Academy vs. ECNL

[Sped]

For me, college soccer is just a way for my dd to get her degree. If I can get some financial assistance along the way, great.

I would prefer she played for an Ivy League school versus any top tier D1 school. The soccer career will be over long before the "real" career ends.

I think I might tweak that a bit - if you can play at Princeton or Stanford, you play at Stanford. Brown or UCLA? Penn or Cal? There are plenty of top D1 schools that give you a great education as well. Michigan, UVA, UNC, Duke, Cal, UCLA, Stanford are all fine by me lol.

 

[ESPNANALYST]

Grades and scores get you a likely letter from an Ivy. Amazing soccer talent is a bonus I would assume.
Yes not interested in D1

I think I might tweak that a bit - if you can play at Princeton or Stanford, you play at Stanford. Brown or UCLA? Penn or Cal? There are plenty of top D1 schools that give you a great education as well. Michigan, UVA, UNC, Duke, Cal, UCLA, Stanford are all fine by me lol.

Oh please Sped there is a lot more that goes into choosing schools!
Princeton any day of the week over Stanford in this house. East coast baby!
Soccer is not life. Soccer should be the added benefit to the school that they enjoy. Choosing a school for a soccer program- for the love of God smh

 

[Zerodenero]

I think I might tweak that a bit - if you can play at Princeton or Stanford, you play at Stanford. Brown or UCLA? Penn or Cal? There are plenty of top D1 schools that give you a great education as well. Michigan, UVA, UNC, Duke, Cal, UCLA, Stanford are all fine by me lol.

For what it's worth, a perfect example is Momma Make's dd who is a legit stud on all fronts (yes, I'm for real) who could have attended/played anywhere.... (yes, Harvard, Princeton or Yale) but chose a perennial athletic AND academic power house. Remember, Just because you can doesn't mean you should (funny how that works). FIT is so crucially important for girls.

What ever youth league u-youngers choose....maximize it to the full potential.

 

[NoGoal]

Grades and scores get you a likely letter from an Ivy. Amazing soccer talent is a bonus I would assume.
Yes not interested in D1


Oh please Sped there is a lot more that goes into choosing schools!
Princeton any day of the week over Stanford in this house. East coast baby!
Soccer is not life. Soccer should be the added benefit to the school that they enjoy. Choosing a school for a soccer program- for the love of God smh

Stanford with Silicon Valley tech companies recruiting their grads is tough to reject. Google, Apple, AMD, Intel, Cisco, HP, Nvidia, Netflix and Facebook are a few that come to mind.

 

[outside!]

Princeton any day of the week over Stanford in this house. East coast baby!
Soccer is not life. Soccer should be the added benefit to the school that they enjoy. Choosing a school for a soccer program- for the love of God smh

Nice choice to have to make, for some. For others, neither school is a good fit. "The sun may rise in the east, but at least is settles in a finer location." RHCP. Feel free to move back east anytime.

 

[Glen]

Stanford with Silicon Valley tech companies recruiting their grads is tough to reject. Google, Apple, AMD, Intel, Cisco, HP, Nvidia, Netflix and Facebook are a few that come to mind.

Very true. But beyond Stanford, Duke, and maybe a Northwestern, Cal, or Michigan (I may have missed a couple), the Power 5 conference schools range from great regional schools to so-so regional schools. If your DD is from So Cal and plans to stay, no better place than UCLA or USC. But sending them off to comparable schools far away doesn't make much sense to me. If you go out of state, go to the great academic D-III or Ivy League if you can use soccer to get in.

What seems crazy to me is that parents are sending their kids to say, Ohio State, from So Cal. OSU may be a great school if you are going to live in Ohio. But really? Send your So Cal kid to pay more than double in out-of-state tuition in order to receive, say, a half scholarship. Your kid could probably get a better degree from a Cal state school (e.g., Long Beach) with more connections in So Cal for less than you are paying in travel and reduced tuition to OSU. In some respects, I just see this a more pay to play. But hey, I guess the parent can claim their kid got a scholarship to a Power 5 school.

 

[NoGoal]

Very true. But beyond Stanford, Duke, and maybe a Northwestern, Cal, or Michigan (I may have missed a couple), the Power 5 conference schools range from great regional schools to so-so regional schools. If your DD is from So Cal and plans to stay, no better place than UCLA or USC. But sending them off to comparable schools far away doesn't make much sense to me. If you go out of state, go to the great academic D-III or Ivy League if you can use soccer to get in.

What seems crazy to me is that parents are sending their kids to say, Ohio State, from So Cal. OSU may be a great school if you are going to live in Ohio. But really? Send your So Cal kid to pay more than double in out-of-state tuition in order to receive, say, a half scholarship. Your kid could probably get a better degree from a Cal state school (e.g., Long Beach) with more connections in So Cal for less than you are paying in travel and reduced tuition to OSU. In some respects, I just see this a more pay to play. But hey, I guess the parent can claim their kid got a scholarship to a Power 5 school.

It all depends on the player and what they are looking for in a university. UCLA for the most part recruits from the YNT pool. USC YNT pool and best regional players. A player focusing on those 2 specific schools is drastically narrowing their available choices, especially if they are neither a YNT player or top regional player. Not to mention even a 50% offer at USC is still a hefty tuition rate at 32.5K a year.

I tried convincing my DD to remain local and commit to UCI for selfish reasons, but she wanted to attend an out of state university. I then told her try CAL or UC Davis those schools are far, but she was having none of it, lol.

 

[espola]

It all depends on the player and what they are looking for in a university. UCLA for the most part recruits from the YNT pool. USC YNT pool and best regional players. A player focusing on those 2 specific schools is drastically narrowing their available choices, especially if they are neither a YNT player or top regional player. Not to mention even a 50% offer at USC is still a hefty tuition rate at 32.5K a year.

I tried convincing my DD to remain local and commit to UCI for selfish reasons, but she wanted to attend an out of state university. I then told her try CAL or UC Davis those schools are far, but she was having none of it, lol.

Who is paying the bills?

 

[NoGoal]

Who is paying the bills?

Technically if any player is getting at least a 50% athletic scholarship they are paying for their education as well.

To back track, Pac12 and Big10 athletic ships are now guaranteed for 4 yrs. Where as mid-majors are not, so if any player committs to OSU for example. It's not a poor choice compared to non guaranteed ships at Cal State Schools such as SDSU, SLO and LB State. Saving grace at Cal State schools is the tuition is very affordable at $6,500 per year.

I forgot to add, there are preferred walk-ons at UCLA, but lets be honest. The chances of a preferred walk-on ever touching the pitch at Drake Stadium is slim to none. I recall a couple of times club coaches saying, a schools offer indicates how much they really want a player in their program.

 

[soccerobserver]

I think I might tweak that a bit - if you can play at Princeton or Stanford, you play at Stanford. Brown or UCLA? Penn or Cal? There are plenty of top D1 schools that give you a great education as well. Michigan, UVA, UNC, Duke, Cal, UCLA, Stanford are all fine by me lol.

Sped, I have a different perspective and think both views are legit. I have heard that some of the players at Stanford major in things like 'communications" etc...which is not the same as the kind of majors and educational experiences kids get at such schools who are not playing soccer. Also, one of Princeton's stars turned down Stanford for Princeton bc she wanted the high level educational experience she could get there while playing soccer as opposed to what she could get playing higher level soccer at Stanford. Every player has to find the right fit based upon their own uniqueness.

 

[NoGoal]

Sped, I have a different perspective and think both views are legit. I have heard that some of the players at Stanford major in things like 'communications" etc...which is not the same as the kind of majors and educational experiences kids get at such schools who are not playing soccer. Also, one of Princeton's stars turned down Stanford for Princeton bc she wanted the high level educational experience she could get there while playing soccer as opposed to what she could get playing higher level soccer at Stanford. Every player has to find the right fit based upon their own uniqueness.

There are stories that M.A. wasn't accepted to Stanford. I also know another player who was denied admissions at Stanford, but was accepted at an Ivy League School. My guess is Ivies don't get as many YNT players, so the Ivy head coaches can get exceptions approved. While Stanford is practically all YNT players, so less opportunities for exceptions being made.

 

[Glen]

To back track, Pac12 and Big10 athletic ships are now guaranteed for 4 yrs. Where as mid-majors are not, so if any player committs to OSU for example. It's not a poor choice compared to non guaranteed ships at Cal State Schools such as SDSU, SLO and LB State. Saving grace at Cal State schools is the tuition is very affordable at $6,500 per year.

The distinction between those conferences providing some level of scholarship guarantee is very informative.

I am saying something a little different regarding costs. A kid going to a Cal State school with no scholarship - maybe doesn't even play soccer (so scholarship guarantees don't become relevant) - is better off for So Cal job prospects and probably paying less than a kid from So Cal going to OSU and getting a 50% scholarship. So the family/kid is really just paying an extra sports fee so their kid can play soccer at OSU. People are free to do what they want with their money, but it is amusing to me at some level. I also say this with a backdrop that I agree that there is no real career right now for girls to pursue professional soccer. So to me the most important thing is getting the girl to a place that will provide her the most opportunities after college. If you go to Stanford and some others, you can have the best both worlds. But after that, I think we should guide them to prioritize the better school over the better soccer program.

And obviously there are a lot of different circumstances that could make OSU a good choice (maybe the kid gets a full ride or the kid has family in Ohio). I'm talking about the typical girl who gets around 50%. I checked the numbers to make sure I wasn't totally crazy. Tuition is $10K in state and $27K out of state at OSU or $13.5K for an out of state student with a 50% scholarship. Tuition is $6,500 at LB State for in state students.

 

[NoGoal]

The distinction between those conferences providing some level of scholarship guarantee is very informative.

I am saying something a little different regarding costs. A kid going to a Cal State school with no scholarship - maybe doesn't even play soccer (so scholarship guarantees don't become relevant) - is better off for So Cal job prospects and probably paying less than a kid from So Cal going to OSU and getting a 50% scholarship. So the family/kid is really just paying an extra sports fee so their kid can play soccer at OSU. People are free to do what they want with their money, but it is amusing to me at some level. I also say this with a backdrop that I agree that there is no real career right now for girls to pursue professional soccer. So to me the most important thing is getting the girl to a place that will provide her the most opportunities after college. If you go to Stanford and some others, you can have the best both worlds. But after that, I think we should guide them to prioritize the better school over the better soccer program.

And obviously there are a lot of different circumstances that could make OSU a good choice (maybe the kid gets a full ride or the kid has family in Ohio). I'm talking about the typical girl who gets around 50%. I checked the numbers to make sure I wasn't totally crazy. Tuition is $10K in state and $27K out of state at OSU or $13.5K for an out of state student with a 50% scholarship. Tuition is $6,500 at LB State for in state students.

Glen, preaching to the choir. I agree with you 100%, education is first and foremost for womens soccer. IMO, as long as any of our DDs receives their undergrad degree. That's all that counts.

Don't forget if a student get's 50% at OSU it could include housing and books. So 27K + 10K for housing and 1K for books at 50% is 19K per year. My son goes to LB State and his tuition is 6.5K plus 10K for rent and food, and 1K for books. So about the same at 17.5K a year.

 

[NoGoal]

Sped, I have a different perspective and think both views are legit. I have heard that some of the players at Stanford major in things like 'communications" etc...which is not the same as the kind of majors and educational experiences kids get at such schools who are not playing soccer. Also, one of Princeton's stars turned down Stanford for Princeton bc she wanted the high level educational experience she could get there while playing soccer as opposed to what she could get playing higher level soccer at Stanford. Every player has to find the right fit based upon their own uniqueness.

Surprisingly Stanford has a lot of undeclared majors on the womens soccer team, but the few that have declared are majoring in Biology, Computer Science and Engineering along with a couple of Psychology majors.

http://www.gostanford.com/roster.aspx?path=wsoc

 

[soccer661]

I believe at Stanford -- one doesn't declare a major until their junior year.

 

[Zerodenero]

There are stories that M.A. wasn't accepted to Stanford. I also know another player who was denied admissions at Stanford, but was accepted at an Ivy League School. My guess is Ivies don't get as many YNT players, so the Ivy head coaches can get exceptions approved. While Stanford is practically all YNT players, so less opportunities for exceptions being made.

NG- It's probably painful for your haters to read this.....but you're 100% accurate on this (again)

 

[soccermanifesto]

There are stories that M.A. wasn't accepted to Stanford. I also know another player who was denied admissions at Stanford, but was accepted at an Ivy League School.

I find this incredibly fishy.

The Head Coach is well aware of all his recruits test scores and grades and calls his recruits once a month on the phone starting their junior year. The Head Coach has sway with the Dean of Admissions.

Stanford does things like commit scholarship money to two YNT Goalkeepers that are the same year, but only one gets "admitted." Scholarship money now saved for another recruit, one player left scrambling but kept off the market for other top schools.

They are not above going after a player that's committed somewhere else too, even at a position where they seem stacked.

Incredible school, great team though.

 

[espola]

I find this incredibly fishy.

The Head Coach is well aware of all his recruits test scores and grades and calls his recruits once a month on the phone starting their junior year. The Head Coach has sway with the Dean of Admissions.

Stanford does things like commit scholarship money to two YNT Goalkeepers that are the same year, but only one gets "admitted." Scholarship money now saved for another recruit, one player left scrambling but kept off the market for other top schools.

They are not above going after a player that's committed somewhere else too, even at a position where they seem stacked.

Incredible school, great team though.

In my conversations with college coaches (admittedly years ago) they stated that if they were interested in a player, and that player met the school's established minimums for admission, the coach could get him in. At the time of concern, my son's GPA and test scores met the minimums for UC, but were not competitive at Davis, which is to say that without soccer, he wouldn't have gotten in there (in fact my daughter, with much better scores, was waitlisted at Davis before she got in). We found out later that the coach had even more power than that - he could get some quantity of players he wanted in who had scores below the minimum, perhaps because the player fit one of the alternate entry doors, like diversity, legacy, or parental employment.

 

[NoGoal]

I find this incredibly fishy.

The Head Coach is well aware of all his recruits test scores and grades and calls his recruits once a month on the phone starting their junior year. The Head Coach has sway with the Dean of Admissions.

Stanford does things like commit scholarship money to two YNT Goalkeepers that are the same year, but only one gets "admitted." Scholarship money now saved for another recruit, one player left scrambling but kept off the market for other top schools.

They are not above going after a player that's committed somewhere else too, even at a position where they seem stacked.

Incredible school, great team though.

You may find if fishy, but the one I know is absolutely true!

Stanford was recruiting a former teammate of my DDs and I know for a fact Stanford's minimum GPA requirement is 3.50 without test scores. Another buddy I know DD's was also being recruited by Stanford and he told me the same. Every player is different, let's say hypothetically a player has the minimum 3.50 GPA, but still hasn't scored the minimum on the SAT/ACT for Stanford's admissions approval. The player keeps taking the test to meet the min. requirement until the admissions deadline. Waiting pins and needles hoping the last test score meets minimum admissions requirement, only to be disappointed that it didn't. Player now has to scramble to find a new university. Let's not forget the top players verbally commit as HS sophomores and my guess is 95% of the verbal commits haven't taken the SAT/ACT yet.

YNT players are a dime a dozen at Stanford. I highly doubt the head coach can get exceptions for below admissions requirements with the reason, she is a YNT player.

For the record, L.R. vebally committed to Stanford first. My question is why would another GK even consider verbally committing to Stanford, if they already had a verbally committed GK the same class year? Especially the same GK the player competed against and lost to as a YNT pool player.

 

[soccerobserver]

I find this incredibly fishy.

The Head Coach is well aware of all his recruits test scores and grades and calls his recruits once a month on the phone starting their junior year. The Head Coach has sway with the Dean of Admissions.

Stanford does things like commit scholarship money to two YNT Goalkeepers that are the same year, but only one gets "admitted." Scholarship money now saved for another recruit, one player left scrambling but kept off the market for other top schools.

They are not above going after a player that's committed somewhere else too, even at a position where they seem stacked.

Incredible school, great team though.

SManfesto that seems perhaps a bit overly cynical? What you described also sounds like the GK who was not "admitted" in the end had scores or grades that did not make the minimums...even today some are re-taking the ACT to get their scores up...the "offer" is not a guarantee...the HC at Yale and HVD were competing for a player who had not yet made the minimum SAT/ACT score and she kept taking it and retaking it...so her "offers" were conditional and she knew ahead of time that she was not quite "there" for those schools...I never found out what became of her but nothing would have been a suprise...

 

[soccermanifesto]

But no one is addressing the central question, why did Stanford go after, make financial promises to, and get verbal commits from two YNT GKs from the same year?

And why when they are stacked at a position, do they send feelers out to YNT players committed elsewhere?

I wouldn't care if they were doing this with adult players, but Stanford's gonna Stanford I guess. This system works for them and assures them getting the best players and being a perennial contender and powerhouse. But some girls get crushed in the process and are left scrambling . And that sucks.