true top platform for our players.
 
crush said:
Great AZ takes Hound. It's not like Docs don't sell parents on the "Elitistness" of their league and why their league is the true and only pathway to greatness. When my dd was 10, Blackhawks were the top team in AZ, hands down. They played really good soccer.
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oh come on
 
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