2018/ 2019 High School Season

Banana Hammock said:
What exactly are the rules for playing in High School and club at the same time? (mainly from the end of league to Thanksgiving tournaments) Refs vs. no refs, scrimmage... San Diego Section specifically.
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The HS coach should know the rules. This is from the CIFSD meeting minutes held 16 October 2018.
  • Coaches were reminded about CIF Bylaw 600: no student-athlete can try-out for, practice with or compete on an outside team, i.e. club team, once they have participated in a CIF sanctioned scrimmage, game or match.
  • The Green Book has Bylaw 600 details.
Minutes link: http://www.cifsds.org/boys-soccer.html
Green Book link: http://www.cifsds.org/uploads/2/3/3/6/23368454/2018-19_cif_san_diego_greenbook.pdf
 
Surfref said:
The HS coach should know the rules. This is from the CIFSD meeting minutes held 16 October 2018.
  • Coaches were reminded about CIF Bylaw 600: no student-athlete can try-out for, practice with or compete on an outside team, i.e. club team, once they have participated in a CIF sanctioned scrimmage, game or match.
  • The Green Book has Bylaw 600 details.
Minutes link: http://www.cifsds.org/boys-soccer.html
Green Book link: http://www.cifsds.org/uploads/2/3/3/6/23368454/2018-19_cif_san_diego_greenbook.pdf
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Does anyone have advice on getting the San Diego section to sign off on attending ID camps. I know what the rule is, but in another sport my experience has been terrible with them dragging their feet.
 
Competition is the imperative word here for San Diego section. In CIFSDS eyes the presence of a referee has no bearing, as long as a game is played between two teams it is considered competition. So tryouts and practice are okay, just no competing in a high school game and then a club game after that if they want to keep eligibility.

ADs are the main point of contact for ID camp approvals. I usually go on Southern Section’s website and see if an ID camp is on there, if it is I tell my AD and it is up on the SDS site within a day or two. If it isn’t, I tell my AD and it is up within 3 or 4 days.
 
Nefutous said:
Does anyone have advice on getting the San Diego section to sign off on attending ID camps. I know what the rule is, but in another sport my experience has been terrible with them dragging their feet.
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Talk to the coach about this early, so the paperwork is submitted with plenty of time for approval.
 
Nefutous said:
Does anyone have advice on getting the San Diego section to sign off on attending ID camps. I know what the rule is, but in another sport my experience has been terrible with them dragging their feet.
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Note that the college ID camp rule does not effect football players, since there season coincides with the college season. Because of this scheduling issue, this CIF rule dis-proportionally limits female athletes from pursuing educational opportunities. If I had the cash, there would be a Title IX lawsuit about this. I personally pointed this out to Jerry Schniepp in 2015, so if anyone wants to sue, I have documentation of our correspondence to prove that they are aware of this issue but have chosen to do nothing.
 
Banana Hammock said:
What exactly are the rules for playing in High School and club at the same time? (mainly from the end of league to Thanksgiving tournaments) Refs vs. no refs, scrimmage... San Diego Section specifically.
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HS season officially starts a bit earlier this year (Nov. 3 as opposed to 3rd week). I found this on the CIF San Diego minutes:
"Coaches were reminded about CIF Bylaw 600: no student-athlete can try-out for, practice with or compete on an outside team, i.e. club team, once they have participated in a CIF sanctioned scrimmage, game or match."

There are also rules about athletes attending college camps during the HS sport season. They can attend, but have to get approval from CIF for up to 2 college camps during HS season. School athletic directors can submit a waiver letter to CIF on your athlete's behalf. There is usually a running list of 'approved' college ID camps on the CIF website.
 
Nefutous said:
Does anyone have advice on getting the San Diego section to sign off on attending ID camps. I know what the rule is, but in another sport my experience has been terrible with them dragging their feet.
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Attendance at College ID camps in all sports.

1. With CIFSDS prior approval, student-athletes are permitted to attend two college ID camps in any given season of sport. Attendance at any camp beyond two ID camps is a violation and would result in the penalties described in 601.A.

2. A College ID camp is defined as a sport specific camp, held on a college campus under the direction of a college coach.

3. Student athletes must receive permission from the site sport head coach and the Athletic Director/Administrator prior to attending the ID camp. ID camp participation form must be completed, signed and approved by CIFSDS prior to a student attending. Participation in an ID camp without prior approval would result in the penalties described in 601.A.

4. Camp flyer or link to camp website must be forwarded to the CIFSDS office along with completed ID camp participation form.

5. The section office will list approved college ID camps on the CIFSDS web site for reference purposes.
 
Keepers_Keeper said:
Attendance at College ID camps in all sports.

1. With CIFSDS prior approval, student-athletes are permitted to attend two college ID camps in any given season of sport. Attendance at any camp beyond two ID camps is a violation and would result in the penalties described in 601.A.

2. A College ID camp is defined as a sport specific camp, held on a college campus under the direction of a college coach.

3. Student athletes must receive permission from the site sport head coach and the Athletic Director/Administrator prior to attending the ID camp. ID camp participation form must be completed, signed and approved by CIFSDS prior to a student attending. Participation in an ID camp without prior approval would result in the penalties described in 601.A.

4. Camp flyer or link to camp website must be forwarded to the CIFSDS office along with completed ID camp participation form.

5. The section office will list approved college ID camps on the CIFSDS web site for reference purposes.
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Why does this rule exist?
 
Male or female has nothing to do with that rule since everyone is affected. It is simply there to prevent “overuse” of the athlete.

Unfortunately HS season doesn’t align with the college season so a lot of id amps happen during the season we are competing in.
 
Nefutous said:
Does anyone have advice on getting the San Diego section to sign off on attending ID camps. I know what the rule is, but in another sport my experience has been terrible with them dragging their feet.
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Last year I found it to be a pretty easy process - I would email the coach and Athletic Director the camp information including the website with the specifics of the camp/description of the camp and the AD would forward it along to CIFSDS and I would get a response within a day or 2.
 
Question about ID camp attendance (specifically for San Diego Section). So according to the CIFSDS green book players can attend 2 ID camps during the "season of sport:"

  1. With CIFSDS prior approval, student-athletes are permitted to attend two college ID camps in any given

    season of sport. Attendance at any camp beyond two ID camps is a violation and would result in the

    penalties described in 601.A.
And the season of sport is defined as:

504. SEASON OF SPORT

All CIF member school interscholastic activities must be conducted in accordance with the following season of sport Bylaws.
A. Definition of School and Individual Student-Athlete Season of Sport

The season of sport for a school is that period of time which elapses between the first interscholastic contest and the final contest for that particular sport. The season of a sport for any individual student is that period of time which elapses between the student’s first participation in an interscholastic contest and the student’s final participation in a contest for that particular sport in that season.

So if my kid attends an ID camp that occurs after the high school season has started but before she is able to start participating in high school soccer (b/c she is still competing in her fall sport) would that camp count against the 2 permitted? The way the rules read it sounds as though the 2 camps permitted only apply to camps that are attended after the first interscholastic contest has taken place. Thoughts?
 
ajaffe said:
Male or female has nothing to do with that rule since everyone is affected. It is simply there to prevent “overuse” of the athlete.

Unfortunately HS season doesn’t align with the college season so a lot of id amps happen during the season we are competing in.
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I agree that was the original intent. Unfortunately they did not take into consideration the fact that high school soccer season does not align with college soccer season and many colleges have ID camps during high school soccer season. I personally doubt if they even though about soccer since most high school athletic directors have football, basketball or baseball backgrounds. While they did not mean to, they setup a system that discriminates against soccer players. Since soccer is one of the biggest participation sports for females (whereas football is for males), the system by default discriminates against female athletes. The mere fact that the list of approved ID camps on the CIFSD website are almost entirely for soccer proves this. When the system was setup, they did not mean to disadvantage female athletes. I informed them of the problem in 2015, so they are now complicit.
 
The Open Division schools are playing after Thanksgiving, smart on them to figure on how to beat the system.
 
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Multi Sport said:
Again, we think the same on this. If the whole idea is for the betterment of the student then why limit them to what camp or how many camps they can attend?
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Is attending an athletically focused soccer camp betterment of the student? or the athlete? These kids are viewed by the CIF as "Student-Athletes" and all of these rules are designed to ensure its doesn't become "athlete-student."
 
MWN said:
Is attending an athletically focused soccer camp betterment of the student? or the athlete? These kids are viewed by the CIF as "Student-Athletes" and all of these rules are designed to ensure its doesn't become "athlete-student."
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At some point, the parents of the student will decide that the opportunity to win a couple of hundred thousand dollars in scholarships is more important to them than the opinion of a school district bureaucrat.
 
I've recently been asking high school coaches (V, JV and F/S) at my games (CIF Southern Section teams) what they thought about the earlier season start and the change in number of contests (20 --> 28 with all tournament games counting) and scrimmages (1 --> 2). Most of the coaches were also club coaches and said they only scheduled scrimmages in the first two weeks of the season before Thanksgiving because they did not want to impact club players. None had scheduled the max number of permitted games.
 
twoclubpapa said:
I've recently been asking high school coaches (V, JV and F/S) at my games (CIF Southern Section teams) what they thought about the earlier season start and the change in number of contests (20 --> 28 with all tournament games counting) and scrimmages (1 --> 2). Most of the coaches were also club coaches and said they only scheduled scrimmages in the first two weeks of the season before Thanksgiving because they did not want to impact club players. None had scheduled the max number of permitted games.
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I have talked to 6-7 coaches about this and all of them scheduled all games with referees for after Thanksgiving. They said the change just gave them an extra couple weeks of practices. A few of them did not like that the regular season ended a week earlier than past years. They said it did not allow them to schedule an easy week (only one game during the week) during league play. All of the coaches were from D2-Open Div teams and also are club coaches.
 
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