Cal South 2004 Player Pool Announced

[Kicker4Life]

Fact
The 05 who are are the best are and I have not been impressed with your age group in the whole anyway (05)
FACT 2- no one should be playing up at all unless your are a future YNT player and there are maybe 1-2 of those. The rest of you can go pound sand because you are impacting play time so I wish no one would allow it anyway. It's a function of he parent ego every time. I think it's pathetic

I will agree and disagree.....there are a mixed bag of '05's playing up and if they are talented enough they should play up, why not? As for the playing time, if the younger kid playing up is getting playing time then she must have earned it. If a coach is giving into parental pressure, then that's a coach issue, not a kid issue.

I agreee parents get too involved. I watched an '05 come to a DA training session. When they broke out into age groups she went with the '04's. He Dad immediately ran down to that end of the complex and signaled to her to run over to the '03's and trained with them, which she did. LaVar Ball anyone???

 

[avh]

Fact
The 05 who are are the best are and I have not been impressed with your age group in the whole anyway (05)
FACT 2- no one should be playing up at all unless your are a future YNT player and there are maybe 1-2 of those. The rest of you can go pound sand because you are impacting play time so I wish no one would allow it anyway. It's a function of he parent ego every time. I think it's pathetic

You might want to check the definitions of "Fact" and "Opinion". There are a lot of reasons kids play up. Especially at smaller clubs where they may not field quality teams at every age group or not even field teams at every age group. Sometimes it for parent convenience, so they are not driving 120+ miles for games on weekends and 50+ miles for practice three times a week. And sometimes it is simply for the best coaching fit for the kid. To say "no one should be playing up at all unless your are a future YNT player" is, of course, your opinion. But there are plenty of kids who play up for good reasons, other than the parents ego.

 

[ESPNANALYST]

You might want to check the definitions of "Fact" and "Opinion". There are a lot of reasons kids play up. Especially at smaller clubs where they may not field quality teams at every age group or not even field teams at every age group. Sometimes it for parent convenience, so they are not driving 120+ miles for games on weekends and 50+ miles for practice three times a week. And sometimes it is simply for the best coaching fit for the kid. To say "no one should be playing up at all unless your are a future YNT player" is, of course, your opinion. But there are plenty of kids who play up for good reasons, other than the parents ego.

This is an 04 thread.
There are two 05 who play on top teams who deserve it.
We know the landscape.
This is DA we are talking about not your local club.

 

[Striker17]

I will agree and disagree.....there are a mixed bag of '05's playing up and if they are talented enough they should play up, why not? As for the playing time, if the younger kid playing up is getting playing time then she must have earned it. If a coach is giving into parental pressure, then that's a coach issue, not a kid issue.

I agreee parents get too involved. I watched an '05 come to a DA training session. When they broke out into age groups she went with the '04's. He Dad immediately ran down to that end of the complex and signaled to her to run over to the '03's and trained with them, which she did. LaVar Ball anyone???

This made me laugh out loud!
We already have an 05 on our DA causing major problems. It's going to get funny real quick when she is sitting all the time because she will be. I never understood why clubs do this when we have awesome girls on our second team who may not be as technical as the 05 but are definetly more athletic, clearly larger and about half as much drama. I am telling myself that she is with us because she's technical and that's the whole point but technicality isn't worth anything if someone about theee feet taller than you man handles you.
Our 05 age group at our club is straight alpha daddy drama. Oh and like half of them are dual rostered in the 04 ECNL Lol!!!
I have never seen so much parent helicoptering in my life. With boys sports I don't see this! If I told my sons football or baseball coach what to do I would probably get laid out.

 

[Striker17]

You might want to check the definitions of "Fact" and "Opinion". There are a lot of reasons kids play up. Especially at smaller clubs where they may not field quality teams at every age group or not even field teams at every age group. Sometimes it for parent convenience, so they are not driving 120+ miles for games on weekends and 50+ miles for practice three times a week. And sometimes it is simply for the best coaching fit for the kid. To say "no one should be playing up at all unless your are a future YNT player" is, of course, your opinion. But there are plenty of kids who play up for good reasons, other than the parents ego.

Are you an 05 parent or 04? Just curious and I can explain why.
The parents I have seen who play up at our age level - 2 are non drama and ok.
I am not judging anything but it's a pattern and one I also do not agree with at all. The craziest thing for me about all of it though is that the kids know what's up. The 04 girls at their hundreds of sleepovers they have at my home talk about how the girls are sweet and it's their "crazy parents". One 05 girl at our DA tryouts said she didn't want to be there and her dad made her come and she felt uncomfortable. My DD actually welcomed her.
My point is similar to playing time, positions, etc the kids know the truth. They know where they stand on a roster. If you are an 05 vying for my DD spot prepare for the battle of your life.

 

[avh]

This is an 04 thread.

Got it. This is a thread on "Cal South 2004 Player Pool Announced". There are at least a couple of girls on the '04 player pool list that play up on '03 teams. And are possibly good enough to make an '03 DA team ... if they choose to play up.

I also get it that a kid being the standout on a team her own age, doesn't necessarily help her development. And she doesn't have to be "a future YNT player" for this to be the case. If she's good enough to play with them, and can handle the size and speed difference of the older age group, why shouldn't she be allowed to play ... even at DA level.

There are two 05 who play on top teams who deserve it.
We know the landscape.
This is DA we are talking about not your local club.

I realize this is DA you are talking about. And it applies to DA just the same as your local club. There are reasons, other than the parents ego, for kids to play up. If you believe U.S. Development Academy, one of those reasons is it accelerates their development.

"The Development Academy's 10-month Program allows for a greater opportunity to institute style of play and implement a system according to U.S. Soccer's Development Philosophy. It also gives teams increased opportunities for younger kids in their club to "play up" against older players in both training and matches, thereby accelerating their development."

So if the kid is good enough to play with them, and can handle the size and speed difference of the older age group, let 'em play. One of the outcomes may be that the player (and parent) learn that they are not quite ready for it.

 

[NoGoal]

Are you an 05 parent or 04? Just curious and I can explain why.
The parents I have seen who play up at our age level - 2 are non drama and ok.
I am not judging anything but it's a pattern and one I also do not agree with at all. The craziest thing for me about all of it though is that the kids know what's up. The 04 girls at their hundreds of sleepovers they have at my home talk about how the girls are sweet and it's their "crazy parents". One 05 girl at our DA tryouts said she didn't want to be there and her dad made her come and she felt uncomfortable. My DD actually welcomed her.
My point is similar to playing time, positions, etc the kids know the truth. They know where they stand on a roster. If you are an 05 vying for my DD spot prepare for the battle of your life.

What you posted doesn't sound fun and probably isn't fun for a 11/12 year old either.

 

[NoGoal]

Got it. This is a thread on "Cal South 2004 Player Pool Announced". There are at least a couple of girls on the '04 player pool list that play up on '03 teams. And are possibly good enough to make an '03 DA team ... if they choose to play up.

I also get it that a kid being the standout on a team her own age, doesn't necessarily help her development. And she doesn't have to be "a future YNT player" for this to be the case. If she's good enough to play with them, and can handle the size and speed difference of the older age group, why shouldn't she be allowed to play ... even at DA level.



I realize this is DA you are talking about. And it applies to DA just the same as your local club. There are reasons, other than the parents ego, for kids to play up. If you believe U.S. Development Academy, one of those reasons is it accelerates their development.

"The Development Academy's 10-month Program allows for a greater opportunity to institute style of play and implement a system according to U.S. Soccer's Development Philosophy. It also gives teams increased opportunities for younger kids in their club to "play up" against older players in both training and matches, thereby accelerating their development."

So if the kid is good enough to play with them, and can handle the size and speed difference of the older age group, let 'em play. One of the outcomes may be that the player (and parent) learn that they are not quite ready for it.

IMO, If and only if the younger player can start on a DA team. I have noticed especially for girls that their performance is tied closely with their confidence level. If the younger player is #15-22 in the depth chart on an older team, NOT playing and losing confidence. She is better off starting, playing a lot and enjoying the game in her own age group. That trumps (no pun intended) any advantage playing on an older team.

Players don't develop on the bench. It's why younger players who don't start on their pro team and loaned out, so they can play and get better.

 

[avh]

Are you an 05 parent or 04?

I'm an 04 and 02 parent.

 

[ESPNANALYST]

Got it. This is a thread on "Cal South 2004 Player Pool Announced". There are at least a couple of girls on the '04 player pool list that play up on '03 teams. And are possibly good enough to make an '03 DA team ... if they choose to play up.

I also get it that a kid being the standout on a team her own age, doesn't necessarily help her development. And she doesn't have to be "a future YNT player" for this to be the case. If she's good enough to play with them, and can handle the size and speed difference of the older age group, why shouldn't she be allowed to play ... even at DA level.



I realize this is DA you are talking about. And it applies to DA just the same as your local club. There are reasons, other than the parents ego, for kids to play up. If you believe U.S. Development Academy, one of those reasons is it accelerates their development.

"The Development Academy's 10-month Program allows for a greater opportunity to institute style of play and implement a system according to U.S. Soccer's Development Philosophy. It also gives teams increased opportunities for younger kids in their club to "play up" against older players in both training and matches, thereby accelerating their development."

So if the kid is good enough to play with them, and can handle the size and speed difference of the older age group, let 'em play. One of the outcomes may be that the player (and parent) learn that they are not quite ready for it.

Lost me on a lot of points.
First one being - this isn't in theory every soccer player it's a DA group. Based on RAE anyway we are looking at most DA rosters being Jan- Jul birthdays. Any 05 that gets into that mix better be able to show it. Often they don't.
Coaches make choices that's on them. I have yet to see any more than two of the 05 cage who are better than an 04 at my club. It does matter when you are talking about minimum starts and limited subs.
If you know how I post you know I am all about meritocracy. When you combine RAE which already has shown a major shift in abilities and then add someone who can be upwards of two years youngers it's laughable and it's parent driven.
Again one percenters here and most parents don't want to realize a) your daughter isn't playing for the NT b) your daughter isn't getting a scholarship.
I don't share your views that suddenly a swarm or enlightened parents who care about Little Betty Sues development and ability to progress technically have appeared in SoCal. What has occurred is that the new shiny toy is here and Little Chloe And Little Rae have scored tons of goals and even made ODP so we have to have them stay at the club so let's offer them DA or the dual rostered B team ECNL to make Mommy And Daddy ok with life.
And no they aren't taking my daughters spot. They have no business taking one of the girls in the ECNL spot and I would LOVE to see a head to head.

 

[ESPNANALYST]

I'm an 04 and 02 parent.

Then you should know that there is a huge difference between an 05 and 03 mentally and physically.
The 05 who have hit puberty are obvious- but also obvious to a clinical person is they are slowing down fast.

 

[ESPNANALYST]

Again if we are talking TECHNICAL then it tou have a technical 05 with vision fine have at it.
Personally I have found that those parents are obnoxious and I thoroughly enjoy the fact my Coach is seeing it and changing things. There is no need for this nonsense unless you are a one percenter

 

[Striker17]

IMO, If and only if the younger player can start on a DA team. I have noticed especially for girls that their performance is tied closely with their confidence level. If the younger player is #15-22 in the depth chart on an older team, NOT playing and losing confidence. She is better off starting, playing a lot and enjoying the game in her own age group. That trumps (no pun intended) any advantage playing on an older team.

Players don't develop on the bench. It's why younger players who don't start on their pro team and loaned out, so they can play and get better.

Perfect way to say this.
Starting and impact player

 

[biz32]

I know no one on Aresnal so can't speak to theirs.
All of the other stellar 04 I know who play up are playing 03 DA confirmed. I know of about 5 great 04 players on the "top teams" who were trying out for 03 DA but that's all very how shall we say hush hush? For now they haven't committed to the 03 DA but have stated they will be doing 04 DA. My gut is we have a lot of time until Aug 1 so expect movement.
The very best 05 are also playing 04 DA to my knowledge.

Thanks for the info..

 

[avh]

Lost me on a lot of points.
First one being - this isn't in theory every soccer player it's a DA group. Based on RAE anyway we are looking at most DA rosters being Jan- Jul birthdays. Any 05 that gets into that mix better be able to show it. Often they don't.
Coaches make choices that's on them. I have yet to see any more than two of the 05 cage who are better than an 04 at my club. It does matter when you are talking about minimum starts and limited subs.
If you know how I post you know I am all about meritocracy. When you combine RAE which already has shown a major shift in abilities and then add someone who can be upwards of two years youngers it's laughable and it's parent driven.
Again one percenters here and most parents don't want to realize a) your daughter isn't playing for the NT b) your daughter isn't getting a scholarship.
I don't share your views that suddenly a swarm or enlightened parents who care about Little Betty Sues development and ability to progress technically have appeared in SoCal. What has occurred is that the new shiny toy is here and Little Chloe And Little Rae have scored tons of goals and even made ODP so we have to have them stay at the club so let's offer them DA or the dual rostered B team ECNL to make Mommy And Daddy ok with life.
And no they aren't taking my daughters spot. They have no business taking one of the girls in the ECNL spot and I would LOVE to see a head to head.

Hmmm ... I don't think I ever expressed views on "a swarm or enlightened parents". You seem to have some kind of hang up with some parents (or coaches) that play politics. I simply disagreed with your "FACT 2- no one should be playing up at all unless your are a future YNT player" and that "It's a function of the parent ego every time". I believe I said that if the kid is good enough to play with them, and can handle the size and speed difference of the older age group, let 'em play. Which should agree with your meritocracy view. Remember, I said good enough to play not good enough to sit the bench (i.e. better than the 11th best '04). There are reasons, other than the parents ego, for kids to play up.
And as far as the the relative age goes, it can be a day to just short of two years, not the "upwards of two years" you claim (unless we are talking Anaheim Surf). But I can't say that I've seen an '05 at my club that is better than the 11th best '04 either. I wish I could also say that thus, there weren't any '05 offered spot on DA ... but I can't. So yes, I understand parents and politics.
I really haven't watched '05s much at all, but I have seen some '04s that looked good enough, fast enough, and physical enough, to hang with the '03 DA team at some clubs. I still stand by my point, if the kid is good enough to play with them, and can handle the size and speed difference of the older age group, let 'em play.

 

[avh]

Then you should know that there is a huge difference between an 05 and 03 mentally and physically.
The 05 who have hit puberty are obvious- but also obvious to a clinical person is they are slowing down fast.

Got it, seen it. But, I've also seen the kid more than capable of playing one year up and starting. I'm not saying it's every kid, but I certainly disagree with the statement that "no one should be playing up at all unless your are a future YNT player".

 

[ESPNANALYST]

Got it, seen it. But, I've also seen the kid more than capable of playing one year up and starting. I'm not saying it's every kid, but I certainly disagree with the statement that "no one should be playing up at all unless your are a future YNT player".

My favorite player is an 05. Ever.
She's transcendent though

 

[ESPNANALYST]

Hmmm ... I don't think I ever expressed views on "a swarm or enlightened parents". You seem to have some kind of hang up with some parents (or coaches) that play politics. I simply disagreed with your "FACT 2- no one should be playing up at all unless your are a future YNT player" and that "It's a function of the parent ego every time". I believe I said that if the kid is good enough to play with them, and can handle the size and speed difference of the older age group, let 'em play. Which should agree with your meritocracy view. Remember, I said good enough to play not good enough to sit the bench (i.e. better than the 11th best '04). There are reasons, other than the parents ego, for kids to play up.
And as far as the the relative age goes, it can be a day to just short of two years, not the "upwards of two years" you claim (unless we are talking Anaheim Surf). But I can't say that I've seen an '05 at my club that is better than the 11th best '04 either. I wish I could also say that thus, there weren't any '05 offered spot on DA ... but I can't. So yes, I understand parents and politics.
I really haven't watched '05s much at all, but I have seen some '04s that looked good enough, fast enough, and physical enough, to hang with the '03 DA team at some clubs. I still stand by my point, if the kid is good enough to play with them, and can handle the size and speed difference of the older age group, let 'em play.

Sounds like we agree more than we don't.
No hangs ups here at all I have benefited from politics just like everyone else. It's life. Whether you choose to have the girls play for coaches who can't control favoritism and politics is a whole other issue for a different thread.
If they are special most of us can see it. That's all I am saying.
Truce

 

[avh]

Sounds like we agree more than we don't.
...
Truce

Agreed. (but my first post is still dumb ... I guess I can live with that)

 

[Real Deal]

Fact
I have not been impressed with your age group in the whole anyway (05)
FACT 2- no one should be playing up at all unless your are a future YNT player and there are maybe 1-2 of those. The rest of you can go pound sand because you are impacting play time so I wish no one would allow it anyway. It's a function of he parent ego every time. I think it's pathetic

Personally I have found that those parents are obnoxious and I thoroughly enjoy the fact my Coach is seeing it and changing things. There is no need for this nonsense unless you are a one percenter

Wow! You should be hired by US Soccer if you can tell the 1 percenters at 11-12 years old.

You really know every kid out there, dude? And you know what makes a special player? Or you just know the impact players. You have the nerve to say you're "not impressed" with the whole 05 age group? Hm. Then I wonder why do you feel so threatened?

It's not supposed to be about which 12 year old is the biggest impact player, but which ones have special qualities to develop, whether they are a few months older or a few months younger should really not matter-- though yeh, it probably will not work out that way.

Agree it has to be up to the coach. But I'll bet, in some cases, it is 04 PARENTS and their politics preventing that from happening whether to an 05 or 04. And completely agree ESPN, that the 05 age group has an amazing amount of drama parents, but quite frankly--the worst of them sound just like you.

 

[Real Deal]

My favorite player is an 05. Ever.
She's transcendent though

Is she your daughter?
If not, I feel sorry for your daughter.