Is US Mens/Boys Soccer Dead or Dying

I’m not talking general flag football, I’m talking high end 7 on 7. Ie premium sports, California power, Florida express

What middle school soccer teams can matchup with the athleticism of the ie ducks and oc buckeyes of the world?

What hs school soccer teams can matchup with the athleticism of bosco and mater dei?
My nephew plays te for a top 20 school. It’s very different than the soccer process. He used to be in a very high skilled sport and walked onto football in high school purely based on body type. He just got a big 10 offer despite having very little footage and having played very few minutes for his top 20 school sitting behind seniors (though he did shift to varsity as a sophomore and skipped the frosh team altogether). He does 7v 7 but no one takes the practice schedule as seriously as soccer (it’s a once a weekend thing). Very little by way of skills training. The training mostly comes in diet and straight up exercise for which he puts my soccer player to shame.

Soccer training is very iq and skill based. It requires a different kind of dedication. Yes soccer is also athletic and could benefit from the entrance of those top 20 school football athletes. But again it’s not 1 to 1. You have to knock out the lower level schools. You have to knock out those that aren’t willing to grind the skills (partially why they are attracted to football…with the exception of the qbs which start very young it’s something you can jump into and without a large investment if the body is right). You have to knock out the positions like lineman that don’t translate into a running sport. And you have to knock out the lower play iq players (which becomes a critical factor in the move from collegiate football to pro). While it would potentially widen the pool of finding a generational talent like Messi necessary to win the World Cup, it doesn’t explain why we aren’t able to put together a supporting squad in contention for the quarter finals of the cup every year. We have enough athletes for that just based on the Latino community alone.
 
My nephew plays te for a top 20 school. It’s very different than the soccer process. He used to be in a very high skilled sport and walked onto football in high school purely based on body type. He just got a big 10 offer despite having very little footage and having played very few minutes for his top 20 school sitting behind seniors (though he did shift to varsity as a sophomore and skipped the frosh team altogether). He does 7v 7 but no one takes the practice schedule as seriously as soccer (it’s a once a weekend thing). Very little by way of skills training. The training mostly comes in diet and straight up exercise for which he puts my soccer player to shame.

Soccer training is very iq and skill based. It requires a different kind of dedication. Yes soccer is also athletic and could benefit from the entrance of those top 20 school football athletes. But again it’s not 1 to 1. You have to knock out the lower level schools. You have to knock out those that aren’t willing to grind the skills (partially why they are attracted to football…with the exception of the qbs which start very young it’s something you can jump into and without a large investment if the body is right). You have to knock out the positions like lineman that don’t translate into a running sport. And you have to knock out the lower play iq players (which becomes a critical factor in the move from collegiate football to pro). While it would potentially widen the pool of finding a generational talent like Messi necessary to win the World Cup, it doesn’t explain why we aren’t able to put together a supporting squad in contention for the quarter finals of the cup every year. We have enough athletes for that just based on the Latino community alone.
Congratulations to your nephew! Is he class of 2028? Top 20 in state or national? I’m a big cfb fan

It would 100 percent widen the talent pool. I’m obviously not saying every football player would take every spot. Simply stating our best god given athletes are not playing soccer here. Take the same talent pool and put them in a soccer first country and you’re good to go.

Mentioned earlier another big issue is the multi sport culture we have. Cuts the talent pool down even further.

Side note, I struggled finding a place that sold soccer trading cards. Baseball/football cards were easy to find.
 
Congratulations to your nephew! Is he class of 2028? Top 20 in state or national? I’m a big cfb fan

It would 100 percent widen the talent pool. I’m obviously not saying every football player would take every spot. Simply stating our best god given athletes are not playing soccer here. Take the same talent pool and put them in a soccer first country and you’re good to go.

Mentioned earlier another big issue is the multi sport culture we have. Cuts the talent pool down even further.

Side note, I struggled finding a place that sold soccer trading cards. Baseball/football cards were easy to find.

Let's also not forget CTE concerns has had a massive impact on football participation. I played pop warner growing up in SoCal. It was super popular back then. In NorCal it's almost non-existent in some areas. Tackle football is losing a lot of athletes as a result -- maybe not to soccer, but they're going somewhere.

I could get behind the argument "Not all of the best athletes are playing the same sport". The idea that American football players are the optimal athletes really has no bite to it. The demands of playing a high level 90 minute soccer game far outweighs anything the NFL puts on the field. That's also true when comparing the NBA to the NFL. It's not even close. If the average height of an NBA player was closer to the average height of an EPL player (they're not close)....then I could see that argument....plus Europe has a strong basketball presence these days.

At the end of the day -- it has nothing to do with player pool. That's just a lost leader that distracts from the real problems.
 
Some interesting statistics on boy's/men's side as compared to the women's side in terms of college recruits from California.

This is according to TopDrawerSoccer:

2025 Men's College Commitments (all divisions): 89
2025 Women's College Commitments (all divisions): 183
2026 Men's College Commitments (all divisions): 18
2026 Women's College Commitments (all divisions): 131

Obviously the commitments will grow for both years particularly for 2026 men's, but it gives you a good idea of the odds you face as a California boy making a college roster. I will also say that the quality of colleges on the girls side is far more impressive than the boys. Note that the college scholarships for D1 for 2025/26 are the same for both genders (28).
 
Some interesting statistics on boy's/men's side as compared to the women's side in terms of college recruits from California.

This is according to TopDrawerSoccer:

2025 Men's College Commitments (all divisions): 89
2025 Women's College Commitments (all divisions): 183
2026 Men's College Commitments (all divisions): 18
2026 Women's College Commitments (all divisions): 131

Obviously the commitments will grow for both years particularly for 2026 men's, but it gives you a good idea of the odds you face as a California boy making a college roster. I will also say that the quality of colleges on the girls side is far more impressive than the boys. Note that the college scholarships for D1 for 2025/26 are the same for both genders (28).
Nationally its even more dramatic:

2025 Men's College Commitments (all divisions): 691
2025 Women's College Commitments (all divisions): 1,438

Keep in mind that it doesn't mean that these kids are getting scholarship.
 
At the end of the day -- it has nothing to do with player pool. That's just a lost leader that distracts from the real problems.
Hard disagree. You can repeat yourself until the cows come home - it still doesn't change the fact that it's missing the point. There are plenty of oft-repeated problems with US soccer - but not having the best athletes even choose to be in the pool in the first place from the earliest ages is always going to be a big one when talking about national (and other top 0.1% teams).
 
Hard disagree. You can repeat yourself until the cows come home - it still doesn't change the fact that it's missing the point. There are plenty of oft-repeated problems with US soccer - but not having the best athletes even choose to be in the pool in the first place from the earliest ages is always going to be a big one when talking about national (and other top 0.1% teams).
Found this interesting video. Soccer is the national past time of Brazil. There's no other sports distraction there (at least any more than basketball or skiing is in Europe). They are also the second most populous country in the Americas so clearly no issue there with the player pool size. Yet, Brazil seems to be struggling to find its former success. So what changed?

I think the player pool is part of the answer for why we can't find a generational talent like Messi. It's not the answer for why we can't beat Panama or Canada. What changed for Brazil?

The Europeans developed an academy system. The top Brazilian players get selected and play for European academies (because of the Portugal connection, and less reciprocal restrictions on immigration, it's easier for them to play in Europe). But when they come back to play for the national team the coaches are making them try to play the Brazilian game and dribbling just doesn't matter as much anymore.

It all comes back to the academies. We have a problem on the front end (our academies start late). We also have a problem on the backend (we have no clear way to transition a U18 academy player to the pros....in an ideal world there should be NO colleges coaches at the GA cup....every academy kid that's scouted for college is a failure of the US system where in Europe they'd be playing lower level pro ball)

 
You realize she's disagreeing with you when you say it's a "sp. lost leader", right? Of course it's not the only issue - and it's probably not the largest issue if we ranked them - but as long as soccer remains a secondary/unpopular sport in the US - it's not likely to attract those few who would be able to perform in a way to change its standing at the world level.
 
My nephew plays te for a top 20 school. It’s very different than the soccer process. He used to be in a very high skilled sport and walked onto football in high school purely based on body type. He just got a big 10 offer despite having very little footage and having played very few minutes for his top 20 school sitting behind seniors (though he did shift to varsity as a sophomore and skipped the frosh team altogether). He does 7v 7 but no one takes the practice schedule as seriously as soccer (it’s a once a weekend thing). Very little by way of skills training. The training mostly comes in diet and straight up exercise for which he puts my soccer player to shame.
I recently saw a story of a kid who was either a TE or WR that hardly played in HS due to the quality of the team, but got a D1 offer based on his 7v7 film.
 
Let's also not forget CTE concerns has had a massive impact on football participation. I played pop warner growing up in SoCal. It was super popular back then. In NorCal it's almost non-existent in some areas. Tackle football is losing a lot of athletes as a result -- maybe not to soccer, but they're going somewhere.
I'm actually surprised that there as many kids still playing football as there is, particularly high school. If you want to play high school football there is zero reason to play pop warner football. Why risk a concussion at an early age, and I'd argue that club soccer is much better training for football than pop warner (at least for the skill players).
 
I'm actually surprised that there as many kids still playing football as there is, particularly high school. If you want to play high school football there is zero reason to play pop warner football. Why risk a concussion at an early age, and I'd argue that club soccer is much better training for football than pop warner (at least for the skill players).

For sure. I suspect if/when NFL actually admits responsibility for CTE, shit will hit the fan. Oddly enough after tackle football, girl's soccer is next on the list for concussions. But that's a thread that's been beaten to death I'm sure.

Been watching the NBA play-in tournament all week. Definitely some athletes out there -- too bad the average height in the NBA is 6'5....5" taller than the average EPL player (just under '6)
 
I'm actually surprised that there as many kids still playing football as there is, particularly high school. If you want to play high school football there is zero reason to play pop warner football. Why risk a concussion at an early age, and I'd argue that club soccer is much better training for football than pop warner (at least for the skill players).
The exception is qb. It takes a long time to develop skills and the tactical awareness is as difficult and as fast as soccer. Most of the qbs at the top 20 SoCal schools have been playing a long time since they weee tykes, even if it’s just flag and by middle school most are looking at the top middle school programs which Iiuc are contact.
 
For sure. I suspect if/when NFL actually admits responsibility for CTE, shit will hit the fan. Oddly enough after tackle football, girl's soccer is next on the list for concussions. But that's a thread that's been beaten to death I'm sure.

Been watching the NBA play-in tournament all week. Definitely some athletes out there -- too bad the average height in the NBA is 6'5....5" taller than the average EPL player (just under '6)
Think about the tens of thousands of basketball players that just weren’t tall enough
 
The exception is qb. It takes a long time to develop skills and the tactical awareness is as difficult and as fast as soccer. Most of the qbs at the top 20 SoCal schools have been playing a long time since they weee tykes, even if it’s just flag and by middle school most are looking at the top middle school programs which Iiuc are contact.
Very little passing in wee tyke Pop Warner and not much more after that age. Like you mention, most of the development occurs in middle school in flag or 7x7 passing leagues. The footwork and field vision learned by soccer players is a significant benefit for QB's. Maybe a steeper learning curve for soccer players turned QB, but not out of the question. A kid my son grew up playing soccer with, moved to football country in middle school and started playing non-contact football. He had Power 5 D1 offers by the time he was a sophomore. It's not as common for a soccer player to play QB as other FB skill positions, but it's not uncommon. Youth soccer is still better training for football than youth contact football. The toughest part for many soccer players is learning to tackle or be tackled. My son is still not very fond of either, but that's likely due to other factors.
 
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