T 2.0

watfly said:
I know you were told to believe the "both sides" narrative, but you might want to check in with reality.

www.snopes.com

No, Trump Did Not Call Neo-Nazis and White Supremacists 'Very Fine People'

However, the accuracy of what Trump did claim – that there were "very fine people on both sides" of the 2017 Unite the Right debacle – is in question.
www.snopes.com www.snopes.com
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It is one of the most repeated lies out there. Even after being debunked...supposedly professional journalists it still repeat it.

Husker and Espola are not too bright and just remember the initial slur...completely unaware of actual facts.
 
Hüsker Dü said:
There is always a question as to WTH trump is talking about and people like you are always there to give him every benefit of the doubt. Yeah “both sides” of the statue debate. On one side was torch carrying neo nazis chanting “Jews will not replace us!” and “Blood and soil!”
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It wasn't ONE side chanting...etc.

There was one side that didn't want statues/monuments taken down. Those where the part of good people on one side. The other side was those that wanted them down. Those where the other side...that was part of the good people.

Then you had a very small group of neo nazis show up. Trump wasn't defending them.

Here is the statement in full. You don't need to give him the benefit of the doubt. Just read or watch what he said. And if you do, then you know he wasn't supporting neo nazis. But here you go. I am sure even after reading that...and I can give you the video...you will still default to HE SUPPORTED NAZIS!!!!

Trump: Excuse me, they didn't put themselves down as neo-Nazis, and you had some very bad people in that group. But you also had people that were very fine people, on both sides. You had people in that group — excuse me, excuse me, I saw the same pictures as you did — you had people in that group that were there to protest the taking down of, to them, a very very important statue and the renaming of a park from Robert E. Lee to another name. George Washington was a slave owner. Was George Washington a slave owner? So will George Washington now lose his status, are we gonna take down — excuse me — are we gonna take down statues of George Washington? How about Thomas Jefferson? What do you think of Thomas Jefferson? You like him? Okay good. Are we gonna take down the statue? Cause he was a major slaveowner. Now are we gonna take down his statue? So you know what? It's fine. You're changing history, you're changing culture, and you had people — and I'm not talking about the neo-Nazis and the white nationalists, because they should be condemned totally. But you had many people in that group other than neo-Nazis and white nationalists, okay? And the press has treated them absolutely unfairly. Now, in the other group also, you had some fine people, but you also had troublemakers, and you see them come with the black outfits, and with the helmets, and the baseball bats, you got a lot of bad people in the other group too.
 
"Dear Federal Judges:

We The People are the sovereign.

The cornerstone of sovereignty is control of our border.

We lend the federal government limited, specific, enumerated, and divided powers.

Congress may create due-process rights for the expulsion of illegal aliens, if it chooses.

But we never gave you that power.

Not at our founding.

Not after the Civil War.

Not in any subsequent Congress.

Certainly not after the last election.

You allowed Biden to illegally mass-import over 10,000,000 illegal aliens, including terrorists.

Now you’re illegally stopping Trump from expelling the worst terrorists and their enablers.

You are violating one of our most important sovereign rights.

You are destroying your legitimacy with a large swath of Americans." Mike
 
Desert Hound said:
It wasn't ONE side chanting...etc.

There was one side that didn't want statues/monuments taken down. Those where the part of good people on one side. The other side was those that wanted them down. Those where the other side...that was part of the good people.

Then you had a very small group of neo nazis show up. Trump wasn't defending them.

Here is the statement in full. You don't need to give him the benefit of the doubt. Just read or watch what he said. And if you do, then you know he wasn't supporting neo nazis. But here you go. I am sure even after reading that...and I can give you the video...you will still default to HE SUPPORTED NAZIS!!!!

Trump: Excuse me, they didn't put themselves down as neo-Nazis, and you had some very bad people in that group. But you also had people that were very fine people, on both sides. You had people in that group — excuse me, excuse me, I saw the same pictures as you did — you had people in that group that were there to protest the taking down of, to them, a very very important statue and the renaming of a park from Robert E. Lee to another name. George Washington was a slave owner. Was George Washington a slave owner? So will George Washington now lose his status, are we gonna take down — excuse me — are we gonna take down statues of George Washington? How about Thomas Jefferson? What do you think of Thomas Jefferson? You like him? Okay good. Are we gonna take down the statue? Cause he was a major slaveowner. Now are we gonna take down his statue? So you know what? It's fine. You're changing history, you're changing culture, and you had people — and I'm not talking about the neo-Nazis and the white nationalists, because they should be condemned totally. But you had many people in that group other than neo-Nazis and white nationalists, okay? And the press has treated them absolutely unfairly. Now, in the other group also, you had some fine people, but you also had troublemakers, and you see them come with the black outfits, and with the helmets, and the baseball bats, you got a lot of bad people in the other group too.
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Facts are irrelevant to the narrative he is told to parrot. Husker's lack of self awareness is astonishing. It's funny because he claims that I believe everything Trump says. I actually believe very little Trump says, but I do appreciate about 70% of his policies and the effort he is putting forth. However, I don't think his heavy handed approach helps him, although maybe that's irrelevant given the resistance to any thing he does.

I can't say I'm pro-Trump, as much as I just vehemently disagree with the Dem's current policies and political approach which effectively boils down to lawfare and "Orange Man Bad". A month ago they were vandalizing Tesla's and now they are embracing Musk because he disagrees with Trump. (I support Musk on the BBB debate). Our system relies on a viable two party system and right now the Democratic is not viable and a long way from being so. Choosing the 20% doesn't work.
 
watfly said:
Facts are irrelevant to the narrative he is told to parrot. Husker's lack of self awareness is astonishing. It's funny because he claims that I believe everything Trump says. I actually believe very little Trump says, but I do appreciate about 70% of his policies and the effort he is putting forth. However, I don't think his heavy handed approach helps him, although maybe that's irrelevant given the resistance to any thing he does.

I can't say I'm pro-Trump, as much as I just vehemently disagree with the Dem's current policies and political approach which effectively boils down to lawfare and "Orange Man Bad". A month ago they were vandalizing Tesla's and now they are embracing Musk because he disagrees with Trump. (I support Musk on the BBB debate). Our system relies on a viable two party system and right now the Democratic is not viable and a long way from being so. Choosing the 20% doesn't work.
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My thing over the years has been how partisan the press is. They don't report the news. They actively take sides.

I chuckle when I hear people say NY Times or NPR, etc etc are down the middle. I then ask them some basic questions.
- when is the last time you saw articles/stories in favor of lets say tax cuts, smaller gov, gun rights...etc etc. Stories in favor of those and other issues in the mainstream press are as rare as sightings of bigfoot. Just really doesn't happen. You may get the occasional oped from a conservative in there...but the news sections, etc align almost 100% with one party (Ds).

And you when you deal with husker and espola you can see they only get info from one type of source.

The dem party currently has gone off the rails.
- they and the deep state pushed the Russian collusion angle despite knowing it wasn't there/true
- they advocated shuttering schools and biz and actively pursued policies to censor opposing views
- they attempted to get T off the ballot in certain states and succeeded till the SC said no
- they did the bs lawfare that is so blatantly political it isn't funny. They toss around convicted felon with 31 counts. But hid the fact on the jury vote to make the misdemeanor charges a felony were not unanimous. By that I mean there were 3 separate charges voted on. None had to be unanimous. All 12 just had to vote on on one of them. So 4 could vote for 1, 4 for 2 and 4 for 3. None added up to all 12 voting for the same charge. That is a star court.
- their focus on the 20% issues is amazing.
- etc

It really is no wonder that over the past couple of election cycle people have been moving away in droves from the party.

At some point reality will set in and they will moderate. But right now it doesn't look like it will be anytime in the near future.
 
watfly said:
I can't say I'm pro-Trump, as much as I just vehemently disagree with the Dem's current policies and political approach which effectively boils down to lawfare and "Orange Man Bad". A month ago they were vandalizing Tesla's and now they are embracing Musk because he disagrees with Trump. (I support Musk on the BBB debate). Our system relies on a viable two party system and right now the Democratic is not viable and a long way from being so. Choosing the 20% doesn't work.
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This.
 
Desert Hound said:
My thing over the years has been how partisan the press is. They don't report the news. They actively take sides.

I chuckle when I hear people say NY Times or NPR, etc etc are down the middle. I then ask them some basic questions.
- when is the last time you saw articles/stories in favor of lets say tax cuts, smaller gov, gun rights...etc etc. Stories in favor of those and other issues in the mainstream press are as rare as sightings of bigfoot. Just really doesn't happen. You may get the occasional oped from a conservative in there...but the news sections, etc align almost 100% with one party (Ds).

And you when you deal with husker and espola you can see they only get info from one type of source.

The dem party currently has gone off the rails.
- they and the deep state pushed the Russian collusion angle despite knowing it wasn't there/true
- they advocated shuttering schools and biz and actively pursued policies to censor opposing views
- they attempted to get T off the ballot in certain states and succeeded till the SC said no
- they did the bs lawfare that is so blatantly political it isn't funny. They toss around convicted felon with 31 counts. But hid the fact on the jury vote to make the misdemeanor charges a felony were not unanimous. By that I mean there were 3 separate charges voted on. None had to be unanimous. All 12 just had to vote on on one of them. So 4 could vote for 1, 4 for 2 and 4 for 3. None added up to all 12 voting for the same charge. That is a star court.
- their focus on the 20% issues is amazing.
- etc

It really is no wonder that over the past couple of election cycle people have been moving away in droves from the party.

At some point reality will set in and they will moderate. But right now it doesn't look like it will be anytime in the near future.
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The Dem's have lost the middle due to their extreme policies that defy common sense. So the Dem's only have themselves to blame for the reelection of Trump.
 
watfly said:
The Dem's have lost the middle due to their extreme policies that defy common sense. So the Dem's only have themselves to blame for the reelection of Trump.
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They have lost the middle as shown in the election. But worse for them they have stayed at least as far left ideologically since the election and have moved further left in actions with the decisions of their activist judges, tacit support of firebombings, and their "Margaritas with MS13" approach to illegal criminals and terrorists. At the same time, the middle is moving to the right.
 
kickingandscreaming said:
They have lost the middle as shown in the election. But worse for them they have stayed at least as far left ideologically since the election and have moved further left in actions with the decisions of their activist judges, tacit support of firebombings, and their "Margaritas with MS13" approach to illegal criminals and terrorists. At the same time, the middle is moving to the right.
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There are going to be a lot of story lines between now and the midterms with the two biggest being:

1) Can Trump have a strong economy and lower interest rates
2) Can the Dem's change their tune
 
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