DA and ECNL

Kicker4Life said:
I think you are overlooking the fact that many of the ‘03’s and above were ECNL players prior to this season. So maybe they were already top US Soccer prospects going into this new cycle and these players simply decided the best situation for them was to remain on their current teams.
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Yeah, I don't think there's much debate that the 2004 DA teams are better than ECNL.

That said, there are plenty of 2004's who opted out and will play ECNL or even SCDSL so they can play other sports too.
espola said:
Research based? Point me to the research, please.
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for starters (and including links to other studies on injury): http://www.stack.com/a/new-study-re...ort-athletes-have-a-better-chance-for-success
 
Real Deal said:
That's funny, I don't think they play enough! One game a weekend is less than we've ever played, and i think they need more actually. If you have a kid who practices skills constantly, it just doesn't feel like enough. I sincerely wish just one day of practice was actually mandated as an organized scrimmage or futsal. Little less practice, little more play maybe? But what do I know, I'm not an expert.
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Most euro clubs will say that you should play one game for every 6-8 practices or so. More touches, fewer games.
 
broshark said:
Yeah, I don't think there's much debate that the 2004 DA teams are better than ECNL.

That said, there are plenty of 2004's who opted out and will play ECNL or even SCDSL so they can play other sports too.

for starters (and including links to other studies on injury): http://www.stack.com/a/new-study-re...ort-athletes-have-a-better-chance-for-success
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That's nice, but perhaps we misunderstood each other. I was looking for research that showed multiple-sport athletes were less susceptible to overuse injuries.

I am old enough that the better athletes in my high school played a different sport every season - soccer in the Fall, basketball in Winter, and baseball in Spring. They also participated in recreational sports like skiing, swimming and golf in their free time. No one could imagine a sport that had a 12-month season.
 
broshark said:
Yeah, I don't think there's much debate that the 2004 DA teams are better than ECNL.

That said, there are plenty of 2004's who opted out and will play ECNL or even SCDSL so they can play other sports too.

for starters (and including links to other studies on injury): http://www.stack.com/a/new-study-re...ort-athletes-have-a-better-chance-for-success
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Not arguing the fact that Multi Sport Atheletes reduce injury risk from wear and tear and actually are looked upon greater than single sport atheletes from recruiters.

I know several DA players that continue to play other sports like tennis, volleyball (beach and/or indoor), Surf, etc. one such player left an ECNL team and is playing DA and is a Barsity Tennis player in High School (as a freshman.

As MANY keep saying, DA isn’t a guaranteed pathway to the USNT. So if Soccer43’s DD left an ECNL team and “sacrificed” so much to be in that team so she could get a NT invite (cause they weren’t getting that chance in ECNL, I think he/she needs to take a realistic look at who is to blame....the league of the decision. If my assumptions are wrong, I apologize, just looking back they their posting history, that is the conclusion I drew.

DA is 6 months old, unproven and definately not perfect....especially at the older age groups.

We chose to go DA (04) for a few reasons:
- COACH
- Location
- Training Curriculum

A pathway to the NT was not one of them. However, she did get the call in to the last Training Center session which was just icing on the cake.
 
espola said:
That's nice, but perhaps we misunderstood each other. I was looking for research that showed multiple-sport athletes were less susceptible to overuse injuries.

I am old enough that the better athletes in my high school played a different sport every season - soccer in the Fall, basketball in Winter, and baseball in Spring. They also participated in recreational sports like skiing, swimming and golf in their free time. No one could imagine a sport that had a 12-month season.
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There are many DA girls who continue with other sports, some that don't have "jerseys" or a patch, ie recreational sports. Some are even managing another sport at their high school. And, guess what, they even have a life. Hobbies, shopping, sleep overs, texting, texting, tv, music, goofing off with friends and family. Most of these girls have a passion for their sport and miss it when not playing. All while maintaining great academics.
 
Kicker4Life said:
Not arguing the fact that Multi Sport Atheletes reduce injury risk from wear and tear and actually are looked upon greater than single sport atheletes from recruiters.

I know several DA players that continue to play other sports like tennis, volleyball (beach and/or indoor), Surf, etc. one such player left an ECNL team and is playing DA and is a Barsity Tennis player in High School (as a freshman.

As MANY keep saying, DA isn’t a guaranteed pathway to the USNT. So if Soccer43’s DD left an ECNL team and “sacrificed” so much to be in that team so she could get a NT invite (cause they weren’t getting that chance in ECNL, I think he/she needs to take a realistic look at who is to blame....the league of the decision. If my assumptions are wrong, I apologize, just looking back they their posting history, that is the conclusion I drew.

DA is 6 months old, unproven and definately not perfect....especially at the older age groups.

We chose to go DA (04) for a few reasons:
- COACH
- Location
- Training Curriculum

A pathway to the NT was not one of them. However, she did get the call in to the last Training Center session which was just icing on the cake.
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Thanks for the commentary on our situation but you do not know anything about us, DD's path or decisions and your conclusions are way off base. I was providing a perspective from observations, personal experience, and experience of DD's friends regarding the DA as clubs are handling this differently and players are having a different experience during this "experiment", especially depending on what age group you are in. I don't come on here to bash or critique others but I would suggest not making assumptions about posters as you don't know what you are talking about in terms of our player(s) Appreciate hearing your experience but none of your commentary about our situation is correct.
 
Kicker4Life said:
We chose to go DA (04) for a few reasons:
- COACH
- Location
- Training Curriculum

A pathway to the NT was not one of them. However, she did get the call in to the last Training Center session which was just icing on the cake.
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I agree, DA program is not run in Siberia, or Alcatraz, folks. It's soccer. If you don't like it, don't do it.
 
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espola said:
That's nice, but perhaps we misunderstood each other. I was looking for research that showed multiple-sport athletes were less susceptible to overuse injuries.

I am old enough that the better athletes in my high school played a different sport every season - soccer in the Fall, basketball in Winter, and baseball in Spring. They also participated in recreational sports like skiing, swimming and golf in their free time. No one could imagine a sport that had a 12-month season.
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It is nice, thanks! Had you read, you'd have seen there's a link to another study in the article that discusses increased injury in specialized athletes: http://www.sportsmed.org/aossmimis/Members/About/Press_Releases/AM2017SundayB.aspx

#readingisfun

BTW, swimming has always been a 12-month season.
 
Real Deal said:
Well I would hope you like your coach, since he/she was the one who got your DD into a Training Center. :cool: Not sure what that has to do with DA. There are non-DA kids who go to those as well based upon their coach's recommendation.

But I do agree, DA program is not run in Siberia, or Alcatraz, folks. It's soccer. If you don't like it, don't do it.

I will say though that this kind of arrogant notion that "cream rises to the top" as the dual age banding occurs, or in DA selections overall... Well, seeing as US Soccer probably only cares about placement of one or two kids, the vast majority of choices as to who makes the team are made by coaches and clubs also, so once again, there will no doubt be other things involved in those selections besides soccer talent-- and that's problematic (politics as usual). Hopefully colleges are keeping an open mind and scouting other leagues as well.
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Excellent post! We have also found that the majority of the "work" is done by the family in regards to this. Start the research now and be proactive with finding the right fit.
I understand and agree with your post but wanted to add that additional layer.
 
Soccer43 said:
You make some good points but don't agree with some of your comments. I am not arguing about which team is or should be the best at a DA/ECNL club. I am talking about top players that would have preferred to stay in ECNL and have a life and other opportunities but were pressured into moving to a DA team because they were told if you don't you will not be scouted. If you don't have a player in the DA you may not realize the increased level of sacrifice that has been required of these girls- I think many are watching and evaluating this for next year
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Hello Soccer43,

Are you open to a different view of a part of your statement? It's the "have a life" part.

At this age group ECNL and all high level clubs are all practicing 3 days a week for 1.5 to 2 hours. The DA adds one more day. Kids playing multiple sports will most likely have a hard time being ultra competitive in our year around environment as they get older at the ECNL level also. They often feel compelled to choose a sport by the clubs or high school coaches so the focus can be on the sport better suited to get that holy grail of a college scholarship.

Only speaking for my kids, they don't want to play other sports or high school athletics. We support and show up for the friends that do and my kids don't long for a missing part of their lives. My girls team isn't top of the barrel either when I say this, so it's not just a winning thing. It's a dedication and preference of style thing.

With the current age bands the only way I see ECNL going away is if somehow the DA makes the DPL (DA2) extremely attractive. I'm talking way beyond what it currently is. I know the DA wants all DP players to come through the DPL type system with the same curriculum and standards as the DA. For most kids, that simply isn't a big enough draw yet. May be in the future. So for now, and especially next year, I expect the DA and ECNL to thrive.

Both leagues have great players and teams that play great soccer. The big differentiator is the substitution rules. It really shows which coaches are great managers also and which players have higher soccer IQs combined with physical endurance. It's a challenge and one that is good for our soccer community. I'm glad it's not the only option though. Not every player is cut out for it. The ECNL / college type sub rules are necessary for many to continue to develop without falling behind to the point of despair.
 
espola said:
We can see how well that worked out on the men's side. Should we expect the girls to do any better?
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I would say the majority of players on those team were not DA players and the few who were mostly didn't come up in the system from age 10 or 11. The Boys DA is 10 years old. Most of those guys were much older. I say we should see the difference in the next 6-8 years as the born and bred DA players are making up a good part of the team. We are starting to see more field players go overseas in great leagues as young pros. May be the system is starting to pay dividends.
broshark said:
It is nice, thanks! Had you read, you'd have seen there's a link to another study in the article that discusses increased injury in specialized athletes: http://www.sportsmed.org/aossmimis/Members/About/Press_Releases/AM2017SundayB.aspx

#readingisfun

BTW, swimming has always been a 12-month season.
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Unless you played water polo too!!! :) Water polo of course includes swimming, but the focus is different.
 
Soccerspew said:
Check out our blog on ECNL and USDA
http://www.soccerspew.com/elite-club-national-leagueecnl-vs-development-academyusda/
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I gave it a read. Seems mostly fair and balanced.

My question is why not quantify the scout count in the article? It basically said the DA event wasn't college coach/scout oriented. Word is there were around 600 in Florida and for certain plenty of East Coast big time programs. By that I mean top 10 teams, recent national Champs, etc....

Top Hat vs Legends 03 had at least 65 college coaches and scouts. LAPFC vs West Florida Flames had 30 to 35 and they are the lower to mid table teams.

Just a point for clarity. I heard the Arizona ECNL event was packed also.
 
C.A.M. said:
I gave it a read. Seems mostly fair and balanced.

My question is why not quantify the scout count in the article? It basically said the DA event wasn't college coach/scout oriented. Word is there were around 600 in Florida and for certain plenty of East Coast big time programs. By that I mean top 10 teams, recent national Champs, etc....

Top Hat vs Legends 03 had at least 65 college coaches and scouts. LAPFC vs West Florida Flames had 30 to 35 and they are the lower to mid table teams.

Just a point for clarity. I heard the Arizona ECNL event was packed also.
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If he quantified the count he would contradict his statement. That is why.
 
Will get a better idea in April when ECNL Phoenix showcase takes place same weekend as DA North Carolina showcase.
 
tugs said:
Will get a better idea in April when ECNL Phoenix showcase takes place same weekend as DA North Carolina showcase.
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The article then misrepresents because it said the DA showcase turn out wasn't as good. Either way we all need to know the facts so we can honestly see what it is we are getting from these organizations as far as exposure.
 
The ECNL phoenix event has conflict with the DA Showcase and The National events have some overlap. Should be interesting where the coaches are. IMO overall what the ECNL had, was better for the girls and potential college opportunities. Not only did you have the ECNL events but you had other showcases that you could attend. With the DA you can only play DA events. DA got that part wrong. In reality there is really less than .25% chance of these girls ever making a full national team, should be more about the college opportunity. Could have used the ECNL platform with maybe some tweaks to scout for national team. Should have been ECNL is their initial look, then use college as their farm system and then after that the pro teams if they can remain viable. DA has got a lot of this wrong so far, but it is exactly what the college coaches expected.
The last few years has been a total cluster f with all the changes that US soccer has dropped on youth soccer. I feel bad for the girls that may have been left out in on the shuffle.
IMO opinion the best competition was the ECNL and now is in the DA but should be more geared to college where most of the girls will end up.
 
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