CalSouth National Cup Question (use of ECNL players)

Crescenta put together a power team just to make a run at state cup. During the season they were so so..
 
Arsenal Papa said:
Basically, we were short players so we needed to borrow 2 players to have enough to play. However, if we dropped a few weaker players, we could bring in 8 ECNL girls (even though we only really needed 2, what the heck). With 8 ECNL girls on the pitch, our 6 other good flight 1 players could make a strong team. We had to decide whether to play National Cup, where literally every other Flight 1 team played and most top Flight 2 teams, but we thought with only 8 ECNL players and our Flight 1 players there was a chance we wouldn't win National Cup. Either Legends or Beach maybe could beat us. Probably not with 8 ECNL players, but they'd have a shot. So, we decided to appeal to play down, tell Cal South how weak a team we were, and go for the sure thing and play Presidents. That's competitive soccer. Every other respected ECNL coach would have done the same thing. President's Cup is supposed to be for "competitive" play. It's just like AYSO all-stars or select. Also competitive. If you guys can't handle it, you should have sanbagged and played governors. And, once we get ahead by 4 or 5, the coach even puts in the lesser Flight 1 players on the team to sit the ECNL girls. Our original girls are playing a lot because we are able to get some good leads.
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Is this a joke? Really? Good thing you're playing Presidents and not National Cup. Even with those 8 ECNL players, your team would have been smoked by Legends, all 3 Beach teams, DMCV, Galaxy, Surf EGSL, and many other teams. Good thing your coach and parents weren't up for giving your dds some stronger competition. Better to play down and not challenge your team. Shoot maybe next year you guys should enter an AYSO tournament and beat teams 10-0. Whatever floats your boat and gives you that trophy. But, in all seriousness, so very sad that you are bragging about your wins against teams who worked so hard to get to where they are without ECNL players.
Just plain nonsense and not really a win in my opinion.
 
Arsenal won their 3 elimination games this weekend by a total score of 17-0. I watched parts of two of the games. They were not as close as the scores indicate. It is really disgusting what Randy Brown and Arsenal did. No class whatsoever. They have outscored their opponents by 32-0 in a tournament where all of the other remaining teams have struggled with multiple opponents.

I listened to parts of the post games talks by two of the coaches from two of the teams Arsenal played today. They both basically said what a dirty thing Arsenal did. Everyone but Arsenal parents thinks that (which likely explains why they play for Arsenal and a guy like Randy Brown). The sad part is this teaches a horrible lesson to the kids -- that skirting the rules and ignoring the point of a multiple level tournament system (where players are supposedly to play at their level) pays off. What a lesson to teach girls. Nice job Arsenal. I hope you are proud.

The truly pathetic part is that this thread started off by asking is it us fair to have a few ECNL girls play at National Cup. That's debatable. Having 8 play at President's cup is ridiculous. ECNL girls are 2 levels above this tournament and Arsenal had a shot to win National cup with this "team." Though they probably would have been out-coached and lost.

Cal South will obviously have to address this as RB has said FU to the the system and destroyed the integrity of the State Cup system. Well done.

In the immortal words of Obi-Wan Kenobi - Without honor, victory is hollow, or, Dean Smith, quoting Jo Pa: Victory Without Honor is an unseasoned dish, it may satisfy your hunger but it won't taste good.

To Randy Brown and Arsenal, listen to a real coach. John Wooden once said: "Don't measure yourself by what you have accomplished, but by what you should have accomplished with your ability." Which, in this case, is not anything you can accomplish in President's Cup.

To Cresecenta and whoever plays Arsenal in the finals: Great moments... are born from great opportunity. And that's what you have here, tonight, boys. That's what you've earned here tonight. One game. If we played 'em hundred times, they might win ninety-nine. But not this game. Not tonight. Tonight, we skate with them. Tonight, we stay with them. And we shut them down because we can! Tonight, WE are the greatest hockey team in the world. You were born to be hockey players. Every one of you. And you were meant to be here tonight. This is your time. Their time is done. It's over. I'm sick and tired of hearing about what a great hockey team the Soviets have. Screw 'em. This is your time. Now go out there and take it.


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Justice said:
Arsenal won their 3 elimination games this weekend by a total score of 17-0. I watched parts of two of the games. They were not as close as the scores indicate. It is really disgusting what Randy Brown and Arsenal did. No class whatsoever. They have outscored their opponents by 32-0 in a tournament where all of the other remaining teams have struggled with multiple opponents.

I listened to parts of the post games talks by two of the coaches from two of the teams Arsenal played today. They both basically said what a dirty thing Arsenal did. Everyone but Arsenal parents thinks that (which likely explains why they play for Arsenal and a guy like Randy Brown). The sad part is this teaches a horrible lesson to the kids -- that skirting the rules and ignoring the point of a multiple level tournament system (where players are supposedly to play at their level) pays off. What a lesson to teach girls. Nice job Arsenal. I hope you are proud.

The truly pathetic part is that this thread started off by asking is it us fair to have a few ECNL girls play at National Cup. That's debatable. Having 8 play at President's cup is ridiculous. ECNL girls are 2 levels above this tournament and Arsenal had a shot to win National cup with this "team." Though they probably would have been out-coached and lost.

Cal South will obviously have to address this as RB has said FU to the the system and destroyed the integrity of the State Cup system. Well done.

In the immortal words of Obi-Wan Kenobi - Without honor, victory is hollow, or, Dean Smith, quoting Jo Pa: Victory Without Honor is an unseasoned dish, it may satisfy your hunger but it won't taste good.

To Randy Brown and Arsenal, listen to a real coach. John Wooden once said: "Don't measure yourself by what you have accomplished, but by what you should have accomplished with your ability." Which, in this case, is not anything you can accomplish in President's Cup.

To Cresecenta and whoever plays Arsenal in the finals: Great moments... are born from great opportunity. And that's what you have here, tonight, boys. That's what you've earned here tonight. One game. If we played 'em hundred times, they might win ninety-nine. But not this game. Not tonight. Tonight, we skate with them. Tonight, we stay with them. And we shut them down because we can! Tonight, WE are the greatest hockey team in the world. You were born to be hockey players. Every one of you. And you were meant to be here tonight. This is your time. Their time is done. It's over. I'm sick and tired of hearing about what a great hockey team the Soviets have. Screw 'em. This is your time. Now go out there and take it.


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I've heard so many negative things about this guy, Randy Brown, over the years. Seems like he and BW from Anaheim Surf share like values. Win at all cost. This way they can talk in thier circles with these wins as personal validation. Look how awesome I must be.
 
Thanks Justice. You just dropped the mic on this thread!



Justice said:
Arsenal won their 3 elimination games this weekend by a total score of 17-0. I watched parts of two of the games. They were not as close as the scores indicate. It is really disgusting what Randy Brown and Arsenal did. No class whatsoever. They have outscored their opponents by 32-0 in a tournament where all of the other remaining teams have struggled with multiple opponents.

I listened to parts of the post games talks by two of the coaches from two of the teams Arsenal played today. They both basically said what a dirty thing Arsenal did. Everyone but Arsenal parents thinks that (which likely explains why they play for Arsenal and a guy like Randy Brown). The sad part is this teaches a horrible lesson to the kids -- that skirting the rules and ignoring the point of a multiple level tournament system (where players are supposedly to play at their level) pays off. What a lesson to teach girls. Nice job Arsenal. I hope you are proud.

The truly pathetic part is that this thread started off by asking is it us fair to have a few ECNL girls play at National Cup. That's debatable. Having 8 play at President's cup is ridiculous. ECNL girls are 2 levels above this tournament and Arsenal had a shot to win National cup with this "team." Though they probably would have been out-coached and lost.

Cal South will obviously have to address this as RB has said FU to the the system and destroyed the integrity of the State Cup system. Well done.

In the immortal words of Obi-Wan Kenobi - Without honor, victory is hollow, or, Dean Smith, quoting Jo Pa: Victory Without Honor is an unseasoned dish, it may satisfy your hunger but it won't taste good.

To Randy Brown and Arsenal, listen to a real coach. John Wooden once said: "Don't measure yourself by what you have accomplished, but by what you should have accomplished with your ability." Which, in this case, is not anything you can accomplish in President's Cup.

To Cresecenta and whoever plays Arsenal in the finals: Great moments... are born from great opportunity. And that's what you have here, tonight, boys. That's what you've earned here tonight. One game. If we played 'em hundred times, they might win ninety-nine. But not this game. Not tonight. Tonight, we skate with them. Tonight, we stay with them. And we shut them down because we can! Tonight, WE are the greatest hockey team in the world. You were born to be hockey players. Every one of you. And you were meant to be here tonight. This is your time. Their time is done. It's over. I'm sick and tired of hearing about what a great hockey team the Soviets have. Screw 'em. This is your time. Now go out there and take it.


730f84d0491015a61014c7ac544fd058.jpg
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Sandypk said:
Is this a joke? Really? Good thing you're playing Presidents and not National Cup. Even with those 8 ECNL players, your team would have been smoked by Legends, all 3 Beach teams, DMCV, Galaxy, Surf EGSL, and many other teams. Good thing your coach and parents weren't up for giving your dds some stronger competition. Better to play down and not challenge your team. Shoot maybe next year you guys should enter an AYSO tournament and beat teams 10-0. Whatever floats your boat and gives you that trophy. But, in all seriousness, so very sad that you are bragging about your wins against teams who worked so hard to get to where they are without ECNL players.
Just plain nonsense and not really a win in my opinion.
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SandyPK- please re-read Arsenal Papa's post I believe he was being brilliantly sarcastic his post is totally hilarious...its also obviously a made-up persona since he joined today and has only 1 post...
 
Arsenal Papa said:
Basically, we were short players so we needed to borrow 2 players to have enough to play. However, if we dropped a few weaker players, we could bring in 8 ECNL girls (even though we only really needed 2, what the heck). With 8 ECNL girls on the pitch, our 6 other good flight 1 players could make a strong team. We had to decide whether to play National Cup, where literally every other Flight 1 team played and most top Flight 2 teams, but we thought with only 8 ECNL players and our Flight 1 players there was a chance we wouldn't win National Cup. Either Legends or Beach maybe could beat us. Probably not with 8 ECNL players, but they'd have a shot. So, we decided to appeal to play down, tell Cal South how weak a team we were, and go for the sure thing and play Presidents. That's competitive soccer. Every other respected ECNL coach would have done the same thing. President's Cup is supposed to be for "competitive" play. It's just like AYSO all-stars or select. Also competitive. If you guys can't handle it, you should have sanbagged and played governors. And, once we get ahead by 4 or 5, the coach even puts in the lesser Flight 1 players on the team to sit the ECNL girls. Our original girls are playing a lot because we are able to get some good leads.
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I really hope this was a joke by AP. If not, it was the most nonsensical post in a long time.

Thanks for allowing your coach to make a mockery of Presidents Cup. #NOCLASS
 
Keeper pops said:
Congrats Arsenal!! So far they have scored 25 goals in 5 President's Cup games yet only 6 during the fall..... SMH

Must be the Wheaties for breakfast
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03soccerpops said:
My daughter is happy playing with the EGSL team or at tier 1 or 2, so no promises.
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There is no point of beating a dead horse. Good luck to the other 3 teams this weekend. I don't know if it's better to let the girls know who they are facing so they can be ready or let them find out on the pitch and not have to worry the days leading up to the game.
 
Soccer123 said:
Congrats to 03 Arsenal egsl/ecnl on winning 6-0 vs Eagles in the Quarter-Finals of President's Cup! Up next....Semi-Finals vs Crescenta Valley SC. Good luck Crescenta Valley SC, we will be cheering you on from the sidelines!!
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Crescenta isnt just a regular team its a combination of all there top players from all 3 of there teams in flight 2..im going to cheer in for our league. .
 
Every person has their own set values, morals and ethics beliefs in which they live by. All my post had no mentioned whether if it is fair, just or right of RB. I'm not one to judge one's beliefs of what is ethically correct or their integrity. All, I ever said, it is what it is and life is not always fair. Why tell the players anything. Just let them play soccer. Why put labels or classification on certain girls. Im just tired of people teaching kids how to be play the "victim." Or complain about how unfair people or things can be. I teach my daughter how to face certain "Giants" that she may face during her life time. To believe in herself, or not to count out what others might see as the under dog. To face any challenges with a belief she can triumph in any situation that life might throw at her!!
If I was an ECNL parent, I would be concered that their daughter's are not beating these lower teams with a 10-0 game. Yesterday's first game 0-0 at the 20min. PK in 25 min and own goal at 30 min. 2-0 going into 2nd half and RB had only 1 EGSL girl out the entire first half. In the end those ECNL will suffer from playing st a lower level. So what if they win the title! Those other teams that lost to them will be the true winners because they will have grown as a player. No growth comes from not being challenged. Growth comes from challenges.
 
Not that it matters, but Crescenta Valley did not combine 3 teams or create an All Star team. A few players from the White Flight 2 team quit or were unavailable leaving them with not enough players for State Cup and the Blue Flight 2 team had 18 so they permanently moved 5 players from the Blue team to the White team (for State Cup and next Season). The third CV flight 2 team in the age group (no color, just FC) was not involved and made it to the elimination rounds in state cup. The Blue Flight 2 team could have made it out of pool play, but did not get any breaks.
 
GregAPA said:
Not that it matters, but Crescenta Valley did not combine 3 teams or create an All Star team. A few players from the White Flight 2 team quit or were unavailable leaving them with not enough players for State Cup and the Blue Flight 2 team had 18 so they permanently moved 5 players from the Blue team to the White team (for State Cup and next Season). The third CV flight 2 team in the age group (no color, just FC) was not involved and made it to the elimination rounds in state cup. The Blue Flight 2 team could have made it out of pool play, but did not get any breaks.
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Good luck..it must be nice
 
As pointed out above, it is clear that arsenal papa and soccerpops are not real arsenal parents. They are just being hilariously sarcastic. No parent could believe what they are saying.

I am not sure what point Biz is trying to make. Crescenta Valley does not even have an 03 Flight 1 team and they won their games by 1 goal each. Eagles Gold was a 2-7 Gold team that appealed to play Presidents. They have not blown anyone out and barely made it out of pool play.

No one would care if the 1-9 Arsenal EGSL team played Presidents like Eagles did. Even if they won, they would have been at an appropriate level. The issue is bringing in 10 ECNL players to add to the Flight 1 team. That's what should be illegal (assuming it isn't). I hope someone files a protest. It is morally bankrupt to bring 10 ECNL players in, blow everyone out, and in the process, ruin the confidence and innocence of girls that have worked really hard to make it to the Round of 16, or quarter finals, etc.
 
CalSouth State Cup rules --

http://media.calsouth.com/data/Down...ts/2017/2017CSStateCupV171008162.pdf?rev=F013

Teams must be registered with Cal South and play in a recognized league. From their Nov 15th roster, the team must keep at least 5, 7, or 9 players, depending on age. There is a limit of 5 players transferred from another Cal South team, and no limit (except overall roster limit) on signing up players not on any roster. Club Pass method allows clubs to move players among teams, so players rostered to any team in the club can be placed on a State Cup roster without limits, as long as the other restraints are met.

It is not clear from the thread if the ECNL players came in as Club Pass players, transferred players, or as previously non-rostered players.
 
espola said:
CalSouth State Cup rules --

http://media.calsouth.com/data/Down...ts/2017/2017CSStateCupV171008162.pdf?rev=F013

Teams must be registered with Cal South and play in a recognized league. From their Nov 15th roster, the team must keep at least 5, 7, or 9 players, depending on age. There is a limit of 5 players transferred from another Cal South team, and no limit (except overall roster limit) on signing up players not on any roster. Club Pass method allows clubs to move players among teams, so players rostered to any team in the club can be placed on a State Cup roster without limits, as long as the other restraints are met.

It is not clear from the thread if the ECNL players came in as Club Pass players, transferred players, or as previously non-rostered players.
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But, one must always consider the fact that Cal South doesn't always enforce their own rules.
 
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