2 new girls DA clubs announced

[outside!]

Are we still talking about YNT players? The YNT pools are a joke. The best players aren't just good in training. And I know a whole bunch of YNT players that came from ECNL clubs including the only two Full WNT players that never played in college. Checkmate.

This may be the first time I have ever mentioned YNT players on the forum. I do not believe that any of these players are "jokes". They are someone's children and they have worked very hard to get to where they are at.

Things change MAP. ECNL was not keeping up and it cost them. GDA has made a ton of mistakes, but the simple fact that they attracted so many SoCal clubs shows that ECNL was ignoring reality. My personal biggest problem with both ECNL and GDA is that they are closed leagues. There should be a way for top unaffiliated teams to play against ECNL/GDA teams. If ECNL/GDA would have compromised and formed one league, they could have then used National League/National Championships as a way for non-member teams/clubs to play into some kind of national competition. There will come a time when a upstart club/team will have a team that is better than what we call the "elite" teams. These teams may exist right now, but we have no way of knowing.

 

[timmyh]

For what is worth, the Dallas Texans have dropped ECNL and the Texas DA clubs have created their own DPL league for their 2nd teams. ECNL may be making gains in some parts of the country at the DA's expense, but in Texas ECNL is on life support and the DA has won.

 

[GoWest]

For what is worth, the Dallas Texans have dropped ECNL and the Texas DA clubs have created their own DPL league for their 2nd teams. ECNL may be making gains in some parts of the country at the DA's expense, but in Texas ECNL is on life support and the DA has won.

I looked up the club article announcing DT all-in for GDA. I am curious if I missed something else with regard to other TX ECNL clubs leaving? I think that leaves 9 or so TX clubs still in ECNL? Maybe ECNL expands by one or two in TX to counter the loss?

 

[MWN]

I don't agree with your comment about it being about money. Other than possible sponsorship money and DA merchandise, I don't see how they are making much money. The only fee the collect from the clubs is a $50 fee per player and coach for registration fees. There is a performance bond a club needs to post to be in the DA but is relatively small and refundable. They provide all event fees (no tournament/showcase fees to attend) and all referee fees for all league and showcase games. At showcases their are multiple medical stations, ice baths, free water, Powerade, fruit and snacks not only for players but for spectators too. The DA merchandise they sell is no different than what is sold at Surf Cup or the Players Showcase. They have scouts at every field and film every game.

In my opinion, US Soccer is losing money by running the USSDA.

Now the argument to make is whether the clubs are making much money by having DA. My assessment here is that appears to be more a break even operation.

They would not do it if it was break even. They are reaping the rewards of status. Being a DA club attracts more players at all levels.

From a USSF perspective the DA is a money loser and part of their "mission" as a non-profit. Which is to elevate the level of youth soccer so we remain competitive on the girls side by sending them to college and maybe send a few male players to Europe to become real professionals so we can suck them back onto the US National Team and finish better than 16th in the World Cup. The USSF knows that professional soccer in the US is not established. There is no 2nd, 3rd or below levels that can make money, let alone invest in players. The USSF has the MLS which operates like the 1960's Soviet Union and is doomed to mediocrity unless changes are made in the future.

Without an actual money making professional program to compete with the European leagues, the only way to wrangle the development of boys and girls was to form a Development League and convince the US clubs to foot the bill.

The model is the USSF spends a few million on youth development from their World Cup receivables, but makes the "clubs" that are members bear the financial brunt.
The model for the clubs is to "market" themselves as elite programs to get dollars out of parents who think Johnny or Joanne has the chops to make it to college or the pros. The DA clubs are nothing but money losing teams (break even at best) that are funded on the backs of the Flight 3-1, Bronze-Premier, AC-SDDA F1, etc.

@Simisoccerfan is correct, US Soccer is losing money.

@Fact is correct, the DA is simply a marketing ploy/scheme/program to attract money paying parents to clubs with DA teams. The lower ranks happily subsidize the DA because they believe that someday their little one will be on the DA team.

 

[MWN]

Does it attract more players than being in ECNL? I personally don't think there is more than a marginal amount of you money you can make through attracting more players because your expenses increase with every player. The real money is made by running tournaments and charging parents for parking.

For the record, facilities keep the parking (rarely do clubs/tournament promoters get any parking beyond a dollar or two), its part of the economics of facilities. The clubs get lower field fields, which help the bottom line.

 

[eastbaysoccer]

GDA will be alive and strong in So Cal but it appears to be falling apart everywhere else.

Hawks, PDA, Texans, Eclipse all dumped DA. Florida clubs are to follow and more to come by the fall. Nor cal powers like Mustang, Davis and MVLA have not jumped on board and remains relatively weak aside for the Earthquakes.

 

[timmyh]

GDA will be alive and strong in So Cal but it appears to be falling apart everywhere else.

Hawks, PDA, Texans, Eclipse all dumped DA. Florida clubs are to follow and more to come by the fall. Nor cal powers like Mustang, Davis and MVLA have not jumped on board and remains relatively weak aside for the Earthquakes.

Your info isn't quite correct. Texans dropped ECNL and are DA only.
DA has routed ECNL in Texas. That battle is over.

 

[shales1002]

I looked up the club article announcing DT all-in for GDA. I am curious if I missed something else with regard to other TX ECNL clubs leaving? I think that leaves 9 or so TX clubs still in ECNL? Maybe ECNL expands by one or two in TX to counter the loss?

I did the same @GoWest . They still have 9 clubs. Losing ONE club isn’t quite the life support and sky is falling scenario. Just wondering if Texans actually lost ECNL and claiming to be walking away. Just curious. All I read about was others posters wanted to be “all in ecnl”. But hey float your narrative @timmyh .

 

[eastbaysoccer]

The true narrative and fact is the DA started 10 years or so ago for the boys and 10 years later they find themselves at home Missing the World Cup. Clearly as the richest country in the World with a population dwarfing Iceland one would think this clearly is not working.

Let’s go to one relegation league based on the “team” not the club and get rid of ecnl, GDA and all the other garbage.

 

[Fact]

Not hard to tell what is timmyh’s agenda when you look at all his posts . Hate on Texas ECNL.

@timmyh take your our advice “This place would be better without you guys airing out grudges and getting personal and cluttering up threads.”

 

[Kicker4Life]

The true narrative and fact is the DA started 10 years or so ago for the boys and 10 years later they find themselves at home Missing the World Cup. Clearly as the richest country in the World with a population dwarfing Iceland one would think this clearly is not working.

Let’s go to one relegation league based on the “team” not the club and get rid of ecnl, GDA and all the other garbage.

By the way, the US isn’t the only country that will not be at the World Cup. Some countries with a Rich, Successful Futbol heratige also find themselves watching the WC from the stands.

Everyone has their own narrative that advances their agenda. I don’t know much about the Boys DA but 10 years is not that long and hopefully some of the better players are getting plucked from DA into Professional Academies where they will really develop.

 

[futboldad1]

By the way, the US isn’t the only country that will not be at the World Cup. Some countries with a Rich, Successful Futbol heratige also find themselves watching the WC from the stands.

Everyone has their own narrative that advances their agenda. I don’t know much about the Boys DA but 10 years is not that long and hopefully some of the better players are getting plucked from DA into Professional Academies where they will really develop.

Did you see the bracket that the US was in? Absolute joke to not qualify from that and cannot be compared to the South American or European brackets unless you're a USSF flag waver.

 

[outside!]

Absolute joke to not qualify from that and cannot be compared to the South American or European brackets unless you're a USSF flag waver.

Unless they are in an offside position and effect play.

 

[Kicker4Life]

Did you see the bracket that the US was in? Absolute joke to not qualify from that and cannot be compared to the South American or European brackets unless you're a USSF flag waver.

I hear you and that is a very valid point. Do you blame the players or the coaches for the USSF? I’m a USA flag waiver...not much of a fan of the USSF as an institution or Suneel (and his prodigies) as leaders of it but that is for another thread.

As for DA v ECNL I firmly believe it becomes a geographic matter across the Country and in the larger geographic regions DA will struggle mainly do to the HS issue.

 

[MakeAPlay]

This may be the first time I have ever mentioned YNT players on the forum. I do not believe that any of these players are "jokes". They are someone's children and they have worked very hard to get to where they are at.

Things change MAP. ECNL was not keeping up and it cost them. GDA has made a ton of mistakes, but the simple fact that they attracted so many SoCal clubs shows that ECNL was ignoring reality. My personal biggest problem with both ECNL and GDA is that they are closed leagues. There should be a way for top unaffiliated teams to play against ECNL/GDA teams. If ECNL/GDA would have compromised and formed one league, they could have then used National League/National Championships as a way for non-member teams/clubs to play into some kind of national competition. There will come a time when a upstart club/team will have a team that is better than what we call the "elite" teams. These teams may exist right now, but we have no way of knowing.

First of all, at no point did I say that YNT players are a joke. I said the YNT (youth national team) system is a joke. Secondly, every kid out on the pitch laying it on the line every week has worked hard to get to where they are and that is not something exclusive to them. ECNL was much more responsive to it's members than GDA is simply because it was run by the clubs. The ECNL clubs are responsive because they serve their customers (paying parents). On the girls side there is little way to remove the pay to play from the system until our domestic league becomes independently sustainable. Finally regarding an open system, you are missing the point of GDA and ECNL and that is to service varying slices of the elite girls soccer pyramid. Who really cares about the team that wins the national championship. The only championship that really mattered was the ODP championships and that has been devalued recently. At the end of the day it colleges and national teams recruit players not teams.

Keep thinking things are changing and that this is about the kids. They aren't and it isn't.

Good luck to you and your player.

 

[Real Deal]

As for DA v ECNL I firmly believe it becomes a geographic matter across the Country and in the larger geographic regions DA will struggle mainly do to the HS issue.

I don't know. Why does anyone care that much about high school soccer for their kids? It was being highly discouraged prior to DA, by coaches and, yes, ECNL ones too. The reason being: It is the bad soccer injury capitol of the universe! Not even counting overuse.... I think it's just being used as an excuse by clubs who are being revealed by GDA as maybe not as "elite" as they seemed. I wonder, if US Soccer changed the rules tomorrow, would these clubs jump back in?

Anyway, I would way rather have my kids getting recruited to colleges while in high school, than playing high school soccer. They can try track or hoops or something where they won't get killed.

As long as GDA proves to be a viable college recruiting platform, providing the necessary training for the next level, I can't see it going away.

And if the majority of future WNT players come from SoCal and Texas, well then, so be it

 

[MakeAPlay]

I don't know. Why does anyone care that much about high school soccer for their kids? It was being highly discouraged prior to DA, by coaches and, yes, ECNL ones too. The reason being: It is the bad soccer injury capitol of the universe! Not even counting overuse.... I think it's just being used as an excuse by clubs who are being revealed by GDA as maybe not as "elite" as they seemed. I wonder, if US Soccer changed the rules tomorrow, would these clubs jump back in?

Anyway, I would way rather have my kids getting recruited to colleges while in high school, than playing high school soccer. They can try track or hoops or something where they won't get killed.

As long as GDA proves to be a viable college recruiting platform, providing the necessary training for the next level, I can't see it going away.

And if the majority of future WNT players come from SoCal and Texas, well then, so be it

This view seems very parochial. Kids shouldn't have to choose elite soccer versus playing with their friends. Doesn't GDA also mandate no other high school sports? My player was county athlete of the year her senior year of high school and it was due to her playing multiple sports at a high level. It didn't stop her from playing more minutes than any other field player the girst 2 years of her college career at a school that has top 5 team. If your player cannot handle physical play D1 college soccer might not be for her and that is a fact.

Good luck to you and your player.

 

[Real Deal]

This view seems very parochial. Kids shouldn't have to choose elite soccer versus playing with their friends. Doesn't GDA also mandate no other high school sports? My player was county athlete of the year her senior year of high school and it was due to her playing multiple sports at a high level. It didn't stop her from playing more minutes than any other field player the girst 2 years of her college career at a school that has top 5 team. If your player cannot handle physical play D1 college soccer might not be for her and that is a fact.

Good luck to you and your player.

Fair enough. But I will note that physical soccer and bad soccer are two different things. And that too much soccer in general leads to overuse injuries. Do understand, though, that at the right high school you can gain fun accolades and win a championship and that can be a great experience.

So--I am most curious to know your opinion on this:
If the "no high school rule" were to change tomorrow, would these clubs jump back on board, and would folks like you be more inclined to accept GDA?

 

[MakeAPlay]

Fair enough. But I will note that physical soccer and bad soccer are two different things. And that too much soccer in general leads to overuse injuries. Do understand, though, that at the right high school you can gain fun accolades and win a championship and that can be a great experience.

So--I am most curious to know your opinion on this:
If the "no high school rule" were to change tomorrow, would these clubs jump back on board, and would folks like you be more inclined to accept GDA?

I was never against what the pie in the sky goals of the GDA were originally intended to be. My problem is that it is a lie. If their goal was to create these elite players for the national team then they need to fully fund it, pick the players regionally and have them play and train together on a different track from the pseudo elite players. In SoCal there are only about 25-35 players per age group that should be in a program like that not the 300+ per age group that are in the program. For all but maybe 1-4 per age group college is going to be the highest level that they ever play. Why not have a track for that? GDA is not that track and it is not elite only like ODP. So what is it supposed to be? Personally I didn't want my player to play high school out of fear but she wanted to play and never got injured. She got to play with her friends (they were never good enough to play with her past AYSO) and it made her happy. One of those friends she has known since elementary school and now they go to college together. Whenever I see her friend she always talks about how great those 2 years (she was on frosh/soph and JV her first two years while my kid was on Varsity all 4 years) that they played together were. Life is about the journey and soccer is only a small part of it even if your kid is a future national team player. Unless they are getting offered SIGNIFICANT money to forgo it (think Wes McKinnie, Tim Weah or Christian Pulisic) let them play.

Good luck to you and your player.

 

[MWN]

I don't know. Why does anyone care that much about high school soccer for their kids?

Because its fun. My son absolutely loved it. Trying to make the varsity team as a freshman, playing with his schoolmates and meeting new kids from the school that he now had something in common with, going to practice after school with that kid from Spanish class, that kid from biology, the silent nods from the upperclassman when walking down the hall between classes, the comradery and sense of pride when all the soccer players (Freshman, JV and Varsity) wore their school soccer polo shirts on game day, riding on the bus to an away game, having the cheerleaders make a poster with the boy's name on it, having the girls team cheer them on during their playoff run, playing in a stadium filled with parents and classmates, etc., etc.

HS soccer may have its negatives, but in SoCal, at least at our school, the coaches for the Varsity and JV team are each local Club coaches and the same is true for virtually every school in our league. The kids that make the teams are almost all club kids and I can honestly say that my son's team played a better brand of soccer than his last two club teams.

We ask so much of our kids, do well in school, devote 2-4 hours a day to practice a few times a week (mine is a GK), chores, and other things that might not be fun. Humans (including our sons and daughters and especially our daughters) are social animals and playing for the High School team is just plain fun and an experience that club soccer does not provide.

When roughly 8-9% of kids will ever play in college at any level and the odds of getting a scholarship are even less, why on earth would we as parents/adults permit some A-Hole with US Soccer in Chicago to dictate to our kids they can't have fun for a few months?

Various scientific studies have found the injury rate is slightly lower in HS soccer (2.6 per 1k AEH) v. Club (3.0 per 1k AEH). (see, http://www.apta.org/PTinMotion/News/2017/3/22/HSSoccerInjuries/ and http://natajournals.org/doi/pdf/10.4085/1062-6050-45.3.238?code=nata-site) Note, anybody claiming different is relying on anecdotal evidence, which is inherently unreliable.

Bottom line ... they are kids. If they want to play HS soccer let them. Its fun. If they don't, OK that is their choice. The only exception in my mind is if you have a truly gifted athlete that is invited to the US Soccer National Youth Team Camp. Otherwise, a few month break playing HS soccer isn't going to impact much at all.

 

[Kicker4Life]

Doesn't GDA also mandate no other high school sports?

I know of a few DA players playing other High school sports I.e. Tennis. I think it is more the exception than the rule.