Chances of playing in College

definately not the norm

I agree but it is up to the kids, family and coaching staff to make it happen. All of the players attend summer school and they stay on top of their studies. They still have plenty of time to be kids though. All they have to do is want it bad enough. I just don't think that it is some unique ability. It just has to be important to the kid.
 
The data that would interest me is the major that the players are in. I am a late college goer, just got my degree at 50, after my military career. As a father with college and pre-college age kids I took an interest in the college programs. The vast majority of college players, soccer included had what I considered the easy degrees; liberal arts, business, communications. It is very rare to see an engineering, pre med, hard sciences type in any athletic program. With the big emphasis on STEM at the elementary and high school levels little discouraging to see so few people who want that type of degree and play soccer.

My DD will be starting her third of five years of college this fall and will be making it a Red Shirt year due to her academic load. Her college soccer coach suggested the Red Shirt. She is a dual major Kinesiology and Athletic Trainer with a goal of Doctorate in Physical Therapy and BS in Athletic Training. This third year is the most difficult academically with 20 class units and 100 hours of internship required. DD coach is using her as an extra coach to help the freshman mids and forwards adjust to the 4-3-3 formation they primarily play. The coach is fine with DD missing practices and games if she has school work to complete. DD has two friends that completely stopped college soccer after their sophomore year. Both are nursing majors (Illinois and South Carolina colleges) and did not have enough time to study and do internships and continue to play/practice soccer. They along with my DD have academics as the number one priority. DD friend that is going to an Alabama university stopped soccer after her first year to focus on her civil engineering major. School and getting good grades should always be the first priority.
 
My personal experience tells me that it takes a special kid to be able to playing college sports while studying engineering. Most college degrees are easier and require a lot less time. Challenge comes down to what your friends are doing. Likely if your playing sports your closest friends will be those you are playing with. Unless they are studying engineering they will have more free time then you. Free time in college usually leads to a party and if your playing sports your fit and usually popular thus your invited. It's Wednesday night and practice just ended. Do you join your teammates heading to a party or go to the library to do 6 hours of Thermo homework? There is only so much time in a day and something needs to give. For me it was the sport after trying to make it work for three years. For many kids its the degree. They drop engineering and become a business major. Funny thing how my youngest daughter wants to play college soccer and study engineering! She is a pretty intense kid and is very focused so I think she has a chance but I told her that she should be prepared to sacrifice her social life since it won't be the same as her teammates.
 
My personal experience tells me that it takes a special kid to be able to playing college sports while studying engineering. Most college degrees are easier and require a lot less time. Challenge comes down to what your friends are doing. Likely if your playing sports your closest friends will be those you are playing with. Unless they are studying engineering they will have more free time then you. Free time in college usually leads to a party and if your playing sports your fit and usually popular thus your invited. It's Wednesday night and practice just ended. Do you join your teammates heading to a party or go to the library to do 6 hours of Thermo homework? There is only so much time in a day and something needs to give. For me it was the sport after trying to make it work for three years. For many kids its the degree. They drop engineering and become a business major. Funny thing how my youngest daughter wants to play college soccer and study engineering! She is a pretty intense kid and is very focused so I think she has a chance but I told her that she should be prepared to sacrifice her social life since it won't be the same as her teammates.

You hit the nail on the head. You need to have a group of friends that are doing the same thing as you and on the same life track. One of my player's roommates is an engineering major and her and one of the others are life science majors. They all spend plenty of time studying (they have mandatory study hall) and they do have social lives. They KNOW that it can be done as one of her roommates has a parent that is a doctor and was a track star in college. Her team has several STEM majors and honestly most of the roster are dean's list students. It can happen it just requires a plan.
 
There seems to be an underlying assumption that engineering/science degree is harder than other studies and many comments are made about how much work outside the classroom that comes with these degrees.

Frankly, I disagree with this belief. I have BS and MS in engineering and MBA. I know what it takes to get these degrees. Also, I teach as a guest lecturer at one of our local universities' engineering college one day a week. I see how students work and see the quality of their work. Those who get it, gets it and they jump out at you. Similarly, those that don't get it also jumps out at you.

The challenge is how to get those in between into those that gets it and not into the struggling group. Most often it has to do with their learning style and how they learn than anything else. Unfortunately, vast majority of students don't know how they learn. They've done whatever the teacher required of them through high school.

If you take ANY subject and requirements to do work outside of classroom (e.g., reports, reading, HW or what have you), time is time. There is no difference what's occupying the student's time. It just takes time. So stop making STEM into something more than what it is.

There's a natural selection for any given subject. Those that succeed in STEM area have affinity to the subject and will understand the material just the way an accounting major student understands general ledger. To those that understand science, its no more difficult than those that understands accounting - its just different.

Our society has hinder STEM by hyping it and making everyone believe its hard. The complexity of understanding the subject to any given student depends on the suitability of the subject versus the understanding ability of that individual.

I read years ago that its lot easier to teach engineers, finances than teach CPA's physics. Perhaps but not necessarily is what I've found over the years. It depends on the person.

So for every example of athlete failing in "hard" or engineering subject, there is a success story for those athletes that have an affinity for those hard subjects. Perhaps the student was led to believe he/she wanted to be a chemist or engineer, when in fact his/her affinity should have led them to a liberal arts major.

Not the students fault for this. We should not have to declare major when applying for college. Its a stupid system. Just take a look at the percentage of major changes once enrolled.

Leave you with two thoughts:
I worked on the average 32 hrs/wk during my entire college days. Paid for school by working and did not take out student loan. Most athletes don't put in more than 32 hrs/wk unofficially (officially it has to be much less). There are many that work like I did and successfully completes engineering or science degree, not just athletes.

The other, my older kid reports to his preseason camp next week. He is an incoming freshman that's majoring in Physic and Economics minor. His favorite subject was physics in high school and it came natural to him. He understands it much like another student understands history or accounting. Having watched him how he understand subjects and how he learns, I have no concerns for him being college athlete and studies. Not to say its a piece of cake, but he'll get it done. Struggles will be there but nothing he can't handle.

So time demand is time demand, regardless of if 6 hrs of thermodynamic or 6hrs of literature analysis. Its how well the kid can manage the time. The only caveat is game travel. That's different. Not only is it time consuming to travel,but, missing classes hurt. Tutors are provided for athletes to shorten the struggle but there's no substitute for missing class lecture/time. Again, this is study subject independent issue.
 
There seems to be an underlying assumption that engineering/science degree is harder than other studies and many comments are made about how much work outside the classroom that comes with these degrees.

Frankly, I disagree with this belief. I have BS and MS in engineering and MBA. I know what it takes to get these degrees. Also, I teach as a guest lecturer at one of our local universities' engineering college one day a week. I see how students work and see the quality of their work. Those who get it, gets it and they jump out at you. Similarly, those that don't get it also jumps out at you.

I have to disagree...most STEM is harder and requires more hours. I remember back in school that transferring from engineering to the business school was very competitive (required something like 3.7 GPA) since people were bailing after hitting the engineering weed out classes. But the opposite (transferring into engineering) was easy w/ regards to GPA since nobody sane wanted to go into engineering due to the workload.
 
There is a reason why playing a collegiate sport is nearly impossible to do while studying a hard-science. From personal experience, I can tell you what it takes to get a geology degree. Most of your first two years are filled up with a couple of geology courses (Geol. 101 plus lab; Earth History plus lab), three calculus courses, four chemistry courses (one year of general chemistry; one year of organic chemistry), two biology courses (one year), three physics courses (three semesters) and breadth requirements. You are always taking at least two hard-science courses with lab. Most labs take about 2 hours to prep for, and two actual lab hours, twice per week. In other words, that is 8 lab hours per science course, per week, and that usually means up to 16 hours per week just for your labs.

By the time you get to your third year, you are taking very demanding geology courses with labs, and nearly every course has required field trips twice per semester. (The geology professors work together to get them all in on different weekends.) So, if you are a soccer player in the Fall, you usually have at least 6 weekends where there will be a conflict between your games and your field work.

You can play collegiate soccer and get a degree in the sciences, but you better set aside about 5-6 years to do it.
So many majors require five years anyway, especially at public Universities. If a student can take 2-3 AP science classes and score a 4 or 5 on the AP test, they can earn university credit at most schools, that would make a dent in the freshman requirements and free up the class load to take another requirement.
 
Any driven kid can make the time to play a college sport. The problem is missing school for travel. Certain majors have required labs and internships (generally STEM majors) that cannot be missed. We've found certain Ivies to be more accommodating in this respect as they know that school comes first.
 
My DD will be starting her third of five years of college this fall and will be making it a Red Shirt year due to her academic load. Her college soccer coach suggested the Red Shirt. She is a dual major Kinesiology and Athletic Trainer with a goal of Doctorate in Physical Therapy and BS in Athletic Training. This third year is the most difficult academically with 20 class units and 100 hours of internship required. DD coach is using her as an extra coach to help the freshman mids and forwards adjust to the 4-3-3 formation they primarily play. The coach is fine with DD missing practices and games if she has school work to complete. DD has two friends that completely stopped college soccer after their sophomore year. Both are nursing majors (Illinois and South Carolina colleges) and did not have enough time to study and do internships and continue to play/practice soccer. They along with my DD have academics as the number one priority. DD friend that is going to an Alabama university stopped soccer after her first year to focus on her civil engineering major. School and getting good grades should always be the first priority.
Amen Surfref, I told me wife....if our DD picks a cheesy major, she might as well quit college soccer, pack her bags and transfer as a full-time student to UC Davis where she was accepted purely on her academic achievement.
 
Any driven kid can make the time to play a college sport. The problem is missing school for travel. Certain majors have required labs and internships (generally STEM majors) that cannot be missed. We've found certain Ivies to be more accommodating in this respect as they know that school comes first.
You don't know what your posting about. There are a couple of engineering majors on my DD's college team. If an individual is gifted in mathematics....the class will be easy for them. No different than soccer being easy for a YNT player.
 
Amen Surfref, I told me wife....if our DD picks a cheesy major, she might as well quit college soccer, pack her bags and transfer as a full-time student to UC Davis where she was accepted purely on her academic achievement.

The college major should be the number be reason for choosing a college. Soccer should not be the first reason for picking a school. The education will be more important in the long run than soccer.
 
There seems to be an underlying assumption that engineering/science degree is harder than other studies and many comments are made about how much work outside the classroom that comes with these degrees.

Frankly, I disagree with this belief. I have BS and MS in engineering and MBA. I know what it takes to get these degrees. Also, I teach as a guest lecturer at one of our local universities' engineering college one day a week. I see how students work and see the quality of their work. Those who get it, gets it and they jump out at you. Similarly, those that don't get it also jumps out at you.

The challenge is how to get those in between into those that gets it and not into the struggling group. Most often it has to do with their learning style and how they learn than anything else. Unfortunately, vast majority of students don't know how they learn. They've done whatever the teacher required of them through high school.

If you take ANY subject and requirements to do work outside of classroom (e.g., reports, reading, HW or what have you), time is time. There is no difference what's occupying the student's time. It just takes time. So stop making STEM into something more than what it is.

There's a natural selection for any given subject. Those that succeed in STEM area have affinity to the subject and will understand the material just the way an accounting major student understands general ledger. To those that understand science, its no more difficult than those that understands accounting - its just different.

Our society has hinder STEM by hyping it and making everyone believe its hard. The complexity of understanding the subject to any given student depends on the suitability of the subject versus the understanding ability of that individual.

I read years ago that its lot easier to teach engineers, finances than teach CPA's physics. Perhaps but not necessarily is what I've found over the years. It depends on the person.

So for every example of athlete failing in "hard" or engineering subject, there is a success story for those athletes that have an affinity for those hard subjects. Perhaps the student was led to believe he/she wanted to be a chemist or engineer, when in fact his/her affinity should have led them to a liberal arts major.

Not the students fault for this. We should not have to declare major when applying for college. Its a stupid system. Just take a look at the percentage of major changes once enrolled.

Leave you with two thoughts:
I worked on the average 32 hrs/wk during my entire college days. Paid for school by working and did not take out student loan. Most athletes don't put in more than 32 hrs/wk unofficially (officially it has to be much less). There are many that work like I did and successfully completes engineering or science degree, not just athletes.

The other, my older kid reports to his preseason camp next week. He is an incoming freshman that's majoring in Physic and Economics minor. His favorite subject was physics in high school and it came natural to him. He understands it much like another student understands history or accounting. Having watched him how he understand subjects and how he learns, I have no concerns for him being college athlete and studies. Not to say its a piece of cake, but he'll get it done. Struggles will be there but nothing he can't handle.

So time demand is time demand, regardless of if 6 hrs of thermodynamic or 6hrs of literature analysis. Its how well the kid can manage the time. The only caveat is game travel. That's different. Not only is it time consuming to travel,but, missing classes hurt. Tutors are provided for athletes to shorten the struggle but there's no substitute for missing class lecture/time. Again, this is study subject independent issue.
And for those who can't visual or comprehend what mirage is posting about. It might be easier to watch the movie Good Will Hunting.
 
You don't know what your posting about. There are a couple of engineering majors on my DD's college team. If an individual is gifted in mathematics....the class will be easy for them. No different than soccer being easy for a YNT player.
I guess you would even disagree with me if I say the sky is blue.

I understand the point that one major is not necessarily more difficult or time consuming for a kid that is gifted in that area. But for some majors (generally STEM) that have mandatory labs or internships, you cannot miss too many of them and if you are consistently missing Thursdays and Fridays for travel and games, that is a problem. Sorry to break it to you but I do have personal experience in this area and know that the Ivies have been better accommodating and will help you get out in 4 with summer school.
 
I guess you would even disagree with me if I say the sky is blue.

I understand the point that one major is not necessarily more difficult or time consuming for a kid that is gifted in that area. But for some majors (generally STEM) that have mandatory labs or internships, you cannot miss too many of them and if you are consistently missing Thursdays and Fridays for travel and games, that is a problem. Sorry to break it to you but I do have personal experience in this area and know that the Ivies have been better accommodating and will help you get out in 4 with summer school.
Sorry to break the news to you, but at my DD's university the assigned athletic sports advisors know which classes are available throughout the season and will work with their schedule. It has to fit between conditioning and strength training in the morning and practice in the afternoons. They also know which professors will work with the student athlete knowing very well they will be missing class during the season. They also know which professors will not accomodate the student athlete. Whoch leads to why the university has graduate students assigned as the team tutors to help the student athlete succeed.

My wife works for a prestigous local D3 college and if a parent truly prefers their DDs focus on academics with the sports being 2nd. D3 is the way to go!
 
Protip:
It's very important to find a Culture that matches your players goals. Wednesday night parties don't make sense to student-athletes. Stick to the goal... books + soccer + rest= Growth/Development
 
Sorry to break the news to you, but at my DD's university the assigned athletic sports advisors know which classes are available throughout the season and will work with their schedule. It has to fit between conditioning and strength training in the morning and practice in the afternoons. They also know which professors will work with the student athlete knowing very well they will be missing class during the season. They also know which professors will not accomodate the student athlete. Whoch leads to why the university has graduate students assigned as the team tutors to help the student athlete succeed.

My wife works for a prestigous local D3 college and if a parent truly prefers their DDs focus on academics with the sports being 2nd. D3 is the way to go!
I would also add and learned a university based on the academic quarter system is more advantageous for a D1 soccer student athlete vs the semester system. The quarter system year doesn't start until mid September, but the soccer training season officially begins Aug 1st. By the time the fall quarter begins. The soccer season is almost half over. When Winter and Spring quarter rolls around....no more traveling and missing class and that's when the student athlete can talk the tougher STEM courses without worrying about absences.

So when looking at potential schools.....don't forget to research if he university is on a quarter or semster system.
 
I would also add and learned a university based on the academic quarter system is more advantageous for a D1 soccer student athlete vs the semester system. The quarter system year doesn't start until mid September, but the soccer training season officially begins Aug 1st. By the time the fall quarter begins. The soccer season is almost half over. When Winter and Spring quarter rolls around....no more traveling and missing class and that's when the student athlete can talk the tougher STEM courses without worrying about absences.

So when looking at potential schools.....don't forget to research if he university is on a quarter or semster system.
Protip via @NoGoal
 
I would also add and learned a university based on the academic quarter system is more advantageous for a D1 soccer student athlete vs the semester system. The quarter system year doesn't start until mid September, but the soccer training season officially begins Aug 1st. By the time the fall quarter begins. The soccer season is almost half over. When Winter and Spring quarter rolls around....no more traveling and missing class and that's when the student athlete can talk the tougher STEM courses without worrying about absences.

So when looking at potential schools.....don't forget to research if he university is on a quarter or semster system.

Protip via Nogoal- Forget everything said about picking the school for the best academic fit. Rather only go to a quarter system school so that academics interfere the least with soccer.
 
Sorry to break the news to you, but at my DD's university the assigned athletic sports advisors know which classes are available throughout the season and will work with their schedule. It has to fit between conditioning and strength training in the morning and practice in the afternoons. They also know which professors will work with the student athlete knowing very well they will be missing class during the season. They also know which professors will not accomodate the student athlete. Whoch leads to why the university has graduate students assigned as the team tutors to help the student athlete succeed.

My wife works for a prestigous local D3 college and if a parent truly prefers their DDs focus on academics with the sports being 2nd. D3 is the way to go!
Sorry to break it to you but I said the Ivies are "better accommodating." I never said that schools don't work with their athletes. Of course they want them to keep up their grades and graduate because it helps their stats. However at schools such as D1, sports play a bigger financial role in the school culture and thus an athlete's commitment to the sport is more rigid. At Ivies school come first.
 
Back
Top