Poaching Players (Team Manager Ethics)

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Daijobdes

BRONZE
I ran into this before the break… An example of purging or poaching caused by a Team Manager.

Does a Team Manager (Flight 1) have a ethical responsibility about giving out pertinent information to the entire team equally?

Background: Team Manager knew a group of players was “trying out” and were leaving the team. The other half of the team believed the team was staying together based on “emails and talks” the Team Manager was sending. They (other half) did not know or go to the try outs.

Is this how poaching or purging players works? The half of the team that tried out formed a new team and the others were left out of the Jan 2020 try outs and now with COVID-19 they are in Limbo for flight 1 clubs.
 
Big difference between “knew” about the tryouts and “caused” the tryouts. No clear which version this was.

I take it the manager was in the going to tryouts faction?

Same thing happened to the CA Thorns 09 team up by us. In that case, the manager was the recruiter. Top half of the team left for a big name coach. A lot of bad blood. Both teams dropped a division and are fighting their way back up. (up here that means they no longer played up a year.).

Unpleasant and I do not recommend it. Despite all that, it worked out. The next year, everyone still got to play and have fun. No worse than dropping a division because you get cut.
 
Daijobdes said:
I ran into this before the break… An example of purging or poaching caused by a Team Manager.

Does a Team Manager (Flight 1) have a ethical responsibility about giving out pertinent information to the entire team equally?

Background: Team Manager knew a group of players was “trying out” and were leaving the team. The other half of the team believed the team was staying together based on “emails and talks” the Team Manager was sending. They (other half) did not know or go to the try outs.

Is this how poaching or purging players works? The half of the team that tried out formed a new team and the others were left out of the Jan 2020 try outs and now with COVID-19 they are in Limbo for flight 1 clubs.
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Absolutely obligated to provide the same information to everyone on the team. The clubs have used tryouts as a weapon and already have enough power. Conspiring behind the scenes, with other families, discussing the option to leave, is the only power players have anymore. And since we're the paying customers... so be it. You're sticking out your neck in doing so, already, because you can't keep a secret in comp soccer. You can't stop recruiting. It sounds like, in SoCal, the clubs recruit players away. In NorCal, I think the parents are the worst offenders. Always in search of the better mousetrap. More often than not, I've seen that backfire.

That said, a team manager should not go sounding the alarms to all families that some are leaving. That's probably the morally correct thing to do... but unethical as team manager. Besides, I'm guessing others had a pretty good idea.
 
Daijobdes said:
I ran into this before the break… An example of purging or poaching caused by a Team Manager.

Does a Team Manager (Flight 1) have a ethical responsibility about giving out pertinent information to the entire team equally?

Background: Team Manager knew a group of players was “trying out” and were leaving the team. The other half of the team believed the team was staying together based on “emails and talks” the Team Manager was sending. They (other half) did not know or go to the try outs.

Is this how poaching or purging players works? The half of the team that tried out formed a new team and the others were left out of the Jan 2020 try outs and now with COVID-19 they are in Limbo for flight 1 clubs.
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Advice for you. All for free. Be patient. The coach usually runs all his tricks (the bad ones) through TM. If that is happening, you don;t want to be in that mess. Top 1 flight in Socal=Top goat imho. Don;t join a new team. Wait until all the dust and virus settles. My #1 mistake was trying to get a head of all you. Wait until the end of the next cut off day is for the new season. I waited until two days before cut off last year. Best decision ever. My earliest sign up for a club soccer season was Dec 3rd 2015. I signed 8 months before new season started. What a fool I was.
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ethically yes the manager should be impartial and handing out info to all.....some managers are unsung heroes and do lots of work with no drama....kinda like some coaches.........but some managers are gossips and stirring is the only work they do........kinda like some coaches :)
 
My buddy told me to watch out for the TM/board member dude. If you didn't get invited to the poker party, you know where you stand for next season he would tell me. I think it's good info and good way to get out of that mess. Too many (not all and we love our TMs because they work their asses off) of them get involved in decisions that are not good. The TMs that spreads gossip are actually dangerous and spread half truths around the team that cause cancer. Horrible for a team for 10 months.
 
Ellejustus said:
Too many (not all and we love our TMs because they work their asses off) of them get involved in decisions that are not good. The TMs that spreads gossip are actually dangerous and spread half truths around the team that cause cancer. Horrible for a team for 10 months.
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this is my experiences too........
 
Eagle33 said:
all it takes is one "cancer" parent to mess it up for a team, it doesn't have to be a TM
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Every team has a little cancer. However, TM cancer is not curable imo unless you cut it out and that can;t happen because the cancer originated from the head (Doc) and heart (coach). That is called stage 4 club cancer.
 
Ellejustus said:
Every team has a little cancer. However, TM cancer is not curable imo unless you cut it out and that can;t happen because the cancer originated from the head (Doc) and heart (coach). That is called stage 4 club cancer.
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I agree... the TM was very supportive throughout the year. He was very open until he was not...

Everything changed, the last week of January. Half the team didn’t show up for a game. He was telling everyone to go to the game because he ran the Shutterfly. Team had to forfeit . Parents called and he said “by the way the team is over, good luck.” Coach was shocked and angered… Half the parents knew what was going on the other half didn’t.

Funny the TM said this was a ‘meritocracy”… He always preaching it… It was a meritocracy until tryouts…if you knew there were tryouts…lol

Is the lesson?… its only about my kid not yours.
 
Daijobdes said:
I agree... the TM was very supportive throughout the year. He was very open until he was not...

Everything changed, the last week of January. Half the team didn’t show up for a game. He was telling everyone to go to the game because he ran the Shutterfly. Team had to forfeit . Parents called and he said “by the way the team is over, good luck.” Coach was shocked and angered… Half the parents knew what was going on the other half didn’t.

Funny the TM said this was a ‘meritocracy”… He always preaching it… It was a meritocracy until tryouts…if you knew there were tryouts…lol

Is the lesson?… its only about my kid not yours.
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Sorry to hear this. Out of curiosity, how did half of the team not know about the tryouts? Was this some sort of secret tryout? Curious as to the logistics of how the TM went about it.
 
Happens all too often.
Sometimes a coach will be planning to leave. But he'll only tell the parents that he wants to take along with him. "Don't say anything because if I finish out the season, I'll get my final check. But for the new team, I'll make sure you get a discount if you keep it a secret. I've only told 5 other parents. They are coming with me. "
 
I'll also say that many coaches put too much responsibility and trust on to team managers.
Coaches that only communicate with parents via team managers are putting themselves at risk of a parent mutiny.
Coaches that make team managers act like the ATM machine, the counselor, the scheduler and the bus driver are putting their teams at risk.
 
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Emma said:
Sorry to hear this. Out of curiosity, how did half of the team not know about the tryouts? Was this some sort of secret tryout? Curious as to the logistics of how the TM went about it.
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I really don't know... The first I heard about it was when we forfeited the game because we only had half the team. I believe it was a "cabal" all along... if you were in... you were in... not matter your "kids" skill level.

My view...A strong DOC and Coach would have seen the waring signs and put a stop to it... We had a week organization... Parents would step out of line and not get corrected. Looking back on it …. the TM did not enforce standards he just wanted his kid up front. The Coach and DOC need to ensure parents don't over step their bounds and ruin the team. I have more respect for coaches and DOC because of this.
 
Emma said:
Sorry to hear this. Out of curiosity, how did half of the team not know about the tryouts? Was this some sort of secret tryout? Curious as to the logistics of how the TM went about it.
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Emma, you know if you ask questions like that your looking for gossip morsels on the soccer forum. Watch out @Daijobdes. I started soft here in July, asking a few questions like this one and now I'm hated by a few. TM in club soccer need to go away and be called something else. My wife was "TM" for high school team. However, most of the parents were little "tms" helping my wife be the TM. Dads too :) It's how one leads the troops. Some lead with Power ((Assholes who think it's their way or the highway)) and some lead with Authority ((doing the dirty work too)). My wife delegated duties to other little tms. We all worked together to make this years soccer team the best ever parent wise. We all stepped up for the good of the team. Too many TMs act like they know all the D1 coaches too and all that. I hate that sh*t!!!. "Buzz off, we can handle this ourselves, thank you btw". Let them come to my dd if they like what they see. Soccer goats should have private planes coming to pick up the goat, not goat emailing 10 coaches and hoping her club soccer coach says one of them might be interested. That is not goat recruiting at all.
 
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Ellejustus said:
Emma, you know if you ask questions like that your looking for gossip morsels on the soccer forum. Watch out @Daijobdes. I started soft here in July, asking a few questions like this one and now I'm hated by a few. TM in club soccer need to go away and be called something else. My wife was "TM" for high school team. However, most of the parents were little "tms" helping my wife be the TM. Dads too :) It's how one leads the troops. Some lead with Power ((Assholes who think it's their way or the highway)) and some lead with Authority ((doing the dirty work too)). My wife delegated duties to other little tms. We all worked together to make this years soccer team the best ever parent wise. We all stepped up for the good of the team. Too many TMs act like they know all the D1 coaches too and all that. I hate that sh*t!!!. "Buzz off, we can handle this ourselves, thank you btw". Let them come to my dd if they like what they see. Soccer goats should have private planes coming to pick up the goat, not goat emailing 10 coaches and hoping her club soccer coach says one of them might be interested. That is not goat recruiting at all.
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We've had 7 team managers bt our 2 children and 5 were AWESOME - thank you! 1 was manipulative and 1 was not meant to manage anything. I was a TM one year bc no one else wanted to do it. It's a lot of work and I'm very thankful for TMs. I've seen many scenarios where things change as coaches move around or when a clique of kids move together to a different team. I've never heard of a secret tryout and was curious. I'm not looking for names of people or club, just how something like that would workout logistically. Who knows - I might implement my own secret tryout one day if it sounds exciting enough.
 
Emma said:
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We've had 7 team managers bt our 2 children and 5 were AWESOME - thank you! 1 was manipulative and 1 was not meant to manage anything. I was a TM one year bc no one else wanted to do it. It's a lot of work and I'm very thankful for TMs. I've seen many scenarios where things change as coaches move around or when a clique of kids move together to a different team. I've never heard of a secret tryout and was curious. I'm not looking for names of people or club, just how something like that would workout logistically. Who knows - I might implement my own secret tryout one day if it sounds exciting enough.
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Thank you for serving BTW. That has to be the hardest "job" in club soccer. One of my old friends ((probably hates me now)) did a hell of a job. I think she got $100 off dues for 20 hours a week and all the parents on top of that. Most TMs have been great btw. However, we have nothing else to do so why not talk about all the hacks who were TMs in club for all the wrong reasons. I know of one who had a hubby who was pissed his goat was not CM. So since his wife had all the emails, "they" decided to have a an "invite only team meeting" to start a soft coup with half the team. Well, it got out because these kinds of meetings get out quickly. Team split up right before playoffs all because daddy wanted CM for his Sally. No joke Emma :(
 
I think a TM has an obligation to let the coach know what is going on. If they choose to be part of the leadership, they need to be loyal to it. Kind of like an assistant coach.
 
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