Speed, strength and agility training

Chalklines said:
Have any of you actually researched or studied over training? Or are we just repeating somthing you thought sounded hip & intelligent?

If emphasis is placed on nutrition/sleep in between work outs, over training turns into a myth.

Remember the days of old? Grabbing a ball in the morning and playing all day till it got dark, every day, all summer? Throw in some swimming days and foot races with your friends... Etc.... Etc.....

Was that over training? It's a lot more then some of these kids are doing now inside and out of their clubs.

Organized sports have become the new "play" because kids don't go outside to play with their friends.
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I'm with you. I would add that I think some people mis-identify speed and strength training with massive repetitions. A qualified trainer will focus much more on proper technique than reps. I will venture a guess that more injuries are caused by improper technique than over training, and that many "over training" injuries are the result of bad technique.

A typical club soccer player is only getting 4.5 hours of training/play a week. Adding in another hour or so of speed/agility should be beneficial and not a problem. All kids are different physically and mentally, but 6 hours of training a week should be nothing for a competitive youth athlete. As I've mentioned before my daughter trains 12-20+ hours a week for dance which is more physically demanding than soccer, other than the contact. In 7 years at this pace she has not had an injury ('knock on wood"), and overtraining injuries are uncommon at her studio. We don't push her and always ask if she wants to scale back. She never complains, she loves it.

Now I'm not going to pretend that any kid can train at that level, very few can. And there are probably some kids that can't handle even 4.5 hours of training a week. The point being is that we can't generalize what is too much or too little training for kids, each child is different.
 
Group training my son goes to is plyo, speed and agility training - along with footwork. Been the best thing he has done for balance the last 3 years - as well as improving touch on the ball. Now as he is growing, not big on stretching - which i try to hammer into him. Stubborn almost teen. Groin usually bugs him which has cause imbalance. Tried to find a no BS yoga program he can go to in our area and nothing around - all adults or for tots. A lot of coaches are working in plyo, agility work for younger kids now but 10-15 mins of work as well at least one 60 min training session a week. Doing strength/agility training 2-3x a week,is over doing it - especially on those who havent hit puberty. Plenty of plyo studies online and most involve 2 or 3 x a week - but they involve teens or adults. Another overlooked aspect is mobility - kids need to learn how to massage their muscles - heat & manual manipulation, foam rollers, balls, etc. If you powerlift youll know how important it is to be both flexible & ease of which your muscles can move through a movement (mobility). My kid is as stiff as cardboard. so working on that.
 
JJP said:
I asked my kid what he did in speed training and why it worked for him. I normally have to drive him far for practices so I stay to watch, but his speed coach is just a few blocks from my house so my kid bikes there. His trainer has an impeccable reputation and my kid really liked working with him and it was working, so I just paid the dude and let him handle it.

First, the trainer does an assessment for imbalances. Right footed player is normally stronger in his left foot, but has better control on his right foot, for example. He determined that as my son grew, he had not strengthened enough his lower leg muscles to support his weight on the balls of his feet, and he was over striding and not pushing off, shortening his follow through.

The trainer made him do a bunch of exercises to balance him and strengthen the muscles he needed to get on the balls of his feet, and fix his stride mechanics. I have no idea what those exercises were. All I know is, I spent all of last season yelling at my kid "Get on the balls of your feet and run knees high!" It was a waste of breath. I could see the problem but I had no idea how to fix it.

My advice is, soccer is the beautiful game. Good players should move beautifully when they are playing. If your kid is serious about getting better, and there's something that looks off, you should get the coaching to fix it. Even if your kid is moving ugly and playing well, to me, it just means the kid is too physically mature or talented for the level of competition. Against higher level competition inefficient movement will not cut it.

My son was doing fine in flight 1 but when he went academy he really struggled because he was not moving right. It took nearly a season to fix his mechanics but by the end of the season he was blowing by quality academy level defenders.
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is this in a public area or in a group? guess his age would be important as well. wouldnt be comfortable my kid being alone with a trainer or medical provider.
 
Fact said:
Don't forget proper stretching before and after practice and games. Speaking with PT specialists, a large percentage of kids they see are due to tight muscles that have a domino effect throughout the body. The rollers that some clubs are giving their teams are great, but one or two quick rolls on the legs is not enough.
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Our coaches have our girls using the FIFA 11 stretching/warm-up regime. I like it because it accounts for both sexes in the stretches being used. Someone a few months ago posted a video on it and it broke down why it was created.
 
Fact said:
Don't forget proper stretching before and after practice and games. Speaking with PT specialists, a large percentage of kids they see are due to tight muscles that have a domino effect throughout the body. The rollers that some clubs are giving their teams are great, but one or two quick rolls on the legs is not enough.
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Im big on stretching as well but ton of studies show stretching isnt that important at earlier ages - or we would see kids blowing out hammies, groins, quads at school at recess when they go into full sprints cold. As they get older, muscles grow/denser, more important. genetics big factor. my kid not naturally flexible.
 
Last spring just before club break and into the summer we enrolled our kids in to speed and agility class. They thoroughly enjoyed it. We did take into account that there was not much soccer happening at that time. And made sure our kids wanted to do it. It also focused on core strength and was grouped by age. Class sizes were between 3-4 kids. The instructor has a PTC and a former Olympian. She made the class fun and incorporated games into each session. Cost was great if you accessed weekly.
 
Not_that_Serious said:
Im big on stretching as well but ton of studies show stretching isnt that important at earlier ages - or we would see kids blowing out hammies, groins, quads at school at recess when they go into full sprints cold. As they get older, muscles grow/denser, more important. genetics big factor. my kid not naturally flexible.
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In my experience I've seen pulled muscles and other related injuries(due to tightness during growth spurts) starting around 12 for girls and a little later for boys. No one is naturally tight. It is all a matter of stretching. A family member was a punter in high school where he was average. He is now in the pros and attributes it to the yoga he does religiously. The height of his kicks are now amazing since he is more agile.
 
Fact said:
In my experience I've seen pulled muscles and other related injuries(due to tightness during growth spurts) starting around 12 for girls and a little later for boys. No one is naturally tight. It is all a matter of stretching. A family member was a punter in high school where he was average. He is now in the pros and attributes it to the yoga he does religiously. The height of his kicks are now amazing since he is more agile.
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yes due to the growth spurts. flexibility has a lot to do with genetics - physical attributes such as bone size and structure often determine how flexible someone is. a rail thin kid isnt going to be the same as a thick kid - my kid isnt tiny and even while in martial arts starting at 6, has always had a problem with flexibility. sucks that all the yoga near here is for really tots or for adults - think someone would do well if they offered yoga for kids/adults in sports here in south OC.

i will add, yogis will say it isnt genetic. id say those who do learn to be flexible become flexible at different rates and with different ROM. so genetics are a factor. would take me a lot longer to be flexible given the genetics my mom handed me down (bone issues) than someone free of such conditions
 
Not_that_Serious said:
is this in a public area or in a group? guess his age would be important as well. wouldnt be comfortable my kid being alone with a trainer or medical provider.
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You can watch the kids train. I saw a session or two, it looked good and then I left. At this point, my boy is a teenager and my feeling is he needs to make his own decisions if he wants to train and how hard he wants to train, and I'd rather he do that without me hovering over him.
 
JJP said:
You can watch the kids train. I saw a session or two, it looked good and then I left. At this point, my boy is a teenager and my feeling is he needs to make his own decisions if he wants to train and how hard he wants to train, and I'd rather he do that without me hovering over him.
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you mean teens dont love you hovering over them? hah. i hear you. my kid is in middle school, getting there
 
There are programs that do saq training and than there are track coaches. I'm stuck in between those two options. Trying to figure out what is best. My little one loves to run and I'm taking her to the track coach. However it's mostly running.
 
I would recommend finding a trainer that focus on both injury prevention - knee exercises - and core training. The core really helps keep hips, thighs and quads in proper shape.
 
Josep said:
I would recommend finding a trainer that focus on both injury prevention - knee exercises - and core training. The core really helps keep hips, thighs and quads in proper shape.
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I agree! I would like to try another location close to me that specialized in youth sports saq training....I guess I'm trying to get a feel for other peoples experience to see what's best. my older kid did saq training and I felt it made her stronger and she had speed and quickness when it came to running. But she started at an older age at maybe 12-13. My little one is 9 and I'm not sure saq training is good for her at such a young age. Even though the program starts them at 7 years old. That seems so young to me.
 
A lot more teams are doing CrossFit as well. Not sure that’s the answer. But there’s no question the core training is beneficial. My second kid started at u10.
 
behindthescene said:
Crossfit is the absolute worst training for athletes. Athletes bodies aren't built for muscle burnout each and every workout.
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Im with you I don't think Crossfit is right for what we are doing.

Core exercise is very good , repetition is even better. Real drills that mimic actual play is perfect. Stamina is key.

Similar to Martial Arts they teach Technique Strength and Stamina, Soccer is very similar .

Technique equals touch , A good player needs Touch first IMO. If you kid is constantly losing the ball when its past to him/her, work on touch, period. If you child cannot trap a ball, be able to pass on awkward angles, complete good pass thru pass, then you need to work on touch, nobody likes kickball and we see it a lot , even in Flight One unfortunately....

Strength to be able to body on the ball , break thru defenders, can come from core exercise and lots of practice and training, they are working their muscles intensely ,(As a parent are you training 3-4 X's a week?) no need to lift weight just yet, Im not against it but still their building muscles daily on the pitch. When the kids are shoulder to shoulder , the stronger more aggressive one will win especially if he/she has the touch or Technique to control the ball at higher speeds...Leverage , Body Control, Strength all that is important.

Stamina , obviously come from a lot of practice, playing time , training, etc...... Our coach runs the hell out of our kids and they rock, they are definitely a first and second half team, their rarely ever tired and in the second half when teams are gassed , their just running circles around them

You want your kid to stand out make sure they never Run out of Gas, have a Good Touch, and has Decent Strength to battle thru on the field.....it will come , they just need the dedication to be better, if your kid wants extra training, do it! Or better yet go out on the field yourself, with them and have fun, work hard as hell, but have fun.


just my 2cents....
 
Chalklines said:
Have any of you actually researched or studied over training? Or are we just repeating somthing you thought sounded hip & intelligent?

If emphasis is placed on nutrition/sleep in between work outs, over training turns into a myth.

Remember the days of old? Grabbing a ball in the morning and playing all day till it got dark, every day, all summer? Throw in some swimming days and foot races with your friends... Etc.... Etc.....

Was that over training? It's a lot more then some of these kids are doing now inside and out of their clubs.

Organized sports have become the new "play" because kids don't go outside to play with their friends.
Click to expand...
Interesting, I remember the "good old days" of playing outside all day, oh ya, we stopped when we wanted, ran inside for "refreshments", went out side and chatted and did what ever then played something again. It was never at the same intensity as training, games,and more training. Oh yes, the good old days of walking to school 8 miles in the snow and in 110 degree heat!
 
sandshark said:
If your kid is playing almost every weekend and training 3-4 days per week with their club and then you adding some outside "Speed and agility trainer" they are being way way over trained! These are little growing bodies and can only handle so much.
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Actually my 10 years old trains 2 times a week with her team, 1 private on her own and she does 2 saq trainings a week. Maybe 6-7.5 hours a week divided by 5 days.

She used to do gymnastics and those girls train 15-20 hrs a week. I thought this was way less when you calculate the hours per week.
 
JJP said:
I asked my kid what he did in speed training and why it worked for him. I normally have to drive him far for practices so I stay to watch, but his speed coach is just a few blocks from my house so my kid bikes there. His trainer has an impeccable reputation and my kid really liked working with him and it was working, so I just paid the dude and let him handle it.

First, the trainer does an assessment for imbalances. Right footed player is normally stronger in his left foot, but has better control on his right foot, for example. He determined that as my son grew, he had not strengthened enough his lower leg muscles to support his weight on the balls of his feet, and he was over striding and not pushing off, shortening his follow through.

The trainer made him do a bunch of exercises to balance him and strengthen the muscles he needed to get on the balls of his feet, and fix his stride mechanics. I have no idea what those exercises were. All I know is, I spent all of last season yelling at my kid "Get on the balls of your feet and run knees high!" It was a waste of breath. I could see the problem but I had no idea how to fix it.

My advice is, soccer is the beautiful game. Good players should move beautifully when they are playing. If your kid is serious about getting better, and there's something that looks off, you should get the coaching to fix it. Even if your kid is moving ugly and playing well, to me, it just means the kid is too physically mature or talented for the level of competition. Against higher level competition inefficient movement will not cut it.

My son was doing fine in flight 1 but when he went academy he really struggled because he was not moving right. It took nearly a season to fix his mechanics but by the end of the season he was blowing by quality academy level defenders.

Thank you for this information! It really helped open my eyes. My dd just moved up and I noticed the difference in her running. As if she wasn’t mature enough. I couldn’t place my finger on it until Now. I just started her back up on saq training a month ago and I can’t wait to see if it helps with her running form.
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Great information regarding stretching, getting an assessment at beginning, not a trainer that just pounds the pavement... Any recommendations for speed/agility/technique trainers in OC area? You can PM me is you do not want to post. Thanks
 
I'll post all day long about our trainer his name is Chris Rameriez and he owns Touch n Go Soccer located in Tustin. Half out team trains with him now and he's the real deal. Nice Indoor facility , small class sizes and 75 minutes of 1v1 training , strength and agility and ball mastery. Im very happy with what he's doing to my son, my kid is a center mid and he owns that position now. Confidence and crazy drive . Call Chris you will not be disappointed!
 
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