Let’s play devils advocate here since both you and Rainbow neither have kids playing in ECRL or GA Aspire. Imagine your kid is playing GA or ECNL playoffs and you go up against a team that entered playoffs as a bottom seed. The team you play brings in 3 players who are now playing semi-pro/pro or some stud DD who is playing MLS Next 2 years up just for playoffs. Your team, according to the soccer rankings, is supposed to win 2-0 but instead loses and the team that brought guest players goes to the Elite 8 as a result, your team goes home not making it out of group play. How are you going to feel about that? Are you still feeling “man I’m happy they got to go against this great competition” or do you feel cheated?
Fall 2025 NL & RL G13 – Who Are the Top Teams in the Southwest?
- Thread starter socaldad10
- Start date
Sure, I'd feel cheated. But whats the difference?
Winning a trophy at an artificially created level doesnt mean much. Once you start playing at the highest levels whats "fair" is open to interpretation.
RandomSoccerFan
PREMIER
I think that may be the crux of it. Once you are playing at the highest (not one of the highest) levels, it seems that whatever side can be put on the field according to the rules of the league should be a-ok. It should be the best of the best - and complaining about a team being "too competitive" for whichever reason, isn't appropriate. Whoever is doing the complaining is not understanding what it means to compete at that highest level.
But once you go down a rung or two (NL --> RL in this instance), artificially bumping up the RL strength to win a game that, by all rights, doesn't matter very much, is a crappy thing for a club to do. That's why there are rules in place to "artificially" keep the lower brackets fair, to ensure reasonable competition for all. Coaches used to be banned for a year if they were breaking rules and playing top kids down on lower teams. It seems that there is no longer much shame felt in it, or even an understanding why it's the case.
playing fair like the good old days is 100% out of the window. I have seen clubs do things lately that they would never be caught dead doing before. The winds shifted and it is what it is.
What’s artificial? ECNL and GA is an amateur level which shouldn’t be taking on professionals. ECRL and GA Aspire are 2nd tier, what’s artificial about that? It’s a defined level. Each club member has a top team and a second team.
What’s artificial is having first team players on a second team to advertise later the success of the club and take away of the achievements of the kids who are playing at that level.
RandomSoccerFan
PREMIER
I think you're probably right. But I don't think that all is lost, and things cannot change for the better from time to time. Leagues still have detailed competition rules (on this specific issue, and on many other topics), and continue to include them in their annual review/update for the rules/policies that clubs agree to when entering teams. It seems that clubs have become more comfortable breaking those rules, as there have been few consequences for those that have decided it's worth the risk.
I can tell you - from direct experience - it is effective to call out clubs that are blatantly breaking the rules, and they will face consequences that they aren't happy with.
If league rules/policies are updated over time so that this turns out to not even be something a club has to follow (roster only eligible players), then it seems that we'd have gone too far down that path.
Meh
Believe it or not but I have multiple kids playing and at multiple levels, first and second teams. The only thing that really excites me anymore is winning at the highest levels. Everything else is fun to watch but hard (for me) to get emotionally involved in. It's interesting watching the parents on the second team get excited about perceived cheating by opponents. Its also interesting watching how the coach 100% picks teams to play against that they can beat. Which is being done to keep the parents engaged and happy with their investment.
Again I'm not saying that theres anything wrong with playing on a second team. Use it to get minutes and be the star. But I've always viewed it as a platform to prepare for the time when you can play on a top team.
RandomSoccerFan
PREMIER
It's not a term that has to be fuzzy or interpreted various ways to different people. If the coach/club is breaking rules in the rulebook, not only in intent but by the actual wording of the rule, it's cheating. Or whatever other equivalent descriptor that should be used when someone is breaking rules (and doesn't want to be called out for doing so).
Getting overly excited about another team's decision to cheat is a different angle. Seems like most don't get overly worked up if the game is competitive or if their team wins. If they end up losing, especially losing badly, seems like they are more concerned about someone appearing to need to cheat to ensure a win.
rainbow_unicorn
PREMIER
People care way too much about winning in youth soccer. Development is king.
Which would you rather have...winning a national championship with your kid being non-existent on the field?
Or being on a losing team with your kid balling out and everyone watching knows that your kid can play?
Which would you rather have...winning a national championship with your kid being non-existent on the field?
Or being on a losing team with your kid balling out and everyone watching knows that your kid can play?
davidnunez
BRONZE
go look at the pictures from the ECNL National champion teams - literally 60% of those kids had no (zip, nada) role in the playoffs. They are smiling and their parents are bragging about their kid being on a championship team (bench).... As long as folks keep up that approach, we will have these discussions about winning teams.
To piggy back on that, below is the recruitment data for the # of D1 offers given to each team for the class of 2026. If you’re not on the top team of the top clubs and you’re not a starter for your mid tier club, there’s a high chance you’re not getting a D1 offer.
IMO you might as well play RL or GA at that point to continue improving your game (if you’re not getting the playtime). If you’re on a mid to lower level tier NL team as well you should be considering playing RL if you’re not happy with your role on the team, style of play or position / commute and etc because you’re likey to end up in the same situation.… hitting that transfer portal later to get to a D1 school if that’s what you desire.
Koge NL 24
Legends NL 20
Surf NL 17
Slammers NL 14
Beach NL 14
Eagles NL 13
Blues NL 13
Utah Royals NL 12
City SC GA 11
Phoenix Rising NL 9
Top Hat GA 9
Rebels NL 9
Heat NL 6
LA Breakers NL 5
Pats NL 5
West Coast GA 5
Koge RL 1
Legends RL 1
Phoenix Rising RL 1
Sporting CA NL 0
Slammers RL 0
LA Surf GA 0
FRAM GA 0
Remember, these rosters are all full with 18-24 kids. Seeing this list ask yourself, for the other 18-24 on the roster not going D1, was it worth sitting on the bench where they could have been getting playtime in the second league and possibly getting a better offer since they’re going to end up going D2-D3 like the rest of the player pool?
davidnunez
BRONZE
thanks for sharing that data! First glance comments:
wow - look at all the SoCal programs over performing - not just the clubs that thump their chests.. a lot of great clubs here in SoCal
wow - look at KOGE and look at Slammers (they could have combined the numbers under "Slammers" and it would have been insane)
kudos to City GA - punching above expectations as a GA club in ECNL-saturated SoCal
also, don't discount the great opportunities and experiences of playing D2 and D3 soccer.. it's still a huge success. (but be forewarned about the "quality" of play of D3 Women's soccer... you have to see it to understand)
wow - look at all the SoCal programs over performing - not just the clubs that thump their chests.. a lot of great clubs here in SoCal
wow - look at KOGE and look at Slammers (they could have combined the numbers under "Slammers" and it would have been insane)
kudos to City GA - punching above expectations as a GA club in ECNL-saturated SoCal
also, don't discount the great opportunities and experiences of playing D2 and D3 soccer.. it's still a huge success. (but be forewarned about the "quality" of play of D3 Women's soccer... you have to see it to understand)
This is what I've been saying for several years. Yes there are some very good Socal ECNL clubs. Theres several not so good clubs. Theres some good GA clubs and some not so good clubs. Recruiters are atrending events for both leagues. if you want to get noticed get on a team that will be highlighted by the league. Look at City SC. They're atrending all the top GA events and being showcased by the league in front of the same coaches and recruiters ECNL clubs play in front of. This is why you're seeing the high number of commits.
On the GA side expect to see more from FRAM, Socal Reds, believe it or not Rangers, and maybe City SC Southwest (Temecula). You can just tell that they have the right leadership and mentality behind their teams. It takes a few seasons to build a culture that keeps players engaged and not thinking the grass is greener at other clubs.
Is that data total offers or number of players offered?
RandomSoccerFan
PREMIER
The problem is that you phrase it as if you're choosing chocolate or vanilla, beach or countryside vacations, where every choice is just as likely to be awesome. When the reality is there are many strong ECNL clubs in socal, and when you're talking about likelihood of D1 recruiting, there's 1 GA club. It's not either/or - it's make sure you're with a strong club with a good reputation, and performing well on that team.
Committed and signed D1 players
socaldad10
BRONZE
So I guess I’m not stressing enough about D1 lol. Honestly, I’d be happy with D2 or D3 as long as it’s a full ride or a solid athletic/academic split that still covers 100%.
Are all parents really this locked in on D1?
What kind of pressure are you putting on your kids? Not judging at all — just genuinely curious how others see it.For me, I’m good if my kid plays D1, D2, D3, NAIA… I’m also good if she decided she’s going to go to Cal State for $48k total for the program and decides to not play in college, although I would be sad because I enjoy watching her play, I’d be happy because of what she’s gained from playing sports.
But I think the biggest thing that drives the D1 or bust is the notion of kids gping pro, going to a “top program” or the amount of funding there is for non-academic scholarships. For example, D3 school is not going to have any athletic scholarship funding but will have academic scholarships funds that if the player qualifies for they’ll push their way. D1 has purely athletic scholarship money available. NAIA
Pretty much it breaks down like this:
Funding Type D1 D2 D3 NAIA
Athletic. Yes. Yes. No. Possible, but usually partial
Amt Available. 28 max. 9.9 per team, N/A. 12 full or partial
typically partial
to give to
19 students
Academic or Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes
need based aid
So if you’re looking for a full ride and your DD doesn’t have a 3.9 or higher, you’re looking for that D1 because its easier to get funding then it is not going D1 purely based on athletic merit.
But I think the biggest thing that drives the D1 or bust is the notion of kids gping pro, going to a “top program” or the amount of funding there is for non-academic scholarships. For example, D3 school is not going to have any athletic scholarship funding but will have academic scholarships funds that if the player qualifies for they’ll push their way. D1 has purely athletic scholarship money available. NAIA
Pretty much it breaks down like this:
Funding Type D1 D2 D3 NAIA
Athletic. Yes. Yes. No. Possible, but usually partial
Amt Available. 28 max. 9.9 per team, N/A. 12 full or partial
typically partial
to give to
19 students
Academic or Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes
need based aid
So if you’re looking for a full ride and your DD doesn’t have a 3.9 or higher, you’re looking for that D1 because its easier to get funding then it is not going D1 purely based on athletic merit.
None of the 2026s are committed *and signed* yet. Except for the couple that reclassified as 2025s.
They don't sign their scholarship/agreement until November, unless it changed this year? Last year (even with the NLI day going away), the commitments weren't announced by schools until November.
They don't sign their scholarship/agreement until November, unless it changed this year? Last year (even with the NLI day going away), the commitments weren't announced by schools until November.
Really? You’re telling me the seniors in high school haven’t signed?
Also, wide variation in D1 programs...
What programs are City girls going to? Colorado, rt? What top 25 programs? I don't know that team or this age group very well. But I know Koge, Surf and Legends are sending/sent players to UNC (multiple), Stanford, USC, UCLA, Notre Dame, Mich State, UVA, etc.
What programs are City girls going to? Colorado, rt? What top 25 programs? I don't know that team or this age group very well. But I know Koge, Surf and Legends are sending/sent players to UNC (multiple), Stanford, USC, UCLA, Notre Dame, Mich State, UVA, etc.