U 20 Women's World Cup

I just finished watching the replay of USA vs Japan. So glad to see the team playing beautiful soccer win. The Japan team reminded me of the Magic Johnson era Lakers or the Jordan led Bulls with their beautiful triangle and in contrast the US team made me visualize the Kobe era Lakers with no teamwork just a selfish individuals throwing up dumb shots and dumb passes with no regards to teammates. I can only assume that the US soccer management believe in literally mindless kick ball for this to occur.
 
I have two questions, were those really our county's best forwards??? And do they actually coach the wing defenders to automatically blast the ball a mile up field to the opponent???
 
Wow! That was a complete route! JE and the entire US coaching staff must be embarrassed. US packed the box to keep the score close but the game itself never was.
The poor play of the midfield continues to come up. I can tell you for sure we have players that can posses, distribute, and dictate from the middle 3rd of the field but that isn't what they are being instructed to doing. Coaching is failing them miserably and the US youth system needs an overhaul.
 
NoGoal said:
IMO, it's obvious what our YNT needs are the following.

1. Improved team chemistry by living and playing together. Solution, fully subsidized YNT year round residency program.

2. Select, implement, and further develop playmaking midfielders. Solution, evaluate and identify quick midfielders with great vision and skill.

3. Learn to play through the midfielders and stop with parking the bus. Solution overhaul the YNT head coaches.

4. Learn to defend by holding possession instead of always high pressuring. Solution change the playing philosophy.
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It can be done, and relatively quickly. If you look at Mexico, who outplayed the US for 83 minutes, and they had 9 Mexican-American girls who grew up in the same club/university system as all of the US players. They were able to play nice soccer after a couple of camps. What the hell was the USA doing at their camps?
 
Justafan said:
It can be done, and relatively quickly. If you look at Mexico, who outplayed the US for 83 minutes, and they had 9 Mexican-American girls who grew up in the same club/university system as all of the US players. They were able to play nice soccer after a couple of camps. What the hell was the USA doing at their camps?
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My guess the beep test, hahahaha!
 
I can't imagine anyone who watches youth/college soccer in the US is really suprised by the performances. US Soccer on the Womens side is in even more of a dire situation than the Men's side, and it's only because the rest of the World didn't really care in the past that they were able to ride the wave of victory based off athleticism and numbers. The whole program needs an overhaul. I fear the DA will have minimum impact...unless those few coaches that are actually able to develop players and teams, are presented with a pathway to coach themselves in the USYNT program, Is there anyone in that group of coaches who isn't connected to JE in some way? We need to stop the good old boys/girls network, identify those who can do it and give them an opportunity to revamp the game. Having good athletes is a plus, but games at the top level are not won on a teams ability to outrun an opponent. Also look at some of the coaches who scout for the youth national team player pools. Their own teams are horrible! They wouldn't know a good player if Carli Lloyd came round for dinner, let alone identifying a teenager with the ability to evolve in 5-6 years time. I predict a period of 5-10 years where we will effectively become an 'also ran' at the World Level. I hope I'm wrong.
 
Lets stop pretending though that the international clubs don't have athletes. Japan and Korea had girls just as fast, physical, and aggressive as the US and France does. They win more 50/50 balls, are just as fast, and just as strong now. Combined with their strong technique, these two teams were the class of the tourney. I actually felt the best athletes weren't on the field for the US.

While watching the Mexico / USA game, I thought I heard it mentioned that 10-15 girls from the Mexico team play college ball in the U.S. If they can play as a team with their top girls, why can't the US do the same? Work with the colleges, have the girls red-shirt a year during world cup, and form the best team possible and play together as long as possible.

Was the keeper from Rutgers the best keeper the US had for their U20 team? While good from the line, she looked extremely uncomfortable moving around the box. This seemed to carry over to many positions. Are the best players actually on the U20 team? I know many here watch a lot of college soccer. Thoughts?
 
socalkdg said:
Lets stop pretending though that the international clubs don't have athletes. Japan and Korea had girls just as fast, physical, and aggressive as the US and France does. They win more 50/50 balls, are just as fast, and just as strong now. Combined with their strong technique, these two teams were the class of the tourney. I actually felt the best athletes weren't on the field for the US.

While watching the Mexico / USA game, I thought I heard it mentioned that 10-15 girls from the Mexico team play college ball in the U.S. If they can play as a team with their top girls, why can't the US do the same? Work with the colleges, have the girls red-shirt a year during world cup, and form the best team possible and play together as long as possible.

Was the keeper from Rutgers the best keeper the US had for their U20 team? While good from the line, she looked extremely uncomfortable moving around the box. This seemed to carry over to many positions. Are the best players actually on the U20 team? I know many here watch a lot of college soccer. Thoughts?
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Are you asking were these the best '96 birth year and younger players or were they the best players. The U20 WWC has a birth year cutoff date of 1-1-96. By the way the Mexican, Canadian and Ghanian players didn't have to redshirt and lose a year of college. You do the math on that. Duke and Stanford cost $72k a year. Even with a 3/4 scholarship that is $18k that the family has to pick up. Multiply that by 4 (and the 5th year typically doesn't include as much money. They might get less their 5th year) and you understand why some of the best players pulled themselves out of contention. Not to mention it is highly doubtful that their weren't better players than Otto and Fox out there.
 
Completely agree with that article. From just watching the game it seemed 80% of the time USA would lose throw in, free kicks, and goal kicks, the article seems to confirm that. Similar to hockey if you lose 80% of the face offs, good luck in the game.

Sounds like you are saying the best girls aren't joining these teams, and much of it has to do with money. It would seem like having the national team work with the colleges, providing a partial scholarship to the girls that do play with the team would be the smart play. The colleges get better trained players, the players get a huge experience and extra training without being hit in the pocketbook, and the national team gets better players. Win/Win/Win.
 
socalkdg said:
Completely agree with that article. From just watching the game it seemed 80% of the time USA would lose throw in, free kicks, and goal kicks, the article seems to confirm that. Similar to hockey if you lose 80% of the face offs, good luck in the game.

Sounds like you are saying the best girls aren't joining these teams, and much of it has to do with money. It would seem like having the national team work with the colleges, providing a partial scholarship to the girls that do play with the team would be the smart play. The colleges get better trained players, the players get a huge experience and extra training without being hit in the pocketbook, and the national team gets better players. Win/Win/Win.
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I agree with you. Instead of using the money on another administrator or buying out a contract they can provide money for the girls as an incentive to play. At the end of the day girls soccer isn't about getting rich. It's about getting a great education and having a great experience representing your country. I know for a fact at least 4 players that would have made the U20 team (one was on the last cycle's U20 team when she was in high school) chose not to. They happened to go to expensive private universities and from my conversations with the coaches a couple of years back they rarely give out full rides. As most of us know by now girls soccer isn't football or basketball, it isn't even guys soccer where there is an opportunity to make an extremely good living playing pro. On the girls side it is a labor of love and we will lose our ability to compete with the top countries in the world that are inhibited by amateurism (and that send a lot of their players to US colleges) if we don't take care of our minor league (NCAA soccer).
 
Not justifying US Soccer's plan (or lack thereof) but . . .

Professional leagues (or in this case, a national team) are only as good as the players produced by their "farm" systems. The farm system for US Soccer is our youth club scene. Youth club soccer is not designed with the purpose of developing talent for the long haul. They are designed to make money by attracting parents by winning lots of games for a very short period of time (and I don't see the DA system changing that because they're using the same organizations). Winning games with 11 years olds requires an entirely different skill set than winning with 28 year olds. When it comes to women's soccer, there is no professional league for them to aspire to, and so the only real goal for the most talented female players is to get into college, which requires them to win a lot of games as 11-16 year olds to get into a position to be recruited. So they (and their parents and coaches) do what it takes to accomplish that goal. But that goal (getting into college) has nothing to do with the United States being able to field a team with the technical chops to beat a team like Japan. It is a cultural thing. Our culture uses youth soccer as a means to a completely different end. In other cultures, playing soccer IS the end. Unless that changes, we'll always wonder why we lose to smaller countries, poorer countries, or countries with less resources. It's not about athletes. There is a reason the SEC dominates college football and NFL rosters. It's not because southern players are more gifted or talented. It's the culture.
 
Mystery Train said:
Not justifying US Soccer's plan (or lack thereof) but . . .

Professional leagues (or in this case, a national team) are only as good as the players produced by their "farm" systems. The farm system for US Soccer is our youth club scene. Youth club soccer is not designed with the purpose of developing talent for the long haul. They are designed to make money by attracting parents by winning lots of games for a very short period of time (and I don't see the DA system changing that because they're using the same organizations). Winning games with 11 years olds requires an entirely different skill set than winning with 28 year olds. When it comes to women's soccer, there is no professional league for them to aspire to, and so the only real goal for the most talented female players is to get into college, which requires them to win a lot of games as 11-16 year olds to get into a position to be recruited. So they (and their parents and coaches) do what it takes to accomplish that goal. But that goal (getting into college) has nothing to do with the United States being able to field a team with the technical chops to beat a team like Japan. It is a cultural thing. Our culture uses youth soccer as a means to a completely different end. In other cultures, playing soccer IS the end. Unless that changes, we'll always wonder why we lose to smaller countries, poorer countries, or countries with less resources. It's not about athletes. There is a reason the SEC dominates college football and NFL rosters. It's not because southern players are more gifted or talented. It's the culture.
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You had me until the last two sentences. I have been to Nebraska, Ann Arbor and BYU on gameday. Trust me they are as intensely fanatical about their football as they are in the heart of Tennessee or Alabama. NFL rosters are 18% SEC players, 14% ACC players, 13% Big Ten and 13% Pac 12 players. While the SEC has some intense stadiums to play in (Tennessee and Texas A&M spring to mind as some crazy places to play that I have been to) statistically speaking, with them having 15 member schools they are only slightly ahead of some of those conferences in terms of player numbers. Regardless, not really an equivalent situation. Football gets the best athletes and also has the carrot dangled of a 100% paid education AND the potential of millions of dollars. Not even the best female soccer player ever makes (or made) comparable money over her career to a starting NFL player that stays in the league for 4-5 years.

I agree that it is a cultural thing but more of it has to do with our soccer coaches cultural background and incentives. The coach of the US women's national team makes abut $215k a year. That is below the average of a Power 5 schools assistant (non-coordinator) football coach. Not sure what the highest paid women's college coach receives but I am pretty certain that it would be on the average to low side of a football assistant coach. That and the intense pressure to deliver wins at all coasts is the real issue. If the coaches were evaluated on style of play or had a differing incentives things might change. I don't expect it to happen unfortunately.
 
Is it me or did the relative skill set for the U20's just suddenly get a lot worse versus Japan, PRK and France etc? Seemed like USWNT was on Top of the World only what 2 years ago ???

Please somebody tell me the "real" U20 team was On Holiday and that therefore this does not forshadow the future!
 
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soccerobserver said:
Is it me or did the relative skill set for the U20's just suddenly get a lot worse versus Japan, PRK and France etc? Seemed like USWNT was on Top of the World only what 2 years ago ???

Please somebody tell me the "real" U20 team was On Holiday and that therefore this does not forshadow the future!
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A friend told me, Japanese trained youth players must be able to juggle the ball 1000 consecutive times without messing up. I wonder how many of the U20s can do that.
 
soccerobserver said:
Is it me or did the relative skill set for the U20's just suddenly get a lot worse versus Japan, PRK and France etc? Seemed like USWNT was on Top of the World only what 2 years ago ???

Please somebody tell me the "real" U20 team was On Holiday and that therefore this does not forshadow the future!
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The US WNT is still ranked #1 in the world by FIFA.
 
NoGoal said:
A friend told me, Japanese trained youth players must be able to juggle the ball 1000 consecutive times without messing up. I wonder how many of the U20s can do that.
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That my friend is the difference between them and us and the reason they can absolutely torture a team in the final third.
 
MakeAPlay said:
You had me until the last two sentences. I have been to Nebraska, Ann Arbor and BYU on gameday. Trust me they are as intensely fanatical about their football as they are in the heart of Tennessee or Alabama. NFL rosters are 18% SEC players, 14% ACC players, 13% Big Ten and 13% Pac 12 players. While the SEC has some intense stadiums to play in (Tennessee and Texas A&M spring to mind as some crazy places to play that I have been to) statistically speaking, with them having 15 member schools they are only slightly ahead of some of those conferences in terms of player numbers. Regardless, not really an equivalent situation. Football gets the best athletes and also has the carrot dangled of a 100% paid education AND the potential of millions of dollars. Not even the best female soccer player ever makes (or made) comparable money over her career to a starting NFL player that stays in the league for 4-5 years.

I agree that it is a cultural thing but more of it has to do with our soccer coaches cultural background and incentives. The coach of the US women's national team makes abut $215k a year. That is below the average of a Power 5 schools assistant (non-coordinator) football coach. Not sure what the highest paid women's college coach receives but I am pretty certain that it would be on the average to low side of a football assistant coach. That and the intense pressure to deliver wins at all coasts is the real issue. If the coaches were evaluated on style of play or had a differing incentives things might change. I don't expect it to happen unfortunately.
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Good point about the coaching culture and pay. "The intense pressure to deliver wins at all costs is the real issue." This I could not agree with more wholeheartedly, from the top of the US game down to the bottom. And you are right that I probably shouldn't compare football because it undercuts the real point I was trying to make, which is that college is the end game for US girls in soccer, rather than becoming a professional international player.

P.S. We'll have to start a college football thread to debate my SEC comment. My point about NFL rosters has to do with where those players grew up (south). Lots of those elite Big 10 and ACC players are from Texas, Florida, Georgia, Louisiana, etc. I grew up in Dixie, and say with all due respect, unless you've lived there, you can't appreciate just how much perspective they lack with regards to football. There are some great places (which you mentioned) that do match SEC Saturdays for passion, but in the South, it is a 7-day a week religion to the point of absurdity. No comparison.
 
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