Yeah seems like a no brainer.
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RandomSoccerFan
PREMIER
I am not implying that you're incorrect. I'm assuming that it is a completely accurate view of the situation. It's also accurate that if they have more than 4 NL girls "helping out" on it - they are not following the ECNL rules. Re-classing NL players as RL players throughout the season, and then having them play up the vast majority of the time - shouldn't be fooling anyone, if they cared to challenge clubs that are breaking these rules. Those affected by the blatant cheating of other clubs have the option of actually pushing back, or just continuing to complain that it's happening (and nothing changes).
Last time I checked ECRL players could play in ECNL games as long as they were from the same club. I assume the same rule applies going the other way ECNL to ECRL. Although I never really looked at the rules closely enough to confirm.
The one rule that leagues do care about is that players can only play in one ECNL or ECRL game per day. This generally keeps ECNL players from playing ECRL because most clubs want their top team to win.
RandomSoccerFan
PREMIER
I posted them a couple of pages up. They are specific to the RL rules. You can't use NL players to materially make the RL team better. There's a hard limit of 4 of them, and there's a more fuzzy rule that if you're affecting the competition by doing it - you're not using the players in your club appropriately. Calling NL players "RL" so they are officially on the RL roster, but always play on the NL roster (and help out when RL has a tough game or is in playoffs), is a pretty obvious attempt to skirt these rules, and wouldn't be hard to report, investigate, and punish if confirmed and warranted.
That makes sense. Like I said I never looked at ECRL specific rules that closely.
One other rule that most leagues have is some date before finals rosters must be set. This is so coaches can't bring on players during finals from other teams if they lose.
Personally I don't understand rules 2nd tier leagues implement to keep top players out. If top tier players want to play "down" great. I see it as an opportunity to see how things work at a higher level. How will you ever get better if you never get a chance to play better players?
RandomSoccerFan
PREMIER
You're a remarkably optimistic person.
A more cynical person would instead believe that clubs play some of their top players down whenever needed so their Tier 2 team can appear better than they are, their Tier 3 team can appear better than they are, and so on. If the core reason of separating players by skill level is to promote relatively fair competition for all, allowing anyone to choose to disregard it entirely by playing kids who are already significantly better is pretty much ignoring that imperative.I believe it comes down to what you want to get out of playing a sport. Some people want to win trophies and medals. Others want a shot at being the best of the best. There's nothing wrong with either perspective.You're a remarkably optimistic person.
For me having done this for what seems like 10+ years plastic trophies don't really matter anymore. If they make my kid happy great. Throw it on the pile with the others. In my opinion worrying about clubs loading up "really good" players on 2nd tier teams for wins is the wrong way to think. Who cares if a clubs 2nd or 3rd teams are "really good"? If this is the case clubs are either playing better players down or holding back talented players from moving up. (Espicially if their top teams aren't doing very well)
At this point I see the value of an Academy type of system where everyone gets a chance but only the unicorns go onto the next level. It might be difficult for your kid to hear that they're not good enough for the next level. But it can also be a blessing in disguise because now they can try other things.
RandomSoccerFan
PREMIER
That's the crux of it. For 99.9% of kids involved in it, at some level, the question is if they are enjoying it or not. While it can be seen as a filter to find the few who want to continue through college or pro - for the vast majority; that's irrelevant. Playing kids down to chase wins in divisions they are already too skilled for isn't fun. Not for them, not for the kids they are playing against. Nor is it doing anything to better "develop" either party - the one chasing wins, or the one seeing what it looks like when someone cheats.
I always figured the Stanford and Duke types could do whatever they want but furrow my brow when I see state schools loaded up with Euros. Maybe I'm not looking at it objectively.
To be clear, I was offering up an opinion in favor of no school financial assistance for foreign students who are attending US colleges for the purpose of playing for the schools sports teams. I feel more strongly about this when the sport is a non revenue sport because non revenue sports have a limited pot to draw upon to support the student athlete on their squad.
Players such as Alessia Russo and Lucy Bronze attended UNC but never graduated from that school. I love watching both these players, but truth is they were brought in to help UNC win NCCA championships. This was/is not unique to UNC.
In the days of unlimited rosters, it could make some sense from the perspective that a foreign born superior skilled player be on the squad. here was more room. However in this time of restricted to 28 rosters, spots will be not available to home grown talent so the :"ringer" can be added to the squad.
If this is on public monies, I object. Less clear if it at a private school funded without public/federal monies.
maestroFRSM
SILVER
Lol, where were you last year?
so a player plays NL all season and then goes and plays on the RL playoffs that season and you say that's not a NL player on the roster for RL playoffs?
well it happens. Looks like clubs were using ECNL players in SoCal state cup teams as well this year to win. As long as ECNL has these "fuzzy" rules the Coaches and DOCs will exploit them. I haven't read up on the SoCal rules in a while but I'm assuming its still the same and anyone can play on the SoCal state cup roster as long as they have a player card.
This following scenario has absolutely happened before and will continue to happen because it’s within the rules. A player is on Club X and rostered on their ECNL team. They play all season and finish league play for Club X's ECNL team and do not make the playoffs. The player then transfers to Club Y before playoff starts and rosters are locked and is rostered on Club Y's ECRL team. The player then plays for Club Y's ECRL team during playoffs and then Club Y's ECNL team during playoffs. The player does not count as one of the 3 Max ECNL players playing on Club Y ECRL roster for playoffs.
And don't get me started on the Discovery player slots. That's the ultimate ground for DOC fuckery...
RandomSoccerFan
PREMIER
According to state cup rules, there's no prohibition against ECNL, MLS, or any other player with a valid player card for SoCal being added to a state cup roster. Keep in mind, State Cup used to be (and apparently still thinks it is) the highest level of youth soccer competition in California. The roster rules mean that once a kid is added to a state cup team roster, they can't be placed on any other state cup roster for the duration of the event. If their team is eliminated from the competition, they can be placed on a state cup roster of a team that is still in the event, as long as it is in a higher bracket.
Clubs can use whoever they want to help a state cup team win. It's just that not many of the "better" clubs do much of this anymore, as State Cup is a significantly lower level of competition, and it isn't even worth the injury risk for those playing in the different leagues.
Plausible - as long as Club X is happy to let them go to Club Y and they're fully paid up. It seems like the recommendations a few posts above about requiring a player to show at a minimum number of league games before playoffs would be impactful, if this is a commonly abused loophole.
rainbow_unicorn
PREMIER
Ask any NL player if they want to play for their RL team for playoffs. 99.9% of them will say no
What’s funny is the ability to play down is a big chunk of the rationale for mls2. And lots of the mlsn players don’t seem to want to play down either, even if they are reserve players that rarely if ever get to dress for games let alone play.
It makes more sense if you read the scenario.
NL player at a weak club transfers to a stronger club. The stronger club puts them on the RL roster for 2 weeks for RL playoffs, then moves them up to NL for NL playoffs.
I can see a club doing that, and I can see an NL player putting up with it if she really wants a shot at NL playoffs.
I completely agree that almost all NL starters have zero interest in RL playoffs. They have their own events to worry about.
Scrub It Kook
SILVER
If a player is not dressing or getting meaningful minutes they are not developing as quickly as they potentially could. This is just the youthful (or parent) ego that unfortunately could prevent them from being offered other opportunities.