Terrible ECNL Teams/Clubs

H

Highlander

SILVER ELITE
OK, I'm new to ECNL. I was looking over the SoCal ECNL standings...some teams/clubs are getting CRUSHED! I thought ECNL was about the best. From what I can tell without promotion/relegation its just a league built to make the top clubs look good while they feast on some crapy teams/clubs. I know for a fact there are teams that are better than some of those bottom dwellers in ECNL. They need to stop protecting clubs with the golden hand shake of guaranteed ECNL status. Lot's of good clubs/teams that can give the current ECNL teams better competition. Why can't we come up with a system that makes sense for the players/teams/clubs/parents?

I have to wonder why anyone would want to play for Nevada/Arizona ECNL teams. Why would you spend all that money and time to get CRUSHED! I saw some teams with a -40+ goal differential...consistently those teams come from NV/AZ...mix in a couple CA clubs here and there. So crazy.
 
Those AZ/NV clubs are likely made up of the best players in those states that CAN AFFORD to play ECNL. Not cheap to travel for 1/2 of your games. Not cheap to play at that level.
Both of those states probably have some fantastic players that can't afford the time and expense of playing at that level.
Maybe you can afford it- but you have a job that requires you to work weekends. That's not gonna work because you want to see your kid play.
 
Highlander said:
OK, I'm new to ECNL. I was looking over the SoCal ECNL standings...some teams/clubs are getting CRUSHED! I thought ECNL was about the best. From what I can tell without promotion/relegation its just a league built to make the top clubs look good while they feast on some crapy teams/clubs. I know for a fact there are teams that are better than some of those bottom dwellers in ECNL. They need to stop protecting clubs with the golden hand shake of guaranteed ECNL status. Lot's of good clubs/teams that can give the current ECNL teams better competition. Why can't we come up with a system that makes sense for the players/teams/clubs/parents?

I have to wonder why anyone would want to play for Nevada/Arizona ECNL teams. Why would you spend all that money and time to get CRUSHED! I saw some teams with a -40+ goal differential...consistently those teams come from NV/AZ...mix in a couple CA clubs here and there. So crazy.
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ECNL lower teams (in the Southwest maybe other locations) will start getting better with less competition for players from GA.

However there's always going to be a couple that suck just because they can.
 
Highlander said:
OK, I'm new to ECNL. I was looking over the SoCal ECNL standings...some teams/clubs are getting CRUSHED! I thought ECNL was about the best. From what I can tell without promotion/relegation its just a league built to make the top clubs look good while they feast on some crapy teams/clubs. I know for a fact there are teams that are better than some of those bottom dwellers in ECNL. They need to stop protecting clubs with the golden hand shake of guaranteed ECNL status. Lot's of good clubs/teams that can give the current ECNL teams better competition. Why can't we come up with a system that makes sense for the players/teams/clubs/parents?

I have to wonder why anyone would want to play for Nevada/Arizona ECNL teams. Why would you spend all that money and time to get CRUSHED! I saw some teams with a -40+ goal differential...consistently those teams come from NV/AZ...mix in a couple CA clubs here and there. So crazy.
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I would say
  1. You should discount U13/14 - IMO there should only be in state / local for these and allow those kids to develop. Large numbers of these kids will be gone / replaced with "late" developers.
  2. ECNL SW is too big which dilutes the talent pool. AZ can't produce 4 quality teams at every age group (3 ECNL & 1 GA), so every team hurts to some extent. In NV, Heat is no longer the only show in town. SoCal doesn't have 13 elite teams per age group either. Based on PPG across all 17 teams.
    1. U18-19 the bottom 5 teams are from SoCal. Only one AZ/NV team has a negative GD (its -1)
    2. U17 the bottom 3 teams are from SoCal. Heat at #4, AZ 9/14/15
    3. U16 AZ & NV teams are weak. I know AZ is not strong generally for 06s. No idea why.
    4. U15 AZ are ranked 10/12/17, NV is 16.
  3. The point about who can afford to play is pertinent.
  4. Lastly, these teams match up well against plenty of teams across the country. SoCal is very strong and the top 3/4 teams per age group would blow away the majority of ECNL teams nationally. I have no doubt that the lower teams in SoCal would be very strong in many ECNL regions, they are fortunate though to be in SoCal. College coaches (which is the only point) know this and so the kids from all these teams get college opportunities.
 
DA admitted girls in 2017, and some strong ECNL teams moved over. ECNL replaced them with other clubs (who tried but weren't admitted in prior years). Now DA is gone and ECNL faces a problem: Let those DA teams come back, and you have pretty obvious haves and have nots. Keep them out and you allow a competitor league to compete.

3 new ECNL teams this year, all were prior DA teams: Beach and Legends rank top 5 across the board, while Royals is middle of the pack. All are ahead of their geographical rivals.

Eventually ECNL will probably go to a pro/rel approach with ECRL, but I think the existence of GA will keep them from doing it for now.
 
SoccerLocker said:
Eventually ECNL will probably go to a pro/rel approach with ECRL, but I think the existence of GA will keep them from doing it for now.
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Not sure how they do that unless they have different clubs in ecRL vs ECNL. Because if you relegate a club from ECNL to ecRL who fills the spot? An ecRL team from a club already in ECNL? I doubt 2nd teams in the top division creates a good image of a top league.
 
whatithink said:
AZ can't produce 4 quality teams at every age group (3 ECNL & 1 GA), so every team hurts to some extent.
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I think going forward it really is 3 teams. It seems already at the youngest ages...ie the last 2 age groups, the players are not going to del Sol.

Can Phx area handle 3 teams? Possibly. It has the same population as the San Diego metro area. Time will tell on that however.
 
Desert Hound said:
Not sure how they do that unless they have different clubs in ecRL vs ECNL. Because if you relegate a club from ECNL to ecRL who fills the spot? An ecRL team from a club already in ECNL? I doubt 2nd teams in the top division creates a good image of a top league.
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I think they drop the entire club down, not individual ages. Your top teams would be in ECRL across the board. Just like what Beach and Legends did last year and Pats is doing this year.
 
Desert Hound said:
Not sure how they do that unless they have different clubs in ecRL vs ECNL. Because if you relegate a club from ECNL to ecRL who fills the spot? An ecRL team from a club already in ECNL? I doubt 2nd teams in the top division creates a good image of a top league.
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Easy. You don’t call it a second team.

You split it geographically.

Eclipse. Eclipse North.
PDA Blue. PDA South.

Or just give them two names:

Real Co. Real Co Athletico.
FC Stars Blue. FC Stars White.
Mighican Hawks. Michigan Hawks Magic.
SLSG Green. SLSG White.
Concorde Fire Platinum. Concorde Fire Premier.

Or, if you can, split it geographically and by name:

Sting Dallas Black. Sting Dallas Royal. Sting Austin.

Agree it doesn’t do much for appearances, but we seem pretty far down this road already.
 
timbuck said:
Those AZ/NV clubs are likely made up of the best players in those states that CAN AFFORD to play ECNL. Not cheap to travel for 1/2 of your games. Not cheap to play at that level.
Both of those states probably have some fantastic players that can't afford the time and expense of playing at that level.
Maybe you can afford it- but you have a job that requires you to work weekends. That's not gonna work because you want to see your kid play.
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I’m going to have to respectfully disagree in regards to NV. Pleanty of talented players spread out and they can afford it! . Heat is the only ecnl sanctioned club out here and have a monopoly on it. Our dd is U-13 and we are going to follow the coaching and continuous development over a patch on her jersey at this age. If we lived in Cali it would be different since there are so many ecnl options she would be able to pursue. If she is still playing out here at a top level when she is 15 or 16 then we will see what the pathway looks like at that point.
 
whatithink said:
You should discount U13/14 - IMO there should only be in state / local for these and allow those kids to develop. Large numbers of these kids will be gone / replaced with "late" developers.
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This is interesting. What's your experience on the typical team turnover between U13 to U15?
 
LVB said:
I’m going to have to respectfully disagree in regards to NV. Pleanty of talented players spread out and they can afford it! . Heat is the only ecnl sanctioned club out here and have a monopoly on it. Our dd is U-13 and we are going to follow the coaching and continuous development over a patch on her jersey at this age. If we lived in Cali it would be different since there are so many ecnl options she would be able to pursue. If she is still playing out here at a top level when she is 15 or 16 then we will see what the pathway looks like at that point.
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Heat suffers at the younger ages (Last or next to last in youngest 3 age groups), but are increasingly competitive in HS years (Their 05 team is very good). There doesn't seem to be any pressure/advantage to join early. Does being the only ECNL club actually hurt them due to lack of competition with other clubs (i.e. they are inflexible)?
 
Desert Hound said:
Not sure how they do that unless they have different clubs in ecRL vs ECNL. Because if you relegate a club from ECNL to ecRL who fills the spot? An ecRL team from a club already in ECNL? I doubt 2nd teams in the top division creates a good image of a top league.
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Conspiracy theory-based promotion: Big club(s) get another team in ECNL through some one-off deal like Eclipse, PDA, etc.

Merit-based promotion: Slammers get a 3rd team and/or Blues get a 2nd team.

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SoccerLocker said:
Heat suffers at the younger ages (Last or next to last in youngest 3 age groups), but are increasingly competitive in HS years (Their 05 team is very good). There doesn't seem to be any pressure/advantage to join early. Does being the only ECNL club actually hurt them due to lack of competition with other clubs (i.e. they are inflexible)?
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They seem to be getting less competitive every year and struggling again this season. To answer your question I would venture off to say they are not willing to compromise but that is pure speculation.

Heat FC ECNL Girls
U-13
0-7-1
GF- 4
GA- 30

U-14
0-6-2
GF- 1
GA- 27

U-15
1-7-0
GF- 8
GA- 36

U-16
2-4-1
GF- 12
GA- 18

U-17
5-1-2
GF- 18
GA- 12

U-18/19
4-3-1
GF- 12
GA- 10
 
I am a believer that ECNL should not have U13 teams (and maybe even U14). Parents do not need to spend that money at that age. For most of the country ECNL clubs travel way more than So Cal. So this is really a belief based more on the rest of the country than our conference.
 
GT45 said:
I am a believer that ECNL should not have U13 teams (and maybe even U14). Parents do not need to spend that money at that age. For most of the country ECNL clubs travel way more than So Cal. So this is really a belief based more on the rest of the country than our conference.
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In total agreement. The expectation to win based on the dollars spent drives the train. More time is spent on winning (or trying to win) than teaching players how to play the game. There is a big difference between a U13 player and a U15 player, so much happens in those years.
 
Put Heat in 70 percent of divisions across the country, it would be a different look. Without having direct knowledge of what happens there, we have to respect and understand how damn good the California divisions are compared to most divisions across the country.
 
GT45 said:
I am a believer that ECNL should not have U13 teams (and maybe even U14). Parents do not need to spend that money at that age. For most of the country ECNL clubs travel way more than So Cal. So this is really a belief based more on the rest of the country than our conference.
Click to expand...

ECNL at U13/14 is a big money grab that is more closely aligned with the old school-year age groupings, and also the old NCAA recruiting rules. If 8th graders were being made offers, then sure U14 serves a purpose. With the new rules U14 and U13 are practically pointle$$. But guess what, I paid $$$ for that dumb crap just like some of you reading this :rolleyes::p
 
myself said:
ECNL at U13/14 is a big money grab that is more closely aligned with the old school-year age groupings, and also the old NCAA recruiting rules. If 8th graders were being made offers, then sure U14 serves a purpose. With the new rules U14 and U13 are practically pointle$$. But guess what, I paid $$$ for that dumb crap just like some of you reading this :rolleyes::p
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GDA brought in U13 to grab kids early so ECNL countered. U15 should be the first year, prepping kids for the U16 year when they are Sophmores and coaches are looking. Anyone doing showcases prior to then is being used as a marketing vehicle and money pit for coach/club egos.
 
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