AYSO santa clarita cracks

Just received a mass email from a former president of the valencia region and current assistant area director for area 10S, harping on United's plan to hire outside people, raise fees, and move toward a "professional club" plan. He then recommended another club in the area, FFSC , locals also refer to it as the "For F's Sake Club"...

Minutes later another member of the region sends out a clarification that the prior email was not authorized nor sanctioned by AYSO...

I wonder when the resignation will be expected or tendered by those involved. I'm sure soccer will get more interesting in Santa Clarita.
 
Keep us posted. Just looking: That United program fielded 29 teams this season! So that region (four regions) have gone "all in" on this, plus having Extra teams. I know from our regional admin that volunteerism in AYSO is down about 30% - and so the more they push the most engaged families into their paid program, the fewer soccer enthusiasts who will be involved in the Core program. Will be interesting to see if there will be ripple effects in other regions.
 
What are the costs of Extra and United? We did Extra our 2nd year in soccer and pretty sure if was less than $500 for the whole year, but I thought that United increased costs substantially.
 
What are the costs of Extra and United? We did Extra our 2nd year in soccer and pretty sure if was less than $500 for the whole year, but I thought that United increased costs substantially.

I coached a couple of Extra teams some years ago and I believe the total costs were around (or perhaps less than) $500 for the year. In terms of AYSO United, I don't know for sure but I did hear from some parents that the costs are around $1500 (in comparison to $2500 which is probably the average for club soccer) and so it's a decent saving for those parents who struggle financially. That said, if you can afford $1500, you can probably stretch another $1000 over the course of 12 months if you feel that your kid will get better coaching (which isn't always the case with 'normal' clubs as we know; AYSO United actually have some very good coaches).

As always, the AYSO Extra vs United vs Other Clubs issue is always a personal choice for each parent/player based on their circumstances and the clubs/options available to them in their area.

Interestingly, United Pacific were one of the most successful clubs in the whole of CSL this season; proof that AYSO can compete in the club scene. Some other United regions were much less competitive, as you might expect.

I do think that the addition of AYSO's United program will affect and destabilize their Extra program and even their Core programs potentially over the long term, as @jrcaesar highlighted above. AYSO is/was a very good recreational soccer organization. Having both rec and club soccer under the same umbrella could prove problematic for them as time goes on. We'll see how it pans out but my personal feeling is that there will be more issues like the one which looks to be developing in Santa Clarita.
 
AYSO is trying to build a tiered program where a player can progress naturally from core to extras to the various levels of club in United to eventually rival DA with the IS64 id plan. United parents in most regions are expected to perform service (coaching/ref/team parents/field monitor/snack booth) on top of paying the fee so it's actually a way to keep volunteers in, rather than have them leave for club. Because they have such a large talent pool, it's really easy to recruit the best from the Extras and Core teams, as well as from other clubs, and voila you get a competitive team.

The division is that the AYSO National Office is really pushing a move to professional based coaching with equivalent salaries. "Accountability" is the word that I kept hear thrown about. That will mean United fees will be cheaper than non-AYSO clubs (who may have to subsidize the DA teams as well DOC salaries and field costs-- AYSO has cushy relationship with various parks and recs where in the 90s they developed spaces in return for priority rentals). They also cut down the cost by not doing as many tournaments or fundraising for them off book and raising money for the ref fees through the team account. So for a team where coaches are volunteers the expense might be around $500. For one with paid coaches $1500. The issue is national wants the teams to switch to professionally based but some regions still believe in the volunteer mantra.

The problem with volunteers is that no matter how well meaning they are, it's difficult to get them fully invested in the training, particularly if they want to break old habits and ideas. That, plus, the chip on the shoulder of various United clubs about not being respected for only being an "AYSO team", has led to a strange fixation for winning. One team I saw, for example, built a team around 4 superfast kids that could belt it into the corner of the goal from almost the half. They swept various tournaments and were only stopped by the TFA flight 1 pre DA team. But it was some ugly soccer without possession control and largely run and beat the other side after goalkeeper punts.
 
I coached a couple of Extra teams some years ago and I believe the total costs were around (or perhaps less than) $500 for the year. In terms of AYSO United, I don't know for sure but I did hear from some parents that the costs are around $1500 (in comparison to $2500 which is probably the average for club soccer) and so it's a decent saving for those parents who struggle financially. That said, if you can afford $1500, you can probably stretch another $1000 over the course of 12 months if you feel that your kid will get better coaching (which isn't always the case with 'normal' clubs as we know; AYSO United actually have some very good coaches).

As always, the AYSO Extra vs United vs Other Clubs issue is always a personal choice for each parent/player based on their circumstances and the clubs/options available to them in their area.

Interestingly, United Pacific were one of the most successful clubs in the whole of CSL this season; proof that AYSO can compete in the club scene. Some other United regions were much less competitive, as you might expect.

I do think that the addition of AYSO's United program will affect and destabilize their Extra program and even their Core programs potentially over the long term, as @jrcaesar highlighted above. AYSO is/was a very good recreational soccer organization. Having both rec and club soccer under the same umbrella could prove problematic for them as time goes on. We'll see how it pans out but my personal feeling is that there will be more issues like the one which looks to be developing in Santa Clarita.
Agree, having a rec and a club like program could be a problem on many levels.
 
Agree, having a rec and a club like program could be a problem on many levels.


Meh. Other clubs have done it like Simi Premiere and Real So Cal. The rec program gives them a base from which they can mine players. The Ole club which has had much success recently starts with futsal leagues for the younger ones from which they can select players internally.
 
AYSO is trying to build a tiered program where a player can progress naturally from core to extras to the various levels of club in United to eventually rival DA with the IS64 id plan. United parents in most regions are expected to perform service (coaching/ref/team parents/field monitor/snack booth) on top of paying the fee so it's actually a way to keep volunteers in, rather than have them leave for club. Because they have such a large talent pool, it's really easy to recruit the best from the Extras and Core teams, as well as from other clubs, and voila you get a competitive team.

The division is that the AYSO National Office is really pushing a move to professional based coaching with equivalent salaries. "Accountability" is the word that I kept hear thrown about. That will mean United fees will be cheaper than non-AYSO clubs (who may have to subsidize the DA teams as well DOC salaries and field costs-- AYSO has cushy relationship with various parks and recs where in the 90s they developed spaces in return for priority rentals). They also cut down the cost by not doing as many tournaments or fundraising for them off book and raising money for the ref fees through the team account. So for a team where coaches are volunteers the expense might be around $500. For one with paid coaches $1500. The issue is national wants the teams to switch to professionally based but some regions still believe in the volunteer mantra.

The problem with volunteers is that no matter how well meaning they are, it's difficult to get them fully invested in the training, particularly if they want to break old habits and ideas. That, plus, the chip on the shoulder of various United clubs about not being respected for only being an "AYSO team", has led to a strange fixation for winning. One team I saw, for example, built a team around 4 superfast kids that could belt it into the corner of the goal from almost the half. They swept various tournaments and were only stopped by the TFA flight 1 pre DA team. But it was some ugly soccer without possession control and largely run and beat the other side after goalkeeper punts.

Plenty of teams/clubs have won lots of games playing that way.
 
Meh. Other clubs have done it like Simi Premiere and Real So Cal. The rec program gives them a base from which they can mine players. The Ole club which has had much success recently starts with futsal leagues for the younger ones from which they can select players internally.
Meh, right...
Not talking the teams transitioning or putting them on the field. But rather the internal logistics of operating a club like entity nationwide/specific geographic areas and on a daily basis. Each geographic location will have its struggles. For example in our area AYSO is losing fields and being asked to pay club like rates. Why? They have expanded their yearly usage. The fields operated by cities/districts are now seeing a decline in revenue. Primarily because AYSO was given a cut rate where as clubs paid far more. Now that AYSO wants fields more they have to pay a more competitive rate. Also, AYSO took advantage of making reservations for fields and letting them sit idle. Furthering the lose of potential earnings.These same cities and districts have approached AYSO on this and now are being monitored. This is one small example in a sample location.
 
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Lots of moving parts @Grace T. that’s the problem. Yes, it’s a good idea in principle but each section/area/region has their own ideas, as you kind of allude to in your post.

You seem very ‘pro-AYSO’ by the way; no problem with that. You likely have an inside knowledge of how it all works which is helpful.

My concern would be that trying to get all of the different elements (core, extra, United) and their ego’s on the same page is a hugely difficult ask. Next to impossible IMO based on being around many of the ego’s now for a number of years (not just AYSO, youth soccer in general).

The benefits AYSO has enjoyed (as another poster mentioned) will be more closely scrutinized now that they are no longer just a ‘rec’ organization. That in itself will be tricky to navigate from an organizational and financial perspective.

I like the organization and wish them well. I just think there is a bumpy ride ahead.
 
Lots of moving parts @Grace T. that’s the problem. Yes, it’s a good idea in principle but each section/area/region has their own ideas, as you kind of allude to in your post.

You seem very ‘pro-AYSO’ by the way; no problem with that. You likely have an inside knowledge of how it all works which is helpful.

My concern would be that trying to get all of the different elements (core, extra, United) and their ego’s on the same page is a hugely difficult ask. Next to impossible IMO based on being around many of the ego’s now for a number of years (not just AYSO, youth soccer in general).

The benefits AYSO has enjoyed (as another poster mentioned) will be more closely scrutinized now that they are no longer ‘just a ref organization’. That in itself will be tricky to navigate from an organizational and financial perspective.

I like the organization and wish them well. I just think there is a bumpy ride ahead.
Yes. AYSO is now being looked at differently. As you stated no longer just a rec program.
 
You seem very ‘pro-AYSO’ by the way; no problem with that. You likely have an inside knowledge of how it all works which is helpful.

My concern would be that trying to get all of the different elements (core, extra, United) and their ego’s on the same page is a hugely difficult ask. Next to impossible IMO based on being around many of the ego’s now for a number of years (not just AYSO, youth soccer in general).

\.

Like many things, I can see both sides of the story with AYSO. I agree with Lastman that one of the issues they have organizationally is that they are used to having regions operate independently and not be run by the national office. The United program is different as each United program is a region more under the control of the National office. But yes, this fractured organization structure, and the autonomy of the regions, seems to be a great problem in getting everyone on the same page.

I also agree egos are a huge problem, as with most of youth soccer in general. AYSO is not immune, and if anything the chip on their shoulder makes them even more susceptible.
 
AYSO is trying to build a tiered program where a player can progress naturally from core to extras to the various levels of club in United to eventually rival DA with the IS64 id plan. United parents in most regions are expected to perform service (coaching/ref/team parents/field monitor/snack booth) on top of paying the fee so it's actually a way to keep volunteers in, rather than have them leave for club. Because they have such a large talent pool, it's really easy to recruit the best from the Extras and Core teams, as well as from other clubs, and voila you get a competitive team.

The division is that the AYSO National Office is really pushing a move to professional based coaching with equivalent salaries. "Accountability" is the word that I kept hear thrown about. That will mean United fees will be cheaper than non-AYSO clubs (who may have to subsidize the DA teams as well DOC salaries and field costs-- AYSO has cushy relationship with various parks and recs where in the 90s they developed spaces in return for priority rentals). They also cut down the cost by not doing as many tournaments or fundraising for them off book and raising money for the ref fees through the team account. So for a team where coaches are volunteers the expense might be around $500. For one with paid coaches $1500. The issue is national wants the teams to switch to professionally based but some regions still believe in the volunteer mantra.

The problem with volunteers is that no matter how well meaning they are, it's difficult to get them fully invested in the training, particularly if they want to break old habits and ideas. That, plus, the chip on the shoulder of various United clubs about not being respected for only being an "AYSO team", has led to a strange fixation for winning. One team I saw, for example, built a team around 4 superfast kids that could belt it into the corner of the goal from almost the half. They swept various tournaments and were only stopped by the TFA flight 1 pre DA team. But it was some ugly soccer without possession control and largely run and beat the other side after goalkeeper punts.
Please explain how AYSO ID 64 will rival DA.
 
Please explain how AYSO ID 64 will rival DA.

No idea. All I know is part of the long term plan is to have a DA or a DA equivalent at the top of the AYSO pyramid. It's a few years away, but the point of ID 64 is to lay the ground work by IDing potential players and giving them a pathway to be seen by colleges. Beyond that: phase 1) steal underpants, phase 2) ?, phase 3) profit!

Like I said, I'm not a proponent....there's a lot that I like in what I see...there's some bad stuff too...and there's some bad stuff that just doubles down on the other bad stuff throughout US soccer.
 
No idea. All I know is part of the long term plan is to have a DA or a DA equivalent at the top of the AYSO pyramid. It's a few years away, but the point of ID 64 is to lay the ground work by IDing potential players and giving them a pathway to be seen by colleges. Beyond that: phase 1) steal underpants, phase 2) ?, phase 3) profit!

Like I said, I'm not a proponent....there's a lot that I like in what I see...there's some bad stuff too...and there's some bad stuff that just doubles down on the other bad stuff throughout US soccer.
Got it. Appreciate your reply.
The more AYSO becomes like a club program could derail them in the future or make them no different than any club program anywhere else.
I certainly applaud them for constantly trying to be competitive in this new arena.
 
I think AYSO would have been fine staying as a "rec only" program. But when clubs starting offering 7 teams per age group with A,B,C,D,E,F,G teams- the clubs started dipping in to the players that would and should be part of a rec program.
 
I think AYSO would have been fine staying as a "rec only" program. But when clubs starting offering 7 teams per age group with A,B,C,D,E,F,G teams- the clubs started dipping in to the players that would and should be part of a rec program.

It's a chicken and egg economics problem. The clubs started offering those choices because the rec program is so bad (though it will get better as volunteers get more soccer experience). Parents were unsatisfied with what they were getting.

Many of the rec coaches don't know how to coach and several have never played. I remember reading a NYT piece by a mom who had never played and didn't know anything about the game but stepped up because no one else would...that's not generally a problem with the United coaches who at least know the fundamentals of the game. And the rec coaches don't escape some of the same problems on the sidelines that are there with licensed coaches (and if anything might even be more out of control since they are just volunteers and therefore aren't accountable...don't like the way I do it go ahead and fire me).

Then there's the problem of having everyone in the same player pool. Some kids might not be A team material, but they are better than the fat kid that can't run and is just there to get exercise, the awkward kid who swing and misses any time the ball gets passed to him, or the kid being forced to pick a sport by his parents but has no passion for soccer.

England is organized very differently than we are. They have a very small academy program...DA and level 1 equivalent and that's pretty much it...no B, C D or E team...this is reserved for boys that want to go pro and not kids that aspire to getting into college. Then there's a small middle ban of pay to play development clubs for kids hoping to break into the academies (my son's little friend Henry Save All is one of those)...there are arguments over how much of rackett it is. But then there's a very large rec program and that rec program is tiered....there are A, B, C, D, E, and F levels and the kids float and interchange between the levels depending on how committed they are and how their body is developing. Their rec program has as big of a kick ball problem as ours does, but it doesn't force the striker who is more technically advanced to wait for billy (who can't pass a ball without swinging and missing) to get him the ball. AYSO for the longest time felt things should be more democratic...everyone plays together...from the handicapped kid to the gifted striker...it just didn't work as even the C and D level players got frustrated. AYSO now seems committed to an appropriate tier for every player that wants to play...whether that pans out is still up in the air.
 
Our team came from two Extra teams that combined when they did the age change. We then pilfered the best athletes from two select teams. The problem with United was that at $1500 for the year it wasn't that cheap, so the move to a club happened with us keeping our coaches. Our fees are less than $1000 per year and that is a key for many of our parents. Now in our 3rd year of club, and after some growing pains(losses due to trying to play possession without having the skill yet), the girls are getting a good grasp on technique, possession, ball control and defence, which has seen a result of more wins. I believe United needs to keep the cost around $1000 per year or they run the risk into competing with too many other clubs, of which there are hundreds to choose from.
 
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