We Don't Need More Athletes

[dad4]

Drop it to $1500 per year for 8 years. Anything above that is on the parent. People spend more than that on coffee.

Where did you find a good program for 1500 per year? We spend that just on summer camps.

Whoever it is, list their name. They deserve the free advertising.

 

[Grace T.]

Where did you find a good program for 1500 per year? We spend that just on summer camps.

Whoever it is, list their name. They deserve the free advertising.

That's around the cost (or less) of many AYSO United Programs. But it depends what you mean by "good": they have a tendency to punch over their weight if winning is your thing but you have (mostly YMMV) volunteer coaches, 1 tournament, fields they piggy back off of regular AYSO, and no DA.

 

[Simisoccerfan]

In the classrooms every week.

I think you're missing the point...try this little experiment...ask high school aged club-level athletes (male and female) what they're thinking in terms of career goals. In my discussions, a much higher percentage now (vs. 30 years ago) say "pro athlete". Like you say, many of them are excellent students who could use their intelligence for a host of impactful and rewarding career opportunities beyond sports. But because they have been only identified as a "soccer player" (or pick your sport) from such an early age and by so many around them, they struggle to see themselves as anything else but. When the sport ends, they can have an identity crisis. Worse yet, depression, etc.

View attachment 6357

I just read a study of several hundred thousand college students that said 41.1% of college students had moderate to severe depression. You can't post data above with putting it into proper perspective. This would seem to imply that participating in sports helps fight off depression.

 

[Soccerhelper]

I just read a study of several hundred thousand college students that said 41.1% of college students had moderate to severe depression. You can't post data above with putting it into proper perspective. This would seem to imply that participating in sports helps fight off depression.

I need to chime in here. Depression is so huge in college most parents are blind to it because most of them crammed college down their kids throats. Add "have to be a soccer stud" to it and double the stress and potential for depression. Plus, kid has to be perfect! My son got denied his first rush to a frat house. He was 100% sad. He said he only tried to join because he is lonely and bored. College life is hard for some. I told my son to screw that frat house and find some real friends. True friendships take time and one should never have to pay to have friends Frats cost money too.....

 

[Sheriff Joe]

We live in a capitalist economy. This means it is the job of us to work hard to help the capitalists make money. The capitalists sit back and get a bite of the profit that we the workers help to make. They give us some crumbs so that we can take home and feed our children. Once we hit 65 and have knee issues, we are tossed aside. It is true. We do not need anymore entertainers. We need more workers to help the capitalists create wealth!

Thanks Bernie.

 

[Sheriff Joe]

I just read a study of several hundred thousand college students that said 41.1% of college students had moderate to severe depression. You can't post data above with putting it into proper perspective. This would seem to imply that participating in sports helps fight off depression.

Was that study done between 2008 and 2016?

 

[espola]

Was that study done between 2008 and 2016?

This is a serious discussion. Go drop your turds somewhere else.

 

[socalkdg]

Where did you find a good program for 1500 per year? We spend that just on summer camps.

Whoever it is, list their name. They deserve the free advertising.

Play for Milan/Empoli Red. 05 girls. $900 per year. Included uniforms, CSL, 2 tourneys, lighted fields in Corona, and National cup. 18 girls on the team. Just finished fund raising to pay for SCNPL for spring and two more tourneys. Without fund raising would have been another $200 per kid.

 

[focomoso]

They say, "This country of HUGE opportunity for both boys and girls doesn't need any more entertainers." And as @MWN often rightly points out, athletes are entertainers. There is a place for sport and art and other entertainment, but 2020 Americans are lionizing sports to such an extent that academics, intelligence, innovation and scientific thought are beginning to pale in comparison.

Here's what your friends (and you?) are missing. In a generation or two, there will be only entertainers. As more and more work is pushed off to automated systems, the only work that will provide value is what other people enjoy. This includes art, entertainment and sports. When AI can do math better than humans (not far off), being good at math won't be very useful except for math olympians. Same with engineering, science and finance. It used to be that you could make a good living as a reasonably competent scientist / engineer / financier, but all of these industries are headed for a dramatic reduction in importance. The mid-level will disappear and only people making a living will be the people who can build and maintain the AI itself. After that, all that's left are artists, sportspeople, celebrities and "leaders". So, if you really want to prepare your kids for the future, take them out of traditional schools and get them into an arts or sports program.

 

[G07KeeperMom]

In the classrooms every week.

I think you're missing the point...try this little experiment...ask high school aged club-level athletes (male and female) what they're thinking in terms of career goals. In my discussions, a much higher percentage now (vs. 30 years ago) say "pro athlete". Like you say, many of them are excellent students who could use their intelligence for a host of impactful and rewarding career opportunities beyond sports. But because they have been only identified as a "soccer player" (or pick your sport) from such an early age and by so many around them, they struggle to see themselves as anything else but. When the sport ends, they can have an identity crisis. Worse yet, depression, etc.

Okay, in my opinion, the answer to what you're suggesting has nothing to do with an emphasis on sports and everything to do with parenting. Parents should provide perspective. How many times have you heard a child say they want to be a "YouTuber"?! My 10 year old son tried to tell me that once or twice and my response was "..that is not a CAREER, kid!" You can try that as a hobby if you want, but after YouTube dies, what are you REALLY going to do with your life? I talk to my kids about things like this all the time, because so often when I ask other kids what they want to be these days, they say "I don't know", and that makes me sad. What happened to the days when kids had plans and dreams?!

I talk to my kids about what I see as their strengths/talents all the time...things they can use to contribute to this world. My son is a talker! I joke with him all the time that we have to find a way to monetize that! That is his unique talent! He's also bright, but man, the kid can talk himself out of any situation! He may be a future lawyer, businessman or real estate broker! He also loves little kids, so maybe a pediatrician (so you can help them feel less tense about going to see the doctor). I give my kids ideas on what they can do IN ADDITION to sports or "you tubing" (ha!) - one of them is bound to spark an interest eventually!

Same with my daughter who says she wants to play soccer professionally - AWESOME! But what about that strong and curious mind of yours? That mind was not given to you JUST for soccer! ...you could do a lot of good in the world with it! It would be a waste not to! So as of now, her plan is to be a Professional Soccer player and a Neurologist. Excellent!!!

I'm sure their career goals will change/evolve just like mine did as I got older, but I will always ask them to reach for an academic/professional goal in addition to their soccer/entertainment goals...because it's always good to have a strong backup plan.

That said, my kids get SO MUCH benefit from sports that will one day help them in a professional setting as well. They have learned to listen and translate instruction into action; they have learned teamwork and how to manage difficult personalities; they have learned to set goals for themselves and work to achieve them; they have felt the satisfaction from achievement and to truly believe that their work will get them there; they have learned how to be organized so they can keep up with it all their activities; they have learned how to process failure, learn from it and try again; they have learned to communicate with Coaches/adults and present themselves with confidence. They have learned SO many lessons that you just can't get out of a book/class! For now, their dream includes sports, and that's okay...because I see first hand, it is such a healthy outlet outside of academics and it isn't as much competing with their academic lives and pursuits, as it is ultimately enhancing it.

 

[Grace T.]

Here's what your friends (and you?) are missing. In a generation or two, there will be only entertainers. As more and more work is pushed off to automated systems, the only work that will provide value is what other people enjoy. This includes art, entertainment and sports. When AI can do math better than humans (not far off), being good at math won't be very useful except for math olympians. Same with engineering, science and finance. It used to be that you could make a good living as a reasonably competent scientist / engineer / financier, but all of these industries are headed for a dramatic reduction in importance. The mid-level will disappear and only people making a living will be the people who can build and maintain the AI itself. After that, all that's left are artists, sportspeople, celebrities and "leaders". So, if you really want to prepare your kids for the future, take them out of traditional schools and get them into an arts or sports program.

Agree generally but slight amendment. It's not entertainment which is the key trait in the future but creativity. There isn't going to be a need for an attorney who can do a by the numbers incorporation, but there will be for creative thinkers on trusts and estates. Less of a need for doctors that can handle routine things like conjunctivitis, lots though for those that can do complex surgeries, disease research, or cancer treatments. Less of a need for math crunchers, but plenty for creative programmers. Less of a need for stock brokers, but plenty for complex algorithm developers. There's still quite a bit on the bottom end (still need nurses aids for example to clean the bed pans), and a lot on the high end, but less in the middle.

So translating to soccer, if the goal is to use soccer as a tool for developing adults (like KeeperMom argues), as opposed to getting a national team or sending as many upper middle class kids to college as possible, then it would be critical to develop creative thinking skills and creative play in soccer plays, and to avoid joy sticking at all costs. But that's not how soccer is set up in the US, and it's certainly not the way our public schools are set up (which are increasingly concerned with conformity and comity instead of critical thinking). That's also BTW why I think kids are drawn to videogames, youtube, and for our kids soccer....it's a vehicle to develop that creativity (which kids enjoy) where they aren't otherwise getting it in school.

 

[focomoso]

Agree generally but slight amendment. It's not entertainment which is the key trait in the future but creativity. There isn't going to be a need for an attorney who can do a by the numbers incorporation, but there will be for creative thinkers on trusts and estates. Less of a need for doctors that can handle routine things like conjunctivitis, lots though for those that can do complex surgeries, disease research, or cancer treatments. Less of a need for math crunchers, but plenty for creative programmers. Less of a need for stock brokers, but plenty for complex algorithm developers. There's still quite a bit on the bottom end (still need nurses aids for example to clean the bed pans), and a lot on the high end, but less in the middle.

So translating to soccer, if the goal is to use soccer as a tool for developing adults (like KeeperMom argues), as opposed to getting a national team or sending as many upper middle class kids to college as possible, then it would be critical to develop creative thinking skills and creative play in soccer plays, and to avoid joy sticking at all costs. But that's not how soccer is set up in the US, and it's certainly not the way our public schools are set up (which are increasingly concerned with conformity and comity instead of critical thinking). That's also BTW why I think kids are drawn to videogames, youtube, and for our kids soccer....it's a vehicle to develop that creativity (which kids enjoy) where they aren't otherwise getting it in school.

I also agree, generally, but even creative fields that aren't ingested by humans will eventually go. Complex surgeries will be performed better by robots than humans. Disease research and cancer treatment will be automated. Even creative programmers (my current field) will fall away because who needs a person to develop a complex algorithm when you can train an AI to solve the problem with a neural network?

The only thing that I can see resisting this, at least for a while, is human ingested content. It will be a while before an AI can write music or paint a picture without at least the guidance of a human (though, of course, computers make the processes easier). And in the very long term, the only thing that will resist this is human achievement. I suspect that in the end, the only thing people will do is recreation and competition.