HIGH SCHOOL SOCCER TRYOUTS ARE A RIGGED SHITSTORM AND I'M PISSED ABOUT IT

[Grace T.]

I was actually talking about the boys side given that the OP's post was about boys soccer. I don't know as much about the girls teams (niece isn't there yet until next year)-- I know at his private high school most of the varsity girls players are ECNL or ECRL players, while the varsity boys are merely club soccer players. Yes, private schools tend to make way for players (but again even my son's lower middling private school had cuts for both boys and girls) and not all private schools are equal (on the west side, Oaks, Chaminade, Sierra Canyon, Harvard Westlake all have great teams, and some I know give out scholarships of varying size). The variable I'm most curious about is how it goes in the Latino heavy high schools of the city-- there are plenty of boys for example that still play Latino league rec into high school but not as many girls and ECNL opportunities are a dearth in the downtown triangle. But I wouldn't be surprised, especially in white areas, if the girl's side was more competitive than even the boys have become. The girls also don't have the MLS Next prohibition against high school, right?

It's a bit ridiculous we've gotten to the point that even at middling high schools kids need to be letter leaguers in order to make varsity, let alone the freshman team.

oh p.s. The other difference with private schools is they have soccer PE in the fall to bring up to speed the non-club players and players who might wind up cut and if the program is large enough they'll organize intramural friendlies (5 v 5 for example).

I roll my eyes whenever anybody says selections are political and rigged. Sure there may be the exception here and there. But for the most part coaches are trying to select the best players based on limited information/tryouts and it is a subjective, far-from-perfect process.

Imagine yourself in the coach's shoes at tryouts and you are looking at many of the players for the first time (I'm doing this right now for a middle school team). It's easy to spot the handful of players who are just better and will make the team. It's easy to weed out the bottom players who are not good enough. But then you have this big swath of players in the middle that you will need to choose from to round out the roster. That is the tough part and the selections will always be debatable. That's competitive soccer.

I tell my kids that if you want to make a certain team that it's not good enough to be at the same level. You have to be heads-and-shoulders above the others if you want to ensure a spot on that team.

I agree with this. However in high school soccer there does tend to be one very widespread tiebreaker: how high of an upperclassman the kid is. If they are a senior, the tie break is likely to go to them. If they've played on the team before, the tie break is likely to go to them over say an equivalent sophomore who has not played on the team before.

 

[Socal-Soccer-Dad]

A part of me wanted to say "get over it kid, you're overreacting" but then I kinda enjoyed that - the unadulterated 15 year old rant against the system. I was 15 once, albeit 30 years ago... I vaguely remember the anger... just walking around angry about everything haha...

The Varsity Boys™ Are Pre-Selected GODS.
Here’s the kicker: TRYOUTS DON’T EVEN MATTER. Yeah, you heard me. That Varsity squad? PRE-FUCKING-MADE. All those little darlings from last year? They automatically make Varsity again. It doesn’t matter if they were lazy or played like shit during tryouts—they’re in. Coach Clipboard literally said there's like 5 FUCKING SPOTS available on Varsity BEFORE FUCKING DAY 1 OF TRYOUTS STARTED. They automatically get a pass. Why? Oh, because they’re club kids or academy babies. The coach SOMEHOW, already knows them from those clubs. The system is rigged as shit, and we all fucking know it.

I just want to say one thing: that "gate-keeping" system and "pre-made" varsity team that you hate? welcome to the early entrance to the real world cause as you grow, you'll realize that'll never change.

That job interview? Sometimes you're just the filler to make sure they interview enough outside candidates to meet a policy... but they already have an internal hire lined up.

The blind date you go on? Sometimes the girl has someone she likes already... but going on this date with you to keep her real target jealous and you never had a chance...

It's more understandable if you think from the other perspective... from the perspective of the coach, employer, company, owner...
A lot of "unfairness" in life goes away if you think from their perspective...

The thing is, yeah, these club kids are good. I’ll give them that. You’d be good too if your parents shelled out $1,000 a month for you to get coached by some mysterious "Elite Coach" who "almost made it pro" in Spain. It actually costs a FUCKING BALLSACK to play on those "Elite" clubs. But the system is RIGGED. The coaches KNOW these kids from clubs because they’re in this weird little soccer mafia together—some shady Illuminati shit in the area where the Varsity coaches keep their precious weird ass connections with the club coaches all tight and buddy-buddy, trading players like they're fucking slaves in the Confederate states 160 years ago.

Another life lesson, the rich douchebags as you call them can also be good... that's the sad revelation of it all as you get older...
Everyone needs a competitive advantage... some inherit good genes from their parents (a huge proponent of athletic success), some learn incredible work ethic from their parents (another hugely important success factor), and some get access to opportunities and coaching and experiences via their parents' money... when you're a parent, you try to help your kid succeed. Argument can be made that helping TOO much can actually hurt the kid but in general, why wouldn't you help your kid get that internship... or extra coaching... or whatever else...

Just because they had access to advantages, it doesn't negate their achievements.

First off, TRYOUTS SUCK ASS.
Like, genuinely, what the actual fuck is the point of putting us through five goddamn days of HELL just to decide who gets cut? They make you run until you’re puking (love that SoCal heat, right?)

This does sound like a terrible experience... they should just choose who they want. They clearly know what other pieces they want to add after having so many already committed behind the scenes.

 

[Socal-Soccer-Dad]

And you know what? In the spirit of the rant, I'm not even going to express condolences that life isn't fair. As a parent who puts my kid in club to give him advantages, I know that's an opportunity that not everyone has, and one that he has because I worked a lot to have the resources to provide that type of advantage for my kids. I do not feel bad that my kids can have additional opportunities because of my work. If my actions inspire future rants about how unfair the the club systems are, then so be it.

Haha life isn't fair. I know more about that now at 45 vs when I was15.

And I don't want it to be fair... I want the hard work my parents put in... and the sacrifices and my wife and I are currently putting in... to matter...

One rant I'd have would be... no matter how hard we try... there's the genetic lotteries I see on teams/sports my kids are on...
If anything's not fair... THAT'S not fair... My kids are pretty good at their respective sports but they're always looking up at their incredible gifts... Maybe they'll let up and our hard work can bridge the gap... but I see them working hard too...

As they say if prodigies also work hard, there's no way to beat them.

 

[Jamisfoes]

Haha life isn't fair. I know more about that now at 45 vs when I was15.

And I don't want it to be fair... I want the hard work my parents put in... and the sacrifices and my wife and I are currently putting in... to matter...

One rant I'd have would be... no matter how hard we try... there's the genetic lotteries I see on teams/sports my kids are on...
If anything's not fair... THAT'S not fair... My kids are pretty good at their respective sports but they're always looking up at their incredible gifts... Maybe they'll let up and our hard work can bridge the gap... but I see them working hard too...

As they say if prodigies also work hard, there's no way to beat them.

I would also like to add, unlike golf or tennis, soccer is not a sport where private 1v1 coaching makes a big difference. Like basketball, in soccer one can get really good just by playing lots of it. You don’t need a class to show you how to dribble, how to shoot or how to play defense. Rich parents have their kids go to those classes. They are all just a waste of money. What matters most is if a kid loves soccer and wants to play all the time, practices on his own. I would even venture out to say that a poor kid living in a high density area has an advantage over rich kids in the suburbs. The Pugbas, the Neymar’s and the Ibrahimovichs, they get to play all day.

 

[crush]

I roll my eyes whenever anybody says selections are political and rigged. Sure there may be the exception here and there.

I roll my eyes whenever you post coach

 

[TopesWin]

I roll my eyes whenever anybody says selections are political and rigged. Sure there may be the exception here and there. But for the most part coaches are trying to select the best players based on limited information/tryouts and it is a subjective, far-from-perfect process.

Imagine yourself in the coach's shoes at tryouts and you are looking at many of the players for the first time (I'm doing this right now for a middle school team). It's easy to spot the handful of players who are just better and will make the team. It's easy to weed out the bottom players who are not good enough. But then you have this big swath of players in the middle that you will need to choose from to round out the roster. That is the tough part and the selections will always be debatable. That's competitive soccer.

I tell my kids that if you want to make a certain team that it's not good enough to be at the same level. You have to be heads-and-shoulders above the others if you want to ensure a spot on that team.

Oh god, yes, there is politics involved! You might be the lucky who hasn't seen it, but it's everywhere - and kudos to you if you are the rare coach who doesn't let politics work its way into your selections! Obviously the stars get picked and obviously the beginners get cut, but there is a pecking order among the rest and the connected kids with connected parents get picked before the unconnected

 

[Grace T.]

I would also like to add, unlike golf or tennis, soccer is not a sport where private 1v1 coaching makes a big difference. Like basketball, in soccer one can get really good just by playing lots of it. You don’t need a class to show you how to dribble, how to shoot or how to play defense. Rich parents have their kids go to those classes. They are all just a waste of money. What matters most is if a kid loves soccer and wants to play all the time, practices on his own. I would even venture out to say that a poor kid living in a high density area has an advantage over rich kids in the suburbs. The Pugbas, the Neymar’s and the Ibrahimovichs, they get to play all day.

Completely disagree with this. Reason why is there are some skills which need to be corrected by a trainer or coach that can say “you are doing it wrong”. Because otherwise if you are doing that wrong thing 1000x on your own your are just perpetuating bad habits. First touch, how to properly cross a ball, how to head, even how to shoot (it amazes me how many olders still flex their foot while shooting and woof it over the bar). Double/triple so for goalkeepers.

I’ve seen the data point: the older kids that play only Latino league. Even though they may watch and be passionate about the game, without the coaching they top out. Hence the ops trouble, who otherwise seems to be passionate about the game and plays it on a regular basis.

I agree private training makes more of an impact on golf and tennis> soccer > basketball > gridiron position (other than qb). The more technical the game the more such training (in group or individual sessions) is needed. The reason for private trainers in soccer is that coaches don’t tend to address individual skills (and I was told by my license instructor I was doing it wrong if I taught them “that’s what parents and trainers are for”)

 

[Jamisfoes]

Completely disagree with this. Reason why is there are some skills which need to be corrected by a trainer or coach that can say “you are doing it wrong”. Because otherwise if you are doing that wrong thing 1000x on your own your are just perpetuating bad habits. First touch, how to properly cross a ball, how to head, even how to shoot (it amazes me how many olders still flex their foot while shooting and woof it over the bar). Double/triple so for goalkeepers.

I’ve seen the data point: the older kids that play only Latino league. Even though they may watch and be passionate about the game, without the coaching they top out. Hence the ops trouble, who otherwise seems to be passionate about the game and plays it on a regular basis.

I agree private training makes more of an impact on golf and tennis> soccer > basketball > gridiron position (other than qb). The more technical the game the more such training (in group or individual sessions) is needed. The reason for private trainers in soccer is that coaches don’t tend to address individual skills (and I was told by my license instructor I was doing it wrong if I taught them “that’s what parents and trainers are for”)

There is this new thing called YouTube. No one in this day and age needs to pay for a private trainer.

 

[NorCalDad]

There is this new thing called YouTube. No one in this day and age needs to pay for a private trainer.

In theory I agree with you. Obviously the "soccer is life" kids who play all the time are generally pretty good assuming they're getting the cognitive training with their team. I think for the rest of the kids, the players that do private training sessions are better than those that don't. This is just math....the kids who do private sessions just have more time on the ball. It's indeed a bummer as I wish I saw more kids playing pickup. I wish it was more ingrained in our culture.

 

[Grace T.]

There is this new thing called YouTube. No one in this day and age needs to pay for a private trainer.

Disagree. The reason why is because humans have a personal bias to assume they are doing something correctly. You aren’t paying the personal trainer to show you a drill or move. You are paying the personal trainer to show you what you are doing wrong and aren’t seeing. You are paying for their eye. Otherwise you are just perpetuating mistakes and bad habits because you think you are doing it right and aren’t capable of self criticism (very few of us are). In the ideal world coaches would do this but we’ve made a decision for some reason, especially at the younger ages when these skills are developing, that coaches shouldn’t spend their limited time doing it. Hence why we have all these teenage boys that despite being the best kickers on their team are always putting the ball on a dfk over the crossbar.

 

[Jamisfoes]

Disagree. The reason why is because humans have a personal bias to assume they are doing something correctly. You aren’t paying the personal trainer to show you a drill or move. You are paying the personal trainer to show you what you are doing wrong and aren’t seeing. You are paying for their eye. Otherwise you are just perpetuating mistakes and bad habits because you think you are doing it right and aren’t capable of self criticism (very few of us are). In the ideal world coaches would do this but we’ve made a decision for some reason, especially at the younger ages when these skills are developing, that coaches shouldn’t spend their limited time doing it. Hence why we have all these teenage boys that despite being the best kickers on their team are always putting the ball on a dfk over the crossbar.

You are free to keep spending the money. The fact is Neymar, Messi, Pugba and countless other pros from disadvantaged backgrounds all learn to play soccer on their own before they got discovered.
Private trainers love to train girls. There are quite a few of them their business model is to focus only on girls. You know why? Girls don’t play pickup games.

 

[Grace T.]

You are free to keep spending the money. The fact is Neymar, Messi, Pugba and countless other pros from disadvantaged backgrounds all learn to play soccer on their own before they got discovered.
Private trainers love to train girls. There are quite a few of them their business model is to focus only on girls. You know why? Girls don’t play pickup games.

Disagree here too. This used to be the model in the Pele days (or Donovan days if you want to stick to the US when players actually used to come out of AYSO), but soccer has become very technical (basketball too is the counter example...it's become more technical as well such as with the reliance on the 3 point shot). Playing pickup is all very fine and good. It's great for developing speed of thought. It's also great for developing innate talent and soccer IQ. It's a necessary component, But the one thing the marquee players you list had is they entered organized sports early on, and also a pro academy. Messi was in a very strong program at age 6, and entered the academy at 13. Neymar at 7 and the academy at 11. Pogba was at an academy at age 6, and the age of entering academies in Europe is now between 5-9. Sure, if you have professional instructors every day who have the time for individual instruction and corrections given you are on the pitch 7 days a week, then you don't need a personal trainer. For those that don't have the academy, that training has to come from somewhere. If you are relying on a personal trainer to get you out there and motivated and put the word in and show you moves, you are doing it wrong. If the only thing you are doing is going out and playing games, with coaches not correcting technical deficiencies, then like the Latino league players you are going to hit a wall.

If we ran an experiment with two equivalent highly motivated boys (same IQ and physical development, watch and equal amount of soccer, each looking up youtube video, each with equivalent training time and games) and give one a competent trainer and the other only a coach (who follows the US guidelines and focuses on the team and free discovery, not individual skills), then put them in front of an academy for selection, the one with the trainer will do better because his mistakes will have been fixed. It's the entire plot of the movie "Chariots of Fire" after all.

 

[KingMI]

You are free to keep spending the money. The fact is Neymar, Messi, Pugba and countless other pros from disadvantaged backgrounds all learn to play soccer on their own before they got discovered.
Private trainers love to train girls. There are quite a few of them their business model is to focus only on girls. You know why? Girls don’t play pickup games.

I agree Girls are more competitive in my opinion so they want to be on top. They are easy money because after 12yrs old no parents can force them to train. When they were little ones it was easy to gather them up. So most are forced to find them a 100 dollar per hour coach from 12-17yrs old.

 

[East County Soccer Dad]

Even if there is/was a bias, a kid not playing club soccer isn't making his school team.
WE have a few elite programs in town and unless you're in a letter league you arent making Varsity, and maybe not even JV.

 

[Jamisfoes]

Disagree here too. This used to be the model in the Pele days (or Donovan days if you want to stick to the US when players actually used to come out of AYSO), but soccer has become very technical (basketball too is the counter example...it's become more technical as well such as with the reliance on the 3 point shot). Playing pickup is all very fine and good. It's great for developing speed of thought. It's also great for developing innate talent and soccer IQ. It's a necessary component, But the one thing the marquee players you list had is they entered organized sports early on, and also a pro academy. Messi was in a very strong program at age 6, and entered the academy at 13. Neymar at 7 and the academy at 11. Pogba was at an academy at age 6, and the age of entering academies in Europe is now between 5-9. Sure, if you have professional instructors every day who have the time for individual instruction and corrections given you are on the pitch 7 days a week, then you don't need a personal trainer. For those that don't have the academy, that training has to come from somewhere. If you are relying on a personal trainer to get you out there and motivated and put the word in and show you moves, you are doing it wrong. If the only thing you are doing is going out and playing games, with coaches not correcting technical deficiencies, then like the Latino league players you are going to hit a wall.

If we ran an experiment with two equivalent highly motivated boys (same IQ and physical development, watch and equal amount of soccer, each looking up youtube video, each with equivalent training time and games) and give one a competent trainer and the other only a coach (who follows the US guidelines and focuses on the team and free discovery, not individual skills), then put them in front of an academy for selection, the one with the trainer will do better because his mistakes will have been fixed. It's the entire plot of the movie "Chariots of Fire" after all.

I haven’t met a private trainer whose tips I can’t already find in YouTube videos. All you need to get a tight first touch is a ball and a wall. You don’t need a trainer to show you the technique.

 

[Grace T.]

I haven’t met a private trainer whose tips I can’t already find in YouTube videos. All you need to get a tight first touch is a ball and a wall. You don’t need a trainer to show you the technique.

Agree on this and if that's what you are paying them for (or to actually motivate you to get out there) you are doing it wrong. You are paying them to correct your technique when you are banging that ball against the wall because you don't know what you don't know and are making mistakes you can't see.

Tackett for GK does a course on reviewing your own game film. One of the struggles is getting teens to be supercritical of themselves 1) because they lack the eye someone with more experience has, and 2) because people are adverse to being self-critical and tend to overlook their mistakes. That's why you hire Tackett to look at the game film for you-- he'll see more than you will.

I've noticed this with my own son BTW...he records all his games since getting them off the club/school/rival club or school's veo can sometimes be a 50/50 proposition (it's amazing how teams won't publish veo if they get embarrassed by what happens). GK goals come in 3 types: mistakes, limitations, and nothing you can do about em. But he can't see the mistakes, and it's frustrating to no end!

After the good stuff...."so 3 goals....what could you improve on?"

"Nothing, it was X's fault."

Looks at the veo.

"So you've looked at the tape? Watcha think? Anything you could improve on?"

"Nope all good. I'm awesome."

Shows it to the coach.

"Dude, you just need to go out there and give it 110%. Be more explosive! Do Better!"

"Coach says I need to just do better."

"Do better how?"

"I dunno".

Shows it to trainer. 1 second later.

"On that third goal you were 1m off your center mark. Your prep step, dive, and length were all flawless. If you had been properly positioned and checked your shoulder against your far post positioning, that should have been an easy save. Let's work on it."

"Oh that's obvious. Why didn't I see it?"

 

[Jamisfoes]

Agree on this and if that's what you are paying them for (or to actually motivate you to get out there) you are doing it wrong. You are paying them to correct your technique when you are banging that ball against the wall because you don't know what you don't know and are making mistakes you can't see.

Tackett for GK does a course on reviewing your own game film. One of the struggles is getting teens to be supercritical of themselves 1) because they lack the eye someone with more experience has, and 2) because people are adverse to being self-critical and tend to overlook their mistakes. That's why you hire Tackett to look at the game film for you-- he'll see more than you will.

I've noticed this with my own son BTW...he records all his games since getting them off the club/school/rival club or school's veo can sometimes be a 50/50 proposition (it's amazing how teams won't publish veo if they get embarrassed by what happens). GK goals come in 3 types: mistakes, limitations, and nothing you can do about em. But he can't see the mistakes, and it's frustrating to no end!

After the good stuff...."so 3 goals....what could you improve on?"

"Nothing, it was X's fault."

Looks at the veo.

"So you've looked at the tape? Watcha think? Anything you could improve on?"

"Nope all good. I'm awesome."

Shows it to the coach.

"Dude, you just need to go out there and give it 110%. Be more explosive! Do Better!"

"Coach says I need to just do better."

"Do better how?"

"I dunno".

Shows it to trainer. 1 second later.

"On that third goal you were 1m off your center mark. Your prep step, dive, and length were all flawless. If you had been properly positioned and checked your shoulder against your far post positioning, that should have been an easy save. Let's work on it."

"Oh that's obvious. Why didn't I see it?"

I get your point about having a trained eye correcting you. It might save you some trial and error time. But I still think soccer is not overly technical, one can get by without privates. Kids also learn from each other and give each other tips.

 

[RandomSoccerFan]

I'd say it depends entirely on whether the individual (and/or team they are playing for), is in the top 50%, top 5%, top 1%, or one of the top individuals/teams in the nation. One size doesn't fit all in this case, and I generally agree with your point that for most kids - private training is only slightly better, if at all better, than working on themselves and the team with their coach and individual work on their own. But an individual training program with private training/coaching has the best chance of taking someone who is already quite talented, already quite motivated, and highly incented to improve themselves, to continue to better themselves week-in week-out as they grow.

 

[Grace T.]

I'd say it depends entirely on whether the individual (and/or team they are playing for), is in the top 50%, top 5%, top 1%, or one of the top individuals/teams in the nation. One size doesn't fit all in this case, and I generally agree with your point that for most kids - private training is only slightly better, if at all better, than working on themselves and the team with their coach and individual work on their own. But an individual training program with private training/coaching has the best chance of taking someone who is already quite talented, already quite motivated, and highly incented to improve themselves, to continue to better themselves week-in week-out as they grow.

I think this is fair. My only caveat would be that the top 1% of older boy players don’t need to do this because they are already in an academy (or similar) that has specialists that address this issue. The percentage that would benefit from private training would also be lower in the Youngers if the coaches were taught to emphasize this but for one reason or another we’ve decided to emphasize other things in team practices such as self learning and speed of thought (or in some cases running laps).

 

[Messi>CR7]

To the OP:
-Had you play club soccer for the last 10 years, your parents would’ve paid a minimum of $5K a year (many pay more).
-S&P500 on the average has returned about 11.6% over the last 10 years. That $50K would be $96K now.
-By not playing club soccer thus guaranteeing your misery in HS sports, your saved your parents $96K.

Present these numbers to your parents and politely (use a different tone than the one in your original post) ask for half of the $96K or a new car.

Best of luck.