Keeping up with the soccer Joneses

[crush]

U10-U11 we were spending about $10k a year. U12, for “Pre-ECNL” is was about $12k and U13-U17 it’s been between $17.5k and $20k per year. That’s $110k to $120k roughly.

Looks like your family had a fun. I know a real close-knit family of four that spent close to $150K flying around the country for years. The dd got 75% soccer and 25% for her brains. Great family. She has no desire to go Pro and will most likely be a Lawyer or a Doctor.

 

[3253]

TRIGGER WARNING: These are just opinions and my generalizations. There are always outliers. I'm sure whoever gets mad at my opinion it's because your kid is the outlier and the only one different. These are all related to boys.

Also, I'm not saying any of this is morally right or how things should be... but this is the reality that I see. I ain't the enemy, just calling what I see. To be honest, I detest most of it. So... this is just what I see, in my experience. You don't like it... yeah, neither do I. You disagree, cool. Move on, I'm good.

1. Are college scholarships given to a lot of southern CA soccer male players more so than from other states?

Yes, statistically, more soccer players come out of Southern California than any other region.... around 40% of all USMNT players have ties to SoCal.

2. How and when do you judge if it’s something attainable for your son?

I have coached players who have gone on to play in the MLS. I also know numerous players and close friends personally who have signed homegrown deals and or are playing USL, USL-1 or MLS Next Pro. I also watch a ton of MLS academy games.

The vast majority of players who have a shot at becoming professionals are or were playing up 1 to 2 age groups in the most challenging available league and still dominant. If you are playing your age group and good, congrats. But less than 1% of all players become pros and less than 7% become collegiate athletes at any level... so you don't need to be good in your age group, you need to be better than your entire age group and good above that.

My top advice for any young parent who recognizes any level of natural ability in their child to, as early as possible, move them up an age group. Never play with your birth year peers until you have hit the highest level you can... and then work to be pulled up one more... ha. This is true in MLS academies. You have 2009s playing u17 with 2007s. You have 2008s playing NextPro with u23s. You have a 2006 starting last week at Columbus Crew. Even America's next great hope Cavan Sullivan is a 2009 playing NextPro against u23s. More than half of all MLS u17 (2007 year) teams are 2008s playing at least one year up. Moral: Be the best amongst those older...

If you are not playing up 1-2 age groups by 16, I would recommend college as the primary focus and goal. Sure, keep the pro dream alive whatever but plan that it will likely occur after college, not after high school, if at all.

Based on the last 3 years of recruiting classes that I've seen...
If you are dominant and starting at an MLS academy, I would think top D1 or any option.
If you are very dominant at the ECNL level and also at a powerhouse high school, then I would think top D1 or any option.
If you are playing MLS Academy and aren't dominant at the MLS level, I would focus on a second tier D1 or D2.
If you are starting at a good MLS Next but non-MLS academy (TFA, Strikers, etc) or MLS Academy kids who aren't dominant, I'd target second tier D1 or D2.
If you are ECNL in your age group and starting or getting minutes... JuCo, D3, D2 or NAIA.
If you are at a lower MLS Next non-MLS Academy, JuCo, D3, D2 or NAIA.

3. Did I miss something along the way about preparing kids to get scholarships that these parents had?

Unfortunately, quite likely. MLS Academy rosters are full of parents who either really know the system, found a trainer who was well-connected and very good and/or are former college/pro athletes. Fair or not, it is largely a closed system of elite players who all grew up together or players who can afford the very high quality and highly technical connected trainers.

4. Do boys playing on MLS next teams and ECNL only get scholarships and not the ones playing EA?

See previous post about soccer being an equivalence sport and the 9.9. Unless you are a US Youth national team level player, you are NOT getting a full ride to a D1 school. Those are rare and used to entice a player who could also go professional. Most PSA (potential student athletes) will get some sort of stackable scholarships. Thus, the higher your grades or other scholarships, the more attractive you are to a coach. You will also likely only get a smaller percentage your freshman year and then it goes up each year. This rewards your likely older starter as well as motivates players to not go into the portal.

Also, I listed above where I see most of the scholarships falling. Early in the recruiting season, you will see a lot of scholarships go to the top ECNL players and non-MLS Academy MLS Next players as the MLS Academy players are weighing their option of college vs NextPro.

FWIW, I rarely see an ECNL player sign D1 who isn't also at a power-house high school.

5. And if this is something you want for your kid to have a shot at do you need to do extra trainings etc.?

Sorry but 100%. The benefit is your top players don't pay for anything... gear, travel costs, food on team trips, hotels, club fees... nothing, but then the parents are spending the money on extra training to try and get an edge. If you do what everyone else does, you will be what everyone else is. Also, there are some really great trainers... who have no connections to top teams. So, who you train with matters. Find out who else trains with them. You can look at the LAG and LAFC rosters and see the products of about 3-5 different trainers... BigCat, YPS, Mike Chapin, ProCarthy, First strike... etc.

Again, other great trainers out there, but in a closed system, it's who you know.

All of this is a meat grinder of a system. My advice is to protect the joy of soccer for your kid. Don't push so hard towards a goal of scholarship or a certain skill level that you crush the kid along the way. Some love it... more flame out and then succeed emotionally and soccer-ly at a lower level (with a lower result).

Don't forget about education. Most of the MLS academies now require online schooling. There are big social sacrifices made so make sure you weigh those out.

 

[3253]

You can look at the LAG and LAFC rosters and see the products of about 3-5 different trainers... BigCat, YPS, Mike Chapin, ProCarthy, First strike... etc.

Plus Willie... man, most of the players at LAFC or LAG have been coached by Willie at some point.

 

[SuperSoccerStar]

"Don't forget about education. Most of the MLS academies now require online schooling."

This comment is very sad for me but its definitely what is happening. On the girls side as well. Just makes me really sad. These kids are not allowed to be kids at all anymore.

 

[Jamisfoes]

TRIGGER WARNING: These are just opinions and my generalizations. There are always outliers. I'm sure whoever gets mad at my opinion it's because your kid is the outlier and the only one different. These are all related to boys.

Also, I'm not saying any of this is morally right or how things should be... but this is the reality that I see. I ain't the enemy, just calling what I see. To be honest, I detest most of it. So... this is just what I see, in my experience. You don't like it... yeah, neither do I. You disagree, cool. Move on, I'm good.


Yes, statistically, more soccer players come out of Southern California than any other region.... around 40% of all USMNT players have ties to SoCal.



I have coached players who have gone on to play in the MLS. I also know numerous players and close friends personally who have signed homegrown deals and or are playing USL, USL-1 or MLS Next Pro. I also watch a ton of MLS academy games.

The vast majority of players who have a shot at becoming professionals are or were playing up 1 to 2 age groups in the most challenging available league and still dominant. If you are playing your age group and good, congrats. But less than 1% of all players become pros and less than 7% become collegiate athletes at any level... so you don't need to be good in your age group, you need to be better than your entire age group and good above that.

My top advice for any young parent who recognizes any level of natural ability in their child to, as early as possible, move them up an age group. Never play with your birth year peers until you have hit the highest level you can... and then work to be pulled up one more... ha. This is true in MLS academies. You have 2009s playing u17 with 2007s. You have 2008s playing NextPro with u23s. You have a 2006 starting last week at Columbus Crew. Even America's next great hope Cavan Sullivan is a 2009 playing NextPro against u23s. More than half of all MLS u17 (2007 year) teams are 2008s playing at least one year up. Moral: Be the best amongst those older...

If you are not playing up 1-2 age groups by 16, I would recommend college as the primary focus and goal. Sure, keep the pro dream alive whatever but plan that it will likely occur after college, not after high school, if at all.

Based on the last 3 years of recruiting classes that I've seen...
If you are dominant and starting at an MLS academy, I would think top D1 or any option.
If you are very dominant at the ECNL level and also at a powerhouse high school, then I would think top D1 or any option.
If you are playing MLS Academy and aren't dominant at the MLS level, I would focus on a second tier D1 or D2.
If you are starting at a good MLS Next but non-MLS academy (TFA, Strikers, etc) or MLS Academy kids who aren't dominant, I'd target second tier D1 or D2.
If you are ECNL in your age group and starting or getting minutes... JuCo, D3, D2 or NAIA.
If you are at a lower MLS Next non-MLS Academy, JuCo, D3, D2 or NAIA.



Unfortunately, quite likely. MLS Academy rosters are full of parents who either really know the system, found a trainer who was well-connected and very good and/or are former college/pro athletes. Fair or not, it is largely a closed system of elite players who all grew up together or players who can afford the very high quality and highly technical connected trainers.


See previous post about soccer being an equivalence sport and the 9.9. Unless you are a US Youth national team level player, you are NOT getting a full ride to a D1 school. Those are rare and used to entice a player who could also go professional. Most PSA (potential student athletes) will get some sort of stackable scholarships. Thus, the higher your grades or other scholarships, the more attractive you are to a coach. You will also likely only get a smaller percentage your freshman year and then it goes up each year. This rewards your likely older starter as well as motivates players to not go into the portal.

Also, I listed above where I see most of the scholarships falling. Early in the recruiting season, you will see a lot of scholarships go to the top ECNL players and non-MLS Academy MLS Next players as the MLS Academy players are weighing their option of college vs NextPro.

FWIW, I rarely see an ECNL player sign D1 who isn't also at a power-house high school.



Sorry but 100%. The benefit is your top players don't pay for anything... gear, travel costs, food on team trips, hotels, club fees... nothing, but then the parents are spending the money on extra training to try and get an edge. If you do what everyone else does, you will be what everyone else is. Also, there are some really great trainers... who have no connections to top teams. So, who you train with matters. Find out who else trains with them. You can look at the LAG and LAFC rosters and see the products of about 3-5 different trainers... BigCat, YPS, Mike Chapin, ProCarthy, First strike... etc.

Again, other great trainers out there, but in a closed system, it's who you know.

All of this is a meat grinder of a system. My advice is to protect the joy of soccer for your kid. Don't push so hard towards a goal of scholarship or a certain skill level that you crush the kid along the way. Some love it... more flame out and then succeed emotionally and soccer-ly at a lower level (with a lower result).

Don't forget about education. Most of the MLS academies now require online schooling. There are big social sacrifices made so make sure you weigh those out.

These all make sense at the elite level. For lower levels, just search up “Arat” on YouTube. Tell your kid, see Arat can do it at 7year old, what’s wrong with you?

 

[watfly]

TRIGGER WARNING: These are just opinions and my generalizations. There are always outliers. I'm sure whoever gets mad at my opinion it's because your kid is the outlier and the only one different. These are all related to boys.

Also, I'm not saying any of this is morally right or how things should be... but this is the reality that I see. I ain't the enemy, just calling what I see. To be honest, I detest most of it. So... this is just what I see, in my experience. You don't like it... yeah, neither do I. You disagree, cool. Move on, I'm good.


Yes, statistically, more soccer players come out of Southern California than any other region.... around 40% of all USMNT players have ties to SoCal.



I have coached players who have gone on to play in the MLS. I also know numerous players and close friends personally who have signed homegrown deals and or are playing USL, USL-1 or MLS Next Pro. I also watch a ton of MLS academy games.

The vast majority of players who have a shot at becoming professionals are or were playing up 1 to 2 age groups in the most challenging available league and still dominant. If you are playing your age group and good, congrats. But less than 1% of all players become pros and less than 7% become collegiate athletes at any level... so you don't need to be good in your age group, you need to be better than your entire age group and good above that.

My top advice for any young parent who recognizes any level of natural ability in their child to, as early as possible, move them up an age group. Never play with your birth year peers until you have hit the highest level you can... and then work to be pulled up one more... ha. This is true in MLS academies. You have 2009s playing u17 with 2007s. You have 2008s playing NextPro with u23s. You have a 2006 starting last week at Columbus Crew. Even America's next great hope Cavan Sullivan is a 2009 playing NextPro against u23s. More than half of all MLS u17 (2007 year) teams are 2008s playing at least one year up. Moral: Be the best amongst those older...

If you are not playing up 1-2 age groups by 16, I would recommend college as the primary focus and goal. Sure, keep the pro dream alive whatever but plan that it will likely occur after college, not after high school, if at all.

Based on the last 3 years of recruiting classes that I've seen...
If you are dominant and starting at an MLS academy, I would think top D1 or any option.
If you are very dominant at the ECNL level and also at a powerhouse high school, then I would think top D1 or any option.
If you are playing MLS Academy and aren't dominant at the MLS level, I would focus on a second tier D1 or D2.
If you are starting at a good MLS Next but non-MLS academy (TFA, Strikers, etc) or MLS Academy kids who aren't dominant, I'd target second tier D1 or D2.
If you are ECNL in your age group and starting or getting minutes... JuCo, D3, D2 or NAIA.
If you are at a lower MLS Next non-MLS Academy, JuCo, D3, D2 or NAIA.



Unfortunately, quite likely. MLS Academy rosters are full of parents who either really know the system, found a trainer who was well-connected and very good and/or are former college/pro athletes. Fair or not, it is largely a closed system of elite players who all grew up together or players who can afford the very high quality and highly technical connected trainers.


See previous post about soccer being an equivalence sport and the 9.9. Unless you are a US Youth national team level player, you are NOT getting a full ride to a D1 school. Those are rare and used to entice a player who could also go professional. Most PSA (potential student athletes) will get some sort of stackable scholarships. Thus, the higher your grades or other scholarships, the more attractive you are to a coach. You will also likely only get a smaller percentage your freshman year and then it goes up each year. This rewards your likely older starter as well as motivates players to not go into the portal.

Also, I listed above where I see most of the scholarships falling. Early in the recruiting season, you will see a lot of scholarships go to the top ECNL players and non-MLS Academy MLS Next players as the MLS Academy players are weighing their option of college vs NextPro.

FWIW, I rarely see an ECNL player sign D1 who isn't also at a power-house high school.



Sorry but 100%. The benefit is your top players don't pay for anything... gear, travel costs, food on team trips, hotels, club fees... nothing, but then the parents are spending the money on extra training to try and get an edge. If you do what everyone else does, you will be what everyone else is. Also, there are some really great trainers... who have no connections to top teams. So, who you train with matters. Find out who else trains with them. You can look at the LAG and LAFC rosters and see the products of about 3-5 different trainers... BigCat, YPS, Mike Chapin, ProCarthy, First strike... etc.

Again, other great trainers out there, but in a closed system, it's who you know.

All of this is a meat grinder of a system. My advice is to protect the joy of soccer for your kid. Don't push so hard towards a goal of scholarship or a certain skill level that you crush the kid along the way. Some love it... more flame out and then succeed emotionally and soccer-ly at a lower level (with a lower result).

Don't forget about education. Most of the MLS academies now require online schooling. There are big social sacrifices made so make sure you weigh those out.

Great and interesting info. How are kids developing soccer IQ and decision making skills in this system? Is it repetition? How much soccer IQ can be developed and how much is organic/innate?

 

[SoccerFan6]

Based on the last 3 years of recruiting classes that I've seen...
If you are dominant and starting at an MLS academy, I would think top D1 or any option.
If you are very dominant at the ECNL level and also at a powerhouse high school, then I would think top D1 or any option.
If you are playing MLS Academy and aren't dominant at the MLS level, I would focus on a second tier D1 or D2.
If you are starting at a good MLS Next but non-MLS academy (TFA, Strikers, etc) or MLS Academy kids who aren't dominant, I'd target second tier D1 or D2.
If you are ECNL in your age group and starting or getting minutes... JuCo, D3, D2 or NAIA.
If you are at a lower MLS Next non-MLS Academy, JuCo, D3, D2 or NAIA.

Interesting and great info. The bold perfectly describes my son, who is a class of 2025. The higher end D1 schools that he's talking to have most of their 2024 class either transfers or international. Only 2-3 incoming freshman per class. I'd be surprised if he gets offered by a top 25 program, his sweet spot will be lower end D1 or D2. With the transfer portal the best programs are going to want more grown men who can make an immediate impact. Why recruit a 17 year old when you can wait a couple years and poach the same kid when he's 20?

 

[michelleP]

Club soccer is exactly about keeping up with the Joneses. It’s not about scholarships. It’s rich folks putting their kids in activities to boost their own ego. All you need is look at your club’s Facebook page come signing day and you will see the kind of schools recruiting your club. But keep in mind, most rich parents aren’t letting their kids go to crappy D1 schools, they are vain but not stupid.

WTF?! LOL Speak for yourself.

 

[michelleP]

We were at a Duke ID camp last month and one of the parents asked if they could combine soccer scholarships with academic scholarships and the coach laughed. "None of my players has ever had an academic scholarship. You don't get an academic scholarship at Duke unless you have a planet named after you...". It was a funny moment.

Need-based aid is different, though (but you still can't combine them at Duke. I know other schools will let you...).

Wow that sucks.

 

[Socal-Soccer-Dad]

We were at a Duke ID camp last month and one of the parents asked if they could combine soccer scholarships with academic scholarships and the coach laughed. "None of my players has ever had an academic scholarship. You don't get an academic scholarship at Duke unless you have a planet named after you...". It was a funny moment.

Need-based aid is different, though (but you still can't combine them at Duke. I know other schools will let you...).

I went to an Ivy wanna-be (you know, the Duke/Chicago/Vandy/UNC type) and knew some kids at my school with full academic scholarships. They were incredibly smart. Probably did have a planet named after them or wrote a book or saved an African village. Many of them could have gone to Ivies but decided to come to my school due to getting a full ride.

On the topic of scholarships, I know D3 and Ivies all do not give athletic scholarships BUT I hear that they'll "find you" some scholarships if you do go to those schools via sports. Is this accurate? Does anyone know from experience or heard anything concrete on this?

 

[Socal-Soccer-Dad]

You can look at the LAG and LAFC rosters and see the products of about 3-5 different trainers... BigCat, YPS, Mike Chapin, ProCarthy, First strike... etc.

Plus Willie... man, most of the players at LAFC or LAG have been coached by Willie at some point.

EST Football, Michael Holzer, Goldenboot Academy, JPS, Accelerator School, Golden Touch, Marcel Lowitsch

Any of these have connections to academies?

 

[Jamisfoes]

I went to an Ivy wanna-be (you know, the Duke/Chicago/Vandy/UNC type) and knew some kids at my school with full academic scholarships. They were incredibly smart. Probably did have a planet named after them or wrote a book or saved an African village. Many of them could have gone to Ivies but decided to come to my school due to getting a full ride.

On the topic of scholarships, I know D3 and Ivies all do not give athletic scholarships BUT I hear that they'll "find you" some scholarships if you do go to those schools via sports. Is this accurate? Does anyone know from experience or heard anything concrete on this?

Girls still sometimes get full rides. Boys are only getting quarter scholarships nowadays.

 

[3253]

EST Football, Michael Holzer, Goldenboot Academy, JPS, Accelerator School, Golden Touch, Marcel Lowitsch

Any of these have connections to academies?

Holzer has relationships I know of but I get the sense that his niche is YNT girls and celebs. I think he makes more doing the private training than he could youth coaching. Great guy and I feel like I could come out of retirement and run through a brick wall after spending 5 minutes with him, until I remember I’m old and out of shape. lol. He’s top notch though, IMO.

I said YPS earlier but meant JPS but couldn’t edit. He used to be at LAFC at the inception.

Never heard of anyone else but again, that’s just me not a reflection of their ability.

 

[3253]

If your goal is playing at the highest level available, you could ask a club: how many of their players have gone on to Galaxy or LAFC? A lot of boys started at TFA or Strikers and Sporting Arsenal and Beach on the ECNL side. There’s one offs here and there of course... also, by u17 year, most have been at either club at least 2-4 years. The gap is real and hard to jump in late.

 

[SoCalGirlsSoccer]

If you are chasing scholarship $ you will be wildly disappointed. Maybe you will break even. Maybe.

My D has played on a top 5 team in the quarter of the country we live in since U10. She’s been getting on a plane to go to tournaments since then. U10-U11 we were spending about $10k a year. U12, for “Pre-ECNL” is was about $12k and U13-U17 it’s been between $17.5k and $20k per year. That’s $110k to $120k roughly.

She just got her first D1 offer. $35k in athletic $ for a school that is $70k per year. I know several girls who are stronger players who got offers in the $25k range for similar schools.

The kicker, my D will get a better academic offer (slightly north of the $35k in athletic money) at the same school, so she will take that, since they can’t stack athletic and academic money. It’s one or the other.

I wouldn’t change a thing, because if she lived a different life we would have gone skiing every year or whatever. That said, my point is the idea of chasing $ is a losing proposition.

This is where I am at. It’s been super fun for her and us, traveling here and there, making the most out of our little vacations. A couple of years more then she is done with club and off to college…and then I can piss my money away on other things like college and living expenses

 

[3253]

Girls still sometimes get full rides. Boys are only getting quarter scholarships nowadays.

For boys, I've seen plenty of full ride offers plus including NLI money... but like I previously said, they're reserved for US YNT level guys. I'm seeing a lot of full tuition but not room/board. Also, a percentage (say 50% freshman year then goes up) plus additional starter bonuses.

I"m also seeing full ride offers thrown in with a lower Next Pro salary to play for an MLS NextPro team.

 

[oh canada]

On the topic of scholarships, I know D3 and Ivies all do not give athletic scholarships BUT I hear that they'll "find you" some scholarships if you do go to those schools via sports. Is this accurate? Does anyone know from experience or heard anything concrete on this?

ivies do not give athletic, talent, nor merit (academic) scholarships - every kid that goes is smart. $ awards are based on financial need, period. There are calculators online. Here's one: https://college.harvard.edu/financial-aid/net-price-calculator

 

[espola]

For boys, I've seen plenty of full ride offers plus including NLI money... but like I previously said, they're reserved for US YNT level guys. I'm seeing a lot of full tuition but not room/board. Also, a percentage (say 50% freshman year then goes up) plus additional starter bonuses.

I"m also seeing full ride offers thrown in with a lower Next Pro salary to play for an MLS NextPro team.

I was under the impression that offering NIL money was a violation of whatever the current rules are. Even so, the NIL money must come from businesses not under the school's control -- is that not right?

 

[Carlsbad7]

I"m also seeing full ride offers thrown in with a lower Next Pro salary to play for an MLS NextPro team.

This is interesting.

Never thought about just throwing in the equivalent of a full ride scholarship into a pro signing bonus.

Takes the possibility of missing out on a college degree out of the equation.

 

[focomoso]

I"m also seeing full ride offers thrown in with a lower Next Pro salary to play for an MLS NextPro team.

Do you mean the cash equivalent of a full-ride scholarship added to the salary or an actual scholarship to a school that you attend during or after your MLS NextPro tenure?