Surf Cup abuse

3 games in 3 days makes sense financially for families but health wise the third day can be tricky...anymore than that is risky but the kids who win or make finals have an amazing time...... national playoffs in Seattle was cool as it was 4 days and 3 games so there was a rest day.......only negative is more $ for families..... it is a balance......overall seeing these events as a vacation with your family to be enjoyed is the best approach versus counting on it getting your kid a scholarship......my kid is no U17 and my advice is just enjoy their journey
 
futboldad1 said:
3 games in 3 days makes sense financially for families but health wise the third day can be tricky...anymore than that is risky but the kids who win or make finals have an amazing time...... national playoffs in Seattle was cool as it was 4 days and 3 games so there was a rest day.......only negative is more $ for families..... it is a balance......overall seeing these events as a vacation with your family to be enjoyed is the best approach versus counting on it getting your kid a scholarship......my kid is no U17 and my advice is just enjoy their journey
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100%. However, when I did my back to back "vacation" to Seattle and Texas in 2017, my son called me out for trying to BS him with the vacation....lol! I made it up to him with a father/son vacation. It was epic. I had to be honest with him when he called me out.
 
oh canada said:
At least 4 teams from EVERY bracket are playing four games in four days. That's a lot of players. Then you have two teams from EVERY bracket playing 2x on the same day (after three previous games). These are not 8yr olds. Talk to every 14-18yr old after three games and I guarantee you they are playing hurt or exhausted. If not, then they don't play hard.

Every team has players that play more than 50% in every game. If you don't know that, then you haven't been watching much U14-u19 soccer.

Given pressures from coaches and other parents, there's no way a kid is going to say "sit me because I need more rest/recovery time" during a college recruiting event. This statement from you makes me think you have no experience yet in these upper age groups.

What's the GOOD reason for playing a 4th game in 4 days? Colleges don't, youth national teams don't, professionals don't. Most of the scouts are gone, the players are exhausted, the soccer is bad, and the injury risk is at its PEAK. There is NO benefit to the player.
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Believe it or not, some players are playing because they love to play. They thrive on and love the competition and are not necessarily doing any of this for college soccer. I know a number of older ECNL players who are prioritizing academics over soccer for thier college goals.
 
The odds of any one player getting hurt in that workload are not that high (most will not get hurt) but the odds of some players getting hurt are quite high. And when you need to pay really close attention is in the days after - does coach have them train w/o recovery days? - and in the aggregate load during tournament season. Sure, many love the game. And, of course, no competitive kid wants to risk not being on the pitch when the coach of the dream school is there but there is no question the risk is greater the more games/minutes in the highest concentration of days. As someone noted upthread, pros and college players don’t have that type of load. As someone who has 2 post-ACL surgery kids at home (and a college playing kid who did play in that format back in the day), it’s a bit disconcerting.

(Look at the Vegas Players Showcase schedules . . . Sometimes 3 games w/in 24 hrs and 4 games w/in 40)
 
soccer4us said:
No one go to tournaments and let your kids know sorry, no tournaments in your career. Have fun though!
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Not really what anyone is saying but it is worth it to always look with a critical eye to confirm what works and adjust what doesn't. The higher one goes in the sport, the more player and parent are exposed to overuse injuries - ACL tears included. Is there a single variable? No. But can we mitigate risk but reducing the # of 4 game/2 day or 3 game/24 hr events? Yes.

NCAA is moving from using OT to decide games this coming season. Why not? Nobody likes ties. We need wins and losses? Or, because the accumulated workload - at the end of OT on a Sun of a two-game weekend or over the course of the season - puts players at risk, lowers the quality of the games and can be addressed through other means for post-season bids.
 
oh canada said:
Said it last year and will say it again...making high schoolers play 4-5 games in 4 days is child abuse. Even 3 games in 3 days is much, but I understand you kinda gotta do that for the college coaches. There's no reason other than Surf Cup $ that older ages need to "crown a champion". Praying for all to be injury-free down there.
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No one is "making" you. You don't want to play. Don't show up. Simple.
 
Love the adults shooting crap. Why don't you ask any kid, boy or girl, if it's too much or too many games for them?
 
bigkick said:
No one is "making" you. You don't want to play. Don't show up. Simple.
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Koalas brain levels are the equivalent of being high all the time. They will fight over eucalyptus leaves even though they can eat any leaf and the eucalyptus is much more difficult to digest.
 
oh canada said:
And scientists say Koalas are the dumbest mammals?
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Meh. You seem to think that there aren't kids there that are crazy obsessed with soccer and passionately want to work at being the best. As the parent of a kid whose seen him painfully fall on his face countless times, and has repeatedly tried to get him out of this broken game (yet somehow he's not only managed to pick himself up on his own with all the adults piling on him, and become not only competent but good), I can most assuredly tell you they exist.

Now you can argue:
-That's not healthy for kids....we as adults should stop them;
-There are kids out there that are not like this, and whose parents push them into doing 4 games a weekend; and/or
-Kids that are not crazy obsessed do not belong and should not being playing at the highest levels.

But "it's abuse" is a sloppy lazy argument. Some kids, especially at the higher levels, are just wired that way.
 
To be fair, they also argued that Alex Morgan was wrong for stating she wanted to be back for the Olympics after giving birth……
 
Grace T. said:
Meh. You seem to think that there aren't kids there that are crazy obsessed with soccer and passionately want to work at being the best. As the parent of a kid whose seen him painfully fall on his face countless times, and has repeatedly tried to get him out of this broken game (yet somehow he's not only managed to pick himself up on his own with all the adults piling on him, and become not only competent but good), I can most assuredly tell you they exist.

Now you can argue:
-That's not healthy for kids....we as adults should stop them;
-There are kids out there that are not like this, and whose parents push them into doing 4 games a weekend; and/or
-Kids that are not crazy obsessed do not belong and should not being playing at the highest levels.

But "it's abuse" is a sloppy lazy argument. Some kids, especially at the higher levels, are just wired that way.
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oh gawd - i wouldn't spend time replying to most others writing the above, but i expect more from you Grace T. Read my post, not the headline. I know there are kids who will/want to play 5 games in 4 days (my eldest son was one). I also know (and teach) A LOT of kids who drink 3 Arizona Teas every day. They need adults to tell them when too much of a good thing can be a bad thing. Unfortunately, many parents don't have that good sense. So, it's incumbent upon the tournament organizer to not put inspired kids and obsessed parents in that predicament. High school aged kids shouldn't play 4 or 5 games in 4 days...period. If you argue otherwise, then I've got a eucalyptus leaf for you.
 
Surf cup is like many tournaments driven to make $$ by almost all means possible.

Are they any different vs Cerritos Memorial or any other tournament where you can play up to 6 games over 3 to 4 day?

Surf was always a great experience for our players, Mondays the best day. finals only before the 2-a-days. Of course helps when you have multiple jackets but it's up to the parents and players to decide if they want to overcome obstacles and push through or not.

Complaining after is amusing but all info is published prior to the tournament so you know what's your signing up for.

Funding rasing for a local club is one thing but these are multiple millions dollar operations where directors can make six-figures easy.

surf cup is just one participant in a overall bigger problem where almost everything is setup to benefit the organizers , some club etc It's not players first but players last in getting a say about things.

Do the heavy legged player enjoy that 5th and 6th game? or just going through the motions. Some will but overall majority would likely tell you they need a break.
 
oh canada said:
oh gawd - i wouldn't spend time replying to most others writing the above, but i expect more from you Grace T. Read my post, not the headline. I know there are kids who will/want to play 5 games in 4 days (my eldest son was one). I also know (and teach) A LOT of kids who drink 3 Arizona Teas every day. They need adults to tell them when too much of a good thing can be a bad thing. Unfortunately, many parents don't have that good sense. So, it's incumbent upon the tournament organizer to not put inspired kids and obsessed parents in that predicament. High school aged kids shouldn't play 4 or 5 games in 4 days...period. If you argue otherwise, then I've got a eucalyptus leaf for you.
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As I said, that's a fair critique, but really all you are complaining about is the additional 5th game as 4 is fairly standard for winning teams at tournaments (or perhaps the entire tournament system....but that's a conversation for another day). I wouldn't have characterized it as "abuse" except to the extent the entire system is abusive. There is a simple remedy: don't go. You are of course free to critique other parent's parenting choices (but we know how that usually goes) and to rail against the system (hey I'm right there with you), but it is the system we got and that's not going to change until you fix college recruitment).
 
oh canada said:
oh gawd - i wouldn't spend time replying to most others writing the above, but i expect more from you Grace T. Read my post, not the headline. I know there are kids who will/want to play 5 games in 4 days (my eldest son was one). I also know (and teach) A LOT of kids who drink 3 Arizona Teas every day. They need adults to tell them when too much of a good thing can be a bad thing. Unfortunately, many parents don't have that good sense. So, it's incumbent upon the tournament organizer to not put inspired kids and obsessed parents in that predicament. High school aged kids shouldn't play 4 or 5 games in 4 days...period. If you argue otherwise, then I've got a eucalyptus leaf for you.
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The better (but also bad) analogy is that it's Arizona Tea's fault that kids drink three of them a day because Arizona Tea is the one marketing and selling the "dangerous" product, just like Surf Cup is the one marketing and selling its "dangerous" product. Presumably, then Arizona Tea should be forced to sell only sugarfree decaf because it knows many kids do not have responsible parents who will hold them accountable for too much of a good thing.

In reality, the team's club coach is actually the teacher in your analogy, who should be telling his students they're doing too much when their parents are too stupid to do anything themselves.
 
GoldenGate said:
The better (but also bad) analogy is that it's Arizona Tea's fault that kids drink three of them a day because Arizona Tea is the one marketing and selling the "dangerous" product, just like Surf Cup is the one marketing and selling its "dangerous" product. Presumably, then Arizona Tea should be forced to sell only sugarfree decaf because it knows many kids do not have responsible parents who will hold them accountable for too much of a good thing.

In reality, the team's club coach is actually the teacher in your analogy, who should be telling his students they're doing too much when their parents are too stupid to do anything themselves.
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Parents should do it. Do you actually want each set of parents to come up with their own rules for how much their kid can play?

I’m trying to imagine the coach reaction if 18 players came in with 18 different sets of restrictions for how much they can play.
 
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